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Suaviloquent

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Everything posted by Suaviloquent

  1. Suaviloquent
    The biggest telling clue is that when we do a thought experiment where every car and truck available was already fully electric anyways and the Bolt and Tesla were just among two of the new models, would they still be comparable? Absolutely not.
  2. Suaviloquent
    Jeep has been printing money the better part of this last decade - arguably just on the Grand Cherokee alone... They really can't go wrong with this.
  3. Suaviloquent
    Actually there's been some words being thrown around that Alpha was never meant to be used for a crossover vehicle - something about packaging issues or some other prescient issue. Anyways, I think it's perfectly fine for Cadillac to build crossovers on the newest Epsilon and Chi platforms. They're great bones, just like the CD4 that Ford uses for its midsize Edge and MKX. Differentiation is also pretty good. There is no paradigm for Cadillac making high performance SUVs or crossovers, so that might be the last priority on the list. They just need a vehicle that some stuffed shirt can finally say it's the best interior in its class and make sure the car has gimmicky top-end headlights and things - you know, what really sets apart the current crop of Cadillacs against the Germans - available top-end content and thereby price as tested. They have the driving dynamics right, but I'm not sure if that's as big as concern for buyers. And with the industry approaching self-driving cars, it just won't matter to a huge cross-section of buyers across every segment.
  4. Suaviloquent
    Plus the Volt just recently sold 100,000 copies. Add a couple thousand plug-in Sparks, and this year's full sales of Volt, and by the time the Model 3 starts the first real bulk of deliveries... Any potential pricing aid AFTER taxes the Bolt will have will be most likely be limited too. And the way Tesla has planned production, the highest trim, loaded models will make the initial production runs. So I think people buying the Tesla are not as sensitive to price. Again. I would refrain from comparing the cars. Because they just can't be compared if the only basis of comparison is base model range.
  5. Suaviloquent
    But the thing is I'm not enamored with the car. I'm not really defending the car as much as I was some intelligible debate. I like it - yeah. But remember, it's turned me over from it being in total failure territory. And I like it for different reasons. I would say given what you want, this and the new CT6 are near equals. And I'm not the only one who would say that. The owner of this site, having spent some decent time with it had this same impression. William didn't. But William just didn't like the styling of the car. I've stipulated the whole time - it's got a fair shot, and in China it's just a shoo-in. It seems like the right way to build a large sedan if you're trying to see the field 5-6 years from now. They're not too vested in it if the large sedan segment dies entirely over here. And compared to the car it's replacing, it's a far cry from the bloated and deficient mutilated Taurus pig.
  6. Suaviloquent
    Okay, my bad. I read a different source what made that obliviously erroneous claim. It still doesn't matter even if the Tesla can't get the credit. It surely affects the deposits for sure. Closer to production may have like 500,000 orders. Again, even turning 30% of them is huge for Tesla, an single EV car on its own. Because the two vehicles are not comparable. One is a a bona-fide premium car. The premium being RWD and being a Tesla, being sold for a very fair price. And even $42,000 for a typically optioned Model 3, being a car only 20% smaller than the Model S yet being perhaps half as expensive is a huge breakthrough. It's pretty clear though. Lump vehicles with the vehicles they actually compete with. It'll be Bolt v Leaf. For Tesla is Tesla v. everyone else. And with those, it's no contest. You know I did read an article about a 2017 BMW 330e today. 12 miles of electric range. Plug-in. I laughed at it. How incompetent the roundel has become....
  7. Suaviloquent
    Yeah, but what are your underlying reasons for this car not meeting Lincoln's objectives? What are you being realistic about?! What!? Especially when I have given a more than credible argument that this vehicle will deliver the product experience exactly like they say it will. If you say again, it's more of the same, I'll point to again, yeah, and more of the same actually means a very credible luxury product for a one that should have a heavy emphasis on passenger coddling. Which is exactly what Lincoln say's they're selling. The car was designed for China first. Any sales here, will just be a bonus for Lincoln. Somehow that's being overly optimistic. It shouldn't be this easy for me to pick apart what someone really doesn't like about this vehicle. Really the heart of it is disbelief is that non-paying, non-existent, people who already have an ill opinion (which people forget, I really hated the premise of the car when it was initially leaked it would happen) that Lincoln can actually market a credible luxury vehicle, without investing the massive resources to create a best-in-class vehicle, which it isn't.
  8. Suaviloquent
    Look, I called you on something you claimed to have not said, and I never really praised the this vehicle other than say why it is differentiated against everyone else. Go ahead, speak volumes how it's going to fail. RE : See my post about how many things I give.... I just meekly said, it'll do what Lincoln needs the car to do. Any sales in America are just a bonus. This car is pretty viable too. It won't suffer from recuperating an immense overhead of an all new platform (and rumoured cancelled outlets to increase scale) that some of its rivals are debuting. And it just has more brand awareness than something like the new Genesis, which I think arguably makes a better product - but is devoid of a soul or heritage. It's going to sell. And there is credible market positioning for it. And people making posts about my character instead of this vehicle? I don't get into those theatrics. They're just lame statements. Don't post something without understanding the consequences of being quoted. Again, I posted everything linked to why this vehicle will do well. It won't overturn the status quo. But that's not what it was meant to do, and it's not like a carmaker leading everyone to believe that their car will be a return to greatness only to have a change in management to call that same vehicle less than flagship worthy.
  9. Suaviloquent
    I like the car for everything it does other than how it drives. And I can predict exactly how it will drive. Which is why the hatorade against this car is so misplaced. And everything that has been said about the Conti either regards to its styling or its interior. Now the styling, up to anyone's taste. But the interior material quality has been for the most part very liked. Other than that, people hate this car on car forums. Not the target demographic by any means. They do it because they can't reconcile the fact that most luxury brands are abandoning the kind of vehicle this car represents. Instead of embracing the heritage of being a land yacht or magic carpet, most large luxury sedans are trying to chase either BMW or Tesla in terms of being technologically advanced, and the driver's choice - which they may be, but it's irrelevant. That's how the Merecedes S-Class became the popular technologically advanced magic carpet. Now does the Lincoln go against that? Hell no. It's just a top sedan worthy for the Lincoln name, something they've never had for a while. But this car again, brings an advanced AWD system available, a credible interior, and an exterior that looks like what a large land barge should look like. Aside from that, if you're in a market, where the height of power is shown off by you not driving, and you want to differentiate yourself from other tycoon wannabes - the Lincoln landing at your shore is timely thing.
  10. Suaviloquent
    No matter what price you pay for the Bolt, you only get a 200 mile range. But with the Tesla offering closer to 300 miles of range in optional upgrades, and at the same time sport sedan rivaling (or given how the Model S is the quick sedan on the planet) or beating speed, how much of the price of the Tesla actually hot air? None. The $42,000 typical option range could perhaps include dual motors and like 240 miles of range. I just see Tesla being a far more credibile brand for electric vehicles, because atleast they're not worried about their gasoline vehicles poaching the sales potential of their plug-in electric vehicle. Or worried about quashing the premise of their premier plug-in hybrid to exist. The Bolt gets rid of range anxiety for the most part and is more practical. If GM used their scale as such a large automaker to impact the charging infrastructure rate of development, the Volt would be completely lacking any real reason to exist.
  11. Suaviloquent
    So again, the tax credit can only be used up to the full amount of liability, not excess. Which means if you owe more tax, you benefit more. Which still means people will pay sticker before the incentives have any part to play.
  12. Suaviloquent
    There are some minivans that offer more value for less. I might consider something like the new Pacifica. But we gotta remember - this thing has a lot of incentives. I'm pretty sure most people pay a good chunk below invoice for these. So realistically, the price ceiling is like $35,000. Probably a Kia Sedona Minivan. Or Pacifica.
  13. Suaviloquent
    But no I don't like the Model 3's style. Do people really forget what I post. Lemme grab an anecdote for ya.... Nope I don't like the way it looks. Wrong again. Oh my... but the Bolt is mash-up of what many commentators sin on other vehicles. But the way Mary Barra answered the question of them attempting to develop EV infrastructure she flat out said that GM has no EV strategy beyond marketing their cars. And DFelt, I going to assume you've mixed how the federal discount works... It's marginal. Which means when you pass the quota, you still get a rebate, but it is reduced in half. Then you sell another block amount, and its cut in half again. After that block amount. which is a lot of sales, it finally goes away. I'm going to slam it home that the Bolt and Model 3 don't compete against each other. And that is a notion that makes the Bolt look better. Because it alleviates itself from having to live up to the expectations of the Model 3. And it's truly a compliance car. GM needs to increase it's corporate FE. Tesla doesn't. Any traditional automaker is still making compliance cars. And I truly believe that GM does not want the Bolt to be a wild success. It's because they want no part in helping it succeed. The Bolt will sell becauase of what it says on brochure - it'll comply to the new standards. The Model 3 - it speaks for itself. The people have spoken, a huge chunk of would-be alternative vehicle buyers are voting with their wallets as we speak. And remember - Tesla only needs to convert half or even less of the pre-orders to make it into the big leagues. Plus, I like how the most expensive component; with the Panasonic/Tesla partnership, will result in batteries made in America. The Bolt can have it written in the fine print, that the most expensive component is from Korea.
  14. Suaviloquent
    Yet they're imported the hot Renegade from Italy. I bet they'd have much more supply of the new crossovers, and sell even more of them in America if SHAP was tooled from them.
  15. Suaviloquent
    Okay suave. I'm trying to be civilized here. Show me where I said it was "more of the same" because I'm sure I didn't and that's your problem. You don't even know who you are arguing with at this point. Bong said it was more of the same. Now are you trying to equate my argument with his? If so, then that is pure fail on your part. It's a f@#king car so ease up on the throttle and keep your arguments straight next time.To the down vote troll: Sorry you are only allowed one per day. My arguments have always been the same, always consistent. And I don't know what anyone is trying to prove. I dismissed the 40,000 people interested in this car. All I said was there are some tangible reasons to consider this car. And none of those elicit comparison to sport sedans at the same size and price point. Then I projected its performance, which is a sin to do. But again, what are you comparing the car to?! A sport sedan - go ahead, pick apart how the car will drive, even though no one has driven it yet. And then I used the more of the same thinking to pull up relevant anecdotes of how the recent MKX has fared in reviews. And if the car drives like a sedan version of that - then it's pretty clear the appeal of the vehicle is exactly what Lincoln says it will be - comfort and not ground-breaking handling, but surprisingly competent. t's pretty clear to me, anyone who has posted against me just flat out hates the car or what it represents. Why I am to bother trying to explain that the brand that will make this car has already forgone the possibility that those people will consider the car, even though they've never driven the car either. I can trace every word I've posted, and all of it ties back to this.
  16. Suaviloquent
    Umm...what? Based off of what information? All we know is that Lincoln has struggled in the sedan market just as much as everyone else (and more so in most cases) yet you think more of the same will make it better? Sorry but changing the name from MKS to Continental does not a barometer of success make so I don't know how can make that assessment Suave (knowing all that). Ask and you shall receive.
  17. Suaviloquent
    Alright, you want to keep churning? Alright Of course I like the car. But more than that.,the same people who haven't driven the car rag on it without driving either. And then some General Moron told me that "you're not an optimist!" But I'm just saying it won't be a sharp scalpel like the Cadillac CT6. I won't be a super-sport sedan that "driving" enthusiasts say they love. And there is nothing wrong with that. Driving enthusiasts FOR large sedans are about to be extinct. And for what factual reason am I wrong in saying it'll drive like a sedan version of the Lincoln MKX! You're the one who said it's more of the same! And it is what I just iterated. Sheesh.
  18. Suaviloquent
    How are they even comparable given all they share is an electric drivetrain! that's the point I'm raising! Am I supposed to start comparing something like a Focus ST or Verano 2.0T to Cadillac ATS 2.0T? Just because one shares a similar drivetrain, doesn't mean they're comparable. The Bolt and Model 3 are not in the same league. PERIOD. And yes, compared to the Tesla, the Bolt isn't as desirable. I've already said I don't like any electric vehicle. But it's not even close. GM has also said they're not in it for real - they don't have a strategy to develop EV infrastructure. The Bolt is just a compliance car. Compare it to the incoming Leaf. But the Tesla is going after bigger game. The Bolt is indeed more practical. But that doesn't reconcile the fact that we NEED to remove the powertrain - namely being electric out of the mix. I can't fathom now starting to say somehow say a Cadillac ATS and Chevy Sonic now compete. People buying electric, they're forced to choose from slim pickings. Okay. But once the electric car options flesh out, it'll appear just nonsensical to compare the two cars - when they speak to totally different customers. And for the price gulf, the Model 3 even starting below the Chevy Bolt is just a huge victory.
  19. Suaviloquent
    This isn't stupid hypotheticals, And if it is, then damn well I'll call it out like it is, people all over the net salivate when they project how a car will drive for other brands. People here project ALL the time that if a car is Cadillac it'll drive a lot like a preceding car - or that it'll follow their mantra of beating the roundel at their own game. OR if's BMW it's going to be softer than they used to be. Or that Audi really hasn't changed much in their recent redesigns. Or how the S90 will be a sedan version of the XC90. Example: CT6 will drive like larger in size CTS. And no this is no hypothetical. It's a fact. They're loosely based on the same architecture - the Lincoln MKX and the Conti. Do people here really think what I said is really inconceivable? Given how much emphasis Lincoln has put on one theme, I'm beyond sure that the Conti will drive exactly how I explained it. It's mind-boggling that you would disagree with me Surreal. You don't even have a point to make. I find a lot of nonsense that quite is just out of bad taste. People just have it for Lincoln just because they want that automaker to make a car to please them. I'm not even a staunch supporter of the brand. But I know exactly how the car will drive. That is a fact. It's stupidity. I don't why people get off of it for other brands. And I'm not making a big IF, and if I am, I just called it on other cars as well. The Lincoln will drive exactly like how I said it will. The details might differ - the overall theme won't.
  20. Suaviloquent
    But, but... that strategy of making sure product is top notch (where Cadillac models still lack in some cases) and capable of pulling high margins its own is a means to an end. The same end of increased sales and profits. Which the rest of the industry is also attempting to do. Like outside of the CLA/GLA - Mercedes spent a lot of time perfecting the C-Class, AMG C63. It's overall execution on luxury and sport is what allowed it to beat the ATS-V, even with worse performance and much higher price.
  21. Suaviloquent
    There was a ghost that manifested. Anyways, the mark of the ghost... I will try to get rid of it. Ghost - please stop doing the +/- on anyone. Please.
  22. Suaviloquent
    On the issue of traction alone, FWD cars do better in snow. But I don't think that is why it doesn't sell very well. The problem with the Chevy SS is that despite being a great performance car - it can only convince those at the fringes that its marginal increases in performance are worth it over a MOPAR LX vehicle. Despite me thinking those two cars would attract two totally different buyers... And it's not exactly expensive, but I don't think it's an outright bargain. It's low volume keeps it priced high, but it must have terrific resale just like the Zeta GTO. I think the person who gets the SS is a Chevy die-hard. And it's great that there's an option for them. But I just think the business case is weak, and gets much weaker as time goes by.
  23. Suaviloquent
    Dammit I should have ordered 5 of the Buick Stage ones!!!
  24. Suaviloquent
    Ah.... It's just an online bean-counter.
  25. Suaviloquent
    Not even that. Some companies that we know of purposely released half-baked vehicles in the past, only to have to rush refreshes to make them competitive. That's the same as delaying a model to get it right - making a mistake to rush to market, then hyping a vehicle only to fail to meet expectations.
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