Jump to content
Create New...
  • 💬 Join the Conversation

    CnG Logo SQ 2023 RedBlue FavIcon300w.png
    Since 2001, Cheers & Gears has been the go-to hub for automotive enthusiasts. Join today to access our vibrant forums, upload your vehicle to the Garage, and connect with fellow gearheads around the world.

     

  • William Maley
    William Maley

    Bits of the Cadillac Escala Concept Will Show Up In Future Models

      What bits from the Escala concept will show up on future Cadillac models?

    If there was one vehicle that was the talk during Monterey Car Week, it would have to be the Cadillac Escala concept. Unlike other concepts that Cadillac has shown during this time, various ideas will appear on future Cadillac models.

    "There's a lot of stuff that's being captured here. All of that won't necessarily find itself coming out in one car; it will be spread through the portfolio," said Johan de Nysschen, Cadillac's president to Automotive News.

    One of the key items that will be spread around is the Escala's design. Compared to Cadillac's sharp and angular design language, the design on Escala is a complete departure with curves and smooth edges. de Nysschen said production models with this look will arrive in 2019. Automotive News speculates that the next-generation CTS (soon to be renamed CT5) will be the first model to sport the look.

    The twin-turbo 4.2L V8 is another part that will be appearing in future Cadillac models. One vehicle that might get it is the current CT6 sedan. When asked, de Nysschen wouldn't give an answer, only saying the brand is considering it for future models.

    But what about the Escala itself? If we go back to our original story on Friday, we pulled a quote from the press release made by de Nysschen saying the following,

    “Escala is a concept car, but one based upon the unrelenting rise of our product substance. Depending on the development of market segment for large luxury sedans, Escala is a potential addition to our existing product plan.”

    Would it take the place of the long-rumored CT8 or sit beside it? No one is quite sure. But de Nysschen did reveal one important detail about the CT8 project. The model is on hold, not canceled as some reports have said earlier in the year. The reason comes down consumers going toward crossovers and SUVs at a quick rate.

    "These are precisely the things that we are just saying: "Let's step back a moment and see whether it's just an energy/price thing, or is it a more sustained shake-up?'"

    de Nysschen said the brand is looking at various options at the moment such as merging the CT6 and CT8 into one vehicle like the Escala, using a new crossover as the flagship, or doing some combination of the two.

    Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

    User Feedback

    Recommended Comments

    expanded cars should be on hold as they do need to focus on making the product line right and tweaking existing auto's to be best in class.

     

    I am also saying it here, If Johan does not see that the industry is changing and that the focus should be on plug-in Hybrids and EV's, they need to cut him loose and bring in a true visionary. Twin Turbo and V10/12 engines are a dying place that has limited future growth besides 1 to 2 generations out at most covering 4-8 years. I would question putting to many resources into old petro technology.

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    The 4.2 liter V8 could have been used around 2013 for the ATS-V and the CTS V-sport, perhaps CTS-V as well depending on how they tune it, and Escalade and CT6.  In the 2013-2016 time frame as fuel prices dropped, that V8 could have been good to have.  By 2018 or 2019, only the real high dollar stuff will have a V8, and electric will be growing, so that V8 could be too late.

    • Disagree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    20 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

    The 4.2 liter V8 could have been used around 2013 for the ATS-V and the CTS V-sport, perhaps CTS-V as well depending on how they tune it, and Escalade and CT6.  In the 2013-2016 time frame as fuel prices dropped, that V8 could have been good to have.  By 2018 or 2019, only the real high dollar stuff will have a V8, and electric will be growing, so that V8 could be too late.

    Moving the goal posts ahead of time I see....

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Well they needed a twin turbo V8 yesterday, not in 2018.  They will still need one in 2018, there will be luxury buyers that want a V8.  But Electric has to be part of the equation.  The new Model S can do 0-60 in 2.5 seconds, you just can't get that out of a V8 or maybe not even a V12 unless the car has no weight to it.  Electric is the high performance future, the V8 might be the cheap performance future, but if Cadillac wants $70-80k for V6 cars, they will want $90-100k for a V8 and you are getting up to Tesla money.

     

    And Mercedes faces the same problem, the AMG cars have a loyal following, but the E63 can't keep up with a Tesla, they can hope, exhaust note, chassis tuning and ride/handling with interior appointments wins buyers, but they can't win off speed.  Until they make an electric car with 750 hp, which it seems like they are doing, as the Maybach Vision 6 powertrain is already in development.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    The CT6 plug in is no match for a Tesla.  The GLE plug-in is closer to a Tesla Model X than a CT6-PEV is to a Model S, and as Mr. T would say, "I pity the fool who races a GLE550e against a Model X, or tries to match it on electric range."  The GLE550e might be the best value hybrid there is, it is like $900 more than the turbo V6 model and has 100 more hp and double the fuel economy

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    12 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

    The CT6 plug in is no match for a Tesla.  The GLE plug-in is closer to a Tesla Model X than a CT6-PEV is to a Model S, and as Mr. T would say, "I pity the fool who races a GLE550e against a Model X, or tries to match it on electric range."  The GLE550e might be the best value hybrid there is, it is like $900 more than the turbo V6 model and has 100 more hp and double the fuel economy

    You always find a way to get your Mercedes plug in somehow.  Benz's only pure electric is the pathetic little SMART and the B-Class only sold in California, they can't compete with a Tesla either. 

    With 432 lb-ft of torque, the CT6-PHEV will feel plenty fast.

    HP is nearly irrelevant with electric cars, so I don't know why we still look for that number. Tesla's max torque is at ZERO RPM which also means ZERO HORSEPOWER, but it's that fact that make people scream when the car takes off in ludacris mode. 

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    479 lb-ft of torque on the GLE550e and S550e.  But I wouldn't call either of them performance cars, even though they move pretty good for what they are.  

    If the CT6 plug in is like $70-75,000 it could be a compelling buy.   Likewise that powertrain could make sense on a CTS or large crossover.   But that is just par for the course, many lux brands have plug in hybrids now or will within a year.  The game changer technology is at Tesla, they just haven't been able to scale it out in big numbers yet.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Torque moves cars, horsepower sell them. 

    Tesla's horsepower ratings are nearly irrelevant. It's their torque ratings that matter.... and that is only going to become more true as more cars get electrified. 

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Yes, but the Tesla P90D has 713 lb-ft and that is now the 2nd most powerful Model S.  Unlikely to find a V8 putting out 750+ lb-ft to compete with that.  Cadillac needs that 4.2 V8 ASAP while there are still buyers who want V8 power and smoothness, and can't afford a $135k Tesla.  But even when you look at Mercedes, BMW and Audi, their mid-size cars have turbo sixes, and most 7-series and A8s are sixes, Q7 is mostly V6, even the GLS is mostly V6.  Only the top dog stuff has V8 power anymore, and in 10 years electric will replace it.   there is opportunity for Cadillac to offer the V8 at the price point a lot of the other guys are selling a V6, that could win buyers in the near term.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    *SIGH*

    SMK....things are getting fixed at Cadillac.

    Yes. Yes. Cadillac bespoked V8s were needed when Northstar was decided to be phased out and should have been replaced then.

    Northstar was left on the vine to rot. That was then. This is now.

    Using the "corporate" V8 which happens to be THE MOST versatile, MOST lethal, MOST WELL KNOWN V8 on the planet aint a bad move. People that view that as "just a Chevy" engine would never buy a bespoked 4.2 TT V8 Cadillac anyway. Other nitpickings would be found.

    Mr. DFELT had the right idea about Electric power.

    Yes Cadillac needs to move forward with electric power and with this new 4.2 liter V8.

    GM has decent EV technology. Better than any other internal combustion engine automobile manufacturer in my opinion.

    Lets be honest. Nobody is better than Tesla. Cadillac does not need to be better than Tesla like Mercedes or BMW or Audi has to be for image. 

    The P100 is with us at Tesla.

    Porsche could talk a big game but unfortunately for Porsche, money talks and BS walks. And that is true for every internal combustion engine automobile manufacturer at this point in time.

    Cadillac has not talked a big EV game so there is no pressure there to be the best unlike the Germans are doing. And so far, other than BMW, they dont even HAVE an EV themselves.

    For all we know, Cadillac is probably keeping it hush hush on their EV technology. We do know it exists through Chevrolet....we just dont know how Cadillac will advance it for their vehicles. Speculation is all we have. I think Johan learned from the ELR mistakes.

    As far as the Escala goes, like every other Cadillac concept in the last 15 years, its just a styling exercise...I doubt the Hoffmeister kink will make it to production.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    16 hours ago, smk4565 said:

    The 4.2 liter V8 could have been used around 2013 for the ATS-V and the CTS V-sport, perhaps CTS-V as well depending on how they tune it, and Escalade and CT6.  In the 2013-2016 time frame as fuel prices dropped, that V8 could have been good to have.  By 2018 or 2019, only the real high dollar stuff will have a V8, and electric will be growing, so that V8 could be too late.

    Why would they need a V8 to do what the V6 did? This kind of goes against everything CAFE related downsizing. I think we would have liked to HEAR a V8 in the ATS-V but that's nothing more than noises because it isn't like the TT3.6 needed anymore power or tq. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    15 hours ago, smk4565 said:

    The CT6 plug in is no match for a Tesla.  The GLE plug-in is closer to a Tesla Model X than a CT6-PEV is to a Model S, and as Mr. T would say, "I pity the fool who races a GLE550e against a Model X, or tries to match it on electric range."  The GLE550e might be the best value hybrid there is, it is like $900 more than the turbo V6 model and has 100 more hp and double the fuel economy

    LOL You're joking, right? Have you heard of these vehicles called the Volt, Prius, or ANYTHING CHEAPER THAN 70k! 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    12 hours ago, smk4565 said:

    Yes, but the Tesla P90D has 713 lb-ft and that is now the 2nd most powerful Model S.  Unlikely to find a V8 putting out 750+ lb-ft to compete with that.  Cadillac needs that 4.2 V8 ASAP while there are still buyers who want V8 power and smoothness, and can't afford a $135k Tesla.  But even when you look at Mercedes, BMW and Audi, their mid-size cars have turbo sixes, and most 7-series and A8s are sixes, Q7 is mostly V6, even the GLS is mostly V6.  Only the top dog stuff has V8 power anymore, and in 10 years electric will replace it.   there is opportunity for Cadillac to offer the V8 at the price point a lot of the other guys are selling a V6, that could win buyers in the near term.

    @smk4565 We all know they have a TT V8 coming. This probably will be the last big power engine or next to last as we do not need them no matter how much you keep pounding the drum of "A true luxury auto company has TTV8, V10, V12, etc.. The fact is that Torque moves auto's and plug-in hybrids and pure EVs are coming and the future will be bright with a whole new way of rating engines.

    You and every auto magazine / web site out there needs to accept that the days of HP are coming to a close.

    Welcome to the 21st century!

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    19 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Why would they need a V8 to do what the V6 did? This kind of goes against everything CAFE related downsizing. I think we would have liked to HEAR a V8 in the ATS-V but that's nothing more than noises because it isn't like the TT3.6 needed anymore power or tq. 

    @ccap41 I agree that we can use smaller size to accomplish larger size. My concern is the whole marketing story about better MPG. I really do not buy it and you can now make that V6 or even a 4 banger sound like a V8, 10 or 12 as the tuning of mufflers is amazing now.

    Gonna Call it now, next tuning will be in sound for the Hybrids and EVs. People will want their own unique sound when driving these Electron Pocket Rockets! :P

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    24 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    @ccap41 I agree that we can use smaller size to accomplish larger size. My concern is the whole marketing story about better MPG. I really do not buy it and you can now make that V6 or even a 4 banger sound like a V8, 10 or 12 as the tuning of mufflers is amazing now.

    Gonna Call it now, next tuning will be in sound for the Hybrids and EVs. People will want their own unique sound when driving these Electron Pocket Rockets! :P

    I honestly don't think it is some marketing ploy. I think it has waaaaay more to do with how the driver drives because if the driver is actually cruising at a certain speed or not flooring it at stop lights you really shouldn't be in the boost and it's almost like a n/a smaller engine. I can't imagine the CAFE regulations would have a loophole to where they can built smaller turbo engines that are just as inefficient as the older, larger n/a ones. That just doesn't make sense. I do think that the way manufacturers are trying to eliminate boost and produce gobs of low end tq is hurting mpg as boost is coming on so early and often now. I actually think a little lag would improve mileage to stay out of the boost for a tad longer. 

    Show me a video of a 4 banger sounding like a V8, V10, or V12... <_<

    Edited by ccap41
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    28 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    @smk4565 We all know they have a TT V8 coming. This probably will be the last big power engine or next to last as we do not need them no matter how much you keep pounding the drum of "A true luxury auto company has TTV8, V10, V12, etc.. The fact is that Torque moves auto's and plug-in hybrids and pure EVs are coming and the future will be bright with a whole new way of rating engines.

    You and every auto magazine / web site out there needs to accept that the days of HP are coming to a close.

    Welcome to the 21st century!

    I actually think the half ton trucks are starting to push this. I'm pretty sure the F150 commercials talk up their 420 torques while GM still talks about horsepower in their Silverados/Sierras. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    7 hours ago, ccap41 said:

    LOL You're joking, right? Have you heard of these vehicles called the Volt, Prius, or ANYTHING CHEAPER THAN 70k! 

    The plug in hybrid GLE is less than $1,000 more than the turbo V6.  No plug in is $1,000 more than the car it is based off of.  This is like the plug in Prius selling for $500 more than the base car.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    8 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    Don't mind @smk4565 this is just him moving the goal posts. When Cadillac beats his beloved Benz at something, his pivot is now to "oh yea?! well Cadillac isn't as good as Tesla". 

    It's really borderline trolling. 

    What did Cadillac beat Benz at?  Building a twin turbo V8 next year?  Pretty much every vehicle Mercedes makes has a twin turbo V8 option.  

    Mercedes has a Tesla problem too because their AMG cars can't run with a Model S, luckily the Model S P100 is $35k more than an E63 but if that price gap closes Mercedes has some trouble because the V8 is never going to beat the electric motor.  Mercedes might be able to win on ride or handling.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites



    Join the conversation

    You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
    Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

    Guest
    Add a comment...

    ×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

      Only 75 emoji are allowed.

    ×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

    ×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

    ×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Support Real Automotive Journalism

    Cheers and Gears Logo

    Since 2001, Cheers & Gears has delivered real content and honest opinions — not emotionless AI output or manufacturer-filtered fluff.

    If you value independent voices and authentic reviews, consider subscribing. Plans start at just $2.25/month, and paid members enjoy an ad-light experience.*

    You can view subscription options here.

    *a very limited number of ads contain special coupon deals for our members and will show

  • Similar Content

  • Posts

    • Id like to add:  Because it seems NOBODY wants to talk about the REALITY OF WHY manufacturing will NEVER come back to North America no matter WHAT kind of monies we throw at it to try to bring it back. And FYI, NOBODY is REALLY investing in ACTUALLY bringing back manufacturing to North America...  PRELUDE Nixon opened up the door to do trade with China. (not a bad thing) Reagan allowed Wallstreet and corporate America to move manufacturing from the US to China.  (In hindsight, a very bad thing for what it was to be)  CHAPTER 1 The industrial revolution arrived. It supercharged the British Empire and it helped to introduce a young country into being a very powerful nation in the decades to come.  We are here to talk about the young nation and not about the British Empire. CHAPTER 2 Ultimately, the industrial revolution brought many innovations on how to produce and manufacture even more efficiently and faster.  It helped win a world war or two and the last man standing so to speak allowed this young nation become almost the sole superpower on the planet. CHAPTER 3  Many many many products were produced.  Many many new technologies came to be that introduced a new modern society. And those new modern products also brought with them NEW MANUFACTURING TECHNIQUES. CHAPTER 4 Remember when I said that this new nation rose up to the challenge to help win a world war or two?  Well, it was the industrial revolution ace up the sleeve that the USA had and the sheer amount of war machines produced efficiently and with speed was the key to these victories.  Especially that last world war.  When the war was over, the USA enjoyed the technology of mass production that was the envy of the world. (remember the bolded part.) CHAPTER 5  Eventually, manufacturing left the USA to go to China. The world followed suit.  China produces the world's gadgets. CHAPTER 6   (THIS IS THE IMPORTANT CHAPTER THAT NOBODY TALKS ABOUT) China has invested TRILLIONS of dollars in manufacturing. Why? THE WORLD depends on it. China holds itself PROUD to be the world's producer of goods. China wants to CONTINUE TO BE the world's producer of goods. So...China has upgraded their manufacturing plants to be very very state of the art. They will CONTINUE to INVEST not only in monies to ALWAYS RENOVATE their manufacturing plants, but they TEACH their populace to go to ENGINEERING schools so they could ALWAYS have STATE OF THE ART MANUFACTURING.  CHAPTER 7    (ALSO IMPORTANT THAT NOBODY TALKS ABOUT) The USA actually stopped renovating in manufacturing looong before the manufacturing plants left for China. But that is not the issue. The issue is, there are NO monies invested RIGHT now to bring back manufacturing. There are NO plants being built.  LOL tariffs...   And where are those monies from the tariffs?   No American company has invested in manufacturing plants to be built. No American company has worked with AMERICAN engineering schools to teach graduating students to manufacture goods in the USA to actually be with techniques of the early 2000s let alone 2025.  Loooooong gone are those 1930s/1940s/1950s techniques...  We are in 2025 let us not forget.   The USA doesnt even have the TOOLING of those 1930s/1940s/1950s plants. Those were sold to China and elsewhere in the world, but those metal tooling dies right now, have probably been recycled. NEW technologies to manufacture...   CHAPTER 8  (A TRUTH THAT WILL PROBABLY HURT BUT DEFINITELY NOT TALKED ABOUT) A certain American does not favour education.  This certain American favours ignorance.   MOST Americans do NOT want to work in a factory.  But ALL Americans do NOT realize MODERN factory work is NOT how it used to be.  To be fair, Apple iPhone workers in China committing suicide because of shytty work hours is also loooong gone. But then again, American media does not allow for  American peoples to know what a modern manufacturing plant consists of.  Also, engineering is too hard for those subset of Americans to actually learn how to manufacture goods in a modern state of the art way to not only compete with China, but to surpass their prowess in manufacturing to BRING BACK manufacturing from China to the USA.    CHAPTER 9 (ALSO IGNORED) And even if, some manufacturing plants came back to the USA.   There is something that we learned DURING the industrial revolution that says the USA will NEVER get ANY manufacturing plants back.  Sheer volume.  The WORLD has China to produce its goods.  China will ALWAYS remain CHEAPER to produce there just BECAUSE of economies of scale.   The skilled labour is in China.  The raw materials are shipped to China to produce whatever you want to produce. ALL the plants of whatever you have thought of producing whatever you want are ALL in China.  All kinds of different ports exist in China to accept ALL kinds of RAW materials.  ALL the ports are huuuuuge in China. ALL the ports are state of the art.  The BOATS to ship ANYTHING ALL OVER THE WORLD are ALL in China.  The boats are huuuuge and the ports could accept them.  And ALL that coordination is done by STATE OF THE ART communication, education and logistics.   PS:  China and the Chinese government subsidize world ports. The USA once did that...  The USA declares the  Panama Canal as their own.  Past history is past history in subsidizing the canal, but China actually finances it PRESENTLY to open up a bigger canal.  The USA whines abut the name of Gulf of Mexico....      In 2025, CHINA is the envy of the world in manufacturing techniques.     No...manufacturing is NEVER coming back to the USA.   Forget about tariffs, ICE agents, DOGE, assassinations, school shootings and everything wrong (or right) about right wing politics  and left wing lunacy.  THOSE are  just ADDED reasons NOT to do business in the USofA. 
    • IIRC the other founder of Turning Point died of Covid after denying safety steps for covid or something. You can argue morality and logic, but the impacts/results/effects of what you do are objective and real.  A bit of non political fun, this is gorgeous.  If I wasn't turning 60 years old today, I would drive that damn thing. 
    • 100% spot on analysis of Kirk. Yes, the way he died was horrible, no matter what side of the political spectrum on which you stand. However, let us not ignore the man's ACTUAL words and actions that helped fuel the "radicalization" of certain factions in this country and create this exact scenario where someone decided to take matters into their own armed hands. Ten years of pure madness fueled by one giant narcissistic A-Hole in D.C.
    • This guy gets the toxic state of America right on so many levels. it's pretty much cooked.  Drew feel free to delete this if need be. 
    • I like a lot of this guys analysis, he explains well why American manufacturing is declining at a greater and greater pace and why jobs are moving away from the United States.   
  • Who's Online (See full list)

  • My Clubs

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.

Hey there, we noticed you're using an ad-blocker. We're a small site that is supported by ads or subscriptions. We rely on these to pay for server costs and vehicle reviews.  Please consider whitelisting us in your ad-blocker, or if you really like what you see, you can pick up one of our subscriptions for just $1.75 a month or $15 a year. It may not seem like a lot, but it goes a long way to help support real, honest content, that isn't generated by an AI bot.

See you out there.

Drew
Editor-in-Chief

Write what you are looking for and press enter or click the search icon to begin your search