oldshurst442

The 911 Turbo S is 3500 LBS... A Carrera is 3100lbs. 3500lbs because of AWD and THAT makes it porky if you wanna be honest about it. A C8 is 3600lbs. And that would be because Corvette's "PDK" unit is heavy, but sturdy to take all that possible high torque in future models. And for the folk that will heavily modify their base Corvettes. Remember, Chevy's V8 engine has the world's most aftermarket support. And that aftermarket support pushes these engines to ungodly levels of horsepower and torque... Carbon fibre also adds cost. Its not an engineering problem. Its more of a "how to mass produce carbon fibre at a lower cost so it could be viable to sell Corvette at 60 000-90 000 dollars and to do that profitable" problem. But honestly, YOU as a Mercedes lover, you really dont want Chevy Corvette engineers to figure out how to mass produce carbon fibre on the cheap because your ego will just explode... PS: its not only to mass produce carbon fibre on the cheap on Corvette's assembly line that poses a problem. Its also to find a way to to repair carbon fibre on the cheap when Corvette body panels get accidented because Corvettes are not garage queen supercars. They are raced. They are daily driven. Corvettes get smacked around pretty good.

To you. To me...the Corvette IS the best sports car in the world. Why? Because the Corvette costs thousands of dollars less and I get almost the performance that ANY other sports car does. And...I could spend just a tiny bit more on Chevy's ENORMOUS aftermarket performance goodies and I BETTER by ENORMOUS amounts ANY sports car in the world. And my Corvette would be just as reliable as it is stock from the factory. The AMG GT will cost you your arm and leg on repair bills after the warranty is up and if you decide to modify it...it will cost you your other arm and leg doing so...and reliability? By God man, there are no more limbs for you to barter with to pay for that...you'd be selling your organs...

Let me introduce you to the C8 Corvette Supercruise will eventually arrive in a year or two with the other iterations like maybe the Grand Sport...maybe it will even be available with the Z51 package next year... Remember though, Corvette prices arent suppose to reach boutique levels...so maybe interiors might take a hit a tad and the best that could be had is a Z51 interior even with a Zora... But that C8 improvement on its interiors is awesome...I wouldnt be asking more...honestly, a C4 Corvette interior was not bad for what you got and it was BETTER than the Porsche interior of the same time frame no matter what anybody says. A C5 interior was also not bad for what you got and yes...the same 911 era interior was a lot better as compared to its last gen and the C5 Vette's, but then again, the 911's price tag soared. A C6 interior was not bad either, but the pattern here is to bitch about the Corvette's interior. A C7 interior was great, but the pattern continues as to bitch about Corvette interiors. A C8 interior is AWESOME and the pattern to bitch about Corvette interiors SHOULD stop no matter how expensive some of these trims get...but the pattern to most anti-Vette folk will be to bitch about Corvette interiors...

Ill look at it later. Im gonna watch Young Guns II with the family right about now. We saw Young Guns last night. Yeah. Ive introduced my kids to the Old West during this pandemic...

That what was said above and the Zora will be a hybrid electric. Meaning...it will have electric motors boosting that power to 1000HP. How many electric motors? 3? Maybe 4? Well...undoubtedly, like @William Maley said waaaay above there in the beginning...IT WILL BE AWD... But its nice to ignore all logical posts by logical people when some of us have a goddam biased agenda around here... And it gets tiring... PS: We know NOTHING about the ZR1... just that it will be a TTV8 possibly the 5.5liter and perhaps it WONT be a flat plane crank. Perhaps Chevrolet engineers will have a traditional mechanical AWD system for it? Maybe like @USA-1 was suggesting what the C8 platform is capable of with its suspension geometry and sticky sticky rubber wont need AWD? The Z06 I believe will have active aero. The other trims, ZR1, ZORA will most likely have it too... I am not sure about the Grand Sport, though. Suffice it to say, the C8 platform is a monster...

Yeah...Montreal cops do that too. And yes...what you said is logical that most busy metro area PDs have this as standard protocol. They are there, they were called, they might as well "earn" their work effort of being called to a scene of an accident that could have been solved by just writing up a joint accident report otherwise... Like you said, its revenue so they might issue a "failure to control your vehicle" ticket or an "obstruction of traffic" ticket or some other bullshyte bylaw thing they could write you up for. But in Montreal...that kind of thing is rare. Well...Montreal police and Quebec Provincial Police (The SQ) have other ways that trap you into tickets. This way is not a favorite of theirs. But like @dfelt said...its really a safety net to protect oneself.

again... 1. making fun of me 2. trolling me 3. not responding to the content nor giving a rebuttal Whatever dude.

Yeah...I know. But...the irony is that...you live in a dream world where I come from. Problem is... You dont discuss ANYTHING. When you get pushed into a corner to vocalize and actually defend your side...you dont... You just punch up the old laughy voting thingy and ignore all other discourse. Proof again in THIS post. Im waiting to see your rebuttal when I called you out on the SEMA E COPO Camaro auction failure. I got a few counterpoints to counter you with. Im quite a few steps ahead in waiting. What do you do though? You laugh it up. You post a clowney Pinocchio while laughing at me calling me a clown in not so many words and then you tell me quite frankly that YOUR point of view is TRUTH while mine is fantasy... Yet no rebuttal of any substance... You trolled me, you called me a clown. You didnt show me ANY evidence of why a SEMA auction failure is THE WORD of EV failure. I used logic but I got rebuttals lined up for you to back up my logic. You are just laughing at me. No rebuttals. Same thing with the political talks. But you will whine about it though. So...why did you make fun of me? Are YOU the only one to be able to PHOQUE this website's rules? You hate EVs... Get the phoque out of this thread and stop trolling it if you are not going to discuss this rationally. Stop the derailing and the trolling.

That is all you do. That is all you ever do. That is all you got. Believe in a narrative. Push a narrative. Lecture us all about this narrative. Ignore everything else. Continue to believe in the narrative. (I dont fault you there...its the internet after all)...but your relentless pushing of your narrow minded narrative and your dissing the other points of view and your continual whining and the hypocrisy of it all is tiresome... So...now...you admit to trolling... Along with politics...THAT is also AGAINST THIS site's policies. Like I said, your hypocritical posting is tiresome at best...

Contempt for it or not that it has bred not, the Supra has outsold the BMW version. But THAT just proves MY point even more. BMW fanbois and Toyota fanbois could cry all they want about how one fanbase says the car is a BMW underneath and the other says its not a real BMW...the Camaro sells comfortably well... And again, the Mustang Mach E has EQUALED the Camaro sales...and sold out... Only cynical in YOUR small minded view of the world... YOU are kinda like those Supra fanbois... wah wah wah And yet, a Mustang Mach E has sold as many Camaros ICE coupes... The Camaro EV not selling as YOU put it is because of SEVERAL reasons. 1. NOT a PRODUCTION Camaro. Its a CONCEPT one off. No REAL substance there 2. NO MARKETING push for it. 3. GM's marketing sucks anyway. They couldnt sell a legit Covid19 vaccine to a Covid19 dying victim to save their sorry ass. But keep that dumb narrative alive while you think you got something going on based only on your narrow view of the world while always ignoring the BIGGER picture...

I really think the styling is doing in the Camaro. When it was on the Zeta platform, it was big and heavy and most enthusiasts were bitching about that, but the sales figures were on par to the Mustang's. It was a bunker inside but the sales were very Mustang-like. THAT was not a deterrent... The Challenger had what camaro sales have now. Actually, the Challenger sales only grew to a smaller amount. But that is because of really crazy horsepower top end Challengers fueling the lower end Challenger sales...and the addition of AWD to the V6 base version making a pony car available to those that want one in snowy States and Provinces. But, like I said, the Challenger sales only grew a tiny bit. NOT that a growth in Challenger sales mean that a decline in Camaro sales are related. Its more like Dodge's marketing with an AWD V6 base and being first to introduce crazy high HP numbers with awesome marketed Hellcat and Demon names and ad campaigns made sure that the Challenger sold in decent numbers for the years to come as a new platform is nowhere near to come. Back to Chevy. They made the Camaro smaller, more in line as a Mustang...and the sales were there as well. Its just that historically, the Mustang almost always surpassed the Camaro's in sales. But, in 2016, the switch to Alpha in sales was high. Not as high as the Zeta Camaro...but that has NOTHING to do with it being smaller, nor the interior being a bunker, nor the price tag, BUT because the STYLING has NOT changed since 2010... And now we are in 2020. And really, the first time we saw a 1969 inspired, retro new Camaro was in 2008 when the movie Transformers came out. In 2016 when Chevy introduced a new generation, the SAME 1969 inspired retro Camaro was kept that was first introduced in 2008 and made into production in 2010... Not to mention the Alpha Camaro refreshes are not exactly mind blowing as compared to what Dodge has done to their even older platformed Challenger... 2008 "Bumblebee" as a concept at the Detroit NAIAS. Then the movie came out in 2009. 2010 production Camaro 2015 Camaro. Last year for the Zeta. and the Alpha Camaro 2018 side profile Again, versus the Zeta platform In now...a decade...literally, the changes are small. The Challenger has got mind blowing marketed Hellcats, Demons and refreshes that are beautiful to augment their sales slightly. The Camaro has stumbled. But yet, STILL sell 50 000 units per year or more since 2016. On the decline, but nothing that a new styling direction cannot fix... The Mustang is just the benchmark in sales that both the Challenger and Camaro have ALWAYS been chasing and the Pontiac Trans Am and Plymouth 'Cuda STOPPED chasing...

I understand the principle behind it because the police have other things to take care of...such as crime. (But what your neighbor is doing now IS crime in itself...its downright fraud) and the reason why I understand this is because the Montreal police ALSO have a similar policy. Well...they strongly suggest you refrain from calling the cops when a mutual police report is filed and the no-fault insurance policy takes over... When an accident has occurred, we file an accident report and both parties involved have to sign the document. If one party is did not sign, it could mean a hit and run. A criminal act. If one party does not agree to the accident report, then he files his own. BUT...there is a report or two, being filed. Information being exchanged. Name. addresses and phone numbers. Proof of insurance and valid drivers license. Little diagram of how the accident happened.... The police intervening in a normal accident, well, they just keep the peace and possibly control the traffic. But the accident report is filed in the same manner. The police do not take sides. If asked, they will just report on what they saw upon arrival. Unless of course they witnessed the accident happening... The police is REQUIRE to be called when personal injury is made or property is damaged BUT if one party calls the police to the scene of an accident, no matter where the accident happens to occur, they WILL come. Can you file a hit and run report? Is it too late? Because in Montreal, you still have time to report your accident as a hit and run BECAUSE proper information was NOT given to YOU BY the person hitting YOUR car... In Quebec, the person actually hitting another car or property HAS the responsibility of reporting it to either the owner of the vehicle he hit, to the cops or to his insurance. But, BECAUSE in Quebec there is "no fault insurance", that only means the owners of the respective vehicle's insurance is responsible for their own repairs. Your neighbor's insurance is responsible for his accident while your insurance is responsible for your repairs. HOWEVER, if you file a report that YOU have been a victim of a hit and run, OR that your neighbor hit you, it dont matter, the INSURANCE will either file a police report to see if your neighbor has file a report with his insurance and get your neighbor that way or if your neighbor mentioned that he hit you in his report...then YOUR insurance WILL claim something from HIS insurance...but most importantly...YOUR premiums will NOT go up while his will. And if HE claimed a false report, HE will be facing some legal action from either his insurance or police or both AND his insurance premiums WILL go up. That would be in Quebec... Like I said, in Quebec, its not too late to file a hit and run report...and when its time to repair your car, the insurance claims adjuster will not only assess what is to be repaired, but will assess how your accident came to be. And if YOUR claim seems to be false...well..your insurance will have some questions for you to answer....and maybe the police as well...

But THAT is my point... Close to 100 000 Camaros have been sold in 2 years. Internal combustion engined Camaros... The other 3 Japanese sports cars COMBINED dont even amass to one year of Camaros sales. Camaro STILL appeals to peoples. Mustangs and Challengers...and Camaros, all three are 2 door sport car coupes STILL appeal to peoples. There is no need to try to inspire folk to buy cars...at least THESE cars. Sales of these cars are great for what is going on in the world regarding what sedans are going through with their CUV counterparts. I applaud Ford with the EV CUV and calling it a Mustang. I think that was a brilliant move both in regards in competing with Telsa AND making sure the Mustang nameplate DOES in fact remain relevant for the FAR future. At the same time KEEPING and maintaining the coupe for the near future. Chevrolet...SHOULD copy Ford and making the Camaro an EV CUV to compete with Tesla, and with Mustang Mach E BUT Chevrolet should ALSO keep the car coupe BECAUSE Ford WILL keep the Mustang car coupe. I wanted to show that Camaro sales are THERE so Chevrolet SHOULD NOT kill the car coupe. It be foolish for them to do so. THAT is how Chevrolet will KILL the Camaro nameplate and the Camaro CUV will NOT sell... The possible EV CUV Camaro and CUV Mustang EVs NEED their car coupe so the CUV pony car namesake COULD relate to car people.

If you call and summon them (the police) to present themselves at the scene of an accident, they wont come?

In order for Chevy to completely be consistent with the Mustang v Camaro that dates back to 1967, Chevrolet needs to KEEP the coupe alive with a replacement car as well. There is still no word on what the future holds for a Camaro car. I am down with an EV Camaro. Car and CUV. What I am NOT down with is if there is no Camaro car but CUV Camaro instead regardless if the CUV Camaro is EV. Camaro still sells well. Just looking at Camaro numbers, they are on a decline, sure, but Camaro still sold 50 000 units in 2018 year and 48 000 units in 2019. Those are respectable numbers for a niche car. When looking at the competition, we always look at Mustang and Challenger and their sales. Why dont we look at the other competition? Nissan 370Z. From 2010, this sports coupe has gone from 10 000 units sold and has declined to 7000 units to 5000 units to just 3000 and 2000 the last two years. Toyota Supra In the last 8-9 months this coupe has been on sale, it has sold 4000 units. Yes yes...coronavirus and all. BUT...this coupe is ALL NEW for 2019 and had 6 months in 2019 to rack up the sales. BEFORE coronavirus hit. And it didnt...do anything in the marketplace. Camaro as funny as it may seem, sold TRIPLE of those amounts in the same time frame as the Supra. I understand the Supra has a 40% higher price difference, over the Camaro and even the 370Z, but still. The Corvette which has an EVEN MORE higher price tag than the Supra sold 17 000 units on an older platform in 2019 and sold out immediately on the new platform which topped out at 50 000 units? 60 000 units? 70 000 units? I dont know how many units, but there is no excuse for low low Supra totals as the Supra is an icon in the sports car world. Mazda Miata Not direct competitor as the Miata and Camaro are two different types of sport cars, but the Miata still falls in the 2 door, sports car, starting price @ $25 000 realm. 11 000 , twice 9000 and 7000 units the last 4 years. And we all say that the Miata is well loved in the marketplace... All to say...48 000 units in 2019 on a now, old platform is amazing. There IS an audience for a Camaro coupe car, and I would think the car IS profitable. If it aint, THAT would be more of a GM engineering/product development problem rather than a Camaro not selling problem. Because the Camaro is still loved by Americans and the sales numbers PROVE that.

Correction: If its a CUV, regardless if its EV or ICE, its an appliance, no way around it...

Dings and dents are part of car ownership and I view them as character and survivor scars. I, like everybody else, am very wary about my new car being dinged. I do all the schizophrenic rituals such as parking far and isolated from other cars and drivers. I do all the walk arounds every single time I get into my new car to see if it has been dinged or paint chipped on the hood... And I put myself through that stress for the 1st three years of new car ownership. The only thing I do when the car gets a tad older is I just park in strategic places to minimize high traffic. I continue to park farther and the like. I dont think I would like all that airbump trim on my rides. Ribbed, black rubber...Id rather save that for certain...um... toys...thank you very much. (use your imagination to what kind of toys Im referring to...)

Brushed aluminium and brushed nickel as a decorative trim choice is just an evolution of chrome trimmed pieces. You see that in household appliances. Chromed faucets are sooooo old fashioned nowadays. Brushed nickel and dark bronze faucets are what is in today... Just like how black fridges and appliances were at the tail end of the 1980s and how stainless steel became hot and even that in 2020, stainless steel appliance are not so hot anymore. Carbon fibre interior trim pieces already hit that fever pitch and is already on the decline... Fins on cars are sooooo ungodly cringey in today's world. The jet aged themed taillights and exhausts that defined sooooo many 1950s and 1960s cars seem so childish today. There is nothing wrong with not being a fan of chrome. I just wanted to put a little of perspective on this whole thing. About not viewing past fads with today's eyes.

I will take the 1950s-1960s chromey but colourful interiors over any other. Your pics of the Caddy, Mercedes or Mazda just proves my point. They are all cheap, drab, gloomy, dark and depressing.... And the french stitching is rampant. MUST mean money... But wait... French stitching in that vinyl steering wheel...

Well...its dark. Its drab. Its kinda...sad. Like a gloomy cloudy day... Ill tell you another thing... The Oldsmobile interior pic only focused on the speedometer and the steering wheel. That would be the WHOLE picture... Not too much chrome in THAT regard, non? And to tell you the truth, that Oldsmobile interior is happy. Jovial. And the shiny bits, especially for the time period, means money... Lets see how a close up of that 2020 Mazda6 steering holds up to scrutiny... And lets be honest here...this is a 2020 model when in 2020....ALL manufacturers have greatly improved the cheapness of plastic... From 1980-2010...modern plasticky interiors are cheap cheap cheap and it dont matter if we are talking about Mazdas or Mercedes. Buicks or BMWs. Chevrolets or Citroens. Cadillacs or Datsuns. Pontiacs or Audis. Is that plasti-dipped fake chromed plastic there to emulate...chrome? For the interior to have a slight touch of class and shininess so it wont to soooo drab? I guess the French Stitching is what symbolizes success and money in 2020. And there is an abundance of that. In some cars, luxury oriented ones, contrasted stitching makes that pop. Maybe in another 50 years from now, in 2070, the 50 year old people then that are born now will find it odd that we have french stitching in 2020 cars to symbolize comfort and success?

It was a sign of the times. Chrome symbolized excess. Richness and excess. Success. Today...we got plastic. Plastic everywhere. Black plastic. Grey plastic. Very drab. Very durable. But very drab. Plastic symbolizes another type of excess and success. Over consumption. Plastic symbolizes disposable. Disposable shyte that we dont take care of, dont respect and throw out on a whim only to replace it with another disposable over consumed shytty product. Between you and me, Id rather be blinded by that "tacky", "cringey" chrome rather than be suffocated by that depressing, suicidal thought induced black, grey plastic. The chrome makes me...HAPPY!

This is how a REAL revolution 'FEELS' like. Again...not talking about the roar of the V8 versus the soulless EVs... But...how loud the music is and MUFFLED are the sounds that make war war. The soldier running and talking to his general that the Americans are coming. The General telling the troops to get ready. The drum and the muskets. All muffled but NOT muted. Then the ROAR of the V8 of the Americans are LOUD. The retreat of the British, the sounds, are muffled. Muffled but NOT muted. The commercial takes AWAY the IMPORTANCE and the STRENGTH of the BRITISH by this muting and ACCENTUATES the ROAR of the MUSCLE CAR and the IMPORTANCE and POWER of the REVOLUTION by the AMERICANS but the muffling does NOT take away the humanity of it all. Au contraire...you FEEL the humanity with the muffled sounds because you HEAR it... This is how one evokes a human emotion with a commercial...by ACCENTUATING human senses and emotions....not stripping them away...

Quiet revolution? GM should pay royalty fees to Quebec for that tagline. Anyway...I prefer the more rambunctious style of revolutions. No honestly. That commercial SUCKS!!! To see a giant basketball player warrior tear down and demolish the net while slam dunking that mothathphoquing ball while flying through the air knocking down his opponents and not having the aural cues that go with it and promoting THAT as a quiet revolution is just...ASININE and STUPID! This rant has NOTHING to do with EVs being silent versus loud V8 rumbling sounds. This rant has everything to do about the commercial itself. I get that GM wants to promote the silent nature of an electric motor and wants to show that power and torque need not be obnoxiously loud... BUT... actual live horse horses galloping is NOT obnoxious. sports sounds are NOT obnoxious In fact, these sounds are what makes us HUMAN and a PART of NATURE. Nature itself has beautiful sounds and THAT would include 1000 horses galloping. In war...1000 horses galloping coming straight towards you must be a terrifying sight AND must be a terrifying sound. But THAT is what makes that awesome. It plays with our humanity and our fears and our strengths as some of us overcome that and become HEROES for the side we are on and win the war... In sports...its the same thing. The crack of a bat when a homerun is hit. The smack of a baseball against the leather of a baseball glove. The sound of a bodycheck in football or hockey. The sound a puck makes it hits a goal post or when a slapshot is made. A slamdunk and the shattering of the glass when the net breaks. These are all sounds that I do NOT want eliminated from my humanity...and to sell me a vehicle nullifying these sounds do NOT make me want to buy an EV... And now...just imagine a dude, that loves his V8...and loves sports...and loves nature...even if he loves nature and wants to save the planet so to speak...but he still wants his V8...and he tolerates EVs...does that make him wanna buy an EV Hummer. I know when that commercial muted my beloved horses and muted the sports sounds...I was left...numb. I felt like my humanity in nature was stripped away from me. Its bad that we now have this social distancing thing going on and that too gnaws away from our humanity....but to have my hearing taken away from me too! PHOQUE THAT! Like I said....my rant is not about quiet EVs and how souless they are. And I get that this commercial was done before social distancing realities came to be.... But its STUPID and ASININE to equate a quiet revolution that are EVs to SOUNDS of nature that exude power and to just mute them. Horses have ALWAYS been a symbol of power. Athletes have ALWAYS represented what humans are capable with their bodies and both those things produce NATURAL noises. To mute them in a commercial to show a new force of power is to equate that to show that EVs are...UN-NATURAL. CONTRADICTORY in my opinion. I didnt see that angle in the 1st commercial aired during the Superbowl...but the 2nd commercial definitely accentuates what I ranted about. And I dont like it and I dont...feel it. (Pun intended as a human not only hears 1000 horses galloping and basketball players tearing down nets but always FEELS those powerful forces...and its only human to hear and feel)

The Escort's interior is pretty snazzy as compared to the Golf's. Its decent. Was it manual? My friend's diesel Golf was manual. He and my then girlfriend taught me to drive stick. She had a 1989 Pontiac Firefly Turbo. The Firefly was quite the peppy ride. The diesel Golf was quite a sluggish ride, to put it lightly. When an Iron Duke Celebrity has more oomph, you know the car is a dog... The Escort had some sporty lines back in the day. It was an attractive car. I liked it back then.

I googled 1957 and 1958 Fleetwood and Sedan DeVille. I chose quickly, the nicest photographs to post without actually looking at what model I was posting. I think the first and second to last pic are Sedan DeVilles and the rest are Fleetwoods. But Im not 100% sure.