razoredge

Well heres a 6 year old 3.5 V8 Displacement: 3586 cc Horsepower: 395 bhp @ 8500 rpm Torque: 275 lb-ft @ 4750 rpm Redline: 8500 rpm So I owuld think for a basic transport car GM could do better than 2 out of a 3. Im not talking about this for the large cars, we have those V8's. I love my old 3.8's better than anyone I think, but Im tired of hearing about smoothness and quiteness so why keep fighting this V6 when it just not naturally balanced. Besides that we know they can get just as much per cube out of an 8 as a 6 as a 4

Well now, how about that sourthern California fellas ? :unsure: Custom capitol of the world!

We have a dealer here that has a "Hugeathon" :lol: Every Aug for the whole month he or his staff work straight through and the goal is to sell 1000 Hyundias, he really has put alot of Hyundais on the road around these parts. I know hes hurting the other dealers, that 10/100,000 really has to sell too.

1985 328 Gts V8 Displacement: 3185 cc Horsepower: 260 bhp @ 7000 rpm Torque: 213 lb-ft @ 5500 rpm Redline: 7700 rpm of course I realize the NSX represents the more ronded off corners of the next decade. Previous I would consider the Dino or Maserati The Bora 1971-78 used a quad-cam V8 which produced 310bhp in its initial 4719cc Merek '72-'83 Dino 1967-73 206GT & 246GT I have always liked how they incorporated the rear wing with the body on the NSX, the Dino has the old style rear tail incorporated into the body I like cars <_<

Then NSX more remindes me of the 308 GTS, 328 combined with the Camaro roof. The Japanese were very fond of Italian cars back when, I know there was a decent Fiat/Lancia/Abarth following in Japan 70's 80's, so I know what inspired this car. AND yes I was harsh, Im just haveing a sick of Japanese this and Japanese that - week........month.........year :lol: I know we make fun of and laugh about the "Ricers" but really they are just dressing their cars up to look like low slung race cars, customized and for the street. As for Creativity, Im always in favor of the high use of al lu men nem but thats nothing new, but still rare. That little Lotus is an interesting build. The Corvette is a rearward mounted front engine, little different than mid engine except for which axle the engine is mounted "midship". Then the Corvette has a rear transaxle. Out the window with your weight dist. Tomato, tomato, that darn little rear opposed engine, Porsche is still makeing the best of the GT classes 40 some years later. Back with the 928 Porsche introduction R&T made much of their usage of the rear transaxle. They also made much of the 84 Vette that they achieved 1. g on the skid pad. In that test it was picked out #1, and felt to outperform the others. They were the Porsche 928, Ferrari 308 GTS {I think} maybe 328 but I cant remember what or if there was a fourth car. Seems like there was. R&T also made much of the Fiero and its layout and especially the body and chassis engineering. So anywho the Corvette has quite a little{LARGE} drivetrain in it. I think you'll also find the C6 headlights were worked & fitted versions of the C5R's headlight. Its a good thing quite a few people buy and love Corvettes, elsewise we would not have them. :)

Boy, fellas I see your still nit pickin. Of course someone needs to drive a car and will make there pick based on that and appearence. However if you cant get anything from those specs, on the positive side, it shows exactly what I have been saying. Gm simply doesnt stand a chance. Those spec show that the Lacrosse is priced, sized and performed competitively in all areas. We have heard all kinds of talk about the size and interior room and engine specs and old chassis but yet these specs show that the Lacrosse is right there with the competition. "Level of engineering" or "technology" give me a break ! Never happy, never, never, never, never, never, never. wah, wah, wah, wah, wah :( Dont cry :(

Who gives a crap, its Japanese. Its a Japanese copy of an Italian car. Like everything Japanese it shows no creativity, just monkey see monkey do. Kinda looks like a kit car to me, so they came up a little short in the styling department but they got the red paint right :lol: So this is the ultimate Japanese sports car right, and your compareing it to base production Corvette ? Sorry but it falls into ZO6 territory not the better riding more practical C5 or C6. Im sure they are welcome to enter the AMLS anytime they want if they got the brass to step up to the plate. Lets see them finish 3rd and 4th overall against the little prototypes, there just short little races B)

Still interesting how some of that styling precedes anything else I have seen like it by 10 years.

I dont forget, Dads Bday was the 8th. So that helps but I never forget, everyday I remember what went down there and Normandy and Gettysburg and the Potomic and Vietnam and hyjackings. I say never forget the struggles that got us to where we are today. Remember from where you came and embrace it.

I make alot of good points :lol: everyone doesnt want to listen :rolleyes: It seems obvious that V6 is cheaper, otherwise we'd be seeing small V8's instead of the V6's. Correct ? I figure if the 6 is such a hastle go for 3 litre V8. 90* packages better, especially with OHCams those 60*'s are some tall engine.

SO you dont like wood ? Because as for fake.....except for Mercedes and Jag wood was always fake. Not sure about the new rice cars everyone loves, maybe they are using real wood now ? At any rate I know a bit about wood and the wood in the Lacrosse looks like it should. Walnut I believe but Id have to see it again, its been a year. I actually found the gauges were nothing special but I liked the total package because it was different. Do you want all center stacks to be the same ?

So anyhow that was a good post 91Z, I know GM needs better product but I wont tolerate bashing of good GM product because it is not fitting someones personal taste. Difference between not fitting ones taste and bashing. Cant sell cars with people bashing them all the time. Good post

well if GM were to get so refined as you wish, if you needed to, you would resort to comparing volumn control knobs. Your callin me thick, that was an sarcastic example of the nit picking. Im thinking I might not be a thick as you, Ill work on it.

With the new product, what is going to turn off the customer long term ? Buickman has said more than once now that this is not the only problem or the only answer but this will address an imeadiate problem and get some funds for R&D. "Why is this so hard to understand?" turbo - As I have said many times no matter what GM does people such as yourself will not approve, you will turn each and every dealership apart to find a car that has a just slightly better volumn control knob and that will be the end of it for GM, they will be cheap junk. Just your harping on the "must be better than anything else on the market".....proves it. " consistent competition-beating quality and sophistication" holy smokes, they need to beat every car made in every department to please you......proof......it cant be done. Every GM must win the 1/4 mile race Every GM must have 7.459 more hp than any other car Every GM must have the exact interior necessary to not make you whiners whine, just how ITF is that even possible, oh thats right its eazy, just copy that Accord interior Every GM must be capable of achieving the highest lateral G's on the skid pad Every GM must be able to beat all the competition in transitional handling Every GM must have fastest 0-60 Every GM must have best gas milage by at least 5 mpg or it wont count Every GM must have the exact styling that all you Rice and Kraut lovers like.....how in the hell is that even possible.....must be they have to combine all the best attributes of the Accord with the "3 series", but then what will you say? Aint gonna happen but Then, then if they accomplish this, you will tear apart every car on the market until you find that perfect volumn control knob and this crap will start all over again. "GM's volumn control knobs dont feel right on the end of my fingers" "Now look at this Camry, this is a proper volumn control knob" As for my "gloom and doom". Do you see America ? Have you seen America ? Have you witnessed America for the last 4 decades ? If nothing else has survived this "new world economy" and no one is willing to control this "new world economy" within our country why in the hell do you think I would not expect GM, Ford and any other remaining product producing operation to go the way of the rest ? If you dont like being called a GM hater you could stop acting like one. I do after all drive nothing but GM's and am not having all these problems and issues that you are or that you claim exist or have existed, being how my cars are older. I should be explaining to them that they are junk but I rather prefer to pat them on the dash and smile. 86 Buick LeSabre Limited 2dr. - 150,000 miles driven dayly for 4 years/80,000 miles, restored, a strange but wonderful collector car for me, not anyone else, for me! 90 Regency FE3 conversion 328,000 miles drivin dayly, lookin good 90 Ciera Cruiser - 19?,000 miles drivin dayly, could use some paint 97 Oldsmobile LSS/L67 - 110,000 miles now with having the older cars the LSS is only used for special trips or drives but it was drivin dayly for 3 years or 50,000 miles So once again Im not seeing it. I know you would like to get me in a Honda but I will continue to resist.

Thats what I was thinking. Buickman should be placed in other areas throught the US to see if this can work elsewhere other than Michigan. By "sales department" I meant the dealership as well as advertising, in other words the whole scope of selling a product or marketing. There has been more than one instance here of Gm loosing a sale because of the dealership. Theres also the huge problem of perception, it has been mentioned over and over by many posters on this board. So now lets give in to turbo and croc and say yep everything GM has is junk. There is nothing new comming for a year or two and as we all know turbo and croc will hate that stuff as well. But forget that, in the mean time what do you do. Have the dealers take a year off and wait for the next round of junk ? Put everything up for sale, pack the rich pricks wallets and put a paragraph in the history books about how at one time the US was a manufactureing giant that went all to hell because turbo and croc didnt like the products ? No You figure out how to market and promote the product you have on the market at this time. After all there is no better time to start. All of GMs recent products have recieved favorable reviews, reviews that were nit picked and had some little weenie reporters explaining that they still werent Japanese but none the less the reviews have been favorable. So now how are you going to sell this stuff. They failed to sell it for Olds. saturin has a car commin out that has everyone up in arms but yet 5 years earlier Olds had an equally impressive car that they could not sell. So something is telling me theres problems in the marketing department - also.

Well I'll try to be optimistic and hope you are correct but I cant see it. Either you are implying that GM's will be built in China, Korea, S Am. OR N.Americans are going to start working for $8 per/no benefits, or somehow through all this talk about labor choking off the R&D funding GM is about to release products that are going to make the whinners stop whinning. Its interesting to me, how, after participating in many posts of this sort that after awhile everything seems to contradict itself. Incidently - amounst other things GM needs to adjust its sales department :)

Id be willing to bet that is your opinion based on the way the layout is styled and its not your taste. Because of how they made it kinda flat. So if it was more like another car you would then like it ?

Dude ? Dont you live in California ? Hardly the place to draw an overview of Americans likes and dislikes. Here on the east coast no one has this so called dislike of Buicks........Get it ! "Dowdy", lets examine this for a moment.......Camry, Avalon, Civic, Accord, Nissans, Mitsubitchi = dowdy I do not prefer bland automobiles, if I did I would have purchased one of those pathatic imports I glanced at in during any of my used car shopping periods. This is why I have continously asked just what it was your favorite Japanese brands had over all the years that gives you the right to say GM's have been inferior ? Ive look at those things, they are garbage with bits and pieces broken or not working, cheap junk, most made me regret the time spent on a quick glance. then for your reliability BS, that is what it is, BS. the only vehical I ever put a tranny in was a Toyota. The only vehical I ever had to switch a motor on was a Toyota. It was the infamous 22R and the highly acclaimed Toyota 4X4. It was a great truck, I loved it and worked it hard, got my moneys worht out of it but it doesnt change the fact that I put more work into that truck per mile than any other I have owned. So your reliability BS is just that, BS, they all break and some people are great at breakin them. I have worked with men that can break Mac trucks like they were tonka toys. then if GM was making cars the way I like them they would be out of business because this guy has no interest in Camry, Accord, Galant, Chevys, saturins or any of the other bland point A to point B vehicals. So hows abouts not letting your personal taste take priority to my personal taste, its highly doubtfull I would be caught dead in something you would drive and visa versa. You are not the ends all god of the automobile, sorry to have to be the one to point that out to you. You really should go work for the Japanese, you alone could convince all but maybe 5% of the American buying public not to even look at an American built car. But fear not, this will happen soon enough, because GM can not sustain and we will have no choice but to drive Asain built cars. That will be great for you because then you can say, you were right and never be disproved. So see you are set up for success. Once again could you tell us why you are here ?

speak for yourself.......only.......everything else out of you have never been much more than "over-inflated ego".........want references ? This is a GM site, you hate GM's, yet you are here, and you want to speak for everyone on the site ? In many conversations regarding automobiles you have made it very clear that you have very limited taste. In order for a company to make something you would approve of it would need to be exactly like another car you have already approved of, but thing is, then you would go off on how it was a copy cat and late to the party. You spent 4 days reviewing Mercury for a school project and now Mercury is all that, however prior you showed no interest in FMC. This in itself almost proves some of Buickmans ideas about marketing would be effective. Not to you of course, you have made your decision about GM products and I know for a fact that you are the kind of person that will use that hatred to the bitter end regardless of what "product" GM puts to market. So once again get over yourself and try to be more productive in your posts and less degrading of those with opposed views. If you have nothing to offer but insults maybe you should skip the topic ??????????? Cause one thing for sure is not everybody here agrees with you either !

yearly incomes in the millions ? yearly retirements in the millions ? multiple millions in some instances ? for failing companies ?

I dont know about that as far as it being carved in stone. Its all old news now and passed history and not really applicable to common road cars but the Italians have been building small displacement V8's and V12's for decades that matched and sometimes even beat engines half again larger. I feel the main point of interest lies in the fact that a V8 is such a smooth and uncomplicated engine at this time when everyone seems to be most interested in how smooth and quite a engine is. It would cost more to build small displacement V8's but the results may be beneficial.

I just hope the replacement is capable of 200-300,000 hands off reliability. Not likely, cant have that with complecated twin cams, cnat have that with complicated vavle systems. I think the new cars are going to all be throw away cars after the second owner gets tired of inheriting the expensive replacement cost of wear items, like water pumps, timing chains, tired engine management systems and what not.

Ill have to go look again, thats not what I remember. I too am sick of everyone and all their BS, crying like a bunch of ninnys over anything and everything they can pick apart.

.93 G is great, so what was the STS's ? What is the weights of all cars ? What is the final drive ratio ? followed by the EPA milage ? Do I care if some reporters did not prefer the American built car...........NOT !

Wont see any responces to this.