Jump to content
William Maley

Toyota News: Toyota Double Downs Investment On Hydrogen

Recommended Posts

Toyota is planning a big push with hydrogen fuel cell vehicles. According to Reuters, the Japanese automaker is doubling-down on investments for fuel cell vehicles by making improvements to reduce costs and building different models including commercial trucks.

“We’re going to shift from limited production to mass production, reduce the amount of expensive materials like platinum used in FCV components, and make the system more compact and powerful,” said Yoshikazu Tanaka, chief engineer of the Mirai.

Currently, Toyota hand builds the Mirai at a plant in Toyota City. Everyday, about 6.5 cars roll out of the plant. This is due to the detailed inspections that partially assembled models go through. The parts comprising the Mirai are quite expensive as well. According to analysis done by Strategic Analysis Inc., it costs Toyota about $11,000 to produce each of the fuel cell stacks. Blame the use of the platinum, titanium, and carbon fiber for the stacks.

Toyota has been building up production capacity as it expects sales of FCVs to increase from about 3,000 to over 20,000 after 2020. This will help reduce the cost of each fuel cell stack to $8,000.

“It will be difficult for Toyota to lower FCV production costs if it only produces the Mirai,” said a source,

That's where an expansion of FCVs come in. Toyota is planning a "phased introduction' of other FCVs, including SUVs and commercial trucks starting around 2025. Toyota declined to talk about future products, but did reveal that it has built prototypes of small delivery vehicles and transport trucks with fuel cell powertrains.

“We’re going to use as many parts from existing passenger cars and other models as possible in fuel cell trucks. Otherwise, we won’t see the benefits of mass production,” said Ikuo Ota, manager of new business planning for fuel cell projects at Toyota.

Why is Toyota doubling down on fuel cells? Sources say that Toyota believes demand will increase as more countries, including China "warm to fuel cell technology". The company also sees FCVs as a hedge against battery materials such as cobalt becoming scarce.

But there is still one issue that Toyota, and other automakers build FCVs still need to solve; infrastructure. There aren't many hydrogen refueling stations around. For example, the majority of hydrogen stations in the U.S. are in California. Not helping is a current shortage of hydrogen at refueling stations in California. Green Car Reports says this issue is due to various problems with supplier Air Products. The company said that it hopes to restore hydrogen supplies sometime in early August.

Source: Reuters, Green Car Reports


View full article

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I totally get the green side of emission on a Hydrogen auto. Yet I still see this as a big negative also since it takes way more energy to produce the Hydrogen fuel. So one must question the long term nature of Hydrogen auto's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fuel cells make great sense for city dwellers, small delivery vehicles, taxis, and other livery.   You can have a hydrogen generator in your garage and hydrogen can be generated from renewable sources, so its efficiency is less of a concern. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Fuel cells make great sense for city dwellers, small delivery vehicles, taxis, and other livery.   You can have a hydrogen generator in your garage and hydrogen can be generated from renewable sources, so its efficiency is less of a concern. 

I get the renewable source for energy, having a small hydrogen generator in the garage is a challenge coming from a person who sold home CNG fueling equipment. RIght now your looking at an overnight fueling refill of a compressed hydrogen tank with high cost for the equipment up front. I am skeptical of a person wanting to pay 6 to 10K for a home fueling system without big rebates from the gov.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, dfelt said:

I get the renewable source for energy, having a small hydrogen generator in the garage is a challenge coming from a person who sold home CNG fueling equipment. RIght now your looking at an overnight fueling refill of a compressed hydrogen tank with high cost for the equipment up front. I am skeptical of a person wanting to pay 6 to 10K for a home fueling system without big rebates from the gov.

You took garage the wrong way.  I'm thinking more like a taxi garage or a mid-size plumbing firm that maybe has 5 or 6 Sienna Commercial Vans.

If you told the business owner that he/she could erase their fuel costs for the next 10 - 15 years with an upfront check of $10k (assuming the vehicle purchases would be a wash) that should be a fairly easy check to write.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is such a thing as a 'Sienna Commercial van'? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's way out there but I think hydrogen is the way of the future... They're way behind on current technology but it'll come along one day. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

You took garage the wrong way.  I'm thinking more like a taxi garage or a mid-size plumbing firm that maybe has 5 or 6 Sienna Commercial Vans.

If you told the business owner that he/she could erase their fuel costs for the next 10 - 15 years with an upfront check of $10k (assuming the vehicle purchases would be a wash) that should be a fairly easy check to write.

Got it, totally zoned on the business garage and that makes even more sense.

I wonder what ever happened to Honda and their Home Garage fueling station that was all the rage in 2007.

http://www.hydrogencarsnow.com/index.php/home-hydrogen-fueling-stations/

honda-home-h2-filling-station.jpg

Now I will say I like this company's products:

http://www.hydrogenhouseproject.org/index.html

They have a Solar Hydrogen Fuel Cell electric lawn mower, Solar Hydrogen Fuel Cell Off-road EV, the cool part is the portable Joule box that can be used to keep your house fully in the power. Check it out.

Sadly, while there was allot of concepts for home Hydrogen fueling, it has all died out due to EVs. I could only find the company above that seems to be building a unit that could be used for home fueling.

16 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

It's way out there but I think hydrogen is the way of the future... They're way behind on current technology but it'll come along one day. 

Questionable if in my lifetime. :P All the rage in 2007 to 2012 and now dead compared to EV. So it will be interesting to see how Toyota gets this jump started as it is going to cost companies that go this route some big dollars to have hydrogen fueling equipment in places that their fleet can access and use it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

There is such a thing as a 'Sienna Commercial van'? 

I made it up. But you got the idea of what I am trying to say while keeping it Toyota. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I made it up. But you got the idea of what I am trying to say while keeping it Toyota. 

Yes...given how huge Toyota is, I'm surprised they haven't gotten into the commercial van space in the US like Nissan has done w/ the NVs...

A US market version of the Hiace would be cool.  And imagine how badazz one of these would look w/ the Lexus predator grille, sharp angles, squinty lights, and 22 inch wheels..(though the JDM Alphard van looks pretty Lexus-ish these days..)

hiace-front-view.png

Edited by Cubical-aka-Moltar
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

There is such a thing as a 'Sienna Commercial van'? 

Makes total sense with Toyota expanding their Hydrogen options that they would have a commercial van running on hydrogen even though it is a floating idea that Drew through out there.

Toyota should pay Drew for the idea of a hydrogen commercial van. :P 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Social Stream

  • Similar Content

    • By Drew Dowdell
      A rumor has been leaked that the next generation of Toyota Tundra, coming in 2021, would have a twin-turbo V6 combined with an electric motor for its top trim trucks.  The tipster posted to TFLtruck.com saying that the new motor would be based on the existing 3.5-liter turbocharged V6 found in the Lexus LS and LC 500h.  It would have around 450 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque and able to achieve over 30 mpg highway. 
      In the Lexi, the engine produces 354 hp and 369 lb-ft of torque and manages 33 mpg highways.  Our suspicion is that Toyota is making up the deficit by filling the bigger Tundra with bigger electric motors and adding an expected 10-speed automatic, up from the current 6-speed.
      Currently, the Tundra uses two V8s for its powertrain, a 4.6 liter making 310hp and 327 lb-ft of torque and a 5.7 liter making 381hp and 401 lb-ft of torque. Neither engine gets better than 20 mpg currently. 
      The next generation Toyota Tundra will be using an all-new platform dubbed F1 and will likely remain in Texas for production.

      View full article
    • By Drew Dowdell
      A rumor has been leaked that the next generation of Toyota Tundra, coming in 2021, would have a twin-turbo V6 combined with an electric motor for its top trim trucks.  The tipster posted to TFLtruck.com saying that the new motor would be based on the existing 3.5-liter turbocharged V6 found in the Lexus LS and LC 500h.  It would have around 450 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque and able to achieve over 30 mpg highway. 
      In the Lexi, the engine produces 354 hp and 369 lb-ft of torque and manages 33 mpg highways.  Our suspicion is that Toyota is making up the deficit by filling the bigger Tundra with bigger electric motors and adding an expected 10-speed automatic, up from the current 6-speed.
      Currently, the Tundra uses two V8s for its powertrain, a 4.6 liter making 310hp and 327 lb-ft of torque and a 5.7 liter making 381hp and 401 lb-ft of torque. Neither engine gets better than 20 mpg currently. 
      The next generation Toyota Tundra will be using an all-new platform dubbed F1 and will likely remain in Texas for production.
    • By William Maley
      After 20 years, Audi will be sending off the TT coupe and convertible into the great parking lot in the sky. During the brand's annual meeting today, Audi CEO Bram Schot said a new strategy focusing on sustainability means the brand has to cut a number of models that don't make economic sense.
      “There will be lots of things that we won’t do any more in the future, or things that we do less. We focus maximum resources on our key projects,” said Schot.
      This is part of an effort to get the brand back on track in terms of sales and profit after the diesel emission scandal which culminated in the arrest of former CEO Rupert Stadler and an 800 million euro ($895 million) fine.
      Schot did reveal that the TT would be replaced by a new "emotive" electric vehicle in the same price range. No other details were given.
      The TT isn't the only model on the chopping block. The R8 sportscar is being questioned as to whether or not it fits into Audi's new focus. Also, the successor to the A8 flagship may go all-electric.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      After 20 years, Audi will be sending off the TT coupe and convertible into the great parking lot in the sky. During the brand's annual meeting today, Audi CEO Bram Schot said a new strategy focusing on sustainability means the brand has to cut a number of models that don't make economic sense.
      “There will be lots of things that we won’t do any more in the future, or things that we do less. We focus maximum resources on our key projects,” said Schot.
      This is part of an effort to get the brand back on track in terms of sales and profit after the diesel emission scandal which culminated in the arrest of former CEO Rupert Stadler and an 800 million euro ($895 million) fine.
      Schot did reveal that the TT would be replaced by a new "emotive" electric vehicle in the same price range. No other details were given.
      The TT isn't the only model on the chopping block. The R8 sportscar is being questioned as to whether or not it fits into Audi's new focus. Also, the successor to the A8 flagship may go all-electric.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
    • By William Maley
      Guangzhou Automobile Group Co. (GAC) made a big splash at the Detroit Auto Show this year with a number of models destined for the U.S. The plan at the time was to begin talking with dealers at the National Automobile Dealers Association convention in March, with sales to follow early next year. But GAC has postponed plans of coming to the U.S. due to the trade war.
      In a statement issued to Bloomberg, GAC said “the escalation of China-U.S. trade frictions” and distribution “uncertainties” had made them decide to put their plans on hold. It's unclear how long this postponement will last, but it will likely be some months - maybe years.
      Many Chinese automakers have made pronouncements to sell vehicles in the U.S. for over a decade, with none coming to shore. As Automotive News notes, Chinese Automaker Zotye as recently as this month was still recruiting dealers and planning to begin sales in the U.S. late next year. Bloomberg reached out to other Chinese automakers,
      Great Wall: No immediate comment on whether or not it plans on adjusting its plans to coming to the U.S. Lynk & Co. (under the Geely umbrella): Spokesperson said they are "evaluating" plans for North America Source: Bloomberg, Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
  • My Clubs

  • Reader Rides

About us

CheersandGears.com - Founded 2001

We ♥ Cars

Get in touch

Follow us

Recent tweets

facebook

×
×
  • Create New...