ccap41

You're rght!

Hahaha well Musk as a person is a completely different issue and I can understand not liking the man. I was speaking strictly of the product(s).

You are literally giving them a pass right now. While what Rivian did was crappy, that is a completely different issue because they were already selling the vehicles at the original pricing. They didn't make that price hike before deliveries. That was about 6 months after it was being delivered. We all know what "around" means. It's a relative word that could mean all sorts of different things to all sorts of different people. They knew this. They knew exactly this. That's why I think it's crappy of them. Also, I'm not annoyed that it isn't 30k. I'm annoyed because *to me* 35k is less "around" than it ought to be. "Around" feels more like +/- 10% ($3,000, in this case).

Dang, this post started before I graduated high school! Hahaha ...I have nothing of value to add though...?

Oh boy, what a blunder that situation was for about 48 hours, until they reneged on that. What an idiotic decision to try and force previous reservation holders into the new price. If I'm not wrong, the price jump was something crazy like 15-20k, too, right?

Sorry, I am wrong here but you're off by about as much as I'm off by. It was Sept 8th, 2022. NOT 2023(duh - I should have known this). It was more like 14 months ago. Hopefully people cancel their orders here as well. Fck OEMs with this crap. I don't care what the brand is, it's crappy to do this. Whoever throws this price estimate out is a professional and this was their specialty. It wasn't just some guy who threw a number out there. There were MANY calculations figured out before and they knew damn well they couldn't hit $30,000. The same way Tesla threw out $35,000, that happened for a couple months. They did it for the headline.

I doubt people who put money down on them expected an additional 5k. I'm not reading any of that because the 30,000 was announced THIS YEAR. 2019, 2020, 2021, and 2022 are irrelevant. This is a 5k jump from September 8th, 2023. And I'll give them the "around" $30,000. but I don't think a $5,000 or 15% increase is exactly "around" $30,000. If they came out and said 32 or 33k. Sure, that's "around" 30k. 35k is as close to 40k as it is 30k. So you're cool that your beloved General is pulling the same crap as Tesla? Don't you hate Tesla and how they're ran?

What? If this was announced years ago, I'd agree. This was nnounced just earlier this year. This has nothing to do with Covid or inflation since 2019. They threw out $30,000 and knew damn well it wouldn't be 30k. It was a bait and *somewhat of a switch*. They wanted the attention-grabbing headlines. You can order a 39k Model 3 right now. For 4k you can at least get a vehicle with a reputable electric powertrain/electronics. If 5k is such a negligible amount, get the Model 3. https://www.tesla.com/model3

Already 5k more than what they said a few months ago. That's nice.

Have you ever heard of the Chevrolet Bolt? It's $26,500 before a $7500 rebate = $19,500. The Bolt EUV is about a grand more so that, too, can be had for about $20k. The Nissan Leaf qualifies for $3,750 of the federal rebate and brings the 28k Leaf down to ~24k.

I'd like to lookup those numbers as well because I doubt they'd be getting credits from Ford. They have a hybrid or plug-in hybrid version of everything they sell and they have a few EVs. I have no clue what the regulations are on this, at this point. I'd assume a lot of those credits are coming from Stellantis, as they still hardly have anything truly fuel efficient.

I don't know why you added anything up. What I showed you was the 2021 Q4 10-k. It was the totals for the years in the snippets, 2019-2021. It wasn't just a Q4 report, it was for the entire year. I don't know what numbers you're getting showing losses but if you subtract the ARC from the bottom line, they're still profitable. The ARCs were not keeping them afloat in 2021. I'm also not exactly sure how you can facepalm data directly off of the SEC's website. There is zero bias in that data.

It's actually over 50% on the Blazer. The ICE Blazer starts at 35k and the EV Blazer starts at 56k. They've already axed the FWD 1LT model (44k) As of RIGHT NOW, it costs the consumer more then 50% more to go from the cheapest ICE Blazer to the cheapest EV Blazer.

I take it you haven't bothered to look at their financial statements. Take away the credits and they were 100% profitable in 2021 still. Prior to that, no. They were using those credits to stay afloat and it worked. Which, is basically what I said, "they've been profitable for the last few years." https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000095017022000796/tsla-20211231.htm#item_8_financial_statememts_supplementar

I agree they need to do that but I disagree that they don't know how. They know they need the demand and mass production to get there. You can't get costs down until you're selling hundreds of thousands a year or more.

They're making money. I'm not sure why you think they're losing money on vehicles but they've been profitable for the last few years. Look over pages 4-6. https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000162828023034847/tsla-20230930.htm#ib5ff2de9b5b0458894a3412674c85416_16

Technically Ford made an Electric Focus... because California.

They're also building 2 or 3 manufacturing plants for EVs and/or battery production. They'll likely be in the red for awhile until all of that is finished and they can get production out of those. That's the cost of doing business.

I love MORR videos. I watch a ton of their stuff on my way to and from work on the bus. I watched this last week and man, that thing was junk when they got to it.

Explain this. This is literally the first time I've read this.

Just in time to be 3 or 4 years late! Not only are they not the first electric truck, they're not the 2nd or 3rd either. They better come out with a banger of a product if you're going to announce first, be 3 or 4 years late and now they're the 4th in the category. Technically, 5th, if you count the GMC Hummer.

It is different but CVTs have been around for a long time now and that no-shift-feeling is what people like about them. There's just no engine noise to accompany the acceleration. And, I know there are differences and people should test out EVERY vehicle before purchasing. But that isn't unique to EVs. Test drive for awhile at a dealership. I'm not saying to not have EVs in rental fleets. I just don't think it is ideal for the majority of people who don't give a crap about their transportation.

Of course everybody cares about that stuff but are there people who think they'll be THAT much different from an ICE vehicle? They think the ergonomics are going to be so vastly different because its powered by electricity as opposed to gasoline? There are people who think the fit and finish will be different because it doesn't have a gasoline engine? I know people are REALLY stupid A LOT of the time but that's tough to comprehend.

I will certainly agree with that. I just don't think *most* people are worried about that stuff. It feel like more people are concerned with charging them and that whole situation.

This discussion has been had before but I agree with @trinacriabob's interaction, I don't think rentals is a great way to get EVs into peoples' hands. The biggest advantage of an EV is charging overnight, at home, for very few dollars. Renting them negates all of that. Having to deal with public chargers isn't a great way to have a great experience.