FUTURE_OF_GM

I agree, and have agreed with this view for a LONG time. But as usual, GM is so schizophrenic that it couldn't make Cadillac what it wanted the division to be. Lutz & Co had the vision of Cadillac battling the best brands in the luxury market. It was never supposed to be the mass market whore that GME and the 'new vision' is trying to make it. Cadillac should be exclusive, BUICK should be 'luxury for everyone' However, GMC's existence as is becomes very valid once profit margins are factored in. I don't see why Pontiac couldn't share a showroom with Saturn, since saturn is supposed to be Oldsmobile now anyway (A step ABOVE Pontiac--- If the division could ever pull the prices it's supposed to). Pontiac's line up can be limited to what it should truly be (performance cars) and the Saturn franchise can use it's "cleaner" image to EXPAND and provide volume for that channel. It's an all around win, Pontiac stays, Saturn expands and the dealers benefit. But it'll never happen because it makes to much sense for GM to think it's a good idea.

1) Zer0 2) LOL RTFLMFAO!!!!! Oh wait, you're serious?

1) Zer0 2) Probably never... Now that I know the truth behind Saturn, it'd be a safe bet that my money would be better spent elsewhere. (As in: a different manufacturer entirely)

You know, enzl... I have consistently been one of your biggest critics over the years. But everyday I see more and more of what you're talking about and what you predicted. I think this post pretty much sums everything up in a nice little package and I agree 100% with everything you said.

1) Zer0 2) I'd buy a Sierra over a Silverado anyday.

1) Zer0 2) I will seriously consider a Camaro, HHR SS or Cobalt SS or Corvette if I can afford it. But other than that, Pontiac gets my vote.

1) Zer0 2) If the HX were made available, I would seriously consider it.

1) Zero 2) Zero

1) Zer0 2) Pontiac is probably the FIRST place I would go for a new car to either buy a G8 GXP or Solstice Targa GXP. I would even consider a G5 over the Cobalt if it had original styling and a sporty nature. Notice how there are so many people who HAVEN'T bought a Pontiac but are now WILLING to look? That shows progress GM, the kind of progress you need for GROWTH instead of shrinking your market share.

And what's sad is that it's akin to GM just "giving up" They're like "Well, okay... GME wants us to o it this way and the politicians want us dead, so why not just forfeit our share to the competition and become a boutique company." So now we have Cadillac with Lambda and Epsilon (Which will ruin what little reputation they have left in the market) Saab with Delta and Epsilon (A division that no one outside of it's fan clubs gives a $h! about buying) Buick and Saturn with the SAME Deltas and Epsilons in the SAME showroom and Chevrolet with imported Korean $h!. That sounds like an awesome GM to me!!! (Sarcasm) How long until the GME faction eliminates Buick for competing with Saturn and how long until Saturn BECOMES Chevrolet as the budget gets tighter and Chevrolet is robbed of resources to prop up this failed business case from the 90s? How long before Cadillac loses ALL dignity and becomes 'damaged' again and Saab wins out as the ultimate luxury division?

Well, GME wants cadillac to be an Audi competitor. (Which will never happen) And I guess that's all that matters.

This is all pretty ignorant... The Escalade replacement should be on Zeta and there is no reason not to do that. I guess Cadillac is going to become a Lincoln competitor now with a bunch of FWD/V6 corporate bull$h! and a "has been" image. I knew GM didn't have the balls to actually compete. Killing the best selling and probably MOST profitable Lambda (Acadia) is sheer ignorance. Sure, Traverse will sell, but I bet it won't pull the margins that Acadia pulls. And killing the Enclave is suicide for Buick. Why is GM management so consistently panicky and stupid?

Cool, but still pretty ugly.

Could the leadership in this country be more ignorant?

Now Porsche can be the most over rated small car too!

Yep. I'll give credit where it's due. The more I think about your idea, the more I like it.

Ahh, the Rageous... One of my all time FAVORITE concepts. Too bad I can't find any decent pictures of it. I used to have the beautiful layout Motor Trend did with it on the cover, but I apparently lost/threw it away.

Wow... You people are no fun at all. I think fireworks are great and I set them off a lot. (Granted, it's not at all hours of the morning AND I live on the side of a mountain away from people) Especially around the 4th, not really to celebrate the nation, as I'm so very OVER what this country is. But rather just to see $h! blow up.

Yeah... I can't wait until that is considered a "sports car" Yay!

Yessir... It's a better match than Cadillac/Saab... Seriously? GM is trying to foist "true, flamboyant, american luxury" next to "weird, introverted, quirky" mid lux. www.notgonnahappen.com And why can't the brands exist as niches? Mini does it just fine... Scion does it perfectly... Maybach, even at its price, doesn't seem to have a problem. I look at it this way; GM is going to have to get innovative if it plans to retain the HUGE amount of equity and heritage it has. BUT once the market stabilizes, they'll be just fine. This whole brand quagmire represents the managements inability to HAVE SOME VISION and STICK TO IT. Not 2 years ago, we were in this situation. A solution was proposed and all was thought to be well. But, instead of giving it some time (The system is ALREADY showing signs of working) they introduce 2 new products and LOSE FOCUS. It's this same schizophrenia with the platform, divisions, designs, etc that will destroy GM. As long as the dog keeps chasing its tail in an imaginary panic as opposed to hunting for food, it ill die. IF, and that's a BIG IF pontiac has to go. I would support it becoming an HSV style, GMPD extension that hot-rodded and re faced ALL GM models.

Excellent ideas Croc. I especially like this idea:

First things first: GM needs to FOCUS the brands and utilize effective marketing Until they do that, nothing will make the company successful... Not good product, not high dollar leaders and not FORFEITING the market by cutting brands. IF HUMMER IS SOLD: First plan: Chevrolet continues as it is. Cadillac actually gets the product it needs to be taken seriously. Saturn and Saab join form one channel and are given marketing dollars to 'create a cohesive image'. Saab launches it's current 'future product' and is given ONE LAST CHANCE to show some sort of benefit from it's ownership. Pontiac is given viable product to be a 'good alternative to Chevrolet (Meaning a mix of performance and economy vehicles that ARE NOT DIRECT CLONES OF CHEVROLETS) GMC is paired down to a smaller line up. Make the Denali line, (Including the XT) the Acadia and the Terrain GMCs entire showroom. If you want to differentiate them from Chevrolet and take the division upmarket, then DO IT. There is no reason why a showroom of GMC Denalis can't make a profit for GM. The HX can morph into a GMC and be sold on the "Professional Grade Truck" image and probably open up a whole new market to the already successful division. The H3/H3T can become Chevies if it is needed. Buick sticks to it's plans. So essentially, GMC and Pontiac are altered. The B/P/GMC channel can benefit from GMC lining up as a true mid-lux premium truck brand beside Buick. And if the market sinks far enough that Cadillac wants to bail on GMT900, GMC can take up the slack by continuing to move upmarket as the premium truck division at GM. (READ: this is a GRADUAL change unlike the Saturn "experience" that has confused the hell out of consumers) Then the B/P/GMC channel can also benefit from Pontiac being more of a volume player instead of niche performance models only. Sure, it'll continue to offer performance and better styling than Chevrolet, but it won't be a niche division. And there is absolutely NO reason why a company that still holds 20% of the market here cannot accomodate one and a half VOLUME divisions. Hyundai/Kia pulls it off without that much of the market and with LESS differentation. Possible Dealer channels: 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Buick/Pontiac/GMC Second plan: Chevrolet continues as it is. Cadillac actually gets the product it needs to be taken seriously. Saturn and Saab join form one channel and are given marketing dollars to 'create a cohesive image'. Saab launches it's current 'future product' and is given ONE LAST CHANCE to show some sort of benefit from it's ownership. Pontiac is paired down to performance models ONLY and given a hot compact off of Delta II, something nice off of Kappa and/or Alpha and one of two Zetas, maybe a mini competitor. It is given a marketing budget to focus purely at enthusiasts and will have to completely rebuild it's image (partially) with very aggressive themes and products. This division ISN'T made for volume and that would be emphasized in the marketing. Buick continues as is and GMC reduces overlap with Chevrolet while expanding to include the "rugged" image of Hummer as the brand moves more premium in feel/image. Chevrolet already prices AND SELLS its trucks in lower GMC territory anyway. (Cadillac can market the more 'refined and luxurious' approach. Especially if the Escalade moves from GMT900) In this plan, B/P/GMC becomes more specialized and focused (something that should've happened already) Chevrolet and Cadillac can be the BIG brands, but if you want something a little different and not so common, why not visit the B/P/GMC store. It would take creative and highly focused products going forward. Possible dealer channels: 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Buick/Pontiac/GMC -or- 1) Chevrolet/Pontiac 2) Cadillac 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Buick/GMC -or- 1) Chevrolet/Pontiac 2) Cadillac/Buick/GMC 3) Saturn/Saab Third plan: Chevrolet continues as it is. Cadillac actually gets the product it needs to be taken seriously. Saturn and Saab join form one channel and are given marketing dollars to 'create a cohesive image'. Saab launches it's current 'future product' and is given ONE LAST CHANCE to show some sort of benefit from it's ownership. Pontiac is paired down to performance models only, GMC is paired down as well and Buick continues on the path to the future. Possible dealer channels: 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Pontiac/Buick/GMC -or- 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac/Buick 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Pontiac/GMC (as niche boutique dealers that would be marketed as "as close to family owned as you can get" which would be a HUGE selling point in todays 'nostalgic' times) -or- 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac/Pontiac (The Pontiac 'sports' clientele could eventually step up to Cadillac***) 3) Saturn/Saab 4) Buick/GMC *** I've always believed that GM should operate as 3 entities to give the consumer 3 flavors. 1) The MASS market consumer can start at Chevrolet and step up to Buick/GMC 2) The ENTHUSIAST could start at Pontiac (what Pontiac is supposed to be) and step up to Cadillac (/Hummer) (This would keep it more exclusive than Buick and at the top of the heap, while NOT watering down the division) 3) The techie, euro fan could start at Saturn and step up to Saab. Fourth plan: SELL SAAB and call it a day. Possible dealer channels: 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac 3) Saturn 4) Pontiac/Buick/GMC -or- 1) Chevrolet 2) Cadillac/Buick 3) Saturn 4) Pontiac/GMC The bottom line is this: GM would be doing fine if they would just FOCUS the divisions and put the importance of SUBSTANCE/IMAGE/CONSUMERISM above the need to IMMEDIATELY turn a huge profit. the days of GM turning a HUGE profit are GONE for the forseeable future and they need to understand that. It's time to REBUILD (the brands have equity that has yet to be tapped) and until 'management' understands that simple concept, they'll be cutting divisions ever 3-4 years until they slit their own throats.

A lot of times it's the experience that counts, not the speed.

+1 again

+1