ccap41

AHHHH I built a C63 for 67,695! I think I will sacrifice the awesome super dark blue for the LED headlights. I have a thing for really nice lighting. Okay that freed up just enough room for the illuminated TriStar in the grille. I wish I could have gotten rid of the fake leather.. but oh well.. Just fake black leather and luckily I already like the aluminum trim more than wood anyway. So I have a C63, black, with full LED headlights and LED TriStar logo in the grille. $67,525.

The CT6 is $65,390 with only the TT3.0 add the seats(and it forces you to add the Comfort Package as well) and it brought it to $69,685

Boom. Nailed it.

OoOoOoOo I likey this price range and vehicle style. Uh Oh, the M / AMG / F / RS can fit into this????

When you say "several" was there more than just Wings?

I'm pretty sure that was Drew actually. I don't think he would have just been making things up w/o some knowledge. (check the other ZL1 thread for his words). You are correct, there is no GT500 right now. Nor is there a Z28 but I don't think we should really compare two different style cars. If anything I think we can all agree the 1LE is way more GT350/R competitor than a ZL1 is. It wasn't me. It was a member of C&G who has since quit the site who stated that GM would have to wait a bit till it got access to the 10-Speed. I didn't challenge it because such agreements have been made in the past and I had no reason to think otherwise. Ohhhhh so you were just being a smartass.. lol touche'.

That's part of why I like these threads so much! It forces you to look into and learn about cars you never knew existed to fit the roles you like. I just learned of something a little bit ago that I will definitely use in a future thread. I actually think the next one 2.0-2.9 will be the toughest. Almost every vehicle offers something in that range whether its n/a, diesel, turbo...heck doesn't volvo offer a turbo and supercharged setup?

Audi A4 - 1.4L Audi Q3 - 1.4L Mazda RX-7 - 1.3L Fiesta ST - 1.6L Can't deny the Alfa 4C, beautiful and simple in the best of ways. I only wish it had a manual transmission. Alfa 4C - 1.7 My Honorable Mention will go to the 2017 Escape - 1.5L I actually think it would be a better all around package than the Audi Q3 with more size and power.. but I think the Audi just looks good so screw it.

DANG! While looking up larger vehicles with smaller diesel engines Ford offers a 2.0 diesel in the Edge: 207hp/332tq. That would have been perfect for me! Time to keep looking...

Yes, but it throws the whole premise of this series. Obviously 99% of 2.0 engines are under 2,000cc, but the limit is intended to encompass both limits. It must be under both units of measurement. Same when we get to 3.0, 4.0, 5.0, etc, etc. I will clarify this further in future threads. Alright, I'm honestly kind of confused.. are you actually looking for 1.9L and below or 1999cc and below? Like is a Focus ST's "2.0" valid or not? Okay, I'll make it easy moving forward. Forget cc's and only go by liters. For this thread, 1.9 and below. Okay cool! thanks! You can guarantee there will be a Fiesta ST in there then.. Something larger for more people will be difficult. It'll definitely have to be something overseas and diesel.

The GM 2.0 = 1998 CC Mitsubishi Eclipse 2.0T = 1998 CC Ford 2.0 Ecoboost = 1999 CC Mercedes 2.0T = 1991 CC I know they generally round up when expressing in liters, so I knew my choices were safe Yes, but it throws the whole premise of this series. Obviously 99% of 2.0 engines are under 2,000cc, but the limit is intended to encompass both limits. It must be under both units of measurement. Same when we get to 3.0, 4.0, 5.0, etc, etc. I will clarify this further in future threads. Alright, I'm honestly kind of confused.. are you actually looking for 1.9L and below or 1999cc and below? Like is a Focus ST's "2.0" valid or not?

So the S-Class has two fewer gears than the CT6..... and the same number as the new Continental. Two speeds in reverse on a passenger car is just complexity for the sake of complexity. What? It still used all 9 forward gears(assumingit reacts like the current 7spds to). If you're stopped and hammer it you'll use 1st, the only time it is really needed anyway. That 2nd reverse gear(while I don't understand it) doesn't count in the forward gear count.Personally, after driving a Mercedes 7spd I don't see the complaint of comfort mode skipping 1st at all. I loved how smooth it accelerated from a stop because every vehicle I've been in 1st is always the harshest,loudest and(obviously) the shortest. Starting in 2nd by CHOICE is a great thing. If the trans didn't have 2 different modes and ONLY relied on initial throttle tip-in to decide to use 1st or 2nd I wouldn't like. But having the choice of different drive modes I don't understand the complaint. I'm mostly just twisting SMK. I really have no problem with the number of gears a car has as long as it delivers the performance I'm looking for at the price. SMK will latch on to some singular specification in an American brand car that is, in his eyes, proof that <American Brand X> is inferior to the Benz. Look how he harps on the Continental having a 6-speed when the Benzes with 7-speeds operate as 6-speeds 99.9999999% of the time. Look at how he is trying to twist the Cadillac 3.0TT into a failure because it is 0.1 seconds behind a Benz with a much larger and much more powerful engine (when its actually a huge win for Cadillac). He'll latch onto these numbers that are absolutely irrelevant to the sales process and try to spin them as gospel. What's also fun is watching him move the goal posts around the field when one or another of his favorite statistics no longer applies or changes things up by making apples to oranges comparisons (Cadillac 3.0TT v Audi 4.0TT while ignoring the Audi 3.0 S/C anyone?) No one is going to walk into a Cadillac dealership intent on buying a CT6 and then turn around and walk out without buying because it is 0.1 seconds slower to 60. No one is going to walk into a Lincoln dealership intent on buying a Continental and then walk out without buying because it has one fewer forward speed than an E-Class. No one is going to walk into a Cadillac dealership intent on buying an XT5 AWD and then turn around and walk out because of the direction the engine is facing. People become interested in a car for what a car looks like, a specific price, or a specific image they see in themselves...not because of dumb statistics like this. As for the Benz transmission specifically. I have no problems with it. It operates smoothly and as it should. Ahhhh I gotcha I gotcha and you are completely correct about all of those reasons people won't walk out of a dealership. Some people just grasp onto certain numbers, for whatever reason, and try and use them as the end-all be-all for a car.

So the S-Class has two fewer gears than the CT6..... and the same number as the new Continental. Two speeds in reverse on a passenger car is just complexity for the sake of complexity. What? It still used all 9 forward gears(assumingit reacts like the current 7spds to). If you're stopped and hammer it you'll use 1st, the only time it is really needed anyway. That 2nd reverse gear(while I don't understand it) doesn't count in the forward gear count. Personally, after driving a Mercedes 7spd I don't see the complaint of comfort mode skipping 1st at all. I loved how smooth it accelerated from a stop because every vehicle I've been in 1st is always the harshest,loudest and(obviously) the shortest. Starting in 2nd by CHOICE is a great thing. If the trans didn't have 2 different modes and ONLY relied on initial throttle tip-in to decide to use 1st or 2nd I wouldn't like. But having the choice of different drive modes I don't understand the complaint.

See, I find this as good information. Thanks for the info smk. Two reverse gears does sound a little silly in ANY car but whatever.. Lol as long as they don't have trans issues then it may be complexity to be complex but as long as it neve hampers the owners then it's nothing to complain about.

Even from a stand still? That's hard to believe because of the AWD vs RWD. Are the turbos that big that there is all sorts of lag as well? I would have thought the lighter weight, AWD, and low end turbo tq would have made it feel quicker This was a 991.1 C2. So pre-turbo. I was very surprised by sluggish it felt. Still amazing to drive, though! Credit my poor reading comprehension there.. I guess when I read 911 I just thought 911 Turbo and I don't know why. My bad. That's why I was all talking turbos and AWD... oops! Good point.. I never paid attention to that. Do that and answer that question for us! Actually, even if it did kick down it would be probably losing more time in the downshift than it would gain if it just stayed in 2nd.

Not really, because no one really drives in 0-60 mode. Commuting to work, my Buick Encore and a Tesla Model-S P90D have the same 0-60 times.... if we even get to 60 at all. That is True, but the thinking is if you want to compare auto to auto, zero to 60 in like auto's especially EV where you have 100% torque from zero makes them all pretty even so then the type of motor with amount of torque shows off the efficiency of the engineering so that you can give a consistent barometer on how the auto does. yes weight, aerodynamics, etc. all play a big role. I just think an EV zero to 60 is a solid gauge of an auto in comparison to petrol and the crazy RPM range of when you get full torque, full HP etc. It's an irrelevant metric to pretty much all drivers not named SMK. Look at the big deal SMK makes about 0.1 second in the S-Class over the CT6 as if it is some huge victory. It's not... it's a crushing defeat that a Cadillac V6 matches a Mercedes V8 that is 1.7 liters (more than one whole malibu engine!) larger. Furthermore, the Benz automatics skip first gear entirely unless you set the transmission to sports mode every time you get in the car. (I don't know the case on the CT6 yet). So in every day driving, you don't even get the published acceleration. The CLS I drove would even sneak back into "normal" mode after an extended period of tame driving so as not to waste gas. 0-60 might matter in a car like the Spark or even the Encore that has double digit 0-60 times, but 1/10th of one second in cars capable of anything under 6 seconds really is meaningless. I don't know about you Drew but I am always driving in 0-60 mode!!! Just got the record there are exactly two people who care about 0.1 of a second to either 60mph or 1/4 mile..whichever makes them win. My C350 did the skip first unless in sort mode and I liked it because 1st was so short it was just an unnecessary shift to feel. It was the smoothest trans I've ever driven with but it was still an unnecessary shift to be felt because in "comfort" mode you don't need the extra rpm for accelerating. I actually loved that trans. You'd be the better judge as you've driven WAAAAY more than I though.

I prefer this stuff. YES, that stuff rocks! Mmmmm I really do enjoy it! It's just tough to find around here for some reason. A store will have it and I'll buy it and then because salt isn't one thing you buy weekly or even monthly by the time I go to buy it again the store doesn't have it anymore!

I prefer this stuff.

I'm pretty sure that was Drew actually. I don't think he would have just been making things up w/o some knowledge. (check the other ZL1 thread for his words). You are correct, there is no GT500 right now. Nor is there a Z28 but I don't think we should really compare two different style cars. If anything I think we can all agree the 1LE is way more GT350/R competitor than a ZL1 is.

The Hellcat wasn't even the top speed leader when it first came out(mfgr claim: 199mph GT500 mrgr claim:202 - both stupid manufacturer claims). Horsepower king, yes. power:weight ratio = GT500. The only thing the Hellcat did over the GT500 was use an independent rear end and had an automatic trans. ZL1 was the best all around car of those three. While not the quickest or fastest it gave the best package. Literally, all the Hellcat has ever really had is raw power but even it's heft was too much to the point of 100% driver skill would win in a race.

So did you read his entire back story and not just the part where he worked for GM fifty years ago? http://www.automobilemag.com/author/robert-cumberford/ As a matter of fact, he is just as honest about the new Camaro. http://www.automobilemag.com/news/2016-chevrolet-camaro-design-analysis/ Nah, I just read the part where he worked for GM which was all I needed to read to know 'Bong would be worshiping his words. So you're letting your bias against Bong, in this case, get in the way of the fact that this reviewer is very accredited and gives equal treatment to all makes? Absolutely. lol But in all seriousness... I'm not a fan of the guy's reviews. I read a small handful on cars that I really though were good looking and a couple I wasn't a fan of and I just don't agree with him. He seems to pick things apart in a way that doesn't make sense to me.

Isn't this more GT500 territory? The last GT500 and ZL1 I thought were competitors. They were the more GT-like cars.

Even from a stand still? That's hard to believe because of the AWD vs RWD. Are the turbos that big that there is all sorts of lag as well? I would have thought the lighter weight, AWD, and low end turbo tq would have made it feel quicker

Don't even act like you don't LOOOOOVE rubbing in anything and everything GM does.When you're getting smack talk like this DIRECTLY FROM THE MANUFACTURER, downvoting me is remarkably petty.Don't hate the player. Hate the game Or, if you're a Ford fan, hate the dullards, beancounters, and fatheads who allowed the company to become so uncompetitive in this segment. Yeah, the game of TrollSoHardLikeWings. I think everybody dislikes that game. 'cept you. The car is fantastic. No doubt about that. But then you throw out crap like "Or, if you're a Ford fan, hate the dullards, beancounters, and fatheads who allowed the company to become so uncompetitive in this segment." What about FCA? They don't have anything competitive either. Hellcat competitive to a hopped up pony car? Absolutely not. Or are you just TrollingSoHard to only get under specific people/person's skin?

Don't even act like you don't LOOOOOVE rubbing in anything and everything GM does.