enzl

Be careful, they'll throw you out for agreeing with me!

Lutz was recently quoted saying exactly the opposite thing. I believe he used 10,000 as the target production number, IIRC. I think the Volt will be a disaster, but what bothers me more is that 2 GM exec's can't get on the same page. It looks bad---and creates the impression they really don't know what they're doing....

Platform, Badge, whatever. Anyone with a moderate about of grey matter in their heads will see that all 4 are related. Great GM product spoiled with Bad old GM thinking. Here's why it's a bad idea: GM providing all of its dealers "something to sell" is vastly different than creating unique, superior machines that result in the DEMAND necessary to support all of these dealers. I'm aware of the difference between the two terms, I've still got huge issues with the corporate planning that goes into this decisionmaking. I'll bet a bunch of Buick, GMC & Saturn dealers now feel similarly.

No, it is a problem. Toyota has so much cash, if they stopped earning a dollar tomorrow, they could support their co. for years. GM is living from paycheck to paycheck. Just because your neighbor has a 60" flatscreen doesn't mean you can afford one. GM cannot afford to support the marketing for multiple launches, either. See Aura, Outlook, Sky, Lucerne, for details of GM's A.D.D. in these matters. All were advertised for 15 minutes, then dropped like a bad habit. Toyota has never provided the template for GM's actions. That's why GM's in the shape they're in. They CANNOT afford to support their bloated workforce (see Union buyouts), Dealer Body (see shops closing left & right) nor their Product Develpment (been in a SAAB dealership lately? How about Pontiac?)

That's what it looks like...I just don't consider a 4100lb+ car a 'sports car' or pony car. Nor are the LX/LY underpinnings really appropriate for a sportscar. In today's terms, a pony car would be smaller...think G37 or even 3-series sized, as its relative to the marketplace. Retro cues or not, a comprable 'new' 4 seat T-bird or Monte would be exactly the Chalenger's size.

On Dodge.com, the screen is at the top of the stack, the radio head unit at the bottom... The pic with the Navi/Head unit as one may be a dealer installed upgrade if not factory equipped. The radio chassis looks to be the same double DIN as the rest of Chrysler's lineup....

This will sell like hotcakes--but again, GM is stepping back into rebadge hell...Outlook sales will shrink, avg. transaction prices for all Lambdas will go down, the Tahoe will take a hit. The rear window looks identical to the Enclave...has anyone overlaid the photos to verify? Chevy dealers are thrilled. All other not so much. This is again firm evidence that something has to give within the divisional structure of GM.

If price and door count are your criterion, you're absolutely correct. Truth is that the Challenger is not a 3-series competitor, in this guise or in the lesser versions that will be along shortly. Will there be 'open minded' consumers looking at both? Of course. But I suspect you could say that about alot of product shopping out there--it's a smart buyers market today. To me, this is the rebirth of the large RWD American coupe--it's not really a sportscar, nor is it a practical sedan--I think it's where a T-bird or Monte would be if there respective manufacturers had stayed the course with 80's-90's developments. That being said, it is a 6-series sized vehicle, so shouldn't that be the BMW comparison, using the same logic you're applying to the 3-series? The Challenger is unique. I hope it encourages other manufacturers to take a few chances. I'd love to see Ford use RWD for larger machines than the Mustang. GM's Riviera concept would be a great large Zeta.

How about just welcoming the Challenger as a unique product?---the rebirth of a RWD lux-coupe in the last T-bird mold, rather than getting everyone's panties in a bunch about interior quality or comparisons to a 335? (Which you cannot find for less than $44k on a dealer lot, but that's another story.)

Because, the unstated fear is that by acknowledging this good news, they'd be retroactively giving credence to CR's previous destruction of almost anything GM. Real catch-22, huh?

While I understand the sentiment, I think you're underestimating the problem: GM has many different types of customers---and for years, they tried to keep them all happy by 'splitting the difference' with their products: For ex. Cadillac tried to keep geezers with the DTS, while trying to foist an STS 'sports sedan' w/ FWD on import intenders--this is despite the fact that Historically Caddy was a RWD co., and all of the growing success of BMW and MB were routinely ignored---Lexus didn't ape Caddy with their first product (LS), they ripped off MB---in 1989!--so the warnings were there. Or, how about the W-body variants? Pontiac, Buick, Olds and Chevy were all peddling the same car, basically---for 10+ years. It's like they never saw, nor adjusted to the quality available from the original Taurus or later Camries, Accords or late Altimas... Now, they've made a bed and must lie in it. To make the same mistake again is stupid. To differentiate ALL brands sufficiently is impossible. Since Olds costs Billions to fold, you can't close a make---so you've got to cut down on the number of models--combine storefronts and, basically, niche-ify most of the remaining small fry--Buick, Pontiac, Saturn, Hummer, Saab. They have no choice. There's no reason why GM can't make do with less product. More product=more problems. At some point, they must cease being the 'WallMart' of cars with a few exceptional product breakthroughs--they must be a manufacturer of quality, unique and class product, regardless of category. Until or Unless that happens, they're just circling the toilet awaiting gravity's inevitable pull.

Volume should always be secondary to profitability in any biz...but Saab's volume isn't an issue at all. The fact is that the Saab lineup today could be 2 great models rather than a series of also-ran and never-was products. The 9-2X was a bad idea poorly executed. The 9-3 is really a warmed over Vectra and the 9-5 needs carbon-dating to extract it's true age. The 9-7X is ironically, the best T-blazer ever built, but still not remotely a Saab. GM has always lacked focus when it comes to Saab. They could be making 200k+ niche, exclusive and interesting Saabs, rather than attempting to craft Saabs out of more plebian underpinnnings and rebadging mediocre sister products. People currently buy Saabs on the deal---many educated consumers jumped ship years ago as CR, JD Power & pretty much every other survey group have found them to be disasterous ownership experiences--dealer flux, poor reliability & worse resale value burned most of these customers around the time the 900 became the 9-3. They won't come back without a massive effort in product, marketing and dealer service---an investment that I don't believe GM can muster nor afford. GM must focus...and not on Hummer either...that's been another distraction that has cost them the development of desperately needed mid-market product.

See, I'm not that bad. Truth be told: I have a collection of Maisto 1:18's that I've picked up here and there (as well as some random 1:24's that were well intentioned gifts). I rationalize each addition by telling myself I'm going to give them all to my son to play with. None have made it out of their boxes yet.

All that matters is that you like it. I'm currently driving a company car: 04 Jeep Liberty Sport RWD V6, 40K. I'd kill for a Vue to drive daily at this point.

I'm not, however, my wife has insisted that the new Vue is 'on the list.' I'm impressed by the obvious improvement--I'm a little sad that the thing is such a tank. Fantastic deal, regardless. (I'm actually a closet Saturn fan. Always loved the idea of Saturn, but have been a little disappointed by the execution. The Aura, Vue, Astra & Outlook are all positive steps in the right direction.)

Here's where I got mine: http://www.chevymall.com/shopping/product/...mp;keyword=volt To answer the above questions: No pics (yet). Completely silent. Hasn't burned a drop of gas.

1:32 scale model. Proudly made in China, BTW

Allocations on the HyHoe based on previous years' Tahoe sales, according to our inventory manager. Looks like rural and fleet guys will make out well, regardless of total sales regarding # available.

Keep in mind that the Impala's #'s are hurt most by fleet sales reductions, then the Malibu...although it's obviously difficult to tell which has more effect. Saturn still worries me...all of the product and very small volume increase---the Outlook probably should have gone to Chevy. GM deserves praise for positive moves in a brutal marketplace. Our Domestic stores had tough months...but Chevy was still solid--the 'bu has definitely gotten some positive traffic.

Psst...GM's incentives were up almost 40% vs Jan. 07, too! Toyota knows how to put their foot on the competitions throat, so it isn't surprising that they're pouring on incentives, especially since the Corolla inventory needs to be cleared and the Camry has fresh competition (which is nice to say about the 'bu, finally.) Unfortunately, GM is still at $3,400/unit...one of the reasons they bucked this month's downward trend in the marketplace. I'm looking forward to GM keeping the momentum going...they've teased their fan base before with decent figures, albeit fleet 'juiced' in the past months.

Great month for GM. Period. Toyota's got enough momentum within a product cadence lull. I think it's the lower tier Japanese and the Koreans that will suffer big year over year volume reductions.

I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized that Ford just refreshed the E-vans this year. My gut tells me the Transit Connect is an attempt to pick up a small portion of the market left open by the elimination of the Caravan SWB cargo model and keep Ford in the minivan segment without devoting an entire plant to Windstar/Freestar production, development and tooling costs. The import mini's completely ignore the trade van space as well. My guess is that the TC will have the same 20% premium to the base minivans as the Sprinters have to full-size vans. I can't see Ford making much with the exchange rate situation.

Wow. I have to respectfully disagree with almost that whole list. The TR7 'vert was the hottest doorstop, ever. The 3rd Gen RX7 was a real Japanese sportscar when compared to its competition The Sterlings were another set of lookers. The 5 door was a Rover 3500 reincarnated. Who could resist a LeCar with a canvas roof---or a 505 Wagon? The 505 Turbo foretold the euro-sedan future--space & fuel efficient w/decent performance. Koreans--can't argue/ Even .5 of a Porsche is OK with me. T/A Turbo...embarassing but cool in a Burt Reynolds in Boogie Nights way... Delorean-bad car with cool doors. Still an awesome way to make an entrance. LeBaron 'vert--singlehandedly brought back the low cost 'vert to the US & made the weekend rental of a 4 seat droptop possible... All IMHO, of course. I guess I'm more of a 'there's something to love" in each one kind of guy...like kids, I want to make excuses for all of them.

Certainly if you're buying your car by the pound.

Not that I need to defend Honda, but what large vehicle is selling like gangbusters in its last year before redesign? It's like you guys conveniently forget common sense when there's an opportunity to make a (feeble) point. Go look at the market: 90% of all products drop off dramatically (15%+) after 3 or more years on the market--except for the Accord, Camry and a few others--the market rewards newness and forgets older designs. Look no further than the incentive charts to see what's new! It's the American dream to have a shiny new thing in the driveway---the fact that your neighbor KNOWS its new seems to carry alot of weight. The New Pilot is ugly. What should piss you guys off most is that sales will be just fine. The sheeple have spoken--they've flocked to the new Accord. They'll buy this, too. That's the burden which all domestics must carry. Their bloated, mediocre dealer body & uphill perception gap require excellence in product execution. The Pilot doesn't have these worries and the sales will prove it. I'd be more sympathetic, but the GM competition like the Outlook (which actually might have a chance of snaring a number of Honda intenders) has completely dropped off of GM's marketing radar. I haven't seen a print ad in months and the Saturn TV spots are Aura lease deals in my area. The Taurus X is even a worse offender. On C&G, it's OK to dream of a better future...I don't give domestics marketers the same slack--they should be attempting to earn a paycheck.