oldshurst442

Nope you are not... But when a Rivian truck replaces the good ole V8 pick-up from GM...you will... And good news, GM will probably invest in Rivian...to further the EV tech so that EVs will be the future sometime soon... PLUS...politics do carve the automotive landscape... My dad hated 4 cylinders, but in 1986, when his RWD V8 Chevy died on him, because of politics, he was guided by politics to purchase a FWD 4 cylinder Chevy. Although a RWD V8 Chevy could be bought, the same one that died on him, (a 1979 Impala versus a 1986 Caprice), his purchase was a 4cylinder Celebrity. And when that died in 1994, his next purchase was a FWD 6 cylinder. He never wanted that FWD vehicle. His desires were always RWD V8s...and he could have bought a new version of his favorite RWD V8 Chevy, he was stuck buying a FWD V6 Pontiac. because politics made it expensive for him to drive RWD V8s... wanting and buying... EVs are expensive NOW... Like I said...short term blindness...

mmmmmm. No. Politics seem to put a dent to that argument. Government regs also seem to put a dent into that argument. CAFE did a lot to downsize cars in the 1970s. Japanese cars got a foothold in this market because of CAFE. FWD became the norm. 4 cylinder engines became the norm. The thing is...stricter CAFE TODAY is pushing EVs into our future...regardless of market share... The future is coming BECAUSE plans were changed...for ICE CAFE regs...regardless of what EV market share is in 2019... Unless CAFE regs change, plans for EVs will not change... Trump wanted to eradicate what Obama did with those strict CAFE regs....but GM of all corporations thought that was a bad idea, because GM wants to push forward with the EVs and though that if those CAFE regs were to disappear, than that would delay the progress made for EVs...GM wants to have less strict CAFE regs, but still strict enough for EVs to push through... Like I said...most of all the automotive world WANTS the EV future to happen. I havent strayed from that thought. because THAT is the reality... Its a GLOBAL direction and the automotive world is behind it all the way.

Well...I got the same speculation on the opposite side of the fence... That was not meant for a victory parade for you. Nor for me. But was just a way for me to tell you that you aint right. You aint wrong, But you aint right. We have reached an impasse regarding our debate. Which is good. But that impasse does NOT mean that EVs are NOT gonna be our future... Those plans for EVs going forward are par for the course as we speak. Especially when many OEMs are spending billions on this.

Nothing concrete yet. Diesel fuel is 100% sure though. But, like I said with the HD broadcasting thingy. It will take a collaboration of everybody to make this a reality. You and I do NOT know what kinds of talks are happening BEHIND the scenes to facilitate such a move, between everybody involved... to ban ICE. And yes...automotive CEOs DO talk to world leaders for such things... Speculation is all I got. But speculation that this is not gonna happen is all you got too... But because there is soooooo much talk about EVs and bans and stuff, it looks like Im closer in my speculations than you are. All you got is plans change. I got proof of those plans being in effect and par for the course. Until further notice, But that hasnt happened....yet...but we dont know if that will ever happen, that the EV plan will be reversed...

You are right. Plans always change. Still doesnt change the fact that as of now...EVs are the future going forward. THAT is THE plan going forward. And until further notice, THAT is what WE have got going. And...unless you could tell the future and tell me for sure that plans WILL change...you got nothing...just a generic statement of plans always change.

yes! Plans of this, Im afraid, will NOT change. High speed trains for California being canceled? HA! Plans for trains in California were NEVER a thing to begin with. Plans for high speed trains did not change course. Plans for trains being canceled is par for the course actually. Had they went forward with high speed trains, THAT would have been a change in plans. Cars were always their main thing... https://www.lamag.com/citythinkblog/inside-l-s-dark-deserted-network-railways/

Nobody is debating that. Im not debating that. But everything does have a shelf life. Everything comes to an end sometime. The reason why I have debated this vehemently today is that all that was presented to me as a counterpoint that EVs are just a fad, or that EVs are just too costly to take serious is just short mindedness. Its a global shift away from the internal combustion engine. Not that the internal combustion engine is obsolete. But because the WORLD wants to STOP using it all together...(for personal transportation pods...) And the rebuttals that I have got just plain REFUSE to acknowledge that fact. And in January 2019, its clear as day that EVERYONE in the AUTOMOBILE INDUSTRY IS COMPLYING and CHANGING the landscape of the Internal Combustion Engine... VW stated that in 2026, they will develop their last internal combustion engine. https://autoweek.com/article/green-cars/vw-will-develop-its-last-internal-combustion-engines-2026-report-says 2026. This does NOT mean that VW will STOP producing petrol cars....on 2026 This just means that no NEW internal combustion engine will be engineered AFTER 2026. VW will continue to build ICE cars as long as their is a demand for them. But no NEW technology to advance ICE will be offered. New engines DO have a lifespan of 10 years before new ICE technology takes over. But that also means that VW will be focusing on EVs so THAT technology will eventually make ICE the inferior technology. Their new for 2026 internal combustion engine will be trucking on as long as their will be a demand for it. 10-20-30-40-50 years AFTER 2026. But the thing is, eventually, this 2026 internal combustion engine WILL be obsolete as VW's focus will be to improve their EVs...and their EV technology could very well mean by 2027 or 2028 or 2038 that their EV technology will surpass that 2026 ICE. Couple the fact that China and Germany and other countries will have banned the sale of NEW ICE vehicles by 2030... YES...as of now, ICE is superior in most ways...the pendulum WILL start to sway the other way. GM also stated something similar. Ford too. The WHOLE industry will be focusing on EVs to take over...and eventually, EVs WILL take over. THAT is why I gave the high definition broadcasting as an example. The INDUSTRY itself is going down that EV road. Choice? Yes in America we have the choice (still) to make our own decision on what we want to buy. In Europe and in China, that decision was made FOR the people. As in NO CHOICE. By 2030 I might add... And it seems that GM, FoMoCo, VAG, Volvo, Chinese car companies, Tesla, Rivian, FCA (maybe?), and some others, (not all manufacturers however) have COMPLIED and are AIDING THAT reality. They themselves are capping the engineering of new ICE but are spending billions in the development of EVs... About a month or two ago, I had a slightly different perspective of this. But in January 2019, many different developments have happened and press conferences have been made in this industry to tell us just that...how the industry is going forward with the EV thing. And to me at least, its clear as day that mostly all who produce cars today, are going forward with EVs as the future. Keep in mind that the calender reads 2019. 2026 is a mere 7 years away. One car cycle away. 2030 is but a short decade away. A mere One and a half car cycle away... Technology also advances very very fast. And billions of dollars are being poured into EVs going forward...to meet the 2030 deadline in the world's biggest car market...

And General Motors money...to make it into a reality...

MUSIC You forgot about the music... And I do not know if I could forgo all that we have today for the 1950s. It seems that some social problems still exist and never went away and some are actually accentuated...(that may seem to be a blemish for today's world...) About the music, although I did not get to enjoy it when it was happening, I get to enjoy the magic and romance of rock-n-roll on todays tech called youtube. And because I was a teenager in the 1980s, that same feel of what the 1950s may have been like, 1980s magic of 1980s movies, 1980s TV and 1980s music were lived by me. Minus the cars of the 1980s. I wish we could tone down the social media mess...THAT would be as far as my complaints could go with today. I bitch about today an awful lot, but it aint all that bad. Im scared to how bad folk could use all this tech we got against us. Our freedoms may be at peril. But all the good things we could do with all this tech is just mind blowing. THAT would be a good thing. And if we want to reminisce about the good old days...well...guess what? The internet is like a time machine. We could revisist and see any time period we want. Just by typing away what we want to see or hear about our past and press "enter". Awesome stuff. I dont think I could do away with that.

That is a gimmick We replaced a relative cheap way to lower the volume of a radio buy simply turning a knob with an expensive and complex system with the irony of using literally the same movenments...in the air... Just like playing air guitar... That is plain stupidity NOT luxury...

You seem to be forgetting that GOVERNMENTS WORLD WIDE are BANNING the internal combuston engine... GOVERNMENTS that DICTATE to their people what to buy.. CHINA seems to come to mind here..I could think of 1 billion reasons of how economies of scale could reduce the cost EVs... I could also think how the Chinese government could also subsidize the industry further with monetaty incentives... Then there is Europe doing the same thing... Tesla is ALREADY doing their part as they have built and continue to expand their charginh infrasctructure...and the Chinese government has subsidized Tesla's factory in China and then their was a time when France offered to do the same for Tesla... And last I saw...FoMoCo and VAG will build commercial trucks and vans together...and maybe EVs.. https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/15/business/ford-volkswagen/index.html

You are not seeing it yet? Sure...as of now...all you are seeing is high costs... That is the short term blindness we all are looking at... When the tech, infrastructure and all that is set into place 10-20-30 years from now, all that what you are seeing now will be water under a bridge... FoMoCo, GM, VAG (Porsche, VW, Audi), Volvo, BMW, M-B, Chinese automotive companies, the folk that own Jaguar, all the EV start-ups such as Tesla, Rivian, and quite possibly the ones that are vapour ware like Faraday.. all these companies are putting all their engineering might and most governments are willing participants to move ahead in an EV future... I feel this is going to go like it did with high definition broadcasting and TVs. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television_in_the_United_States . It took time for everybody to adapt...cost was huuuuuge for everybody. TVs, cameras, satellites to broadcast HD meaning launching these things into space... Yet we are here... Do we think about how expensive all that was? How long it took? How expensive those 1st plasma TVs were and how short of a viewing lifespan they had because they kept burning out... How, with the exemption of very few programming and very few movies were ever made in HD and the expensive cost to buy HD TVs? Even DVDs were not HD then.. I bet we dont think about that at all...and yet its not even 20 years that HD was available let alone fully available with everything and every media...yet we take HD for granted today...yet we do NOT realize how expensive that change was nor do we think about WHO FIT THAT BILL? Because...who really fit that bill? Because...as a consumer...did you really have the option to buy are CRT television after 2004? You could deny the change is ever happening, which is fine...but its happening.

Whether real or imagined, for better or for worse... EVs are gonna be the way of our transportation lives. And I think, when FoMoCo, GM, VAG (Porsche, VW, Audi), Volvo, BMW, M-B, Chinese automotive companies, the folk that own Jaguar, all the EV start-ups such as Tesla, Rivian, and quite possibly the ones that are vapour ware like Faraday...when all these companies are putting all their engineering might and when most governments are willing participants...the EV future is gonna be a go! All the problems, big or small, all the hiccups, big or small, all the mistakes and obstacles that the EVs WILL face in the NEAR and FAR future, well, all those companies and government entities WILL PROBABLY SOLVE those problems going forward. Cost? It wont be a problem when the whole system will work TOGETHER to fight cost... Because as I see it now...the EV thing is not just a consumer option that may or may not succeed in the "real world"...it really is a global way of thought... The planet wants to move away from the internal combustion engine...whether we ICE folk want it or not. Whether we want to believe that or not. The whole ICE, oil and gasoline system (for personal transportation cars) is slowly but surely being replaced by everybody involved in the production of the automobile... Big oil will have to adapt to that. Our roads and infrastructure and we, ourselves, we'll have to adapt to that. But like I said...FoMoCo, GM, VAG (Porsche, VW, Audi), Volvo, BMW, M-B, Chinese automotive companies, the folk that own Jaguar, all the EV start-ups such as Tesla, Rivian, and quite possibly the ones that are vapour ware like Faraday.. all these companies are putting all their engineering might and most governments are willing participants to move ahead in an EV future... Ive said this before, it is not a question of the consumer accepting the EV...its the whole planet wanting to move away from ICE. Some places on this planet will resist, like in Texas or Alberta or Lancaster Pennsylvania. And they WILL put up a good fight too. But ultimately, they will succumb to the EV as its a GLOBAL change...

And.. Ill tackle this: "There are solutions if owners are willing to pay for them. Not every apartment building owner will do this, and the majority have not as yet" True... But we have to view this differently if we are going to use that as a counterpoint. 1. what neighbourhoods are we talking about were landlords are less than willing to spend money on chargers? 2. If we are talking about less affluent neighbourhoods, to put it mildly, than we have to analyze why this may be as to why landlords are not willing to spend money on chargers. a) People renting in these neighborhoods may not even have enough money to buy a used petrol car let alone a brand new 50 000 dollar Model 3 or 40 000 dollar Chevrolet Bolt... b) people in that kind of neighbourhood may also be a tad less house proud, to put it mildly, in that landlords in this kind of neighborhood may think twice in investing that kind of money for chargers for risk of vandalism or theft or whatever... SO MOOT POINT!!! BUT... 3. With that angle out of the way, lets start with the real meat and potatoes argument of "There are solutions if owners are willing to pay for them. Not every apartment building owner will do this, and the majority have not as yet" Now...if we are talking about tenants that rent appartements and own Model 3s and Chevy Bolts... Landlords that own apartment buildings where people have good jobs and have tenants that could afford 40-50 thousand dollar vehicles....well...there is a business opportunity for the landlord to make some sort of money charging a fee covering for the installation, purchase, usage and wear and tear and cost of electricity AND for a small profit... And...people that have CHOSEN to buy or lease a Model 3 or Bolt REALIZE and UNDERSTAND and ACCEPT all of the little nuances and fees and whatnot that comes with owning a 40-50 thousand dollar EV WHILE living and renting an apartment so paying their landlord for service and usage of a charger will not only be accepted, but will be very much appreciated and DELIGHTED to do so!!! Landlords CAN use this and use it as a business venture and make a small profit... Everything has a cost attached to it. The great American spirit is to identify a need, calculate the costs involved and try to make some money of said opportunity. You may see this "There are solutions if owners are willing to pay for them. Not every apartment building owner will do this, and the majority have not as yet" as an obstacle, others may see that as an opportunity to make some fast cash. And as long as the business venture dont lose money...its a success!!! And the beauty of a charging unit. Once it has been installed. That is it! No other recurring costs are attached to it. Only the cost of electricity when in use... And if the building complex is being built new, then the charging units could be designed into the building and could be amortized with the mortgage of the building itself...

I dont mind GM just investing on this. It takes literally billions of dollars to invest in new tech. Hell, it takes billions to invest in new platforms revolving old tech... This way, somebody else does the R&D, the development and the time to engineer while you just help out with a fraction of the cost with investment and reap the benefits anyway. GM has and will continue to engineer their own EV tech, this way, they get to see what another company's vision will be as well and GM could improve upon their own tech going forward. Best of both world's. GM will be improving upon their own EV tech with only their own engineers. GM will see how another company does things with EV tech. Outside of their own engineering. Learn from both and improve the tech even further going forward.

That is still cherry picking a very non-existent problem for SOME EV buyers/owners. While that dilemma DOES exist, it aint THE problem for EV ownership. Because there ARE solutions out there for THAT kind of problem https://www.fastcompany.com/3064354/this-startup-makes-it-easier-to-charge-electric-cars-in-apartment-buildings https://www.chargepoint.com/en-ca/businesses/apartments-and-condos/ https://flo.ca/business/multi-unit-residential-buildings resistance to change... because even with THAT in mind: "Or homes with no driveways. Or apartment dwellers." There are no problems, just solutions... Granted, in some cases the solutions may be harder to get, or even impossible, but still...cherry picking...

Fair enough. Maybe a Model 3 owner (and a Chevroler Bolt, Nissan Leaf owner etc.) rents an apartment in the city somewhere and they park on the streets. But a Model S and Model X owner that are 100 000 dollar cars, the chances are they own (or rent) property that would probably have a garage where a charge station could be installed for use. If no garage, at least on the premises there is a parking lot and there would be a place for charge stations for the people to charge their EVs. Bottom line. Everybody's situation is different. We cant discuss and argue all the negatives just to cherry pick to prove a point. The thing is, an EV owner, if he is blessed with a living quarters that could house a charging station for his own personal use and has access to it 100% at all times whenever he wants it, then moot point to what Blu is trying to suggest. And Blu, he is an owner of a house, n'est-ce pas? He shouldnt even be using that as a negative that he uses the gas station every other day for 5 minutes and does not wait in line to charge a Tesla for hours JUST because he hates EVs... Because for him, if he chose to buy a cute little Chevy Bolt or a very enthusiast Tesla Model S or 3, he wouldnt have to "gas up" at a charge station for daily driving duties... Excuses are just that. Excuses. One could camouflage the hatred excuses and call it "their opinion", but its false to do so that way. Ill accept him just sticking to I HATE EVs than him trying to mask his hatred for EVs with falsehoods!!! That there is the difference why he continues to get flak for his nonacceptance for EVs. His skewing of the facts and the spread of falsehoods...

On some cars, I like that Bulgarian Whore house look, on others not so much. I DO prefer the French Whore house look though... I miss the velour and puffy leather interiors of the 1970s and to a lesser extent the 1980s. Cadillac may not need the quilted look if they do the Escala interior though. THIS is VERY classy!

But a Tesla owner, does not stop at all...as he charges at HOME!!! For the most part!!! But YOU can NEVER do that. Fill up at home! My partner, daily drives his Model S. There is NO charging station on the route he takes from his house to our restaurant. There is NO charging station at our restaurant either. He just uses his supercharger that he has installed at home... And he has done that for the last 4 years... Oh...he has taken it for trips. Family trips to wherever he has gone with his Model S. OK...he had to stop and take time to recharge his EV... But as far as daily driving it back and from home to work...NEVER! He beats you and I in THAT department. (As he does NOT detour away from his regular route to gas up) That part of his life (to visit a gasoline station every other day) is gone forever...

1. Chryco. Nearly went bankrupt (for whatever reason in the late 70s to early 80s. I was too young to know anything about that and now, dont really care about the reasons why) and got a government loan and they did the best of what they could with it and built crappy K-Cars and minivans to survive and pay back their loans... a) Telsa had nothing to do with disparaging Chryco with that K-car and minivan thing nor with the near bankruptcy... b) Chryco, to survive, invented a niche that is still doing good for them, but exciting for car enthusiasts it is not. OK, they merged with Mitsubishi at about that same same time and bought Lamborghini too and created some of the planet's most coolest and exciting cars. Ill give them that. But something happened and then they merged with another company and got their soul sucked right out. Tesla had no part in disparaging Chryco. with that either... 2. Chryco. DID go bankrupt in the mid 2000s. Tesla did no disparaging thing to Chryco. THAT would be Mercedes Benz. 3. Fiat bought the company as a result. And while Auburn engineers have done wonders with pick-up trucks and muscle cars, Fiat is another that COULD be blamed for disparaging Chryco. NOT Tesla. 4. Tesla...is an AMERICAN (call it car company, call it a tech company, call it crap if you wanna) company that has created a specific want and need for something that is quite different than what we are use to. THAT is not disparaging Chryco. That is just great business savvy. Tesla does what it does, nearly as well as Chryco who has been engineering and manufacturing and producing cars since, like YOU put it, since the 19th century. Not too bad for a company that has been doing that since, the 21st century. THAT is not disparaging Chryco. If people, want to buy Tesla vehicles then who are YOU to want to deny Tesla? a) You COULD still buy Chryco. vehicles if you want to. Barring they dont go bankrupt for a 3rd time. Again, nothing to do with Tesla my good friend....Plymouth got canned and Paypal barely existed, let alone Tesla... b) Nothing to do with Tesla either. YOU may not think that there is a market for EVs. But Tesla has sold at least 600 000 EVs so far in their existence. And a smaller, less expensive CUV based on the Model 3 is just about to be revealed. You could chalk up another at least 300 000-400 000 pre-orders for that one as well... THAT is not disparaging Chryco...that is just business. And YOU as freedom fighting, open market, free market loving, buy the hell what you want, American...well...you gots to LOVE that entrepreneurial spirit that Tesla has! THAT is not disparaging Chryco...that is just good business!!! PS: And ummmmm....NOTHING QUIET ABOUT WHAT TESLA DOES!!! ITS LOUD AND PROUD AND TAKING ALL THE OLD GUARD BY STORM!!! And the BEST thing about that? Is that the WHOLE world LOVES Tesla! There are some places on the planet that STILL do NOT know 19th century American car brands...but they do know about Telsa!

Well...I too, wanna hear it! JUST because I also like "heartless", "soulless", and QUIET EVs, does NOT mean I dont enjoy awesome V8 sounds...(Even though those V8 sounds happen to come out ugly, crappy pick-up trucks) So...post the damned thing so I can hears it!!!

Why? Call it laziness. Call it my right as an only child. Im am (was) her apple of her eye after all. Call it whatever you want, its my privilege as a Greek boy, an only child Greek boy, to be spoiled like that by his mom. *SHRUGS* C'est la vie my good friend. With my wife? She simply does NOT trust me with anything that has to do with HER house. Notice I said HER house? That is because its HER house and she does with it as she pleases. And she does not trust me to do anything around the house in fear that I will just screw things up. I do fix things around the house, but I am scrutinized and inspected closely by her. I have to pass her standards or I have to redo it or pay a professional to do the repair job properly. Most of time I do good. And if, knock on wood, our marriage goes south, well, its HER house if you catch my drift....

I got something better for you to check out without the FB BS... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVg9FLv_0-Y Just click on that link and be amazed, aroused and entertained! ditto for me BLU. I dont even have a Facebook acccount.

I was 30. I never once washed my own clothes...well, I went to Greece for vacation couple of times for a couple of months or so without my parents, so there is that. But on a whole, from mommy to straight to wife, I have never washed my own clothes!!! Damn proud of that!

Depending on the car, but Im one of these guys that likes sporty exterior enhancememts...especially on my FWD dreams..(I miss them dearly actually) Therefore, for me, a little exterior sporty enhancememt is welcomed. I see nothing wrong with it. And If the boyracer looks also comes with the goods, even better!!! (mind you, the Turbo GP was not too shabby in the performance department back in the day...not an AMG Hammer, but respectable..) AMG Hammer also got the boyracer styling too. Brings a smile to my face! ? Back to the XT5 Its just a subtle appearance package that is tastefully done. What seems to be the problem? Maybe wanting a V Series version? OK...fair enough. But how would you like that appearance though? Boyracer like the ATS-V and CTS-V or understated? Because Id understand a lot more if the complaining was for the boyracer looks of Cadillacs V Series cars...