Camino LS6

It's the lack of logic about all of this which shocks me most.

"Pontiac is Performance" and "Chevy is Green" Is a supportable strategy for the most part. As I said before, the lack of a RWD Impala is an acceptable sacrifice - but killing zeta is not. Corvette and Camaro would do far more to tarnish the "green" image than Impala would, not to mention the SUVs and trucks. So I don't see that as a real justification for Killing the RWD Impala - there are more valid reasons for that. Besides, " Green Performance" is quite possible anyway.

The fact taht he works for GM is indisputable, I think. The rest? Well...

Now this is some creative thinking, something GM desperately needs. I may not agree with the entire recipe, but aspects of it have real appeal. The key factor is the quality of the creativity in your idea. Something GME lacks entirely.

The architecture still needs the volume

Don't just think of volume by plant, think of volume also by architecture - both are requirements. Zeta in GMNA was to produce a volume of 3-400,000, Camaro will only be able to muster about 100,000 - see the problem?

Some fact (often dated), and boatloads of agenda.

... there is no legitimate reason for a wholesale abandonment of the Zeta architecture. It is a product ready for release with all of its development money spent. It has been crtically acclaimed, and certainly sets a new standard for GM RWD. I will concede that in its present form its shelf life may be shorter than it would have been due to outside factors, but to toss it aside before letting it prove itself in our market is pure stupidity. If CAFE and fuel prices and currency issues pinch it back in the coming years, so be it. But to invite a huge and obvious loss when the product itself is so strong makes no sense. A pendulum swing back to all FWD all the time is unnecessary panic. The product mix needs to be there to legitimize and showcase the range of capability GM can bring to bear. A better choice would be to offer these cars in a decent array and trim the models back as the market requires. GM isn't ready to replace them with anything of value at this point, so simply from the perspective of gaining development time for projects such as Alpha, it makes good sense to bring the Zetas to market for at least one generation. Doing this allows GM to get some return on the investment in both real dollars and intangibles as opposed the the defeatist mentality of running scared back to the failed concept of trying to compete with also-ran FWDs exclusively. GM needs to use the breadth of capability which only it has in this industry to set itself apart. Managed properly, GM can field the widest variety made by any single company worldwide. To restrict itself to only smaller FWD cars and a few sizes of light truck would be to squander its best assets. One would think that GM had learned not to put all of its eggs in one basket by now. That approach has never done anything but punish them in the marketplace.

You miss the point there,Ven. The lack of a RWD Impala by itself is a minor issue. But if the rest of PCS' foolishness is implemented, it will be the begining of the end.

Pontiac didn't really have much of a reason to be until Knudsen gave it the excitement it has since been known for. Only in the very early days as companion brand to Oakland did it really have its act together. That is until the recipe of performance mixed with trim levels upscale of Chevy gave it a lasting identity. Although mis-managed, the theme of performance has persisted to this day, albeit often with just one or two true performance models. Performance remains the defining hallmark of the brand, and any deviation from that focus would render it pointless. With Pontiac, GM has an opportunity to focus performance of a wide variety of vehicles in one central home. In fact, this was their publicaly stated intention. Implementation of this idea has never been given any real effort as GM has starved the brand of the required product to gain that focus. All that Pontiac needs is for that plan to be put in place in a meanigful way at long last. For decades now, GM has sold the brand short when a concerted effort to define it through the right product has been all that it needed.

It could.

Any new FWD Impala will fail - utterly. A LWB version of Malibu under the Malibu name would be a far more sensible idea if we must have a FWD sedan bigger than Malibu. To have developed Zeta and wasted it really is a crime. As much as I still think most of the zetas should still be produced, I will say that once again, GM is late to the party. If these RWD products were here 2 years ago, we wouldn't be discussing any of this. GM delayed itself into a corner and missed the timing sweet spot because they screwed around with the idea of RWD and then flip-flopped about their intentions again and again. Now, they are in full panic mode and are over-reacting to CAFE and temporary financial conditions. An approach such as the one backed by PCS is a one-way ticket to oblivion. Any cancellation of products or brands will immediately be seen by the public as a certain sign that GM is headed for bankruptcy and all of the amazing work done by Lutz and company will be for nothing. The obvious and substantial work done to effect the so far amazing turnaround will be forgotten and the "GM deathwatch" folks will once again dominate all of the press relating to GM. To throw all of this away in favor of such an ill-conceived agenda as GME is promoting is nothing short of suicidal. The bad PR alone will do all the damage required. If this is allowed to come to pass in its entirety, Roger Smith will look like a saviour by comparison.

An absolute waste. Not to mention angering all of us who have been waiting for the zetas for years. This "new GM" will continue to anger and alienate its core buyers until GMNA is a bit player in its own home market. If this isn't stopped, it really is the end.

HBD NOS

Best post yet about this stinking pile of BS.

Selling econo-junk is hardly "Pontiac's roots" What planet are you from? Performance is Pontiac's genuine heritage, hardly a "pretension"

That's a good thing.

I believe so, the car is a National Champion.

If it is only Chevy and Caddy, is it still GM?

There are no words to describe how clean this car is. I had better pics , but imageshack seems to have lost them.

Nice. I have to go find a pic I have hosted that fits right in here.

I'd skip the airride, but I'm with you on everything else.

The best post to sum up all of this was the one that essentially stated that this was a great plan - if a market share of 12% is the goal. Without all of the brands, GM's reason to be sort of disappears.

The C4 ZR-1s aren't bringing much money these days.

Many, many, times. And I've asked about quite a few as well. :AH-HA_wink: