balthazar

But once again- there will be no marketshare swap with IC in a mere 10 years. You're looking at a solid 30. As long as the bulk of an OEMs vehicles supply compliance with CAFE (if it stays), there will be room for high performance IC cars. The monster problem is finding whatever the happy medium is between where OEMs wish to be with EVs and what consumers are willing to sign for.

If they sell today @ $X, and they increase range & power, the price is going to go UP, not down. In what bizzaro world do you think a Leaf won't see a 1 dollar MSRP increase in 10 years time? But BTW, it'll take the Leaf 30 years to go from 80 miles to 350, if it ever gets there at all. It took it 7 years to go from 73 miles to 84- that's 1 mile range increase per model year- at that rate it'll take 250 model years to reach 350. Leaf will never look like a good buy vs. an Altima unless gas prices explode to $10/gal.

X4 is down 43% and X6 is flat- there's no booming there & they're RWD : Flops. BMW cars posting another 10% monthly drop- what is that; like 20 months of volume drop in cars @ BMW? : Freefall.

S-class up 7% is nothing, wasn't it down 30% last month? Must've upped the incentives in a panic. The car is stale and it reeks of 'old school choice', last generation should've been a bolder, more distinct change.

2001 Prius MSRP : $19,995 2017 Prius MSRP : $24,685 I know it's not an EV, but there's some overlap. My point is- vehicle prices don't go down, they only go up. EV battery costs may come down, but the cars won't ever get appreciably cheaper.

77 year old Ford frame: 10 year old toyoyo frame:

100% agree, and I've stated it here going back YEARS. General Motors was atop it's broad zenith when the Divisions strove to compete against all others plus (to some degree) the other Divisions. And this wasn't on a marketing level, but an engineering level. A great time in the industry.

Seems logical its anudder Jeepster. Tho I still think the Wrangler is fairly terrible, I'm starting to pay more attention to the others in the catalog.

So…. your contention is that the XTS is a "land yacht"? Why didn't you say that up front? I would disagree with that theory; doesn't fit what I think of as one. And the only proof I asked for was the 'people who think Cadillac makes land yachts today', which Cadillac model sales numbers do not address.

olds- let me restate with an analogy so you hear other than 'blahblah'. Olds : 'some people believe that there are living, breathing Stegosauruses still walking the earth.' Balthy : 'The 'Wildlife Federation', and empirical science, proves that's totally wrong.' Olds : 'Balthy, YOU have your head in the sand! The 'Wildlife Federation needs to combat the stigma.' You can't correct crazy (beyond powerful sedatives). Cadillac has already addressed all those totally illegitimate 'stigmas', there's nothing more to be done. The few crazies out there that still believe Cadillac is building the Fleetwood of the 90s are beyond caring about.

The Escalades you posted are not available thru Cadillac. There are just as many blinged out & dubbed mercedes swirling in the gutter- both are degridations of the respective brands… but they are done by private owners. That whole movement seems to be fading out anyway, and good riddance. What do you want me to prove the nonexistence of, exactly? I was talking about there no longer being Cadillac 'land yachts'; your proof is @ cadillac.com. That's NOT the answer!!! You have a monthly number for ATS sales, a car the same size & price, with comparable power trains & a better driver experience than it's competition, and JDN thinks splitting that segment with a car a few inches smaller, a few thousand less and FWD is going to 'turn things around'??? Can we get a circus clown's opinion of Cadillac's attack plan in here, please? Just saying 'it's there' doesn't show me. Again I refer you to cadillac.com. And again I submit; a stigma based on a vapor, from people who aren't a viable segment consumer, is immaterial. There are people out there who think 'mercedes' is 'Hitler's car'- a "stigma", what should mercedes do about that?

An A3 is NOT 'prestigious'. All I've ever heard is breezy heresay, I've never heard/seen any segment-viable consumer state they themselves believe Cadillac builds 'land yachts'. Regardless, they're obviously patently erroneous in that belief- how much energy does a retail entity expend convincing people who are wrong that they're wrong when the evidence is Right. There. Find me this microcosm of the car buying society who thinks this way, I mean; I want phone numbers/addresses. Oh God, YOU'RE ONE OF THEM! How is one of these 'blinged out' and other other isn't?? You seem to be dialed in to heresy; ever hear anyone call a full-size truck a 'land yacht'? I haven't.

CR-V has horrendous visibility. My buddy has one @ his house; the 3 women in the household all hate driving it.

Who has this impression, I mean' REALLY? The last Cadillac 'land yacht' was the Brougham, which hasn't been built in EIGHTEEN YEARS. You'd have to be some kind of mountaintop cave dweller to think Cadillac still built something befitting that nickname. WE ALL know there's no 'land yachts', but for some reason some of us think there's others of us that do. It's not the mindset that has to go away, but the mindset that there's a mindset. It's not legitimate. The Escalade is a full-size SUV, that's not remotely the same thing.

Cadillac already has one.

MSRPs run between $73K and $111K depending on power train- that's comparable to the segment (7-series starts @ $81K). S-class with the usual discounting starts @ $86K; Model S has no discounting. Model S certainly isn't in the e-class segment ($52K). Yes- it's not as large as the others in the segment, closer to mid-size, but credit to Tesla for positioning their 'compact full-size' where it is. It has other dimensions that meet or exceed the other 'full-size' sedans (width, cargo capacity). Just Q3 2016 numbers :

Not in the U.S. S-class is old- should've been bolder; current generation is too close to last one and frankly it's become the 'boring' choice. Only moving at a rate of 12K/yr and the Model S is closer to 50K. Tesla owns that segment.

• XT1 or XT2 (Subcompact crossover) in 2020 • CT1 or CT2 (A3 and CLA fighter) in 2021 ^ Oh Holy Hell; NO. ATS and CLA at the exact same size. Unless the CT3 is growing in size, and the CT5 is growing in size (it just shrank), WTF is Cadillac messing around like this for?? ATS/CT3 - DONE. NO LOWER. For God's sakes...

Went shopping (all flip candidates).

Should be 4 SUVs- why bother wasting billions on sedans in a dead segment? Especially with the dismal sales overall of EVs? It's amazing to watch these OEMs just about kill themselves, straining to chase what only they seem to think is the Next Great Thing, like self-driving cars. I just can't see that last one making major inroads within -say- 25 years. 'Start early, get a jump' one might say. I point to the luxury SUV market, started by Jeep in 1963. IOW, there's a 'time' for a market change, and you basically can't force that.

these designs mentioned here are iconic; they've basically reached their zenith. Change for changes' sake- what does that accomplish?

'04 Silverado 2500HD is @ 165K at the moment.

Why would you need a reverse camera in a pickup?