Drew Dowdell

Well then you did something wrong because the prices you pulled are either wrong or purposely selective. +1 on the Lambda-lanche.

In 2000? The Eighty Eight had Aurora badges. It's a trick question because there was no 2000 Eighty Eight and 2000 was the body style switchover for the LeSabre However, in 1999, Eighty Eight could come with a supercharger and LeSabre came with Dramamine..... *dramatic voice* STANDARD!

That's the botox

He is delusional because he'll maintain that if only the CTS-V/Lucerne/Impala/Whatever had DOHC instead of pushrod, they'd finally be able to sell them... yet at the same time, Olds had a nearly entire lineup of DOHC goodness, and still the 3800 is still here and the 3.5 and 4.0 are gone. He is delusional because the prices he quoted are entirely wrong.

Not sure where you're getting your numbers, but yet again, you're wrong: Silverado LTZ is $42k Sierra Denali is $43k - can be optioned up into the low 50s. Base MSRP for the Colorado work truck is $15,085 Base MSRP for the Canyon work truck is $15,085 Top trim for the Colorado starts at $26,940 Top trim for the Canyon starts at $30,005 Tahoe Base MSRP: $34,630 - $50,900 Yukan Base MSRP: $35,345 - $52,630 Suburban 1500 Base MSRP: $38,085 - $52,960 Yukon XL 1500 Base MSRP: $38,915 - $55,435 Suburban 2500 Base MSRP: $39,495 - $47,840 Yukon XL 2500 Base MSRP: $40,335 - $50,025

Powertrain mule? What's with the f-ed up exhaust?

Of all the divisions out there, they are the most "badge job".

Truck buyers are a fickle lot. The costs associated with badging GMC are probably the least of any division. If GMC lets GM sell trucks to people who wouldn't buy Chevies, and at a higher price point, then I'm all for it. What do you think they've been since at least 1947?

You're still full of it. People can't get financing to buy a $30k car. The G8 is an unknown. The Lucerne and all the rest you mentioned have name equity where the G8 does not. If GM is a fault for anything, it's this. Had the G8 been named Bonneville and marketed...like.. at all... G8 would do much better. Every review of the G8 mentions the weight and then says you never notice it. So there goes your idea. It's a credit/finance thing. Unfortunately the G8 will suffer solely because of a bad economy.

BMW and Mercedes can't even blow the CTS out of the water. Honda and Toyota can't blow the Malibu out of the water. ..... yet you expect GM to blow itself out of the water?

EVERYONE was down in November! A wise man predicted to me that in this thread you'd say "Just wait till the 2010 M5 comes out!" Well guess what, the 2010 M5 will still be down a lot of power compared to the CTS-V and GM hasn't even dialed up the boost yet. Edit: And Cadillac proves that you don't need to spend $87k to have the best. BMW puts a LOT of money into making super high tech engines.... well guess what.. they still came up short. The CTS-V is simpler AND faster.

Personally, I think the sale/killing of Saturn is the least likely part of this whole plan.

Last Seen: 27th November 2008 - 01:18 PM

Patrick Stewart's version of Christmas Carol. Simply the best.

He's a troll.

Eat it SMK.

18 Billion is nothing compared to what DC has passed out to AIG, Citi, and the rest. 18 Billion is 1.8 months of Iraq war. Edit: And in the case of GM, the government ACTUALLY HAS A CHANCE TO GET THE MONEY BACK!

But we don't know entirely what is in the pipeline. It seems to me that Buick has far more growth potential with a chance at higher profits than Pontiac does.

A large reason they needed to protect market share so vigorously was because the unions hog tied them. I believe in the Sigma plant not a human hand touches the car until the end of the line, yet I am SURE GM had to keep people in the jobs bank despite this new higher level of automation. The union, preventing workforce flexibility, is what started the market share snowball. Whoever came up with that Jobs bank idea should be tied to the back of Wagoneer's Malibu Hybrid and dragged to DC. Whoever agreed to it should be tied to the front bumper.

If the Prius only exists because of the Pruis, does that mean the Prius only exists because of the Insight and the Insight only exists because of the EV-1?

It's global, Tata was also down some 40%, Spain's entire market was down 50%.

What part of "range extender" do you not understand?

Which market forces? The ones in Japan preventing the sale of imported goods? Or the market forces that gave massive *read complete* tax breaks to the foreign companies to build factories here. Maybe it's the market force of socialized medicine in Japan...how nice of a force it must be for Toyota to have it's healthcare tab picked up by the Emperor.

Because if GM even imagined about closing a production line, the UAW would have a fit. Workers displaced by robots got to go to the job bank for nearly full salary. The Camaro can only be built in Canada. GM has to pay for UAW member's "member" medication (viagra). As such, GM and the others were forced to keep vehicles in production simply to keep revenue flowing to pay people they no longer actually needed. Simply put, they had to have the volume to support workers that would have been otherwise laid off due to technological advances or other improvements in efficiency. Think of the big blotches on GM's record. They come, not from skimping, but from GM trying to change and innovate but being raked over the coals when they failed. Cadillac 8-6-4 : I'm sure this cost GM a TON of money to develop. The idea was a sound one, however the technology wasn't up to the task. The idea failed and Cadillac yanked the engine after just one year on the market.... yet in 2008, I still read CTS reviews that mention this engine. Vega: was one of the first automobiles that GM produced that made extensive use of robotic welding equipment. Aztek: was one of the first mid-sized non-truck based crossovers. Again, here was GM trying to innovate. The concept has proven sound yet the product failed due to something as fickle as styling. Quad-4: Look at this. GM fielding DOHC 4-cylinder engines in 1987. Starting in 1989 output was available up to 180hp. 2008 Honda Accord base engine? 177hp. Saturn Ion: A compact car that could come with either a 5-speed, 5-speed automatic, or one of those new fangled CVTs. Failed for styling. I don't want to hear that GM doesn't know how or doesn't want to innovate.

Ya know... I missed that first line about The Onion and got all the way down to the part about FEMA before I flipped over to CNN to try and figure out what I had missed.