balthazar

>>"How is it possible to push start an automatic pre-59? What is the mechanical explanation to this?"<< Not an expert here, but I've both read and unintentionally experienced this: pre-'59 HydraMatics still have a rear pump in the trans that enable's push-starting. >>"Could you push start a Dynaflow? "<< Yes: the directions are in the B-59 owner's manual.

Attempting to predict the impact strength of a given bodystyle over another is like trying to accurately guess the .cd of a car by looking at it.

I can't agree with you about the styling, Reg- it's clean and aggresive at the same time- a nice combo. That 'pancake' roof also really ups the sporty factor; otherwise it could get visually ungainly quick. The nicest-looking wagon available, IMO; not 'over-the-top' at all.

moltar : >>"Hardtops are neat, I'm not sure how popular they would be today when all cars have A/C..."<< As you are fond of saying: 'It's not 1970 anymore'. In other words, hardtops are not about ventilation in 2009, but styling. A/C has nothing to do with the issue. Chris : I for one would value learning what specific engineering & cost hurdles would oppose an affordable hardtop today. Again- when designing a brand new unique non-convertible shell- making it a hardtop from the start should not be a tremendous deal- the same degree of testing/validation should still be ahead of it. But in this case, with a convertible on deck too, the structural neccessities of the convert should likewise satisfy all design requirements of the hardtop in one shell/ validation process. What am I missing here??

Yeah, most all post-war 2-dr sedans had roll down rear windows until the advent of circa 1970 'entry-level' cars, the Plymouth Duster & Ford Maverick (pivoting quarter windows) being 2 such. Fixed quarter windows (no roll, no pivot) came about shortly after- the '73 A-Body models had them. Obviously, I am not including foreign makes here. Sixty8- I believe it's the taller roofline on the sedans that prevents the quarter window from retracting 100%, because of course the hardtops' do.

Not sure about chassis's for B-O-C, but all sheetmetal & all interiors were changed for '58. Even some glass features changed (B & O dropped the 3-piece backlight). Additionally, many other features, such as transmissions & brakes were also new in some instances... but in general it could be said, yes: the '58 Buick-Olds-Cadillac were more refreshes than complete redesigns. However, in that everything you see from '57-58 is markedly different, I would still call them all 1-year only designs. '58 has another distinction: the last year you could push-start a GM automatic car.

Here's TWO who care. But like I said; not to the point of refusing to buy a Camaro if I really wanted one. When I saw the rear end of my '59 Buick sticking out from a East PA carport, I told my buddy, 'If it's an Invicta 2-dr (which is only a hardtop in the Invicta line), it's mine.' If it had been a LeSabre 2-dr sedan (with a B-Pillar), I would not have bought it. Not interested in a 4-dr of any bodystyle. But there are a million other compromises in modern cars that I have minor issues with. I have a different set of values when it comes to modern vehicles. I think the '09 Camaro flat kicks ass design-wise, it's a powerhouse design with a metric ton of attitude, and if in the market for a modern coupe, I'd buy it regardless of it's bodystyle. Still... it should be a hardtop, IMHO. BTW- adding the required structural steel to a hardtop version meet the same rigidity of a pillared coupe should not add more than 150 lbs at the most.... not the upwards of 600 lbs some here seem to think will be involved. Don't forget that the B-Pillar steel is still included, just in a different location.

As a general rule of thumb, a house's vintage is always a compromise. Newer homes of course have better insulation, better windows and higher capacity electrical & plumbing systems. Of course those things can always be added to older homes and the cost is not as great as you'd think. What can't be added to newer homes is the better construction quality and quality of many materials. Older homes (here I'm talking late 1800s into the 1950s) are substantially better built, structurally. From the '60s thru today, construction quality has steadily gone downhill, ESP since the '80s. In the last 7 years I've observed construction on homes costing up to $4M, and most crews today are marginal craftsmen at best and surprisingly many are just clueless hacks. I've seen some sorry sh!t, let me tell you. Thank God for increasingly stringent building codes or we'd be back in the 1700s.

It disappoints me, but would not make-or-break my purchase, were I itching to buy one. But the so-strong 'modern '69' design of the '09 makes me seriously wonder what the literal / engineering reasons are for making the Camaro sedan rather than a hardtop. Cost & structural rigidity don't seem like they'd amount to close to a prohibitive amount with a brand new shell- just add the appropriate bracing. Side impact is another issue, tho.

>>"every journey starts with a first step."<< It's just a source of amazement to me: hyundai builds sh!t for 85% of it's short history here, posts a year or 2 of decent product and everyone rushes forward with pursed lips to accept the next hyundai like it's made of gold. GM build excellent cars for 85% of it's history, runs thru a relatively short span of rough times, and people rush forward to redesign products that aren't even out yet. No credit for GM's recent big steps, but much love for a brand with one of the most abominable past records in the industry.

scharmer05- a question: why quote the entire opening post (including sig) when you are post #2?? Some of us schlubs still have dial-up connections (imagine!) and the needless repetition only slows page loading down. My family moved when I was 10, to a completely rural township: 3-4 miles away were 2 towns of about 2100 each. I have also lived in the city (Detroit & Baltimore)- and there is no comparison: give me rural life anyday. Right now I am in the suburbs and it's OK, but if I could snap my fingers I'd move farther out into the boonies.

>>"remember, not too long ago "Made in Japan" implied cheap & crappy."<< That was AT LEAST 25 years ago; for Hyundai (assuming you accept all the recent supposed quality allocades) it was more like 3 years ago. Feel free to gamble your money, I've learned the hard way, otherwise.

>>"Call me when the real cars are ready."<< They're out in your barn, waiting. I know mine are.

Ah; sorry, I thought you were referring to the Grand Am 'Camino pictured earlier. As far as the body designation goes, apparently the '82 & up Bonneville was on a stretched version of the GP A-Special chassis... I had misremembered it was the same and thought the LeMans had changed to a 'G' also. LeMans would still be an 'A' in this era.

old Lotus Esprit '49 Nash Ambassador Super 2-dr fastback '50 Merc coupe, chopped '70 Chevelle SS454 hardtop '69 Sedan deVille 4-dr hardtop '50 Buick Super 2-dr sedan '51 Ford 2-dr sedan '66 Pontiac Catalina 4-dr sedan (with the rear door handles shaved )

>>"Wow...I didn't know that a B-body El Camino existed outside of my imagination. Sweet."<< It doesn't; that's a LeMans-based 'El Camino' which was updated with a 1980 Grand Am nose. I am pretty certain the LeMans/Grand Am is a G-Body.

Tucker was working on a hydraulic valve system in '47. There was not enough time in his timeframe to work thru all the engineering- ended up going with a ready-built motor with conventional valvetrain. Had the business end of the venture not gotten in the way, this discussion could be going down an entirely different route.

>>"Ferdinand Porsche was first to create the idea of a hybrid"<< ??

Unlike those that assure others of a vehicle's wonderous features with overwrought, overdramatic & unbelievable adjectives for miniscule differences, I actually bring 18 (11 professionally, 7 part-time) years of graphic design experience to the table for my 'real solid testimony'. There are established and recognized text formatting and presentation guidelines, practices that enhance and enable clarity, communication and intuitivity of information. I clearly pointed out where honda fell flat in that respect, and it's not personal opinion but industry standard I'm relaying. Go re-read my post and look at the pic: at the very least you should be able to see that white digital numbers on a flat black background is hardly what most would call "detailed" and the inconsistancy and ambiguity of numerous points of design in the center screen primarily conveys uncertainty rather than "expensive" development. Example again- what is the "14.2" or the tiny 'A' indicating? At least if the fuel/temp readouts had a different color baseline so, as with the fuel reading, you'd know immediately if it was completely full or completely empty, but all the honda driver gets is a fat white line on a flat black background that he has to contrast with the temp reading to discern which it is. It's crap, graphically-speaking. You can choose not to see these aspects because of the "incredible" 'H' on the hood all you want, but at some point one would think you'd choke on your own saliva and consider for even a split second that the vehicles you favor are not, in fact, touched by the hand of God.

No one but me cares, but as Amateur Caretaker for the Automotive Past... 1961 Cadillacs were powered by 325 HP 390 CI V-8s. No such animal as a 398 American V-8, tho a .030 overbore of the 390 would equal 396 CI. I doubt they were getting that specific, but even if so, they're still wrong.>>"happily on pump gas, never stalling... Caddy acts as though it will run 80 mph all day long. And it pretty much does... it's not hard to keep it on center... Chassis stiffness is remarkable..."<< Always with an undertone of 'I thought this would be impossible; it's OLD for chrissakes!'

Flybrian: I hate you. If I had been let in there, either 1 of 2 scenarios would've happened: I'd still be there now, hiding and caressing. Or I'd have been thrown out in 5 minutes for licking. Any chance I could get a link to the imageshack album? 4th time trying and most of these 500 pics are not making it over my 56K hookup.

>>"Toyota has done the impossible....in a generation, they've overtaken the world's largest company as the #1 producer of automobiles. We can all debate how it was done, or critique Toyota's past, current or future, but, the bottom line is that this is a historic achievement."<< A generation is 20 years... toyota has been selling in this country since 1949; by my calculator that's HALF the timeline of the entire automobile industry (I realize the thrust here is global sales). Not sure that's quite so "historic" and I don't see where 'a generation' defines anything here. GM surpassed Ford to become #1 in only 23 years. - - - - - - There was an Associated Press pic with the article on this in my local paper yesterday, showing toyota pres Watanabe leaning against one of the (stolen ferrari tech) toyota F1 cars, looking slightly skyward with a teeth-splintering, &#036;h&#33;-eating, ear-to-ear grin, one clenched fist pumping the air above him. So much for worrying about market basklash (who here bought that bullsh!t story?).

Strange, classic headline, possibly from NY Post: "Headless Body in Topless Bar".

Looks very sharp, tho it also looks higher than the prev gen. Not sure if that's photo angles of suspension changes, but I'd like to see it lowered. >>"There’s been considerable gnashing of teeth from domestic pickup fans because Toyota’s remade 2007 Tundra was the first and only half-ton to offer a six-speed automatic gearbox and the most powerful gas engine in a standard duty pickup."<< No; there wasn't. Any fan of a GM truck that valued rated HP so highly would merely modify their GM for more- the aftermarket makes this a breeze. No GM fan bought a tundra just because it was rated a few HP more. >>"the Sierra Denali consistently ran 14.8-second quarter mile times at 93.9 miles per hour during three runs at Old Bridge Township Park Raceway in New Jersey."<< That's my home track. Thought it looked familar in the opening pic. Spring Swap Meet this weekend: 8 miles of walking, a mile of show cars, come on down for a good, hot, greasy, rusty time.

New design looks very nice. All Saturn cars should likewise feature very subtly-lit Saturn logos on the nose, both as a gee-whiz feature, and as a strong link to the new dealerships.