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Another day and more bad news for Volkswagen and their diesel engines.

 

Let's begin with the latest. Automotive News is reporting that about 11 million Volkswagen vehicles equipped with diesel engines worldwide have the illegal software. Also, Volkswagen is planning to set aside 6.5 billion Euros ($7.3 billion) in the third quarter to cover the costs of addressing the issue. Volkswagen says the amount could change as the investigation continues.

 

Also, France, Germany, Italy, and South Korea have announced today they will open investigations to see if Volkswagen rigged vehicles to pass their emission tests.

 

The Detroit News has learned the EPA will be expanding their Volkswagen diesel investigation to the 3.0L V6 diesel engine used in a number of Audi vehicles, Porsche Cayenne, and Volkswagen Touareg. This engine was certified for 2016, but in light of the mess with the 2.0L diesel-four, the EPA wants to check the V6.

 

They were certified well before we knew what we know now,” said Christopher Grundler, director of the EPA’s Office of Transportation and Air Quality.

 

Bloomberg has learned from sources that the U.S. Department of Justice has opened a criminal investigation into Volkswagen after the German automaker admitted it had cheated on the EPA tests. This comes days after the Department of Justice announced a $900 Million fine for GM on the ignition switch mess. When asked about the investigation into Volkswagen, Justice Department spokesman Wyn Hornbuckle declined to comment.

 

Next is a report from the Detroit Free Press that says the U.S. Congress' Oversight and Investigations Subcommittee will be holding a hearing into Volkswagen's emission standard violations.

 

“Strong emissions standards are in place for the benefit of public health. We will follow the facts. We are ... concerned that auto consumers may have been deceived — that what they were purchasing did not come as advertised," said U.S. Rep. Fred Upton, R-Mi and Tim Murphy, R-Pa., said in a joint statement.

 

A date hasn't been set for the hearing, but the statement does say it will happen in the new few weeks.

 

Finally, we might have an answer as to how Volkswagen gamed the system in the EPA tests. Consumer Reports explained that the vehicles had two modes; "Dyno” and “On Road”. These modes are necessary as testing is done dynos and could cause the stability and traction controls to turn on. Once the testing is done and the vehicle is turned out, the vehicle goes back to the On Road mode. Somehow, Volkswagen's 'Dyno' mode was programmed to cut emissions.

 

Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required), Detroit News, Bloomberg, Detroit Free Press, Consumer Reports


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Guest wings4life

Soooo, eleventy million cancer spewing Diesel engines have been killing our environment,  and will continue to do so for many, many years....all from just one brand alone….so that customers can save a few $$ at the pump….after initially spending many $$$$$$$$$ to be able to do so, and MAYBE one day recover that cost…..in like 20 years.

 

Tell me again why people think they want Diesel?

 

 

And WOW, VW is in a world of hurt now, and no doubt other automakers as well. 

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I don't think there is necessarily a problem with diesel itself as much as how it was used. The people that should be driving a diesel are the ones who commute 80+ miles per day(40 each way). It really is the best situation for them. Phenominal mileage. With the prices relatively similar to mid grade or premium they can recoupe the initial investment much quicker as well.

 

I defniitely think there is a time and place for diesel cars. They just need to be done correctly like everybody else.

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No matter what we all think, Bloomberg is now saying that VW is stating this actually affects 11 million auto's they made. Their stock has dropped 25% in the last 2 days so a Market loss of 25 Billion Euros in value. VW estimates 6.8 Billion Euros to fix. The following countries have now stated they will investigate and possibly fine VW. Germany, France, South Korea and Italy on top of the US and Canada.

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-09-22/vw-to-set-aside-7-3-billion-as-diesel-emissions-scandal-widens

 

Porsche is now saying that this VW mess will have a drastic affect on them as they own 51% of VW.

 

So Sum this up on what VW has Lost and could cost:

 

25 Billion Euros Value lost in Stock price

6.5 Billion Euros cost to fix the issue

US says possibly as much as 18 Billion fine.

Germany, France, South Korea, Italy, and Canada Additional Fines of unknown value.

 

End Result, VW will survive but be hurt bad by this mess financially

Diesel will get a worse rap as the medical communities and govs will attack it even more.

EV will probably get the biggest push ever.

China will probably lead a revolution of moving to electric auto's.

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i hope the fines are substantial. The engines are putting out 40 times the pollution allowed in California. VW should be banned from selling any diesels for a decade.

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i hope the fines are substantial. The engines are putting out 40 times the pollution allowed in California. VW should be banned from selling any diesels for a decade.

Putting out UP TO 40 times the pollution.

 

That probably means under full throttle acceleration.

 

But, I do agree that the fines should be substancial.

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Guest wings4life

Clean

Diesel

Technology

 

 

And wow, at 40X above what California allows.

 

 

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And then we have those that are trying to say this is no different than Ford with their MPG adjustments they had to make. 

 

WRONG, the cares did not make the MPG but the exhaust pollution was still the same.

 

VW on the other hand purposely changed their computer to pollute more rather than actually build the proper engines to meet the spec. Some countries are saying they will investigate and consider fines plus required engine swaps.

 

Can you imagine if VW has to replace 11 million engines or buy back the autos? This will be very hard on them. Good thing the fired CEO is 68 and able to retire, I doubt anyone would hire him.

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CARB EPA all these regulatory agencies are trying to turn good willing companies into criminals because the screws keep getting tightened.  And all these bureaucratic agencies are really concerned about in this instance is likely collecting fines.

 

The fallout of this, i wonder if Chevy gives up on the next Cruze diesel or if they actually go opposite and make it a marketing point.

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http://wardsauto.com/vehicles-technology/gm-eyed-us-inception-whisper-diesel

 

 

DETROIT – When the second-generation Chevrolet Cruze turbodiesel comes to market in the U.S. in 2017, the engine nicknamed “whisper diesel” will have at least one distinct advantage over its predecessor: American input.

“Our requirements here (in the U.S.) pushed it a lot,” says Mike Siegrist, assistant chief engineer, Chevy Cruze turbodiesel. “The fact that we are going to market this engine here in a Chevy Cruze helped to make it as quiet as it is.”

General Motors’ all-new 1.6L turbodiesel earned plaudits from the European motoring press shortly after it began rolling out last year in Opel products such as the Mokka small CUV. German journalists call it the “flüster diesel,” or whisper diesel, for its uncharacteristically muted noise and vibration qualiti

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Soooo, eleventy million cancer spewing Diesel engines have been killing our environment,  and will continue to do so for many, many years....all from just one brand alone….so that customers can save a few $$ at the pump….after initially spending many $$$$$$$$$ to be able to do so, and MAYBE one day recover that cost…..in like 20 years.

 

Tell me again why people think they want Diesel?

 

 

And WOW, VW is in a world of hurt now, and no doubt other automakers as well. 

So.

...what you're saying is that because there are blatantly illegal engines pumping out blatantly illegal amounts of pollutants because they ignored the effective remedy (likely on grounds of cost), all Diesel engines are bad.

It is a good thing you logged in as a visitor, because that is the kind of comment that would be downvoted into oblivion otherwise.

Yup. Even by your impressive standards, this is a stupid comment.

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CARB EPA all these regulatory agencies are trying to turn good willing companies into criminals because the screws keep getting tightened.  And all these bureaucratic agencies are really concerned about in this instance is likely collecting fines.

 

The fallout of this, i wonder if Chevy gives up on the next Cruze diesel or if they actually go opposite and make it a marketing point.

If they used urea then there's probably no need to-the engine is probably compliant.

C/D just interviewed the boffins from West Virginia who did the testing. They also used vehicles like a diesel BMW X5 as a control.

It used urea. It passed.

The crisis is legit. But those who are shouting from the rooftops to disregard diesel entirely have their tinfoil hats on a bit too tight.

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And then we have those that are trying to say this is no different than Ford with their MPG adjustments they had to make. 

 

WRONG, the cares did not make the MPG but the exhaust pollution was still the same.

 

VW on the other hand purposely changed their computer to pollute more rather than actually build the proper engines to meet the spec. Some countries are saying they will investigate and consider fines plus required engine swaps.

 

Can you imagine if VW has to replace 11 million engines or buy back the autos? This will be very hard on them. Good thing the fired CEO is 68 and able to retire, I doubt anyone would hire him.

As far as I know the only who compared Ford to VW was out redsident fordie. Certainly I didn't.

Be that as it may, then riddle me this: if the emission of choice these days is CO2, then how does overstating mileage make an Al Gore-approved family feel about producing more CO2 than they wanted to? And all because a company lied to them about mileage?

VW omitted an emission control that effectively eliminates NOx. But every single internal-combustion engine on earth will produce CO2, regardless of emission control system.

So... pick your poison.

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They might as well merge with FCA to get economies of scale to offset these losses.  Sergio is probably behind the whole thing!

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I do love the VW diesel engine.  It is strong, friendly and efficient.  I would buy an Amarok TDi if it were available in the U.S. with a regular or extended cab, 4WD and a six speed stick.  GM has already shown that they are not willing to give me that combo in a baby Duramax Collie.  MOAR DIESELS PLEASE!  :)

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I've always been a fan of VW. While this scandal will hurt their image and that of Diesels I have no doubt they'll make a come back. Their cars are good quality and great designs, their having clean diesel was just a plus. Still not the worst cars on the road.

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I really wonder if GM will push their Diesels. VW the most trusted has lost the trust and GM already had a tough road to follow as it was now it has just become more difficult. I think they delay it here in the states and push it overseas to prove its worth before they bring it back here.

The real problem here for VW is not only did they cheat but the fact they took $51 million in green energy kick backs. I can see the government not just fining them but really going after the taking of money in a scam. People who hold office are made to look more foolish then they all ready do and they do not take kindly to companies that will hurt their reps.

If they can find who approved this there could be real criminal charges on fraud against the US Government made here.

To be honest I just had to grin when I heard what they did. It was almost like a Smokey Yunick trick. I have to admire what they did in a way. A company should not break the law but what they did is far from the worst thing an Automaker or company has done.

Hell this is the company that also said hey lets make Hitler a car too. That is one area the PR department is careful about.

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Now, if you want to see what the ACTUAL damage VW's stunt did to the environment, THIS article will suffice:

http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/terence-corcoran-riding-volks-into-the-sunset

 

 

More interesting is this....

 

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/jan/27/diesel-engine-fumes-worse-petrol

Edited by Wings4Life

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That link's not that good, really. I mean, it basically means that Ford's Super Duties are killing whole swaths of people every time the ignition key is turned. I thought they got that out of their system with the Pinto.

Edited by El Kabong

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      The cargo area is quite huge. With all seats up, the Atlas offers 20.6 cubic feet of space. This increases to 55.5 cubic feet when the third-row is folded and 96.8 cubic feet with both rows folded. Only the new Chevrolet Traverse beats the Atlas with measurements of 23, 58.1, and 98.2 cubic feet.
      As a way to differentiate itself from other automakers, Mazda is trying to become more premium. This is clearly evident in the CX-9’s interior. The dash is beautiful with contouring used throughout, and a mixture of brushed aluminum and soft-touch plastics with a grain texture. If I were to cover up the Mazda badge on the steering wheel and ask you to identify the brand, you might think it was from a German automaker. Ergonomics aren’t quite as good as the Atlas as you have to reach for certain controls like those for the climate system.
      The CX-9’s front seats don’t feel quite as spacious when compared to the Atlas with a narrow cockpit and the rakish exterior are to blame. Still, most drivers should be able to find a position that works. The seats themselves have a sporting edge with increased side bolstering and firm cushions. I found the seats to be quite comfortable and didn’t have issues of not having enough support. Moving to the second row, Mazda only offers a bench seat configuration. This is disappointing considering all of the CX-9’s competitors offer captain chairs as an option. There is more than enough legroom for most passengers, but those six-feet and above will find headroom to be a bit tight. Getting into the third-row is slightly tough. Like the Atlas, the CX-9’s second row slides and tilts to allow access. But space is noticeably smaller and does require some gymnastics to pass through. Once seated, I found it to be quite cramped with little head and legroom. This is best reserved for small kids.
      Cargo area is another weak point to the CX-9. With both back seats up, there is only 14.4 cubic feet. This puts it behind most of the competition aside from the GMC Acadia which has 12.8. It doesn’t get any better when the seats are folded. With the third-row down, the CX-9 has 38.2 cubic feet. Fold down the second-row and it expands to 71.2 cubic feet. To use the GMC Acadia again, it offers 41.7 cubic feet when the third-row is folded and rises to 79 with both rows. Keep in mind, the Acadia is about six inches shorter than the CX-9.
      Infotainment
      All CX-9’s come equipped with the Mazda Connect infotainment system. The base Sport comes with a 7-inch touchscreen, while the Touring and above use a larger 8-inch screen. A rotary knob and set of redundant buttons on the center console control the system. Using Mazda Connect is a bit of a mixed bag. The interface is beginning to look a bit dated with the use of dark colors and a dull screen. Trying to use the touchscreen is an exercise in frustration as it is not easy to tell which parts are touch-enabled and not. On the upside, moving around Mazda Connect is a breeze when using the knob and buttons. Currently, Mazda doesn’t offer Apple CarPlay or Android Auto compatibility. Thankfully, this is being remedied with the 2019 model as Touring models and above will come with both.
      For the Atlas, Volkswagen offers three different systems. A 6.5-inch touchscreen is standard on the S. Moving up to either the SE, SE w/Technology, or SEL nets you an 8-inch screen. The top line SEL Premium adds navigation to the 8-inch system. All of the systems feature Apple CarPlay and Android Auto compatibility. The current Volkswagen system is one of the easiest to use thanks in part to intuitive menu structure and quick responses. Moving through menus or presets is easy as the system reacts to the swiping gesture like you would do on your smartphone. There are a couple of downsides to the Volkswagen system. One is there is no haptic feedback when pressing the shortcut buttons on either side of the screen. Also, the glass surface becomes littered with fingerprints very quickly. 
      I did have an issue with the system when trying to use Apple CarPlay. At times, applications such as Spotify would freeze up. I could exit out to the CarPlay interface, but was unable to get the apps unfrozen until I shut the vehicle off. After resetting my iPhone, this problem went away. This leaves me wondering how much of this problem was with my phone and not the infotainment system.
      Powertrain
      Both of these crossovers are equipped with turbocharged four-cylinder engines. The CX-9 has a 2.5L producing either 227 or 250 (on premium fuel) horsepower and 310 pound-feet of torque. The Atlas has a 2.0L producing 235 horsepower and 258 pound-feet. An optional 3.6L V6 with 276 horsepower is available for the Atlas. For the Mazda, power is routed to a six-speed automatic and the choice of front or all-wheel drive. The Volkswagen makes do with an eight-speed automatic and front-wheel drive only. If you want AWD, you need the V6.
      Thanks to its higher torque figure, the CX-9 leaves the Atlas in the dust. There is barely any lag coming from the turbo-four. Instead, it delivers a linear throttle response and a steady stream of power.  NVH levels are noticeably quieter than the Atlas’ turbo-four. The six-speed automatic delivers seamless shifts and is quick to downshift when you need extra power such as merging.
      The turbo-four in the Atlas seems slightly overwhelmed at first. When leaving a stop, I found that there was a fair amount of turbo-lag. This is only exacerbated if the stop-start system is turned on. Once the turbo was spooling, the four-cylinder did a surprising job of moving the 4,222 pound Atlas with no issue. Stab the throttle and the engine comes into life, delivering a smooth and constant stream of power. The eight-speed automatic provided quick and smooth shifts, although it was sometimes hesitant to downshift when more power was called for.
      Fuel Economy
      Both of these models are close in fuel economy. EPA says the CX-9 AWD should return 20 City/26 Highway/23 Combined, while the Atlas 2.0T will get 22/26/24. During the week, the CX-9 returned 22.5 mpg in mostly city driving and the Atlas got 27.3 mpg with a 60/40 mix of highway and city driving. The eight-speed transmission in the Atlas makes a huge difference.
      Ride & Handling
      The CX-9 is clearly the driver’s choice. On a winding road, the crossover feels quite nimble thanks to a well-tuned suspension. There is a slight amount of body roll due to the tall ride height, but nothing that will sway your confidence. Steering has some heft when turning and feels quite responsive. Despite the firm suspension, the CX-9’s ride is supple enough to iron out most bumps. Only large imperfections and bumps would make their way inside. Barely any wind and road noise made it inside the cabin.
      The Atlas isn’t far behind in handling. Volkswagen’s suspension turning helps keep body roll in check and makes the crossover feel smaller than it actually is. The only weak point is the steering which feels somewhat light when turning. Ride quality is slightly better than the CX-9 as Atlas feels like riding on a magic carpet when driving on bumpy roads. Some of this can be attributed to smaller wheels. There is slightly more wind noise coming inside the cabin.
      Value
      It would be unfair to directly compare these two crossovers due to the large gap in price. Instead, I will be comparing them with the other’s similar trim.
      The 2018 Volkswagen Atlas SE with Technology begins at $35,690 for the 2.0T FWD. With destination, my test car came to $36,615, The Technology adds a lot of desirable features such as three-zone climate control, adaptive cruise control, automatic emergency braking, blind spot monitoring with rear-cross traffic alert, forward collision warning, and lane departure alert. The Mazda CX-9 Touring is slightly less expensive at $35,995 with destination and matches the Atlas on standard features, including all of the safety kit. But we’re giving the Atlas the slight edge as you do get more space for not that much more money.
      Over at the CX-9, the Grand Touring AWD begins at $42,270. With a couple of options including the Soul Red paint, the as-tested price came to $43,905. The comparable Atlas V6 SEL with 4Motion is only $30 more expensive when you factor in destination. Both come closely matched in terms of equipment with the only differences being the Grand Touring has navigation, while the SEL comes with a panoramic sunroof. This one is a draw as it will come down whether space or luxury is more important to you.
      Verdict
      Coming in second is the Mazda CX-9. It may have the sharpest exterior in the class, a premium interior that could embarrass some luxury cars, and pleasing driving characteristics. But ultimately, the CX-9 falls down on the key thing buyers want; space. It trails most everyone in passenger and cargo space. That is ultimately the price you pay for all of the positives listed. 
      For a first attempt, Volkswagen knocked it out of the park with the Atlas. It is a bit sluggish when leaving a stop and doesn’t have as luxurious of an interior as the CX-9. But Volkswagen gave the Atlas one of the largest interiors of the class, a chassis that balances a smooth ride with excellent body control, impressive fuel economy, and a price that won’t break the bank.
      Both of these crossovers are impressive and worthy of being at the top of the consideration list. But at the end of the day, the Atlas does the three-row crossover better than the CX-9.
      Disclaimer: Mazda and Volkswagen Provided the Vehicles, Insurance, and One Tank of Gas
      Year: 2018
      Make: Mazda
      Model: CX-9
      Trim: Grand Touring AWD
      Engine: Turbocharged 2.5L Skyactiv-G Four-Cylinder
      Driveline: Six-Speed Automatic, All-Wheel Drive
      Horsepower @ RPM: 227 @ 5,000 (Regular), 250 @ 5,000 (Premium)
      Torque @ RPM: 310 @ 2,000 rpm
      Fuel Economy: City/Highway/Combined - 20/26/23
      Curb Weight: 4,361 lbs
      Location of Manufacture: Hiroshima, Japan
      Base Price: $42,470
      As Tested Price: $43,905 (Includes $940.00 Destination Charge)
      Options:
      Soul Red Metallic - $595.00
      Cargo Mat - $100.00
      Year: 2018
      Make: Volkswagen
      Model: Atlas
      Trim: 2.0T SE w/Technology
      Engine: Turbocharged 2.0L DOHC 16-Valve TSI Four-Cylinder
      Driveline: Eight-Speed Automatic, Front-Wheel Drive
      Horsepower @ RPM: 235 @ 4,500
      Torque @ RPM: 258 @ 1,600
      Fuel Economy: City/Highway/Combined - 22/26/24
      Curb Weight: 4,222 lbs
      Location of Manufacture: Chattanooga, TN
      Base Price: $35,690
      As Tested Price: $36,615 (Includes $925.00 Destination Charge)
      Options: N/A
    • By William Maley
      It seems like ages since Mazda announced plans to bring over a diesel engine. Many things have transpired since then with various delays and the Volkswagen diesel emission scandal. While the company said the diesel engine was still in the cards, we started to think it was as real as bigfoot or the loch ness monster. But the engine is one step closer to reality as the EPA has posted the fuel economy figures for the CX-5 diesel.
      For the front-wheel variant, the CX-5 diesel will return 28 City/31 Highway/29 Combined. All-wheel drive see a slight drop to 27/30/28. Major improvement over gas model, right? Not really. The FWD gas model does trail the diesel in the city by three, but there is only a one mpg difference in the highway and the combined figure is the same. The AWD gas model is pretty much the same story; three mpg difference in the city, two mpg difference on the highway, and the same figure for combined.
      It gets even worse if we compare it to the Chevrolet Equinox and GMC Terrain Diesel. In FWD guise, EPA figures stand at 28 City/39 Highway/32 Combined. AWD models return 28/38/32.
      We're guessing that new emissions equipment and harder testing likely affected CX-5 diesel's fuel economy figure. Mazda might sell the diesel engine as a performance upgrade - the 2.2L turbodiesel produces 170 horsepower and 310 pound-feet of torque. 
      No timeframe has been given on when the CX-5 diesel will finally go on sale.
      Source: EPA

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      It seems like ages since Mazda announced plans to bring over a diesel engine. Many things have transpired since then with various delays and the Volkswagen diesel emission scandal. While the company said the diesel engine was still in the cards, we started to think it was as real as bigfoot or the loch ness monster. But the engine is one step closer to reality as the EPA has posted the fuel economy figures for the CX-5 diesel.
      For the front-wheel variant, the CX-5 diesel will return 28 City/31 Highway/29 Combined. All-wheel drive see a slight drop to 27/30/28. Major improvement over gas model, right? Not really. The FWD gas model does trail the diesel in the city by three, but there is only a one mpg difference in the highway and the combined figure is the same. The AWD gas model is pretty much the same story; three mpg difference in the city, two mpg difference on the highway, and the same figure for combined.
      It gets even worse if we compare it to the Chevrolet Equinox and GMC Terrain Diesel. In FWD guise, EPA figures stand at 28 City/39 Highway/32 Combined. AWD models return 28/38/32.
      We're guessing that new emissions equipment and harder testing likely affected CX-5 diesel's fuel economy figure. Mazda might sell the diesel engine as a performance upgrade - the 2.2L turbodiesel produces 170 horsepower and 310 pound-feet of torque. 
      No timeframe has been given on when the CX-5 diesel will finally go on sale.
      Source: EPA
    • By William Maley
      In a month's time, Europe will be switching from much maligned New European Drive Cycle (NEDC) to the Worldwide Harmonized Light Duty Vehicles Test Procedure (WLTP). Automakers are scrambling to get models certified under this new procedure. This presents a big problem for Volkswagen as they don't have enough engineers to make sure their vehicles to meet the new standards.
      According to Reuters, Volkswagen lost a number of engineers that specialized in engine calibration ever since the company revealed they were using illegal software on their diesel vehicles to cheat emission tests.
      “Engine development expertise has been lost,” said Volkswagen Group CEO Herbert Diess.
      It is so bad, that Volkswagen believes it will affect their financial results for the second half of this year as they might not be able to get a number of vehicles out on the road. The company said there would a bottleneck of certain model variants between now and October.
      Volkswagen is working hard to try and overcome this problem. They have plucked BMW engine development expert Markus Duesmann last week to try and get through this mess.
      Source: Reuters

      View full article
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