razoredge

Ah yes, all the Kings horses and all the Kings men are going to sit down just as they have for the last 10 years and ????????? Discuss officer pensions ? Better get it while you can boys...right ?

OMG, ISNT THAT SATURIN SOMETHING, LOOK AT ALL THE NICE NEW STUFF THEY HAVE COMMING, BOY THEY ARE ALL THAT AND SO MUCH MORE, SATURIN WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN ALL MY LIFE, JUST PLANING AND WAITING FOR THIS YEAR OF GREATNESS I BET, WOW JUST SPECTACULAR, ITS AMAZING WHAT A FEW PICTURES CAN DO FOR THE CRAPPIEST AUTOMOBILE COMPANY EVER CONCIEVED.

Damn that Lacrosse is HOT ! those VW seats look like the same seats they were making in 1980. Same old garbage. I hear VW has gotten quite a rep for reliability ? Oh well so long as they use that softly stained birdseye plaood...... that Honda looks like a piece of crap, I would no sooner consider that then I would a Chevy.........confused ? As for NAV screens for weenies, is'nt GM trying something with the on star program, perhaps this is where they have spent that money. Dont get me wrong I think both are stupid and for weenies nothin but your opinion. Both Buicks go along ways to erase my distress with what they did to the LeSabre and Regals during the 90's and late 90's respectively. You just got a hang up because the base of the chassis has been around 10 years, oh well thats your problem. I bet if I wanted to take the time to crawl around some of your favorite rice burners I could find much the same for over 10 years. Then anything they have improved was done because their citizens are still living in the world we had thought we left behind 100 years ago. But no, now we must be tossed back to where we belong ? Cause according to you and every other GM hater here, GM has done nothing to improve anything since......when.....1959 ?????????? The G6 is by far more exciting than anything Pontiac has had in that segment in years. Actually ever in my eyes, the GA never did much for me. the G6 is one of the few Pontiacs I would considering driving. To bad so many dealers dont know how to sell them. Im sorry so many of you hate GM's and find all their cars boring and simple, but why do you come here ? I cant figure you out for nothing, you dont drive GM, you wouldnt be caught dead in a GM, you dont work for GM, I dont get it ? Bought stock in GM at one time ? I just dont get it.

Boy, most of you are only good at throwing insults, you should be paid great fortunes for your skills. Funny how you want to bash down the workers because the insurance and health care industry got extremely greedy. Blow off the fact that Wagner pissed away 4 billion THAT WOULD HAVE GONE FOR THIS PRODUCT DEVELOPEMENT YOU ARE ALL CRYING ABOUT. STILL AND ALL YOU KNOW ITS BECAUSE OF THEM F'IN WORKERS LETS SEE IF WE HAD BACK THE 4 BILLION FIAT, AND WHAT WAS IT ? A 3 BILLION INCREASE TO THE "HEALTH CARE" THAT BE WHAT, 7 BILLION ???? HMM, VERY VERY INTERESTING Ya know I think ya'll will make really great CEO's one day. You will be able to squander money left and right and ignore it. You will be able to set up a great big distraction from your mistakes and blame the end of civilation on Adam and Eve.

Olds was a quarter million sales

croc ? what the heck are you going off about ? at the current state of the rate GM has maybe 3 years of capitol. Your being a little tunnel visioned too dont ya think. Bankrupcy/bankrupcy not, GM is not selling enough cars. Its becoming more obvious all the time that "the product" is highly subject to opinion. Its not the only problem. Nor are the workers the only problem. Nor is Wagoner the only problem.

I think the Rabbit pickup is the ultimate VW. Like maybe one with the GTi drivetrain. Or maybe a turbo diesel. I had a 1980 gas truck, I think it weighed 1900lb ? The OHC 1.8 moved it quite well, even with 15-1700 lb in it. Great truck, worked as hard as any of mine did. My friend with all the old 60's GM muscle, his son has a GTi and his daughter a Cabrio

What are they then ? Im not being sarcastic, it was a year ago. I thought they were pretty much hard formed plastic. They surely werent padded and upholstered. The upper area, below the window.

I find it pretty interestingly styled for a modern car. As in I mean it is somewhat creative, as in I have not seen this car in anything else. Well maybe a Prius :lol: I like it, not my style but I like it, alot, maybe this could be considered most like a 350Z ? Kinda bubbly and all. Well Randsom dumped Olds and went on to other things. Jeep doesnt know what it is but it aint Willys? Aston Martin, Alfa Romeo and who knows what others have changed ownerships how many times ? General Motors, BMC, British Leyland, BMW has Mini's, Rootes Group and Chinese made Buicks. So, come on, give it to me, we might as well have a bitchin Bugatti ! Color my World

But there is more to it than styling as well. Many of these ideas would go a long way at the car searching level and I dont feel they should be ignored. Some dealers already do some of it. So if this was implemented at dealerships ? What would be wrong with it ? Damn I hope I dont have to break this thing down. Jeeze how many posts have we read with negitive views of the rebates ? Now red tag sales = no profits. What about how it seems that darn saturins claim to fame is the dealerships and no haggle, ect ? GM needs fixing in any areas. Dealerships and purchasing experience is one of them. Wait.......I have a better idea.......wait........dont go anywhere.......

I know that pain Blu :( , have been there 4 times and am watching 5 more that are going to break my heart one day, very very badly. My best friends. Sounds like that little doggy had a great life, so you done well.

and why ((DO YOU SAY THIS ??)) What is your POINT and MEANING behind USING ((WEAK)) in referenceing small displacement ENGINES for the SMALLER cars ((?????)) It is after all ABOUT ECONOMICS in MANUFACTURING as well as ECONOMICS for the CONSUMER. And RAZOREDGE made the first GOOD evaluation of all the WORK and MATERIALS involved ALONG TIME AGO, and that apparently DID NOT FIT IN THIS TOPIC EITHER (((!!!!!!!))) I'M NOT SURPRISED :unsure:

What was the U body mistake ? thats the Vans right ? based on the A bodys ?

yea now theres something for them to think about. Theres alot of money at Toyota, imagine getting your hands on that, running that to bankrupcy and then the law firms and accounting firms can get in on that action too. Oh boy the mother load ! Yes go to Toyota, go to Toyota, set that hook and just start reelin".

I know, I just wanted to make sure :) I am sorry actually, Im getting so edgy with all the complaining and nit picking about everything. No one ever wants to say anything nice about a GM or positive. Seems like everyone searches real hard for something thats not just how they would like it and then its all over for the cars. Kinda makes it seem like GM should just give up now because no one is happy with anything and most likely wont be, regardless of what is done. If its not exactly like something Japanese or BMW it sucks, but then if its to close to being like something Japanese or BMW - it sucks ! Well its just making me crazy. This interior is a good example, especially since you posted pic side by side and now say , hmm ? Helped me to, because I was just going from memory. The Lacrosse is better in my eyes, no doubt. I do not like the Lacrosses hard plastic door panels, but that seems to be how we are going to do door panels now. I prefer the panel on my old Regency or Lesabre Limited. NAV scares me, I cant believe Im on the road driving with so many others that seem clueless as to where they are or how to get to where they are going. I dont have that problem, dont want to pay for gidgit, gadgets. Dont what to drive on the road with people that are going to be fixating on some screen in their dash board. I want to be on the road with people that are looking forward and to the sides and reading the road signs. I want to drive on the road with people that have a good visual picture of where they are going and can get there using the tools and common sense they were born with. Map useage and geographical sense should be a large part of driver testing. Like 25% if not 33%. First, thats somewhat of an opinionated subject. I feel the interior in my LSS is second to none. I could find things I would do differently but Olds did a good job on this car and it works perfect for this car. It is part of the LSS, it is the LSS interior, I can deal with that, I could not deal with my LSS having a Mercedes interior. Incidently, my Mercedes driving sister and brotherinlaw were really really impressed with the LSS and began talking new (nother) car shortly after. They did, they got a second Mercedes. Their son (16) however has recently bought a 68 Toronado for his first car. Hmm ? gotta make you wonder ? Second, from the reading of todays posting on the Camry/Lacrosse interior, Id say the jury is still out and thats being nice, in reality it seems the Lacrosse won. I do know there is problems with decision makers at GM but the Lacrosse shows thought and effort and I frankly just like the thing. I also know how GM faultered trying to keep the "old" gotta be large, RWD V8 crowd happy while the Japs perfected the small economical ride. However I believe that since GM began producing the H/C & E/W's with the Buick V6 (not Chevy) that they closed this gap and got on line with the proper direction to pursue. Steady and continous improvement on these great cars took place through the 80's & 90's, into the G body's that are said to be even better. Now we are into even more improvements in the areas that everyone has been complaining about, but somehow that still hasnt stopped the complaining. Ya know they can get everything perfect. 3 more HP than the rest, 2 more MPG, a 8 speed tranny, the finest softest virgin pleather, hand fitted and sculpted, 26" wheels with tires no thicker than a pin head, windows that go up and down in .589 second, HUD NAV, voice activated cruise control & NAV, satelite TV screens at all four corners of the interior, seeing eye auto NAV so you dont need to miss the soaps while trying to find that new restaurant around the corner for lunch and you guys would pop the trunk and start complaining about the trunk carpet :lol: Ya know what I mean ? B)

We werent talking about Caddy to begin with just as an example in the last few posts. If there is balance complications with the V6 why not make the smaller displacement engines V8's. They only need to compete at that 3-4 litre level but be capable of running smoother and haveing DOD. Having claims of an all V8 brand and ideas of that sort will not sell cars and even has less novelity in these times. A few of us have covered all the aspects of V6 vs V8, RKM, I guess your just going to have to break the suspence.

More attractively styled ? Looks like the same layout, what is it? the wood look on the steering wheel ? screens screens screens ? anybody watch the road anymore ? different color wood ? you prefer the little pattern there on the seats ? They still look like stupid buckets to me. Now if this was the Lacrosse someone was standing up for everybody would be saying , "but the toyota is older and has an upcomming update" so the Lacrosse interior is on its second year. Maybe next time they will copy this toyota interior exactly and then everyone can complain about that. But please keep up the good Toyota promo

Imagine that! Not the way I would have done the front but great work !

I wanted to watch it but was busy. So how was Tommy's reaction to the car while driving. I do trust the guy. He's always reasonable, mostly impartial, you have to watch his face and reaction to see how hes feelin it. He loves the C6 and had great fun in the 300, I noticed he was somewhat quite about the GP GTP (GXP?) and the GTO, mainly the Grand Prix. The Acura's has been a tough competitor in sport touring classes for years. Not keeping up with BMW the last few years and now Mazda had a good year with the RX8. Hey Cobalt got a few too.

You make a good point. Now the LS1 would have been last years CTS-V engine though wouldnt it ? 350hp ? No doubt in my mind they would see better profit on that LS1.

That Camry interior looks alot like the Lacrosses.

do you have some kind of medication problem ?

Thats funny Paulie, I wrote a song called "Queen of the Burning Bush" Not suitable for Christmas topic, a respectable tongue in cheek review of some longer term relationships with women B) I think alot of towns and cities now have wood grinders/chippers for mulch or compost to avoid the land fill problems. You are 100% correct however in that the death of the Christmas tree is actually very sad, kinda like driftwood without the romance, very sad. So I burn mine and go on with my new year.

Jeeze what a bummer, you just cant get away from it. Its everywhere. Well you know, the G6 GTP has the looks I like and I would not prefer a Mustang, RWD/FWD or not. Some of the FWD's in the sport touring classes place favorably againts their RWD competition on the track, so its not an end all. How were the handling and braking ?

Sounds like the 2.8 needs to be run from 3000 - 4500 to use its powerband smoothly in typical driving for a 3500lb car. Does final drive ratio change for the smaller engine ? It should. for the BMW 325i and its performance, Im willing to bet theres a low final drive ratio. Not that Im knocking BMW's level of understanding. Still I have no problems entering highspeed traffic even with the old 3 litre Buick @ 125 hp :o