FUTURE_OF_GM

This is just a "for instance" but, why not build a Pontiac halo on Y-Body? They ARE the performance division afterall.... I mean, it be a complicated situation, but it WOULD give the division momentum. It could be low volume but still make money (Assuming they could get past capacity and tooling costs---on second thought, that might be a hard business case.) If you count the 1999 Evoq concept, the Cadillac renaissance took 6-7 years to complete.... More if you include the last 2 V-Series cars as part of it.

LMAO.... Except it didn't...... The ONLY thing that might've influenced SOME drivers was the MEDIA tirad and/or gas prices The Prius is and WAS just that: HYPE Yep, the prius is "CLASSLESS" alright..... It doesn't have much class. But seriously, we ALL can classify the drivers of BOTH of those cars VERY EASILY. They are FAR from classless, just like EVERY other car on the road.

LOL, because that's their nature.... You're supposed to LIVE BY THEIR RULES and NOT QUESTION WHY, yet, THEY seem to pride themselves on "SAYING that they're different and questioning EVERY aspect of how we live.... It's the most backwards LOGIC I've ever witnessed... PREACH TOLERANCE and PEACE and EVEN FREEDOM, then take away opposing peoples FREEDOM and FORCE them to LIVE the same way you do because your cannot TOLERATE their OBVIOUSLY INFERIOR opinions/lifestyles... And guess what, if you don't obey, they'll sick SIERRA or ELF or PETA on you and resort to violent acts... So much for peace and tolerance ehh? DETROIT WAS RIGHT!!!!!!!!!! HYBRIDS WERE and STILL ARE a WASTE of TIME AND MONEY, yet the ANTI-DETROIT media used them (Or their lack-there-of) as a TOOL to screw over GM and Ford and SNOW the public into believing that they're the answer to the world's problems. It's just too bad that people were dumb enough to believe all that rhetoric for going on 3 years now. AND of course, you'll never see the words "DETROIT WAS RIGHT" in the press.... If anything they're looking for another "SILVER BULLET" argument to fling at the big 2 since this one is LOSING GROUND.

Cool program... And the usual HORRIBLY biased news coverage. ("Gas guzzlers"..... "Rebate".... "The catch" ... etc.. etc...) It's all in the wording. And no, GM isn't going to give anyone something for nothing like the medi, who hates them in the first place, thinks they should. OF COURSE there's a trade off and OF COURSE there's a reason why it's only offered on select vehicles. This author just exploits that as WEAKNESSES that are NON EXISTENT

Focus Fanatics This is a guy shopping Honda for a new car. I'm not sure if you have to be registered to read this or not, but here it is: So, we have to be bombarded all the damn time with articles asking WHY an Escalade doesn't have a button for this and an automatic that. AND even articles QUESTIONING THE CADILLAC REVIVAL BASED ON THIS STUPIDITY and then get to listen to them whining about a Fusion not having navigation...etc...etc...etc... Yet, a car that NOT only doesn't come standard with A/C but also is ABSENT a radio gets their coveted NORTH AMERICAN CAR OF THE YEAR AWARD?!?!?!?! Last time I checked... BOTH of those were pretty RELEVANT standard equipment even for the Civic class and ESPECIALLY for the "premium image" (READ: Bull$h! groupthink) that the Civic is supposed to offer. Talk about a twofaced bunch. In Social Psychology we are taught that a certain stereotype exists and that the world is effected by it in every way. This stereotype is called "What is beautiful is good" and has a very strong basis in ALL of the Disney movies and fairytales of yore. So, that said, I guess 'we' here at C&G can coin the phrase "What is Asian is good" and then 'we' can study it and talk about how deeply it is seated in the FAIRYTALE and FICTION that is published in automotive press everyday. The bias has reached the point of being a joke IMO.... It's sad that more people can't see it and that MOST of the biased people are willing to sellout this badly.

Lots of coverage this got!

That's cool!!! There's a place close to where I go to school that was a Pontiac dealership. It STILL had the old verticle neon Pontiac sign with the OLD chief logo at the bottom (Nostalgia buffs will know what I'm talking about) When I found it, my girlfriend and I tried to see if we could buy the sign. But, luckily someone bought the building and turned it into a classy restaurant called Pontiac Point and used the sign. Very cool!!!

The only reaosn I could see them doing that is maybe to build some 'performance momentum' for the next generation. You know, kinda like Toyota is doing with the Tundra and NASCAR. The current product isn't all that great, but it WILL build awareness and anticipation for the new one.

This is an excellent strategy IMO... GM has too many VOLUME divisions... They were never meant to ALL be volume divisions, if that were the case then GM would have to maintain 45% of the market. I personally would like to see GM do this, Pontiac is NOT a volume division and is supposedly "damaged" so how do you reverse that? You use CORPORATE might to create FANTASTIC niche cars that elevate the division to a desireable status once again... The only catch is; the corporate underpinnings have to be top notch in the first place.

They gotta jump start Toyota sales in BIASED China somehow after all... GM is far to competitive over there, and Toyota is coming in as the underdog. So, the media will naturally come out swinging for the fence.

Japanese AND Korean cars.... Geez, my how americans are so soon to forget the sh*tbags that came out of Korea not 10 years ago, yet Detroit still can't live down the 70's. I guess that 10 year warrenty does a lot for image... Where is yours GM?.... Ford? I guess CR has determined (Like most of the press) that the damage is already done, as Detroit is in an IRREVERSIBLE slide. Now all they have to do is sit back, fluff the "FACTS" every once in a while and watch Detroit crash and burn.

That nice lingo that Toyota so ARROGANTLY termed.... "The DETROIT three"

Not one sentence in and the author is so EXCITED that he/she can't help but drop the "YES!!!! THE GREENIES WON!!!!!!" bomb. WOW!!! Such a HUGE number of vehicles.... OH GOD!!!!! Global....WARMING.... Too.... Much.... To handle!!!!!!! All those DIESEL (to beat all) H1's. And FYI, you stupid journalist, MOST of those weren't produced by GM as GM didn't OWN Hummer until 2000. JESUS!!! Enough with the DAMN greenie-liberal GAS MILEAGE already. No kidding?!?! I just hope GM doesn't kill the prestige/luxury of the name. :fcvxplode: Yeah, he apparently turned "green" or "hypocrit" (Like most politicians) when he got elected... Remind me why I supported him again?!?! Yet again, WHY is this relevent!?!?!?!? WHY is the GREEN aspect of the story becoming the focus again?!?!?! I'm going to buy an H1 and paint "SCREW YOU HIPPIE" on it and drive it everyday!!! Who cares? Who Cares?!?!?!?! LOL, "Pretty amazing" ?!?!?!? Why not just say: 374 H1s, 73 less than the year before?!?!?! Yet again.... who cares? **** So who is doing the hydrogen powered hybrid second generation?!?!?! Is that an AM General exclusive??? Or will it eventually see civilian duty as well? I was hoping that GM AT LEAST had some sort of hand in it, since they need the good PR and since they could claim to be the hydrogen leaders then... Plus I'd LOVE to see a super efficient Hummer line up to SHUT THE GREENIES/HIPPIES up for good. Oh, wait, what am I thinking.... They'll always find something to whine about, then they'll preach equality and individuality, ALL THE WHILE trying to tell people like me (Who view life differently than them) HOW TO LIVE MY LIFE!!! Kind of an oxymoron isn't it?!!?!? Oh well, I guess you get permission to do that when you don't have a job and *THINK* you're educated enough to make decisions for the masses.

I certainly hope GM doesn't become the UAW and Delphis' bitch.... That GMAC cash could do A LOT to secure the Cadillac renaissance, keep the momentum strong in the Saturn turnaround, expand the vast empire that is Chevrolet, fix so-called damaged brands such as Pontiac and Buick or expand the hell out of the GM brands with huge potential such as GMC, Hummer and Saab.

Buahahahahahaha!!!!!!! :rotflmao:

It's sad that the media is SOOO biased now that they are actually essentially REFUSING GM ad dollars. This is a start I guess.... Nice to see GM at least doing something after 2-3 years of just sitting back and letting the media destoy them. This ties in to A LOT of what I've talked about by saying the GM MUST inform the consumer and TELL them how to perceive the company... It's essentially the same thinking as having a mission statement. INFORM the consumer! *Good to see GM cutting the fleet sale tally too!*

Looks like it's time to attack Cadillac now since the media has destroyed every other aspect of GM's divisions... The Escalade must've scared the F*** out of Edmunds (It was too competitive) because since that write up they've waged and ALL OUT WAR against the division. First the bad write up, then the HORRIBLE electronics piece (One of the main reasons the tuner/bling crowd buys the Escalade--how ironic that Edmunds attacks it) and now THIS. They're either 1) Trying to kill Cadillac's momentum in the trendsetting Cali atmosphere by sacking them while they're weakest or 2) Trying to completely SHUT Cadillac out BEFORE they even get a chance. Remember, this is pretty much the ONLY american brand that gets HUGE respect in California... How opportune for Edmunds to front the war (And coming defeat) Umm.... BETTER sales. BETTER image. LOWER buyers age.... What about ANY of that says "mirage"?!?!?! See, this is how it goes... The media has been ATTACKING Cadillac's image boost now for around 2 years (Saying that it's superficial and blingy---eventhough CELEBRITIES and THE YOUNG are exactly who they have been and ARE continuing to appeal to... 2 markets that the asian makers would saw off their nuts for YET, that's not GOOD enough when it's a domestic division... Then the MEDIA has to make it out to be CHEESY and ill constructed. BUT, what exactly is CHEESY and ILL CONSTRUCTED about being a STATUS symbol for those which MASS-AMERICA adores, looks up to and immulates?!?!?!? NOTHING, that's what! (Unless you let the media spin it) Cadillac HAS been successful, yet because of their bias--just like with everything domestic, they have to shun it, pick it apart and cast negativity on it... Eventually, they'll make Cadillac out to be the "overpriced poseur car" and they'll succeed in killing YET another domestic turnaround. MY QUESTION IS THIS: WHAT IS SO BAD ABOUT WHO CADILLAC APPEALS TO?!?!? THEY ARE THE MOST SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE IN THE WORLD So.... We're questioning Cadillac's renaissance based on "One touch power windows and a tilt wheel that ONLY tilts?!?!?!?!?!?!?! WOW.... WE'VE REACHED NEW LOWS.... AND NO SURPRISE THAT EDMUNDS TOOK US THERE. You know, it was bad enough that EVERY OTHER media outlet in this joke of a country wants Cadillac and it's token model to fail so badly that they're willing to pick the truck apart based on it's CARGO AREA PLASTICS and BUTTONS, but now that Edmunds has posed a "Sensational question" and an entire article on essentially fabricating BULL$h! and a BULL$h! perception problem to perpetuate the import-is-better bias is amazing to me......... Wow... Just wow! HOw much longer are these guys going to HOLD ON TO trying to KILL Detroit and just how much more FEABLE and see-through will their articles become.... (Insiders: feel free to answer) The PUBLIC is beginning to see the truth and one can only hope that they'll CONTINUE to see the transparency in the HALLUCINATION TRIP that is the american media. I actually agree here.... And by-in-large I believe the STS to be Cadillacs WEAK SPOT right now and that's NOT a good thing since it's supposed to be the flagship sedan right now. Why, o why GM did you not BEST the competition instead of EQUALING them with the V-Series... We need REVOLUTION, not EVOLUTION. Hopefully the 2008 refresh will address some things. REPEAT AFTER ME GM: REVOLUTION NOT EVOLUTION!!!!!!!

Typical If I read another damn complaint about that F-ing telescoping steering wheel, I think I'm gonna puke.... Nice to see Edmunds finally get in on the "FENCING" game.... "It's good enough for that pool of SHRINKING domestic buyers, but if you're wanting an import then don't even look." Now GM is even getting 'out-written' on their trucks and SUVs. Soon it will be the end.... Overall though, I must say that it was a pretty good review and I think that the grips were minor, and that the AVERAGE, UNBIASED consumer (yeah, right!!! In California?!?!?) will see through it. Then again, I'm sure they won't this is "BUY IMPORT AMERICA" after all

Looks good to me.... Of course, this is C&G, so 80% of the people here will bitch that it isn't class leading (Because in their minds GM will NEVER be class leading) then the 'insiders' will come and take a dump all over it, and tell us all that we should be ashamed that we're not a part of the Toyota revolution. Then in 2 years we'll get to see the media bitch about it and tear it apart because of "subjective" measurements that are ALREADY predetermined in their SIMPLE, naive minds. Just another day...

I agree with this to an extent... Retro IS NOT crap, it is an opportunity for Detroit to really cash in. BUT! Being too retro isn't realistic. I like designs with HERITAGE influences, but there truly isn't many NEW vehicles that can pull of retro and sustain it. The icons aside (Mustang, Beetle, Camaro, Challenger, etc.) what other cars car SERIOUSLY sustain a "retro only" theme?!?!?! HHR, no. PT, no. (Still sells well on it's traits--the style is TIRED and bland now) T-Bird? Apparently not. SSR? We all know the answer to that. Now, the cars that are "HERITAGE INFLUENCED" are doing VERY well... 300, Charger, C6, the new Cadillacs etc. That said, for Detroit to completely turn it's back on it's heritage is a HUGE mistake!!! And I think they know that and I think they're just trying to convey that "Yes, we can still innovate"

1) Yes I have, on the old board I did a DETAILED piece on why I thought the media was anti-Detroit.... And guess what! It WASN'T because of some HUGE conspiracy. No it is not.... The product is there, it's the IMAGE that suffers. And WE ALL KNOW who/what controls image in this country. I know, which is why I'm here. Theory? The earlier post on the old board suggested that the "bashing" was almost subconcious and not always intentional, almost like prejudice. A nightmare that goes away?!?!?! WE ARE LIVING the nightmare as we are witnessing the changing of the guards.... Never once have I asserted that GM and Ford by in large had VASTLY superior product. In fact, in the C&D Impala thread I agreed with you that the Impala was NOT what it needed to be. And, I'll even go this far... Given I were in the market for a car, MY OWN PERSONAL decisions would NOT go to GM right now in 2 of the biggest segments (Impala sized segment would see me buying a CHARGER and the Malibu sized segment would see me opting for a Fusion) BUT, that said, GM DOES deserve FAIR treatment because their products ARE competitive AND competent. Some criticizm is warranted, but the amount of criticizm that GM has seen over the past 1-2 years HAS NOT BEEN and NEVER WILL BE warranted. People making statements like; GM has been bribing people to buy their cars. -or- statements like GM is not essential to this economy, are just contributing to the mounting propaganda and should not be tolerated. Make no mistake, I'm not stupid; just passionate.

The U.S. should be second.... If people are going to be DUMB enough to not give GM a chance at a sale then GM should focus on where it can make more money. END OF STORY Besides, chances are that China will surpass us as the world superpower soon anyway. And I think we all know that america is going downhill in every aspect, including SPENDING POWER.

Who cares?!?!?! Given your history of posts (and probably other media) it's safe for me to assume that you're an advocate of buying ANYTHING import over GM, thus pretty much encouraging a bankruptcy/dissolve, so what's the difference? Would you rather buy your products from an OUTRIGHT ASIAN OWNED company or an AMERICAN firm that CONTROLS the money? Oh, save it man.... I'm so sick of the "insider Toyota corporate policy" on this site and others that I could puke. Yes, yes, we all know that Toyota is an omnipitent presence that brings us nothing but joy, happiness, and fulfill ment and that GM should be banished to hell. WE'VE established that and WE know that you're "ENLIGHTENING" the public for a reason. BECAUSE YOUR JAPANESE AUTOMAKERS HAVE SUCH A HUGE COST ADVANTAGE!!!!!! WHAT ABOUT THAT DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?!?!? YOU INSIDERS PREACH ABOUT GM OUTSOURCING, YET YOU NEVER MENTION ANYTHING ABOUT HOW UNFAIR IT IS TO BE AN AMERICAN CORPORATION WITH YEARS OF LEGACY COSTS IN A COUNTRY THAT PROMOTES YOUR COMPETITORS. WHICH LEADS ME TO BELIEVE THAT YOU WOULD RATHER JUST SEE GM DIE, INSTEAD OF BECOMING MORE EFFICIENT. These are the VERY same people who preach "THAT'S CAPITALISM!" at GM when Toyota mops the floor with their asses in America, yet, we WHO INVENTED modern capitalism, have to play by a different set of rules?!?!?!?! WE cannot out source our labor/parts to other countries to achieve a competitive advantage?!?!?! Something smells fishy to me; sounds like someone has alterior motives to me. You know, ever since I posted with you (Which has been a LONG time---a lot longer than our time here on C&G) you've been against the "buy American" spiel (Which I agree with to an extent---the consumer SHOULD NOT be forced to buy inferior products JUST BECAUSE they are American----but that scenario DOES NOT APPLY in todays market) So, here we are at a topic in which you've complained about GM outsourcing, APPARENTLY because you care about our economy, workers jobs, and GM's benefit to that economy. (That's not why I think, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt) THEN, in the very same breath you preach that "YOU SHOULD NOT BUY AMERICAN, JUST FOR THE SAKE OF SUPPORTING AMERICANS" So which is it?!?!? We can't rightly have GM be faithful to this country and lose MASSIVE amounts of money just in 'good faith' and then have people like you go on record wishing for GM's destruction. What it boils down to is this: These analyst and media types KNOW that GM is pretty much DAMNED either way, and they'll do all in their power to exploit which ever way it goes because apparently they've all been snowed or apparently all have some sort of HUGE grudge against GM and every aspect of society which is linked to them. (like MOST of the people that I can STEREOTYPE to think the same way as them) So, in essence, what it boils down to is this: WILL THE PUBLIC SEE THROUGH THESE BLATANT ATTEMPTS TO DESTROY WHAT'S LEFT OF DETROIT AND MAKE SURE IT NEVER REKINDLES OR WILL THEY SEE THE "SKEWED AND SPUN" TRUTH. My guess is a little bit of both, but overall, I'm sure these people will suceed. I mean, when you're being attacked from all sides, (analysts, media, public, image concious) deliberately and blatantly, as GM & Co. is now, there isn't much you can do. Maybe we'll all get lucky and another firm will buy the rest of Detroit out like happened with DCX so that the media won't have the BURDEN of ridding us of more manufacturing and more of what made this country great, in the self loathing style of which they were borne. P.S. Save the angry e-mails/PM's because you'll just get more angry and challenging responses back.

What a surprise... So, when it's GM against Toyota, it's a cutthroat comparison in which "If GM can't compete, it should die" BUT, when it's GM against another company in the same situation as GM, then GM should be the patron saint and sacrifice itself... and die. (See a pattern) And the fact that you WISHED more of this sort of action against GM show which side of the fence you're on and it definately isn't GM's It's sad when supposedly unbiased insiders (like all insiders here) blatantly DEATHWISH GM in public on a GM board (like all insiders here do) I'd just like to know why all of you hold such a HUGE grudge against GM? Did they kill you kids or something? Oh, and consider this portion of this thread

It's an EXCELLENT spot!!!!! I caught it in 'prime time' the other night (sadly, GM doesn't do that much) IMO, GM should DRILL spots like this into consumers heads NON STOP... Along with commercials that highlight QUALITY/IMAGE and CONTRIBUTIONS TO OUR ECONOMY! They SHOULD be showing this ad more!!! I LOVE the attitude of it!!!! If anyone wants to see it again, or if that link disappears. I also have the commercial on my MySpace page. www.myspace.com/futureofgm