Drew Dowdell

the shamwow guy?

go for the lightest weight body that suits your needs.

Raid 10

Why is a Zeta v. Taurus an invalid comparison? Just because the Zeta is RWD? Think a NG Taurus and NG Charger/300c aren't going to get cross shopped?

That article fails to look at other aspects in the economy that are looming. What that article is doing is equating "stock market" with "economy". Yes, the stock market will improve slightly over the next 9 months, but the economy will not. The sub-prime mortgages are mostly done imploding. Commercial real estate is just getting warmed up and Prime/Alt-A mortgages are back in the green room getting changed. Even if all new housing starts stopped today we have 3 years of housing inventory that we know of. There is an estimated 30% of bank owned housing isn't even on the market today. Housing prices are going to continue to fall well into next spring at least.

you think it's going to get better over the next 9 months?

I'm excited to see what happens with this move. This will be the biggest server C&G has ever been on.

That I do not know. When Toyota doesn't import and more cars to the US and builds them all here, then I'll care.

Do you really know why Ford is doing well today? Seriously? They mortgaged EVERYTHING just before the credit markets imploded even though they didn't need the money at the time. They have solid platforms to put their cars on... but so does GM. Anyone here think the Fusion is that much better a platform than the Epsilon? Anyone? How about the Taurus being a better platform than the Zeta? Bueller? Bueller? How many out there are going to find the MKS to be a better car than the CTS?

It's not a matter of the Japanese general population favoring japanese cars. Detroit doesn't even get a chance to compete. Cars imported to Japan have to pass tests and examinations that domestically produced cars do not. The Japanese LOVED the B-bodies and Chevy Astros. They had an active gray market import program to bring these cars to the island. It cost them a fortune to do because of the inspections.... the same inspections GM would have to go through.

WE had to abort. The downtime will be fairly short this time around.

We should be protectionist because the Japanese are.

If what you mean by "spreading the wealth" you mean "returning to Clinton era tax rates" then sure.... I'm all for it. And no, it's not the same thing. I am all for global trade on a level playing field. We are not on a level playing field in terms of currency and trade restrictions. We'll let just about anyone sell here in the US but US is not allow to sell in substantial quantities to other countries. If General Motors were allowed to compete in Japan and they failed... well then that's their fault.... but General Motors isn't even allowed to compete there. The best they could manage was a rebadged Cavalier sold at Toyota dealerships. When the Asians open up their borders to trade the way we have, then I'm all for globalization. That said, I have no problem parking a battleship in Tokyo Bay in order to do it.

In it's final decade AMC was decidedly the vehicle for people who couldn't afford something from the big three. Cheap imported cars are what really put the nail in the coffin for AMC. No the Gremlin and Pacer weren't great cars, but consider this. The Civic sold 100,000 copies in 1975, the Pacer sold 145,000 and the Vega sold 204,000. I couldn't find numbers for the Pinto and Dart but let's just guess them at another 300,000 combined. In 1975, Honda had 1/6th of the compact market the domestics had...... in 1975!! Throw in the Datsun B210, the Toyota Corolla, the VW Rabbit.... You don't think that year after year, that made a difference in the fortunes of the domestics?

Both of you simmer down now. I'm reopening this thread if it can return to a more civil tone.

Actually, we'd probably have a big 3.5 as AMC probably wouldn't have succumb in the 80s. Why do you assume that there would be no development or improvement if the domestics didn't have to compete with each other. Back when Toyota was still Toyopet, the domestics competed plenty with each other in races to build the most fantastic cars. When the imports came, it became a race to build the blandest cars. And I don't buy your argument that domestics wouldn't be as reliable as they are today. Even if GM stuck around with the 3800 a few more years, it's still an engine you can take a shotgun to and it'll keep running. Oh no! I'll be "stuck" with an LT-1 that lasts only 350,000 miles between rebuilds and powers my 4,000 lbs land yacht down the highway, assertively, at 65mph whilst getting 26mpg. The tradgedy. Drat, I won't get to spin my partner's CRV up to 6,000rpm just to pull out into traffic or feel it's 4-speed auto shift into 2nd just to make it up a minor hill at highway speed. You're correct that the automotive landscape would be very different than it is today, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. Olds, Plymouth, AMC/Eagle, and Pontiac would all still be around today.

!!! +1

How is offering them something in the face of getting nothing a "war on capital"?

Because, without fail, they are still mentioning the f@cking Cimarron. Right there in the first freaking sentence!!!! Just once I want to see this same exact article start with "In 1957, Cadillac was selling one of the most expensive and luxurious cars in the world in the V8 Eldorado Brougham at the same time BMW was building the 1 cylinder, 13 horsepower, Isetta nicknamed das rollende Ei or The Rolling Egg."

To add to what Camino said... I think Toyota is fearing an anti-import backlash. But the $4900 in incentives Toyota has on the hood of the Prius and $3,000 on the hood of the Tundra is still telling about the state of the economy.

It's going to be fuel costs that will do it. Once energy prices spike back up again, you'll see a push to repatriate manufacturing.

uh, yes it does if the way the other countries are getting wealthy is by taking the wealth from us.

Oh good. The economist's way of saying "The rich get richer and the poor get to eat cake"

Ya know... Carter told Chrysler what to do as a company also....

Fixed the title up there for ya....