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caddycruiser

3 New GM rides in 7 months…the Story

18 posts in this topic

I’m trying to make this short, but if you’ve seen even my other single posts...humor me. It’s a long time coming. For more pictures of each of my 3 new GM rides, hit the Member’s Rides Showcase HERE.

If any of you remember, last year early in the summer after I had just graduated and started working officially, I posted about new car shopping. Driving my beloved ’95 Cadillac Fleetwood at the time, I thought I wanted to make a drastic change and was looking at anything from a Chevy HHR to a Honda Fit to, essentially, what I “really wanted” with another new Malibu like I had chosen for my mother earlier in the year and loved.

#1: 2008 Pontiac G6 GT Coupe

White Diamond Tri-Coat, Light Taupe cloth, Sunroof/6-CD, 18” 5-spoke wheels, Remote Start, Cargo Nets & Floor Mats.

Ended up with an ’08 G6 GT coupe that I actually really, really, really liked, and it was a car I never expected to even give a second thought but stumbled upon on the dealer lot, sat in, checked out, and drove a few. Had to have one, really. Spec’d out the perfect one & my dealer got it for me from a dealer in south Jersey, no sweat.

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I really did enjoy this car for what it should have been and honestly still miss it—yes, really. It fit me well, was fun, looked terrific and enough so that it garnered positive comments and questions daily, and I liked how it drove. And, also unexpectedly, I did a 3 year lease so I for sure could jump into something else by about the presumed time I was ready.

BUT, but, BUT, even in the first 24 hours bizarre things started happening and from that first night onto the next 3 straight months of insanity, despite how much I enjoyed the car, it was a nightmare in regards to un-resolvable issues. What went wrong? A list works best, I guess.

1) First night I drove it home, it poured and for whatever reason with this, steam/vapor would just pour out of the front when it was running and got wet. Not a real issue, per say, but not at all normal vs. any other car we’ve ever had, especially when parked in the driveway and it would just keep spewing for 5+ minutes. Alarmed someone at a red light beside me once in the rain too, steaming away. Talked to other G6 owners, even at the dealer, never heard of it with anyone else and eventually—I think—it just stopped happening. Really, this was nothing compared to the other problems.

2) The “Check Gas Cap” alarm & light, or, shall I call it, my in car greeting at least once a week if not once a day from the first morning I had it. Initially, all excited to drive my new car to work, I left home and within a mile ding-ding-ding, Check Gas Cap came on. Probably one of the most common car alerts around, I knew it well and, although unexpected, pulled over, tightened the cap, and went about my merry way.

If only I had known. This ding-ding-ding, alert message on, and then even having gas fumes clearly apparent in the car happened 17 times in total, in the 3.5 months I had the car. Another issue that may or may not have been related was the car chugging and/or shaking from time to time, at idle, under power, or just lightly cruising—often, although randomly in degree. It was checked, checked again, GM TAC was called, and in the end as part of the final repair attempt, after again checking every kind of evap & fuel system part & test they could, dropped the gas tank, replaced the fuel pump, fuel level sensor/sender, gas cap, and re-installed. After? Ran the same if not worse, ding-ding-ding and Check Gas Cap came on more than once and was now accompanied by a gas gauge that would go up-down-up and dance around as it felt, the Check Engine light came on one day with the crazed gauge, AND now even the Outside Temp readout was goofed, sticking on a wrong temperature forever throughout the day only to maybe update or not, if it felt like it. Never, ever fixed, and just went on and on…ding-ding-ding.

3) Creaking, popping, rattling, crackling, thunking, banging, and any other obnoxious sound that could possibly come from the roof, sunroof, and headliner of a car—and go unfixed, baffling everyone. Like the gas “alerts”, this too started early and after repeated fixes, nothing.

The very first time I drove the car around the lot when it first arrived after the dealer car swap down from Jersey, there was a light creaking from around the sunroof but only very slight and I—too concerned with the cool new car-ness among other things—dismissed what I heard as maybe a dry or dirty sunroof seal on a car that really had never been driven or used much, at all. Oh, again, if only I knew. Fix 1 actually did work, but only for a day, with the dealer techs dropping the headliner tightening up what they thought were loose sunroof cables, and re-assembling. Drove home and after a few normal road bumps and vibration, Mr. Creaky-Poppy was back by the time I hit the driveway. Took it in again and again along with the fuel issue and they’d try, calling GM TAC, searching bulletins, etc. and despite actually doing everything GM told them to do as far as tightening, lubing, insulating, adding foam, etc., it only got worse and though the sunroof always worked perfectly, just left me with a roof full of “galloping horses” as my mother called it after I showed her a video, that simply would not stop.

4) Maybe in relation to the fuel system issue, maybe not, the car also always had a low grade rumble/vibration that always felt powertrain related—and a road force tire/wheel re-balance certainly never helped—that essentially manifested itself as a shake felt through my butt & back when cruising, albeit most of the time but also sometimes when it randomly felt like being smooth. In relation to the fuel issues and otherwise, they tried but it never went away, and I essentially just got used to the oddity.

After about a month and a half, I finally called GM/Pontiac assistance, started a claim and though they tried, apologizing for the amount and repetition of issues I had, it never all actually met the “3 repeated times and attempted repairs for per issue” rulebook, so they alone couldn’t do much. So I filed a BBB AutoLine claim, requested it either finally fixed or replaced, and after a month of the process and an official final repair, and an AWESOME GM rep who I still have the contact for and hope remains with GM, they offered me a no upcharge, no usage fee trade repurchase for any other GM vehicle I’d like. A shame, but it happens was the attitude I tried to keep amongst the extreme aggravation and craze it drove me to.

Though I was mentally planning it for a while, picking a replacement was a bit nerve racking but I did it and eventually the G6 was turned back in on October 22, 2008 and now, after a trip through GM headquarters soon thereafter, hit the auctions and a GM dealer used lot in Wisconsin (thanks Carfax) and resides in the Midwest somewhere. Probably the most influential factor in my case and having it repurchased was videotaping EVERYTHING EVERYDAY and doing daily send offs to my GM rep, who thanked me greatly for doing so...I watch them now just to remember the daily nightmare. NOT. But still, enjoy:

http://s26.photobucket.com/albums/c101/cad.../G6%20Problems/

Funny thing? Whoever now has it STILL has yet to set up their Ontar account and I STILL, every month get the Onstar check up email, like clockwork. Hah. Nice to see how it’s, uh, doing, I guess.

#2: 2009 Chevrolet Malibu 2LT V6

Summit White, Cocoa/Cashmere UltraLux, Power Sunroof, Premium Mats, Power Package (rear window shade & 110-volt outlet).

This was a great car, for sure. I completely fell for the Malibu after having a last gen rental (yes, the ugly Enterprise special variety) for a month while my Cadillac was being re-built, and then saw and drove the new ’08 model. Got my mother into one and really liked them even more after living with one for a bit and being impressed by it in so many ways. Originally when I bought the G6, a Malibu was high on my list if not first but I ended up liking the coupe layout of the G6 more and the price/features was better for me at the time.

Once the G6 turned out to be a disaster and GM took it back, a new Malibu was my natural choice or at least the one I naturally gravitated to after being so used to the Epsilon platform and our other one having been so terrific at the same time. My G6 was rather loaded so the trade repurchase allowed for a very loaded Malibu, and I decided on another 2LT but with a V6 and more stuff as my replacement.

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Definitely better than my G6 in so many ways, especially refinement where it felt like a completely different and more refined car in ways, smooth, quiet, sharp handling, compact but roomy, and the generally creamy and nice sounding 3.6L underhood. Everyone else loved the interior and features on this car when I’d drive, and it gave a good showing, for sure.

Too bad it never felt “right” to me, from interior comfort to some driving dynamics AND it also had issues (basically AN issue) too, that escalated to the point of GM engineers coming for a visit and me then having to drive with a data recorder to continue the R&D in my daily driving and car payment making.

What was it this time? Though I test drove the car 4 times before signing anything and not one thing seemed at all abnormal, just splendid, smooth, and such a nice ride, from—I guess like the G6, kind of—the first day I drove it home I felt what was a bizarre and very noticeable drivetrain shudder that would reverberate through the floor and seat based on my throttle and speed from the trans/engine right from around 40mph exactly up to around 55’ish, depending on the day and time. It wasn’t an everyday thing and never to the extent of the G6 issues, by any means, but still something that drove me bonkers from time to time and eventually by the end of ’08 (literally, December 31st) I took it in for a check out. A tech drove it, noted the same thing I had and even called GM TAC about it, but was told—at least based on their account—it was normal.

Didn’t think so, and after my G6 saga they knew I wouldn’t even fathom bringing something back in unless it really was happening, so I moved on to the next steps while still, really, enjoying the car overall and—after such a saga with the G6—not saying a word to anyone except for on a Malibu forum I still frequent. To make this quick, I never went back for a month, but in the meantime we started a poll on the forum regarding who had the issue and who didn’t and the results were pretty telling, I forwarded this off and my experiences to date to both Chevy customer assistance and Ed Peper (yep, really—he replies to emails quickly and was a help with this), and the next day had the GM exec offices calling to set things up. Another long story short, 2 engineers were sent, they test drove the car and data logged, met with me, I drove, etc., etc. but of course like most car problems, Mr. Malibu was having a good smooth day. Still, they were great and believed me so the car was set up with a mobile data recorder “Family Feud button” for me to press whenever driving and the shuddering was happening.

I obliged and had gotten farther than any other affected Malibu owner had so far, so I wanted to push on but after the G6 being an R&D tester daily was beyond getting old, and I had already started “shopping” right after New Year’s casusally. By the time I turned the device back in I had already been shopping and was making a deal on the replacement—enough was enough, and beyond issues I was already tired of making a lease payment on something that simply didn’t “do it” for me enough, had seats that never agreed with my butt or back, etc.. See yah, ‘Bu #2. At least #1 is still around, doing great, and I do still like it a lot—very impressive car, just not for me, as I saw once again AFTER the fact.

#3: 2009 Pontiac G8 GT

Pacific Slate, Onyx Leather, Premium Package, Sport Package

The best. I love this car like nothing else I’ve ever driven, owned, thought about, etc. It’s just a killer car. Before I ever even started with the G6, a loaded G8 GT was “the car” I looked at a few times on the lot and just was enamored by the looks, the interior, how things like the door handles felt, the idea of a 6.0L/6-spd underhood, etc. but still, it never seemed like something realistic to me, both from a price and, uh, needs perspective.

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The Malibu was a great car and I still miss things like the interior look, features, suede, etc. but otherwise, the G8 is a whole other playing field. 6+ months of living with two consecutive FWD V6 cars, issues and all, gave me a much better view of what it was I really did want and would actually be happy with—happy enough to enjoy paying for monthly. The answer remained a G8. Amidst dealing with my Malibu issues and having yet another case going with GM, February came around and so did finally some unbeatable deals on the G8.

I kind of knew what I wanted this time around to, in model, color, and options and after the playout of both the G6 and Malibu with my dealer, I certainly wasn’t going to shop there amidst the latest case, so I shopped. Found a handful of G8’s, got quotes all over, and narrowed it down to 2 matching cars in both MD and NJ, handling everything by email. Drove up the first Saturday of February, test drove both, got great trade prices on the Malibu from both, and then just had that week to sort out the deal. I just couldn’t get over the warm, happy atmosphere and a staff that seemed to read my mind when it came to special requests at the Jersey dealer, plus the internet sales guy was just the absolute best ever, anywhere. Had some extras added on (trunk mat, tint, clear bra), and then drove up the end of the week on Friday 2/13 to give them the Malibu and pick up my new G8. Never looked back even once regarding the Malibu, which I didn’t expect, but the G8 just does it for me…and NO issues. None. It’s great, and after what was 7 months of enough things to make a person think they’re insane almost, nice to be back in the normal world with a hot new car.

The G8 is just beautiful. Physically, if it’s not just for the looks, the Pacific Slate color garners fans all its own, and underneath it’s so solid, rides so well, handles like a well bred performance/luxury sedan, and has that glorious AFM equipped 6.0L purring away that it’s hard to beat—and everything I ever could have wanted. Even better, unlike both the G6 and Malibu that were leased and I had that “last day” forever in mind, the G8 is really mine (or, will be) and I’m already modding. I learned from my Fleetwood that I need that ability to keep me interested more…and there’s no shortage with the G8.

SO…that’s the synopsis and random beauty shots of my bouncings through the ranks of GM for months on end, only to end up “Down Under” with the dreamboat I never fathomed I’d have.

EDIT: OH, and as for the Fleetwood...sold it to a friend/fellow Fleetwood enthusiast in Chicago who has black '96 show car version, to be his daily driver. He put some money into it to take care of some basic maintenance, re-did the suspension & brakes, and then sold it again to an older next door neighbor who had an early 90's Town Car but was apparently enamored by the Fleetwood and would come over to ask about it every few days, cash in hand. It's now his, sitting garaged and the replacement baby for his ex Town Car. I was supposed to head out there 2 months ago and make a stop to see it, but have yet to make it.

Edited by caddycruiser
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The G8, I told you so. :P

When you were looking for that first new car and were thinking about the G6, I said G8...I'm sure others did too. :wink:

This seems to reinforce the belief the the G6 is a very, very poorly engineered car. I never liked it much, but I wouldn't even want one as rental after all of the various stories from both this site and elsewhere.

Too bad about the Malibu...it is a nice car.

...but the G8 is so much cooler...and if you ever feel nostalgic for it you can always drive your mom's. :lol:

Thanks for finally posting this!

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Great job on writing this. It was an enjoyable read. I was away while you were having all these issues, but am glad that you ended up with a G8. It is the ultimate affordable sedan from GM. Each path you're on can lead you to something really great. Glad it has worked out for you.

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Our G6 wasn't that great of a car either. Before we finally traded it for the Aura, it was always in the shop for issues with the electronic steering system. The 3.5L V6 in that car was rough as sandpaper too. It's also remarkable that the same engine is under the hood of the Aura but its a lot smoother.

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I've been waiting to hear of your saga. The Epsilons will drive repeat customers away from GM. Glad that you ended up with what you really wanted in the end.

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Our G6 wasn't that great of a car either. Before we finally traded it for the Aura, it was always in the shop for issues with the electronic steering system. The 3.5L V6 in that car was rough as sandpaper too. It's also remarkable that the same engine is under the hood of the Aura but its a lot smoother.

The variable valve timing and hydraulic steering fixed it. We have the Impala with VVT and Hydraulic steering and the Maxx with Electric steering sans VVT and it's like night and day.

Additionally I'm not too sure about the Epsilons holding up quality wise, our Maxx is a rattletrap and the G6, I've heard horror stories. I've heard lots of wacky stuff about the current Equinox too but I'm glad that that's hopefully been fixed with the 2010, with it's non-Chinese made engines, hell I might even consider buying one :D.

Edited by vonVeezelsnider
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Our G6 wasn't that great of a car either. Before we finally traded it for the Aura, it was always in the shop for issues with the electronic steering system. The 3.5L V6 in that car was rough as sandpaper too. It's also remarkable that the same engine is under the hood of the Aura but its a lot smoother.

I concur. I actually really liked how my G6 ran and drove, well, if it was having a good day and nothing was chiming or creaking too badly, but if I hopped from it into our '08 Malibu 2LT at the same time, or vice verse, WHAT a difference. As I said when I got my Malibu replacement, then, almost hard to believe they were on the same platform in a lot of ways.

Though, however, the "new" EP-I Malibu's and Aura's have started apparently loosing some of the original polish, with reduced insulation, use of the original triple laminated glass, etc. and are noisier. Overall still definitely better than the G6, but not as they started in '07/08 overall--I could tell that difference as well between my '09 and my mother's '08, as far as road/wind noise slightly and the sound of the doors closing. Weird, but it's been discussed in some other forums in relation to new '09s.

Our '08 Malibu 2LT 4-cyl continues on well, solid and silent as could be (impresses me every time I ride in it, still), although my Subie driving father is liking it less and less day by day. Moans about the seats & ingress/egress, and moreso that the power & fuel economy with the 2.4L/4-spd aren't great (okay, actually, today he actually said "on the highway I put it to the floor and it's revving but dead as a doornail, slurping down gas doing it"). Mom loves it, and it has been nearly faultless, however.

I've been waiting to hear of your saga. The Epsilons will drive repeat customers away from GM. Glad that you ended up with what you really wanted in the end.

The G6, maybe so. It seems to have had more than its fair share of issues, in a lot of different ways, for sure. The Aura and Malibu seem to have improved on this greatly, which is good, yet still of course I end up with one that has a drivetrain issue--not exactly Epsilon related, but rather a 6T transmission flooey of some random sort that is becoming more and more common with more on the road--we're still monitoring it with actual report #'s on a Malibu forum, owner by owner.

I posted these in the other thread...I have a LOT of videos, as I had to drive daily with my video camera to record all of the madness, but here's a few good ones back in my G6 days:

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The last 2 were from "the day" that GM called me later that afternoon, apologizing again and offering me the trade repurchase...oh, fun times. Too bad the Pontiac Excitement with this car meant videotaping the latest surprise day by day. Hah.

Edited by caddycruiser
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Thanks for finally posting this story for those of us with "inquiring minds"!! I've been meaning to e-mail you for this story.

I am on my 3rd Epsilon vehicle - 2004 Chevy Malibu LT (purchased 11/03), 2007 Saturn AURA XE (leased 11/06), and the wife's 2008 Pontiac G6 V6 Sedan (purchased 6/08) - ALL with the 3500 V6 engine. So far nothing but minor warranty issues with the three Epsilons. Got rid of the Malibu because of some "bad luck" incidents (minor accidents) and more importantly, styling that I grew tired of 3 months after taking delivery. It was a good & comfortable car, but I did not 'enjoy' driving it (again, the dowdy styling wasn't inspiring). The AURA has been a great daily driver and the wife drove it mostly while I had the Envoy due to the gas price increases. Once she took delivery of her G6 though last June, the AURA has become my daily driver. I love the styling of the AURA and it has not let me down yet. The main issue I have with the AURA is the crappy Hankook tires that it came with and how they started turning bald at 33k (they have never given good/decent wet weather traction even when new). The wife's G6 has the same Hankook tires and they act nothing like mine (AURA being leased means they will remain on the car to the lease end; once they give problems on the G6 though <financed> they will be replaced ASAP). I like the size of these Epsilons and my only big gripe is that I find the seats not to be confortable as they should be in a car of this size (the Malibu & AURA are the biggest offenders of this issue; so far the G6 has been better <maybe due to the G6 being leather-covered, unlike the Malibu's suede/leatherette and the AURA's cloth coverings?>). The wife has put over 13k on the G6 in 9 months and no problems like what has been described here have turned up (and trust me, if she was not happy witht eh car I'd be the first to know about it).

Of course if money wasn't an issue when my lease ends in November (or hopefully sooner!), I'd be taking delivery of my own 2009 or 2010 Pontiac G8 GT. As it stands now, with being laid-off starting July 1 and no prospects for a new job after that date, a G8 has to be off the list (hopefully any new car will not join the G8). While Epsilons have graced my driveway for the past 5 1/2 years, I *think* the wife's G6 will be the last one. I've found them to be good & reliabel cars and see tons of them around in NJ & PA where I travel. Hopefully GM's financial situation improves quickly so that these cars do not become stale and problematic.

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Dead on review Roger...though I had issues and a few other posts were made, I hope it wasn't implied the EP cars are excessively trouble prone. They have their common bugs, but overall are very good and solid midsizers for most owners. Case in point, our '08 Malibu that impresses everyday. Terrific car, well, except for the power/efficiency that I now get carped on for after selecting the 2.4L/4-spd combo for the queen.

You also made an interesting point on seats. I'm not sure what it is or was, as the basic guts of the seats are also shared but otherwise they're different, but while I was comfortable on the somewhat flatter cloth seats in my G6, there was always something off about the shaping of the Bu's front seats, particularly how they force my shoulders forward. I noticed it before, but it was never an issue until I had one. Also used to give me some pretty bad lower back pain on long drives, again something I couldn't figure out.

Oh well. I guess once your first 2 cars ever are consecutive RWD, V8 Cadillac Fleetwoods, there's a "feel" thing that's hard to get over, as well as a size & comfort one, even if I previously thought that was something I no longer did want.

Tires squawking pavement into 2nd and sometimes, possibly, 3rd can be fun...then let off and cruise silently with AFM active frequently, getting great mileage. All on a platform that's not a lightweight, for sure, but is built to handle monster power and quite the beating, and still ask for more. Ah, Zeta...I want to marry you.

Edited by caddycruiser
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caddycruiser, don't think that I was pointing you out for any reason. I know (unfortunately) that your G6 gave you way more problems than any new car owner should have to face in such short time, and once you noticed something 'off' with the Malibu, you became cautious/proactive so history would not be repeated. I was just pointing out that I've now had three Epsilons in 5 1/2 years and so far good luck with their reliability and durability. I've also met people that, like you, experienced problems with their Epsilon that they swore off GM (when the wife told her coworkers she was getting a G6, many reminded her of another coworker's G6 with the problematic panoramic sunroof, which my wife's car does not have! :rolleyes: ). I am hesitant now to look into a 2LT Malibu with the 3.6L V6 though!!

Re: the seats, with the Malibu & AURA if I am wearing a winter coat while driving I cannot get comfortable, so driving sans coat is the way I have to go. So far the G6 has not given me the same problem, but I'm so use to not wearing my winter coat for long drives that I do the same when driving the G6. Something about the narrow curvature of the seats makes me uncomfortable. I totally understand about larger vehicles and the comfort they afford - I felt very comfortable in the Envoy's seats - coat or no coat - and miss those greatly. I've sat in several G8s with my winter coat on and so far do not seem to have any issues. This is an area of concern for me if I pursue the Pontiac G5 GT coupe and/or Chevy HHR (have not sat in either of those cars with my winter coat on, and don't know if I'll get the chance to soon (if I am seriously considering these two cars, I will bring my winter coat on any test drive regardless of the warmer weather outside :lol: ).

I am so jealous of your great G8 GT in the color I would go with too. I am wishing you nothing but total satisfaction on this, your 3rd new GM car in 7 months!!

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Though, however, the "new" EP-I Malibu's and Aura's have started apparently loosing some of the original polish, with reduced insulation, use of the original triple laminated glass, etc. and are noisier. Overall still definitely better than the G6, but not as they started in '07/08 overall--I could tell that difference as well between my '09 and my mother's '08, as far as road/wind noise slightly and the sound of the doors closing. Weird, but it's been discussed in some other forums in relation to new '09s.

I wonder if that has anything to do with different mfg plants. Malibus are made in both Lake Orion, MI (alongside G6) and Kansas City (alongside AURA).

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I wonder if that has anything to do with different mfg plants. Malibus are made in both Lake Orion, MI (alongside G6) and Kansas City (alongside AURA).

Nope. The first people to report the "changes" were with Aura's that only come from Fairfax, and then as '09 production continued on and we started a direct comparison/log of Fairfax vs. Orion Malibu's also on the forum, the same was true. It apparently was one of those unspoken, not noted revisions. If you had never been in an earlier model or just aren't too sensitive to noticing such things, you'd not notice. But if you compared both an '08 and '09, were trading an earlier one for a newer one (some Saturn Aura guys came in here), you likely would...something.

Roger...exactly true. I wouldn't tell anyone to fret over a 3.6L/6-spd EP or any GM, after what then was going on with my Malibu too, as I've driven quite a few from a G6 GXP to other Malibu's and of course Lambda's, all perfect. I compared it once to a friend's '08 GXP, too, to confirm my sanity and hers is and was perfect after 15k or so miles--just a strong, smooth, screamer as normally known. But, too, something is up and there's a handful of GM cases right now regarding the issue, so we'll see where it goes.

:rwd:

Yes. Oh, the world is right again...and who'd a thunk you could be happy with the gas bill with a 6.0L underhood? Really.

Edited by caddycruiser
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Face it CaddyCruiser, God just didn't have plans for you to be driving a front-wheel drive vehicle.

Congrats on your new car!

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Face it CaddyCruiser, God just didn't have plans for you to be driving a front-wheel drive vehicle.

Congrats on your new car!

Apparently. They never liked me, as much as I tried to like them...reallly :AH-HA_wink:

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#3: 2009 Pontiac G8 GT

Pacific Slate, Onyx Leather, Premium Package, Sport Package

The best. I love this car like nothing else I’ve ever driven, owned, thought about, etc. It’s just a killer car.

SWEET!

More and more I've been thinking about getting a G8 ... but ... I really do NOT like sedans. For me (and yes, I know, this is stupid), but sedans are just another reminder of the "family oriented" society we live in. *shrugs* Can't help it.

However ... many of the reviews I've seen ... especially the owner reviews and pics and such are starting to convince me I should buy it anyway. After all, I DO have a nephew to haul around now when he is a bit older....

EDIT: OH, and as for the Fleetwood...sold it to a friend/fellow Fleetwood enthusiast in Chicago who has black '96 show car version, to be his daily driver. He put some money into it to take care of some basic maintenance, re-did the suspension & brakes, and then sold it again to an older next door neighbor who had an early 90's Town Car but was apparently enamored by the Fleetwood and would come over to ask about it every few days, cash in hand. It's now his, sitting garaged and the replacement baby for his ex Town Car. I was supposed to head out there 2 months ago and make a stop to see it, but have yet to make it.

Whereabouts in Chicago? And, if you DO get out this way, let me know...would be great to meet you!

Cort | 35swm | "Mr Monte Carlo"."Mr Road Trip" | pig valve.pacemaker ...Chitown #2 = 07/25/09

WRMNshowcase.legos.HO.models.MCs.RTs.CHD = http://www.chevyasylum.com/cort

"I wanna drive" ... Trace Adkins ... '(Her Favorite Color Is) Chrome'

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