Tariff Tuesday - Buick Killing it in China; Killed in the U.S.

Frankly, I'm upset over this. I've always had a soft spot for Buick.

Buick is at risk of becoming Chrysler, a 1 model brand.  They can keep the Enclave since it is built here, and the XT6 is dying this year which might help sales.  They won't kill the brand since they don't want to buy out dealers, so you cut them down to 1 model and hope dealers opt-out.  

The Envista and Encore GX hit a sweet spot of small SUV at under $30k, but the tariffs would wreck that formula.  Although the Kia Seltos, Hyundai Kona,  VW Taos are all imported too and would suffer the same problem.  

Buick like Chrysler are Dead Auto Brands stagnant. The Tariffs are just stupid and if you do the full 245% that has been in the news makes Buick dead, dead, dead.

Then we have Mazda announcement that they have stopped all production of the CX50 model for the Canada market as they are not going to deal with the Tariffs to go over the border. As such, people laid off, less product, but Canada will now get their CX50's from Japan according to the news.

Buick like Mazda are now casualties of idiot leadership by a person who never has had to work hard let alone build anything in a global market.

Buick couldn't be a more useless brand in the US. They only make different branded Chevys, GMCs and Cadillacs. Do they offer anything different than Chevy, GMC or Cadillac? 

23 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Buick couldn't be a more useless brand in the US. They only make different branded Chevys, GMCs and Cadillacs. Do they offer anything different than Chevy, GMC or Cadillac? 

No, Buick today is just a bunch of ugly generic CUVs.  Nothing unique or memorable, just bland appliances. Likely well built and reliable, but 0% style.  Buick has lost the plot.

I'll admit I'm a bit older, but to me these  are Buicks...the new stuff has zero appeal to me.

31 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

No, Buick today is just a bunch of ugly generic CUVs.  Nothing unique or memorable, just bland appliances. Likely well built and reliable, but 0% style.  Buick has lost the plot.

Yeah, their lineup does absolutely nothing for me. I'm sure they're adequate vehicles, but why buy them over a Chevy or GMC? Why have a whole separate brand for lazy badge-engineered vehicles? 

If they at least offered powertrain options that aren't available on their Chevy or GMC counterparts, I could get behind them more. Maybe offer conventional hybrids, plug-in hybrids or more powerful tunes of their respective turbo engines. SOMETHING to differentiate them. 

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

Yeah, their lineup does absolutely nothing for me. I'm sure they're adequate vehicles, but why buy them over a Chevy or GMC? Why have a whole separate brand for lazy badge-engineered vehicles? 

If they at least offered powertrain options that aren't available on their Chevy or GMC counterparts, I could get behind them more. Maybe offer conventional hybrids, plug-in hybrids or more powerful tunes of their respective turbo engines. SOMETHING to differentiate them. 

My sister has the Envision from China, previously GMC, has had less problems with the Buick than the GMC, so for whatever reason, the Chinese made SUV is more reliable than the US built version. Weird, but I get it, she is going to wait till more Buicks can come back in without the stupid tariffs before upgrading again.

Other than that noticeable issue, I totally agree with you and Robert.

On 4/23/2025 at 3:35 PM, ccap41 said:

Buick couldn't be a more useless brand in the US. They only make different branded Chevys, GMCs and Cadillacs. Do they offer anything different than Chevy, GMC or Cadillac? 

7 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

No, Buick today is just a bunch of ugly generic CUVs.  Nothing unique or memorable, just bland appliances. Likely well built and reliable, but 0% style.  Buick has lost the plot.

Oddly enough it's the Envision, the Chinese one, that is the most unique of the Buick lineup. While it is plaform-shared with the Terrain and 'Nox, it has different dimensions in and out and does feel like a significantly more premium vehicle.   Unless someone is really hung up about brand and RWD, I would recommend an Envision Avenir over a X3 or GLC any day. I can't say the same about a Terrain Denali though.

This is interesting, @A Horse With No Name saw this today on Instagram as it was Mexico plated BYD driving in California.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DHjpyzky6k3/?igsh=MTl0a3lxOGR0YjZtMA==

9 hours ago, G. David Felt said:

This is interesting, @A Horse With No Name saw this today on Instagram as it was Mexico plated BYD driving in California.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DHjpyzky6k3/?igsh=MTl0a3lxOGR0YjZtMA==

Yeah, BYD is already in central and south America.

12 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

 

Oddly enough it's the Envision, the Chinese one, that is the most unique of the Buick lineup. While it is plaform-shared with the Terrain and 'Nox, it has different dimensions in and out and does feel like a significantly more premium vehicle.   Unless someone is really hung up about brand and RWD, I would recommend an Envision Avenir over a X3 or GLC any day. I can't say the same about a Terrain Denali though.

So they have one vehicle that's sliiightly different but still isn't more desirable than a Terrain Denali. Sooooo it's still just a useless brand. Okay, it isn't useless for GM. Everything is paid for and they just charge more than a Chevy for it, so I see their business case. I just don't understand their case as a consumer. 

4 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

So they have one vehicle that's sliiightly different but still isn't more desirable than a Terrain Denali. Sooooo it's still just a useless brand.

Eh, no. The Envision is more desirable to a different customer. It has a substantially nicer interior, better sound isolation, better standard engine, and frankly, looks a lot better too.  I'd buy an Envision, I wouldn't buy a Terrain Denali over it.

The Enclave has less powertrain differentiation, but the interior, again, is substantially nicer. GMC did up the niceness of the Denali, but the Buick is above it still.

The Encore GX is the one that is too close for comfort to the Trax. The Envista is a different style of vehicle than anything Chevy has.

6 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I'd buy an Envision, I wouldn't buy a Terrain Denali over it.

I guess I misunderstood your last comment. To me, your last line made it sound like you'd still take a Terrain Denali over it. 

1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

I guess I misunderstood your last comment. To me, your last line made it sound like you'd still take a Terrain Denali over it. 

Yeah, I meant that if Brand or RWD wasn't a concern, an Envision Avenir would be a great alternative to an X3 or GLC of the same price.  The Terrain Denali wouldn't be.... if for no other reason than you're stuck with that weaksauce 1.5T. 

And before @smk4565 comes in here talking about 0-60 or horsepower of the Envision v. X3, the buyer I'm talking about doesn't care about those things. Buick geared the Envision right so that the torquey 2.0T always feels effortless to drive. Will it lose to an X3 in a drag race? Yes, but the people buying these just want quiet and effortless power to get out of the Target parking lot.

1 hour ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Yeah, I meant that if Brand or RWD wasn't a concern, an Envision Avenir would be a great alternative to an X3 or GLC of the same price.  The Terrain Denali wouldn't be.... if for no other reason than you're stuck with that weaksauce 1.5T. 

 

And before @smk4565 comes in here talking about 0-60 or horsepower of the Envision v. X3, the buyer I'm talking about doesn't care about those things. Buick geared the Envision right so that the torquey 2.0T always feels effortless to drive. Will it lose to an X3 in a drag race? Yes, but the people buying these just want quiet and effortless power to get out of the Target parking lot.

That last line is exactly why my sister who is an in home care open wound nurse bought, quiet and effortless for her comfort of driving from home to home to take care of people. Could care less about speed.

3 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Yeah, BYD is already in central and south America.

They are huge down there.

23 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

No, Buick today is just a bunch of ugly generic CUVs.  Nothing unique or memorable, just bland appliances. Likely well built and reliable, but 0% style.  Buick has lost the plot.

I'll admit I'm a bit older, but to me these  are Buicks...the new stuff has zero appeal to me.

 

I find great appeal in these but they are from a bygone era. No one will spend 60K to restore a 4 door land yacht like that blue Buick when it would bring ten grand tops resale. Which is why demo derbies are still full of cars like that.

Only modern vehicles with much appeal to me are midsized pickups and things that can get me to a hiking trail reliably, like a Subaru Outback/Crosstrek or something.

On 4/23/2025 at 1:11 PM, G. David Felt said:

Buick like Chrysler are Dead Auto Brands stagnant. The Tariffs are just stupid and if you do the full 245% that has been in the news makes Buick dead, dead, dead.

Then we have Mazda announcement that they have stopped all production of the CX50 model for the Canada market as they are not going to deal with the Tariffs to go over the border. As such, people laid off, less product, but Canada will now get their CX50's from Japan according to the news.

Buick like Mazda are now casualties of idiot leadership by a person who never has had to work hard let alone build anything in a global market.

It is only going to get worse.

On 4/22/2025 at 8:04 PM, Drew Dowdell said:

Last week, April 15th, Tax Day for those of us in the U.S., we started a new series called Tariff Tuesday. President Trump’s tariffs amount to one of the largest single increases in taxes on the American People in history. The tariffs which, if fully implemented, will raise $1.4 trillion in revenue, an increase per household of $1,900 to $7,600 per year. Trump's tariff policies change daily, sometimes hourly, so as always, this information is correct for at least 15 minutes after publication. Each week we document the effects the tariff have or could have on the U.S. automotive industry.  Last week we made the case that under Trump's tariff policies, affordable sports cars are dead.

Prediction: Buick - Killed in the US while Killing it in China

Buick is in a bit of a pickle. The number of models they field in the U.S. has dwindled down to just four.  In spite of the decrease in offerings, the brand has shown growth in recent years with a significant jump of 39% in the first quarter of 2025.  It seems as though Americans were catching on to Buick's new offerings.  Buick specializes in inexpensive but premium-feeling small and medium-sized crossovers with just the U.S.-built Enclave filling the large crossover spot. However, Buick's best sellers all come from overseas.  

The Encore GX is Buick's best seller with 58,239 units sold in 2024. The second runner up is the Buick Envista at 51,316 units.  These two models account for more than 50% of all Buick sales in the U.S.  Both models are built in South Korea. The Buick Envision is their third best seller (47,340) and accounts for about a third of all sales. It is built in China. The Enclave is their most expensive model. It is built in the US. 2024 sales numbers are distorted (26,400) as it was a model change-over year, but they have typically moved around 40,000 units a year.

The South Korean built Encore GX and Envista would face 25% tariffs, adding at least $6,000 - $7,000 to the base price of the vehicles.  This pushes the roughly $24,000 Envista and $26,000 Encore GX base prices to between $29,750 to $32,500 respectively.  The same currently goes for the Chinese-built Envision. While Trump has raised tariffs on most Chinese imports over 100%, vehicles and vehicle parts from China are under an exemption that keeps the tariff at "only" 25%.  The base price of the Envision is $36,500 and with the tariff would likely go over $45,000.

While these imported Buick models are excellent values at their current prices and Buick routinely tops the reliability charts, such significant price increases push these models into territory they where not intended to compete in. At nearly $30,000, a base Buick Envista would have to compete with the much larger, more capable, and just as nice U.S.-built Honda CR-V.

Across the Pacific, Buick is doing well in China. They have eleven models on sale today with six more coming on a new EV/PHEV/EREV platform showcased with the Buick Electra GS Concept. Buick and GM are making major inroads in the hot EV market their with 40% increases in EV/PHEV market share. They are also showcasing LFP batteries with faster charging technology than is currently available in the U.S.   Buick China is so confident in their new platform, they are launching an entire sub-brand called Electra that will feature these six new models.

We don't see how Buick can maintain its momentum in the US with massive price increases on its three most popular models that comprise most of their sales. Barclays estimates that GM will cease all imports from South Korea and China, totaling roughly 450,000 vehicles over multiple brands due to tariffs. Rather than on-shoring production, GM may just chose to shutter the brand in the U.S. entirely and let it live on solely in China. While Buick is no longer a major selling brand in the US, ending it removes choice and competition for American consumers. That increased cost and loss of choice are tied directly to the Trump tariffs.

 

 

 

View full article

 

Yep, to be replaced by BYD and other folks.

10 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Yeah, I meant that if Brand or RWD wasn't a concern, an Envision Avenir would be a great alternative to an X3 or GLC of the same price.  The Terrain Denali wouldn't be.... if for no other reason than you're stuck with that weaksauce 1.5T. 

 

And before @smk4565 comes in here talking about 0-60 or horsepower of the Envision v. X3, the buyer I'm talking about doesn't care about those things. Buick geared the Envision right so that the torquey 2.0T always feels effortless to drive. Will it lose to an X3 in a drag race? Yes, but the people buying these just want quiet and effortless power to get out of the Target parking lot.

The Envision is still wrong wheel drive for the BMW true believers, and wrong badge for the snobs.  

Solution to the Terrain/Envision issue is just make the Terrain interior better and make the 2.0T an option.  

I think a general problem is GMC or Buick is they aren't really much nicer than a Chevrolet, they are basically Chevy overlap, but GM must feel there is enough market out there for people that want a 10% nicer Chevy and won't otherwise buy a Chevy if GMC and Buick weren't around.  And they can't buy out the dealer network because it would cost too much.

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

The Envision is still wrong wheel drive for the BMW true believers, and wrong badge for the snobs.  

Solution to the Terrain/Envision issue is just make the Terrain interior better and make the 2.0T an option.  

I think a general problem is GMC or Buick is they aren't really much nicer than a Chevrolet, they are basically Chevy overlap, but GM must feel there is enough market out there for people that want a 10% nicer Chevy and won't otherwise buy a Chevy if GMC and Buick weren't around.  And they can't buy out the dealer network because it would cost too much.

But that’s what I’m saying. The Envision is much nicer than the Chevy inside, and for the price nicer than the BMW too. The Enclave could be powered better, but the interior is appropriately luxury car level.

The only one I’d question is the Encore GX but it sells really well, so it’s gotta be making them a profit pre-tariffs.

GMC is much closer to Chevy 

1 hour ago, Drew Dowdell said:

But that’s what I’m saying. The Envision is much nicer than the Chevy inside, and for the price nicer than the BMW too. The Enclave could be powered better, but the interior is appropriately luxury car level.

The only one I’d question is the Encore GX but it sells really well, so it’s gotta be making them a profit pre-tariffs.

GMC is much closer to Chevy 

I'd say Buick interiors are more Hyundai/Kia level.  Yes they are better than Chevy, but Chevy has historically had bad interiors.

The new X3 interior is a design mess, but probably still better than anything GM has near that price.  BMW outsold Cadillac and Buick combined last year in the US.  Despite Cadillac's EV resurgence that I think is going pretty well, they still have a long way to go.  

GMC to Chevy is Jeep to Dodge, basically the same, a little more trucky and less brand image stigma.

On 4/25/2025 at 11:35 PM, smk4565 said:

I'd say Buick interiors are more Hyundai/Kia level.  Yes they are better than Chevy, but Chevy has historically had bad interiors.

Envista/Encore GX? Yes. Envision, only high end Hyundai like top trim Palisade or Santa Fe Calligraphy.  That said, the Santa Fe Calligraphy bats way out of its league. It is significantly better than the Lexus TX.  So comparing an Envision or Enclave to it really isn't an insult, but more a measure of how far Hyundai has come.  Buick still does better with noise isolation than Hyundai, but it is getting a lot closer.

On 4/25/2025 at 11:35 PM, smk4565 said:

The new X3 interior is a design mess, but probably still better than anything GM has near that price.  BMW outsold Cadillac and Buick combined last year in the US.  Despite Cadillac's EV resurgence that I think is going pretty well, they still have a long way to go

Na, Cadillac has closed the gap on interior material quality. Some of that is Cadillac moving up and some of it is BMW moving down. Cadillac has a more coherent interior design as well.  And again, an Optiq EV and an ICE X3 have reached price parity.

BMW has many more models than Cadillac and Buick combined. It's like saying Chevy outsells Dodge, Jeep, and Chrysler combined.

11 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Envista/Encore GX? Yes. Envision, only high end Hyundai like top trim Palisade or Santa Fe Calligraphy.  That said, the Santa Fe Calligraphy bats way out of its league. It is significantly better than the Lexus TX.  So comparing an Envision or Enclave to it really isn't an insult, but more a measure of how far Hyundai has come.  Buick still does better with noise isolation than Hyundai, but it is getting a lot closer.

Na, Cadillac has closed the gap on interior material quality. Some of that is Cadillac moving up and some of it is BMW moving down. Cadillac has a more coherent interior design as well.  And again, an Optiq EV and an ICE X3 have reached price parity.

BMW has many more models than Cadillac and Buick combined. It's like saying Chevy outsells Dodge, Jeep, and Chrysler combined.

BMW has come down, Cadillac Lyriq interior compared to like an XT6 is a big leap forward.  Still some cheap bits even in a Lyriq interior.

Buick and Cadillac have about 15 models combined, pretty close to BMW.  But I would argue back why doesn’t Cadillac make a coupe or a convertible or a sports car, etc.  Because they probably fear it would not sell because they are not on par with a Mercedes or BMW.

10 hours ago, smk4565 said:

BMW has come down, Cadillac Lyriq interior compared to like an XT6 is a big leap forward.  Still some cheap bits even in a Lyriq interior.

Buick and Cadillac have about 15 models combined, pretty close to BMW.  But I would argue back why doesn’t Cadillac make a coupe or a convertible or a sports car, etc.  Because they probably fear it would not sell because they are not on par with a Mercedes or BMW.

I would argue it's because they wouldn't sell regardless. Even the German ones don't sell in any number.  Cadillac does have sport sedans and C&D just rated the CT5 V-Blackwing higher than the Germans.

14 hours ago, smk4565 said:

BMW has come down, Cadillac Lyriq interior compared to like an XT6 is a big leap forward.  Still some cheap bits even in a Lyriq interior.

Buick and Cadillac have about 15 models combined, pretty close to BMW.  But I would argue back why doesn’t Cadillac make a coupe or a convertible or a sports car, etc.  Because they probably fear it would not sell because they are not on par with a Mercedes or BMW.

If the Germans were HONEST with their sales numbers and profits per model, the coupe / sports cars that are just 2 doors are probably money losers. As such, why have an auto just for Auto Sake, The current V series already kick ass over the Germans and the money is made in the SUVs, so at this point in time, your grabbing at straws to justify the German brands which are past their prime as they are behind in EV technology and have lost their luxury shine even in performance to others.

As they say, every dog has its day and they had theirs and now Cadillac is surging again to come back to the top dog position.

1 minute ago, G. David Felt said:

If the Germans were HONEST with their sales numbers and profits per model, the coupe / sports cars that are just 2 doors are probably money losers. As such, why have an auto just for Auto Sake, The current V series already kick ass over the Germans and the money is made in the SUVs, so at this point in time, your grabbing at straws to justify the German brands which are past their prime as they are behind in EV technology and have lost their luxury shine even in performance to others.

As they say, every dog has its day and they had theirs and now Cadillac is surging again to come back to the top dog position.

This is true. Cadillac has leapt out in front of the Germans on the EV front. Not just in tech, but broad visual appeal.  The Cadillacs look significantly better than their BMW and MB counterparts. Only Audi is competitive in looks, but Cadillac eclipses them in range and self-driving tech.

It's strange bedfellows that Genesis and Cadillac are luxury brand with the better tech and styling over the Germans for EVs.

7 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

This is true. Cadillac has leapt out in front of the Germans on the EV front. Not just in tech, but broad visual appeal.  The Cadillacs look significantly better than their BMW and MB counterparts. Only Audi is competitive in looks, but Cadillac eclipses them in range and self-driving tech.

It's strange bedfellows that Genesis and Cadillac are luxury brand with the better tech and styling over the Germans for EVs.

Doesn't BMW sell more EV's than Cadillac and Genesis?    And once Mercedes redoes their EV's they'll be fine.  CLA this year, the AMG EV sedan is being shown this year, electric GLB and GLC I think next year, electric E-class in 2027 and so on.  

And not that I am big plug in hybrid believer because I think it adds a lot of weight and complexity, but Mercedes makes 11 plug-in hybrids, Cadillac and Genesis don't have any.   And a lot of people think PHEV is where the market is going in the near future.

7 hours ago, G. David Felt said:

If the Germans were HONEST with their sales numbers and profits per model, the coupe / sports cars that are just 2 doors are probably money losers. As such, why have an auto just for Auto Sake, The current V series already kick ass over the Germans and the money is made in the SUVs, so at this point in time, your grabbing at straws to justify the German brands which are past their prime as they are behind in EV technology and have lost their luxury shine even in performance to others.

As they say, every dog has its day and they had theirs and now Cadillac is surging again to come back to the top dog position.

Porsche, Mercedes and BMW are 3 of the most profitable car brands, I am pretty sure they know what they are doing.

Cadillac sold 160,000 cars in 2024 (US sales) Audi sold 196,000.  Mercedes, Lexus and BMW are in the 300s.  I think Cadillac is on the right track with their EV's and they have to keep advancing the tech, going into Formula 1 is a right move.  Cadillac is doing a lot of correct steps, but there is still a long journey ahead to overtake BMW.  

20 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

This is true. Cadillac has leapt out in front of the Germans on the EV front. Not just in tech, but broad visual appeal.  The Cadillacs look significantly better than their BMW and MB counterparts. Only Audi is competitive in looks, but Cadillac eclipses them in range and self-driving tech.

It's strange bedfellows that Genesis and Cadillac are luxury brand with the better tech and styling over the Germans for EVs.

They do look substantially better, yes, I will agree with that.

12 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Porsche, Mercedes and BMW are 3 of the most profitable car brands, I am pretty sure they know what they are doing.

Cadillac sold 160,000 cars in 2024 (US sales) Audi sold 196,000.  Mercedes, Lexus and BMW are in the 300s.  I think Cadillac is on the right track with their EV's and they have to keep advancing the tech, going into Formula 1 is a right move.  Cadillac is doing a lot of correct steps, but there is still a long journey ahead to overtake BMW.  

I don't look at number built as the ultimate metric, how interesting of a car are you building.

Some one of one MOPAR muscle cars are fantastic, Toyota built nine billion nine hundred ninety nine trillion Corollas and they are universally boring cars.

Cadillac is building interesting Iron.

4 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I don't look at number built as the ultimate metric, how interesting of a car are you building.

Some one of one MOPAR muscle cars are fantastic, Toyota built nine billion nine hundred ninety nine trillion Corollas and they are universally boring cars.

Cadillac is building interesting Iron.

Toyota makes money through and Stellantis kind of struggles and has a lousy stock price.

@Drew Dowdell @G. David Felt

Question on the Buick Encore and Lincoln Nautilus, are they 25% tariff die to imported auto or 145% tariff due to Chinese goods?

6 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Toyota makes money through and Stellantis kind of struggles and has a lousy stock price.

@Drew Dowdell @G. David Felt

Question on the Buick Encore and Lincoln Nautilus, are they 25% tariff die to imported auto or 145% tariff due to Chinese goods?

Stellantis makes a lot of interesting fashionable giant paper weights for your driveway. Building actual reliable vehicles might help them. Also, not pricing everything in the stratosphere. 

21 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

@Drew Dowdell @G. David Felt

Question on the Buick Encore and Lincoln Nautilus, are they 25% tariff die to imported auto or 145% tariff due to Chinese goods?

That is a tough question, GM has stopped importing and those that have come in are being kept at the ports till this issue gets resolved. I honestly can see plenty of auto's from Europe, Asia sitting at our ports for months and eventually having to be discounted at the end of the year to be sold due to this stupidity. 

In regards to Mexico and Canada, I have not seen any clear message on how the auto companies are dealing with the models that are built there to come here. As far as I can see, they have paused production, but not 100% sure on all of it as it is such a birds nest mess.

Hopefully Drew might have some other insight I have not seen yet.