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    David

    USPS Awards Contract to Modernize Postal Delivery Fleet and is Met with Resistance by ZETA

      February 23rd 2021 the USPS awarded to Oshkosh Defense a contract for delivering up t 165,000 U.S. built vehicles over the next 10 years to modernize the postal delivery fleet. This will be made up of gas powered, Hybrid and electric vehicles with the first auto's set to be delivered in 2023.

    Oshkosh Defense was awarded a 10 year contract by the USPS to create, build and deliver up to 165,000 auto's for postal delivery across the United States of America. These auto's will be made up of traditional internal combustion engine, Hybrid and electrical vehicles. These purpose built, right-hand-drive vehicles will be used for mail and package delivery. A minimum of 50,000 to a maximum of 165,000 auto's over a 10 year time frame was agreed upon contract for a modern AC equipped NGDV or next generation delivery vehicle.

    Snag_7689d67c.png

    Under the initial $482 million up front payment to Oshkosh Defense is the commitment to finalize the production design of the NGDV on a undefined new platform that will support ICE, Hybrid and battery electric powertrains. This is to include in this initial payment plant tooling and build-out of the U.S. manufacturing facility where final vehicle assembly will occur.

    According to the press release by the USPS, the following is to be included in the final design of the NGDV.

    • Modern air conditioning and heating
    • Improved ergonomics
    • Advanced vehicle technology to include
      • 360-degree cameras
      • advanced disc brakes
      • traction control
      • air bags
      • front and rear collision avoidance system
      • visual, audio warning
      • automatic braking
      • increased cargo capacity with standing room in the back
    • Modern powertrains to meet the needs of extreme rural to inner city delivery

    The contract is an indefinite delivery, indefinite quantity contract. The USPS will have the ongoing ability to order more NGDV over the 10 year period. This is part of the current USPS Boards plan for a 10 year plan to transform the USPS into a efficient preferred delivery service provider for the American Public

    Snag_768b25df.png

    ZETA or Zero Emissions Transportation Association which is made up 51 major companies from the Auto industry to the electrical and high tech industry have come out in protest to this contract. 

    ZETA has come out protesting the locking in of the worlds largest government fleet of auto's for the next 40 years at a time when some of the largest industry leading companies are working to reduce over the next 20 years to be carbon neutral. This move by companies to be BEV leading from UPS, FedEx and Amazon shows that our own USPS needs to also move to a pure BEV. ZETA questions if the U.S. Postmaster General Louis DeJoy has the USPS best interests at heart and mind with this decision which is seen as a reckless contract awarded to a company driven by building petrol powered military vehicles.

    ZETA is asking companies across the U.S. to speak out and call on Congress to act on what is best in the U.S. interest for clean air.

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    1 hour ago, David said:

    which is seen as a reckless contract awarded to a company driven by building petrol powered military vehicles.

    How laughably out-of-touch with reality. I wonder if ZETA has any concept of how many petroleum products are in a given BEV??

    Struggling, flighty, upstart companies are not fit for long-term Gov't contract work. God; look no further than Tesla.

    Long-term viability is a key factor in infrastructure evaluations. Imagine the same backlash against not allowing upstart construction companies to get contracts to build major highways bridge spans or commercial aircraft. 

    They're also not going to be able to come remotely close to being competitively priced. 
     

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    Sorry David.

    ZETA is hogwash!  This 'protest' is a 100% pure 'millennials' type of tantrum.  

    Rivian, Uber, Tesla, Lordstown, Lucid, Faraday Future...

    Quote

     

     ZETA questions if the U.S. Postmaster General Louis DeJoy has the USPS best interests at heart and mind with this decision which is seen as a reckless contract awarded to a company driven by building petrol powered military vehicles.


     

     

    yes...yes...the US military...ALL branches...use phoquing petrol to power ALL war machines. 

    News phoquing flash...ALL militaries of the WORLD use phoquing petrol to power all of their war machines.  

    I have a feeling ZETA's protest is more of a sinister one rather than what they say is for the "best interest of the country".   Its because its hypocritical in nature...   Its because none of the so called electric car makers got THE contract so they are sulking no fair...

    Faraday Future has conned the public with a phantom vehicle...that was supposed to have been on sale 3 phoquing years ago.  How the phoque will THEY provide a vehicle for the US government?

    Lucid has just announced yet another "go on sale"  extension for their EV...   How the phoque will THEY provide a vehicle for the US government?

    Lordstown and Rivian.  These guys are just getting started and are on the cusp of selling their first models to the people.  No recent delays...just yet.    Lordstown's pickup truck is unproven in the real world with their new tech...  As is Rivian's.  Considering that GM/Ford and Dodge sell close to 3 million units of pick-up trucks/year...AND FoMoco and GM have annnounced their very OWN EV pick-ups, are we sure Lordstown and Rivian will make it to year 2 or 3?   Id like to see investor's pour billions into these two companies as they did with Tesla to keep them alive JUST like they do with Tesla...   Problem is...where will all this phoquing money come from to keep these two alive IF the public wont buy into Rivian and Lordstown trucks?   Its bad enough that investor's KEEP on giving Tesla billions...    Like Balthy said...its a GOVERNMENT project that NEEDS to be VIABLE LONG TERM...

    Want proof?

    WW2 and the Willys JEEP.    The government gave FoMoCo the rights to build it as it had the know-how, and capacity to mass produce the JEEP reliably, cheaply and would NOT go under during a war...

    Tesla?

    They got sooooooo many projects going on now, with different delays on EACH and EVERY one of them...how COULD the government trust Tesla to deliver these on time?  Reliably?  Every single product launch Tesla has made...Tesla has botched.  With the possible exemption of the Model Y.   The Roadster 2.0 is delayed. The Cybertruck is said to be different than the concept we saw.  Tesla just announced a so called 'real' sub 30 000 dollar EV, which the Model 3 was ORIGINALLY...   Like Balthy said...   Its a government project.  Cost effective it MUST be...and we ALL know that government projects are NEVER BELOW or even AT the initial estimates....is the US government going to KNOWINGLY award a contract like this to a company that KNOWINGLY goes OVER the initial estimates? 

    And lastly...

    Oshkosh SAID that THEIR postal truck WILL be a BATTERY ELECTRIC vehicle.  It will also be ICE only. It will also be a hybrid. BUT...it will also be BATTERY ELECTRIC only too...

    Its VERY disingenuous of ZETA to cry like this...     NOT the other way around.

    And you know what?

    Oshkosh vehicles are KNOWN to be very reliable and durable in extreme situations.  They have a LOOOOONG history of producing vehicles...   There is nothing wrong with Oshkosh winning this contract.  

     

     

     

     

    PS: I forgot to mention UBER.

    Uber is a most rotten, corrupt company that I have ever known in my 48 years of life...

    Uber skirts all kinds of different country's tax laws and taxi regulations.  They do NOT pay their driver's a decent wage...

    ANY organization that has THEM as a partner...and I distrust THAT organization IMMEDIATELY!!!

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    @balthazar @oldshurst442 Honestly, I think ZETA is wanting this contract to go to one of their supporting companies so they can direct sales to their own agenda.

    Right now anything would be better than what the USPS is currently driving and burning down. Sad that we went this long on these auto's.

    I am honestly glad this contract is a 10 year contract and not like the last one that was 3 decades long contract to keep buying old, out of date junk.

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    We of course every advocacy board wants a fat revenue stream so they can set up layers upon layers of administration and bureaucracy. And get custom letterheads.

    But it's not REMOTELY "sad" that a intended 25-yr old vehicle gets stretched an even further 9 years- THAT'S where you make gravy on your contract (as the buyer).

    14 minutes ago, David said:

    I am honestly glad this contract is a 10 year contract and not like the last one that was 3 decades long contract to keep buying old, out of date junk.

    You misread again.
    The prior contract was 1987-1994 to build that fleet. They were well engineered enough to last up to 34 years so far, but not only is the new contract going to TAKE 10 years to build/replace the current ones, I see no start date for the new contract! That means the current Grummans may be FIFTY years old before finally retired. 

    The current contract is how long the increasingly inefficient Gov't is allowing them to build the same quantity of vehicles it took 8 years to build before. In other words, it allows a 25% LESS efficient contractor.

    [OK, there's some more (largely unnecessary) tech and they're larger vehicles... but "SIMPLER POWERTRAINS" (on the BE's), ammirte?]

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    5 minutes ago, balthazar said:

    We of course every advocacy board wants a fat revenue stream so they can set up layers upon layers of administration and bureaucracy. And get custom letterheads.

    But it's not REMOTELY "sad" that a intended 25-yr old vehicle gets stretched an even further 9 years- THAT'S where you make gravy on your contract (as the buyer).

    You misread again.
    The prior contract was 1987-1994 to build that fleet. They were well engineered enough to last up to 34 years so far, but not only is the new contract going to TAKE 10 years to build/replace the current ones, I see no start date for the new contract! That means the current Grummans may be FIFTY years old before finally retired. 

    The current contract is how long the increasingly inefficient Gov't is allowing them to build the same quantity of vehicles it took 8 years to build before. In other words, it allows a 25% LESS efficient contractor.

    [OK, there's some more (largely unnecessary) tech and they're larger vehicles... but "SIMPLER POWERTRAINS" (on the BE's), ammirte?]

    In reading the USPS news release it says the first ones will be delivered 2023, not when in 2023, but just the start of the 50,000 will start in 2023.

    In regards to the last purchase, thanks for including the date, I thought I had read somewhere that it was a 30 year purchase compared to this 10 year contract.

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    No prob.

    It's a contract to build / supply parts for, and that component lasts 10 yrs. How long they are 'designed to last' I haven't read, but a good supplier should always under-promise & over-deliver. I would hope the bar is raised from the Grumman's to at least 40 years, but I doubt the Fed is thinking in that direction when there's so many 'wrongs to right'. 

    These upstart BEV company's are the equivalent of a kid's lemonade stand vs. McDonalds. Or: 
     

    TR.png

     

    [Like that one? Made it myself!]

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    2 minutes ago, balthazar said:

    No prob.

    It's a contract to build / supply parts for, and that component lasts 10 yrs. How long they are 'designed to last' I haven't read, but a good supplier should always under-promise & over-deliver. I would hope the bar is raised from the Grumman's to at least 40 years, but I doubt the Fed is thinking in that direction when there's so many 'wrongs to right'. 

    These upstart BEV company's are the equivalent of a kid's lemonade stand vs. McDonalds. Or: 
     

    TR.png

     

    [Like that one? Made it myself!]

    That gets my UP VOTE 1,000,000 times! :metal:

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    So the USPS chooses a reliable defense contractor over somebody in their tribe.  The protest is rather childish to say the least.  Do they have a superior product ready to go now?  If not, stand down and shut up.

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    Well they desperately need new trucks.  Those Grumman ones are super old and dated and I am sure not safe at all, probably pollute more than a modern V8 and get crap mileage since everything got bad mileage 30 years ago.

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    Of course everything gets crap mileage when you average 3-5 MPH.

    But you have to give GM credit on the longevity of the drivetrains in these.
    Gonna have to ask my mail carrier next time how many miles on it. 

    Edited by balthazar
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    On 3/6/2021 at 9:32 PM, balthazar said:

    Of course everything gets crap mileage when you average 3-5 MPH.

    But you have to give GM credit on the longevity of the drivetrains in these.
    Gonna have to ask my mail carrier next time how many miles on it. 

    Actually EV's would be perfect for mail delivery trucks. Commercial delivery vehicles I think will lead the way with EV's. 

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    Game is a foot as Oshkosh is now to be investigated due to a day before the USPS announcement, a $54.2 million purchase of Oshkosh stock was purchased after hours. This is more than an average daily transaction of their stock.

    On top of this, a bill has been introduced to fund a $6 billion dollar purchase of clean energy EV auto's for the USPS and 75% must be pure EV rather than the 10% stated in the Oshkosh contract.

    Clearly Workhorse which is who was expected to win the contract is not out yet as legal / political maneuvering moves forward.

    Charged EVs | Is Workhorse still in the game? Lawmakers investigate Oshkosh trades, introduce bill to fund US Postal Service electrification - Charged EVs

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    ^ That's an investigation of the stock trade, not of Oshkosh.

    And why is Congress writing ANOTHER multi-billion dollar bill to give money to the USPS- they literally JUST did that. They have zero self-awareness in D.C..

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    7 hours ago, balthazar said:

    ^ That's an investigation of the stock trade, not of Oshkosh.

    And why is Congress writing ANOTHER multi-billion dollar bill to give money to the USPS- they literally JUST did that. They have zero self-awareness in D.C..

    Yes it is a stock trade but as the story also points out, was there favoritism give by the head of the USPS to Oshkosh when other companies were expected to win the contract and a focus is on what is seen as a 30 year continuation of fossil fuels at a time that EVs make more sense for the last mile delivery over ice.

    Here is what Reuters had on the bill to support changing over the government to EVs.

    U.S. lawmakers propose giving USPS $6 billion for electric delivery vehicles | Reuters

    This one just includes a little more info about the unusual stock trading that went on just before the announcement.

    U.S. lawmakers propose giving USPS $6 billion for electric delivery vehicles | Reuters

    Either way, clearly the contract is going to be looked at, stock trades will be looked at and changes could be happening.

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    • 'Favoritism'? Because the USPS has given so much other contract work to Oshkosh?
    • 'Expected to win' is meaningless.
    • If there is no mandate that the new USPS fleet be 100% BE, then there's no reasonable expectation it would be so. The 50%-75% requirement is a component of the new $6B proposed bill, I didn't see a breakdown requirement attached to the original bill/contract other than the USPS agreed to 10% and would do more if the FUNDING was there.
    • 'Makes more sense' fails to recognize the gorilla in the room - cost. You can't buy 165,000 BE vehicles with postage stamps.
    • The stock trade is certainly worthy of a closer look. But a potential info leak just as well could have come from the USPS or the Gov't.  

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