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Drew Dowdell

Cadillac News: The Non-V CT4 Revealed

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Mercedes does offer way more variety in body styles...Mercedes has  coupes, hardtop coupes, convertibles, 2 seaters, sports cars, wagons, etc.    Cadillac has only sedans, a full size SUV, and 3 CUVs.

Edited by Robert Hall
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5 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Mercedes does offer way more variety in body styles...Cadillac has no coupes or convertibles, no wagons. 

Cadillac had the ATS Coupe just last year before it was replaced by the CT4 and a coupe is on the way for either the CT4 or CT5. I hardly ever see a convertible Mercedes even here in Phoenix and you can still see the hardtop gaps to know it's a conv. so that's another one of their (too many models) they need to cancel as it doesn't sell and wagons don't sell well here at all although the second gen. CTS Wagon was pretty sweet in V Series form. 

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I haven't heard anything about another coupe from Cadillac, would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

 I saw a fair number of MB convertibles in Scottsdale when I lived in Phoenix, though they were outnumbered by G-wagens and GLEs/GLSes...

Edited by Robert Hall

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I have to say I missed this forum where car guys from all over the country be it AZ, MO, NJ, OH, PA, WA and others can can voice our opinions on what we love...CARS. Couldn't have done this 20 or 25 years ago!

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It is a fun group.  People from all over...there are a few of us in Arizona or previously there (I lived in central Phoenix from '08-17 and worked in Chandler, Tempe, Scottsdale)...

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2 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I haven't heard anything about another coupe from Cadillac, would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

 I saw a fair number of MB convertibles in Scottsdale when I lived in Phoenix, though they were outnumbered by G-wagens and GLEs/GLSes...

The ATS Coupe looked badass too. I think it comes down to marketing or lack there of and the perception of having a three point star or a crest that once had black merlettes on the grille. Speaking of that I can't wait for the Blackwing CT6-V to start rolling out next month, gonna be a beast.

I have a house in N Phx bordering N Scottsdale near Tatum Blvd. and you do see them of course, but not as many as you'd think, was my point.

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Mercedes interiors have pretty well owned their respective segments for all of their current generations. I'm not saying they are stylistically everybody's preference but professional reviewers always praise their fit and finish along with superior materials.

Mercedes not only has a vehicle for every little niche in the market(for better or worse *cough* GLE Coupe *cough* *cough* GLC Coupe *cough*) but they have legit AMG versions of everything except the new A Class, that I can think of.

CLA45

C63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

E63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

CLS63,

S63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

AMG GT

AMG GT 4-door coupe

GLA45

GLC63(SUV and coupe)

GLE63(SUV and coupe)

GLS63

G63

SL63

E63 Wagon

On top of those they have the Maybach S Classes.

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Cadillac had the XTS V-Sport :P

But seriously, Cadillac had V or V-Sport versions of all their cars... just not the SUVs because I mean really, who'd buy an XT5-V anyway?

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2 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Cadillac had the XTS V-Sport :P

But seriously, Cadillac had V or V-Sport versions of all their cars... just not the SUVs because I mean really, who'd buy an XT5-V anyway?

An Escalade V-series would probably sell, though. 

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2 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Mercedes interiors have pretty well owned their respective segments for all of their current generations. I'm not saying they are stylistically everybody's preference but professional reviewers always praise their fit and finish along with superior materials.

Mercedes not only has a vehicle for every little niche in the market(for better or worse *cough* GLE Coupe *cough* *cough* GLC Coupe *cough*) but they have legit AMG versions of everything except the new A Class, that I can think of.

CLA45

C63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

E63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

CLS63,

S63(sedan, coupe. and convertible)

AMG GT

AMG GT 4-door coupe

GLA45

GLC63(SUV and coupe)

GLE63(SUV and coupe)

GLS63

G63

SL63

E63 Wagon

On top of those they have the Maybach S Classes.

Oh I know the German marques build solid, good quality cars with a pretty good fit and finish, but they do compare well to Cadillac. My parents had a couple of different BMW 540i's back in the day that I helped them pick out and they are great cars, but they choose Cadillac now for their also solid build and excellent fit and finish with the CTS and Escalade and they're a long standing American company where the big money on a purchase stays here at home. 

1 minute ago, Robert Hall said:

An Escalade V-series would probably sell, though. 

Escalade V would be awesome and one of my buddies at Earnhardt Caddy tells me it's in the works with a 500+ hp TTV8.

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12 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Cadillac had the XTS V-Sport :P

But seriously, Cadillac had V or V-Sport versions of all their cars... just not the SUVs because I mean really, who'd buy an XT5-V anyway?

The same people buying GLA45's.. 

V-Sport is like me considering the AMG43's.. and M-Sports.. and S-Lines. They're nice vehicles with stout powertrains but they aren't true performance versions. 

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1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

The same people buying GLA45's.. 

V-Sport is like me considering the AMG43's.. and M-Sports.. and S-Lines. They're nice vehicles with stout powertrains but they aren't true performance versions. 

And show me... how many GLA45s have actually been sold. I've never seen one outside an auto show and I travel quite a bit.  I've only ever seen a small handful of CLA45s.

Only the XTS had just a V-Sport.

ATS-V
ATS-V Coupe
CTS-V
CTS-V Coupe
CT6-V
 

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4 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

The same people buying GLA45's.. 

V-Sport is like me considering the AMG43's.. and M-Sports.. and S-Lines. They're nice vehicles with stout powertrains but they aren't true performance versions. 

Yeah V-Sport was a fill-in for those who couldn't handle the real horsepower of an actual V-Series. Now V-Sport is V-Series and V-Series Blackwing is the high performance version.  

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7 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

And show me... how many GLA45s have actually been sold. I've never seen one outside an auto show and I travel quite a bit.  I've only ever seen a small handful of CLA45s.

How is one supposed to find how many of each model they sell? 

Mercedes claimed 10% of all sales were AMGs so that's about the best we can go off of. That's roughly 24-2500/year. 

5 minutes ago, USA-1 Vortec 6.2 said:

Yeah V-Sport was a fill-in for those who couldn't handle the real horsepower of an actual V-Series. Now V-Sport is V-Series and V-Series Blackwing is the high performance version.  

Yeah, Cadillac is all over the place right now. They need to sort themselves out. 

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1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

How is one supposed to find how many of each model they sell? 

Mercedes claimed 10% of all sales were AMGs so that's about the best we can go off of. That's roughly 24-2500/year. 

 

Ah! But they count the 43s as AMG also.

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10 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

ATS-V
ATS-V Coupe
CTS-V
CTS-V Coupe
CT6-V

Cool... ~23% of what Mercedes offers. 

Just now, Drew Dowdell said:

Ah! But they count the 43s as AMG also.

That was written in 2017, fwiw. 

https://www.thedrive.com/sheetmetal/17048/amg-makes-up-10-percent-of-us-sales-for-mercedes-benz

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3 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Cool... ~23% of what Mercedes offers. 

That was written in 2017, fwiw. 

https://www.thedrive.com/sheetmetal/17048/amg-makes-up-10-percent-of-us-sales-for-mercedes-benz

Quoted from that link:

Quote

A lot of AMG’s growth is thanks to the new AMG 43 line.

 

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Just now, Drew Dowdell said:

Quoted from that link:

 

Understandable why it would have had a ~50% growth that year then. 

Then we can say ~7.5% are real AMGs then. 

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I mean, if I wanted to get petty, I could point out that GMC sells 25% - 30% of its lineup as a Denali, which is mostly a chrome and leather package that cost $5k. Yet Denali sales alone outsell all of Lincoln, or Jaguar Land Rover. 

Cadillac is not and will never be a full line brand that has to cover every niche.  GM has other brands to do that with. 

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1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

How is one supposed to find how many of each model they sell? 

Mercedes claimed 10% of all sales were AMGs so that's about the best we can go off of. That's roughly 24-2500/year. 

Yeah, Cadillac is all over the place right now. They need to sort themselves out. 

It's because people bitched about the V Series being too aggressive or having too much hp (is there such a thing?) so they added the V Blackwing as the top V version to keep the V Series nomenclature. Blackwing is a perfect performance version name harking back to the black merlettes on the Cadillac crest, great idea really. 

You can't really say Mercedes isn't all over the place right now either man, far too many models and they know they need to cut several and are in the process of doing so.

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I have literally never heard anybody say the CTS-V or ATS-V had too much power.. 

They changed the name because the company as a whole is all over the place. 

They're one thousand times more consistent than Cadillac has been over the last decade or two. 

17 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I mean, if I wanted to get petty, I could point out that GMC sells 25% - 30% of its lineup as a Denali, which is mostly a chrome and leather package that cost $5k. Yet Denali sales alone outsell all of Lincoln, or Jaguar Land Rover. 

Cadillac is not and will never be a full line brand that has to cover every niche.  GM has other brands to do that with. 

What does GMC have to do with this? I already conceded the consumer truck market is all GM(comparing to Mercedes). 

I'm talking about the broad spectrum of options that Mercedes offers from the top to the bottom of their lineup that fills every niche in the middle(again, for better or worse). 

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1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

I have literally never heard anybody say the CTS-V or ATS-V had too much power.. 

They changed the name because the company as a whole is all over the place. 

They're one thousand times more consistent than Cadillac has been over the last decade or two. 

What does GMC have to do with this? I already conceded the consumer truck market is all GM(comparing to Mercedes). 

I'm talking about the broad spectrum of options that Mercedes offers from the top to the bottom of their lineup that fills every niche in the middle(again, for better or worse). 

My point is that GM uses its other brands to fill niches (when needed, thankfully no crossover coupes yet). That's why Buick has a wagon and a hatchback. That's why GMC has a luxury line.  The GMC Yukon Denali XL and the GLS are only $1000 apart on base price, Escalade stars $5k higher

The GLB will likely overlap quite a bit with the Terrain Denali. 

... that's why GMC is relevant.

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And yet none of those offer the options Mercedes does per vehicle. Again, for better or worse because they should and will trim the lineup because it is pretty absurdly large right now with some very slow selling vehicles. 

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3 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

No, not into reality shows either.  I like crime drama... Sherlock Holmes, Poirot, Law and Order and the like. 

Those shows rock along with CSI, NCIS, Criminal Minds, etc.

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3 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

Mercedes does offer way more variety in body styles...Mercedes has  coupes, hardtop coupes, convertibles, 2 seaters, sports cars, wagons, etc.    Cadillac has only sedans, a full size SUV, and 3 CUVs.

That doesn't mean they don't compare or compete with Cadillac, that was the whole point of the Mercedes/Cadillac discussion with ccap41. Like Drew stated GM has the whole portfolio that Cadillac doesn't need, so one particular brand like Mercedes will look overloaded with more models. MB does have cheaper models like GM as well.

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