ccap41

+1 Thanks again rogueriver! Darn, I am going to have to ask you about Mercedes because that is the car my wife wants. I figure the best thing to do is lease to leverage the car being under warranty. My ATS gets complimentary service for its first few years so I have not paid a dime in service. Cmicasa the Great would know a lot more about the cost of maintaining a Cadillac. Well, in all fairness mine was an '06 and nothing is the same now as it was then so I would just look for a more reliable resource to the current lineup. But, for what it's worth, it drove and performed GREAT. I really did love how it drove( C350 ). It was smooth, quiet, efficient, actually pretty dang quick(268hp/258tq) but any parts for it were expensive. I would only believe they are the same i not worse at this point so I would only own one under warranty.. but that's me.

You know I don't know why people piss so much about fleet and commercial sales so much. Unless the number is 20% of total sales or higher..who gives a $h!? Well, that question is answered from the months of back-and-forths over it here but I should ask, "why do you guys give a $h!?"

Honestly, I kind of don't even want to test a 3.6 because they are more than I am willing to spend so if I like it more then I just won't buy the car at all.. It'll either be a "like" or "don't like" of the 2.0 and I won't even consider the 2.5 as I don't really think it belongs in any Cadillac or Buick/GMC.. 180hp/171tq.. GM is better than that to put that motor in these premium brands. I think there should be something below the 2.0 I just don't think the gap should be that large, ~90hp/120tq. I think a 200/200 base engine would be a little more appropriate.

Hahaha yeah I saw that article as well! I don't know if it's their BEST product...the Golf R is pretty special itself.. but it's no Corvette powered ANYTHING How many awesome cars are out there? Yes. I tend to not like seeing videos of myself doing anything but I don't mind watching myself in the mirror(working out).

I guess I should have clarified at some point that I am looking used. So I am NOT looking to spend 35-40k on this car but I'm looking in the 20-24k range with 30-40k miles(you'd be surprised how much they've depreciated). That was one reason I want to know about the maintenance compared to the Germans because I've owned a Mercedes and $h! is expensive. For example, they made a certain wiper blade clip that you can only get from like 2 companies and they were $40 a pair no matter what. Is that the end-all be-all? expensive wiper blades? No. But it's just another thing that is expensive on the damn car that doesn't need to be. I don't want to run into things like that. +1 Thanks again rogueriver!

Thank you Frisky!! Your personal opinion is exactly what I was looking for. I'm glad a few here have gotten to drive exactly what I'm thinking about(and owned as rougeriver does) Well in my price range I am definitely looking at the 2.0T. It seems like everything with the 3.6 is more than I would like to spend at this time. How small are the rear seats? Is it much smaller than my Escape because that's relatively small as well. Ps. I don't know why it won't let me un-bold the font..oh well..

Thank you very VERY much for your personal insight! I'm really glad somebody here owns basically exactly what I'm looking at for their point of view on the car. The biggest issue I have is as much as I want a RWD sporty/athletic car I'm afraid I will be screwed come winter again like I was with my Mach 1. I don't have a place to store a second set of winter tires so a good all-season would have to do. How many miles do you have on yours so far?

+1!

First off, you know damn well that JD reliabliity crap on vehicle that are less than a year old means petty little $h! for the most part. How can a company know how reliable a car is in less than a year's time? Seriously? Second, I know first hand that Mercedes cost way more to own and maintain than your little JD charts reveal. Own one with some miles on it and that'll tell the story, post warranty. I've owned a C350 and had the AC condensor go out at about 80k miles(2k to fix), thermostat under 100k($400 to fix - did it myself for the cost of the thermostat($100) and coolant($35) and little $h! went out on it like the auto wipers, passenger rear door lock knob randomly flew off and had to take the door panel off to realign the piece that the knob screws into(HOW THE F DOES A LOCK KNOB JUST FALL OFF?!?!). Want more? Girlfriend owns a G500.. Constant issue with the doors not locking or unlocking. Every few fuel fill-ups the gas cap light warning comes on(after replacing it twice), multiple light bulbs are out that the vehicle warns about but I've tried replacing all of them and they just don't work, driver front headlight has fried the harness twice(how the F does that happen?), She's had the window motor go in the driver front and passenger rear once each dropping the glass, Windshield wiper motor went once. Oh, and the 6 disc changer in the rear won't eject so there's no using that, just the one in the dash...sorry no getting those CDs out w/o going to a dealer.. Yeah, reliable cars. Oh I forgot the best one of them all!!! Her G500 would randomly just shut off. Driving, idling, on railroad tracks(happened once, not joking - The location is 2 sets of tracks and the road T's on the other side so you're going slow to make a turn.) and sometimes it would start right back up, sometimes it wouldn't. That's about as dangerous as a car can get if you're cruising at 70-80 on the interstate and you lose all power steering and brakes out of nowhere. I was with her twice when it happened and they tried taking it to dealers but it was so sporadic that it was nearly impossible to diagnose. I'm going to bump this so hopefully all get to see the fantastic reliability that MB offers. And I'm going to help you because some people need a reality check. You want to like said brand? Fine. No one is stopping you. However, that should come with a healthy dose of reality to help cure any kind of brand related blindness. Very well said btw ccap. Hey check out what I found in the link you posted earlier! That was a 2 for the price of 1 link, great job! "IntelliChoice cost of ownership calculates the CLA250 would command $1220 more to operate over 5 years than the 320i. Regal and CC: $1987 and $3738 extra over the BMW" http://www.motortrend.com/news/entry-level-luxury-sedan-comparison/

Eventually it will.. I think whenever it is gas goes back up people will think a little more about that extra 1-3mpg hit the CUV is taking. I 100% disagree here. Crossovers are getting to the point they are at least nearly, if not as efficient, as their sedan counterparts while still offering much greater utility. this is why FCA, Ford, cadillac, and most others are investing heavily in new crossovers and SUVs. Name one CUV that is as efficient as it's counterpart, ex Focus->Escape, I should probably clarify so you don't go nuts on the grey areas.. You can't pick a Focus ST and an Escape with the 1.6.

I thought this paragraph somewhat summed it up from the above article: "Hours after the sun set, the Regal was stalking the CLA250 on Route 89A leading to Jerome. The road was narrow, with the eerie kind of dark where a bright moon is of little use. Here, the Regal was as good a curvy road companion as the other three, though it did mandate first gear for the slowest hairpins. It drives like it is the most skewed toward luxury, with abundant pitch and roll, yet its wide front track and accurate steering place the car where it’s needed. Dare we say it was the second-most enjoyable in these conditions behind the at-home-on-windy-roads BMW? The CC doesn’t dive as much on the brakes as the Regal, but it’s harder to feel out the front tires through the steering. The CLA250 is nimble, but the twin-clutch automatic struggles to respond on manual toggles and the overly stiff front shakes the rest of the car, making for sweaty hands."

Tire wear varies GREATLY if you know anything about tires(make/model/compound/wear rating/driver's style/most OEMs have tires designed for their specific cars so buying an ATS with X tire will be different than buying a 3 Series with the same brand name and model tire). Unless you know information about both ATS and 3/C Class tires there is no way one can honestly say they are similar without at the very least knowing the wear ratings of each tire. Yes the only thing that is "similar cost" is oil. But that is what I'm curious about in this thread... is Cadillac as expensive to own and maintain as a Benz/BMW/Audi? I do my own oil changes so that doesn't matter to me. I also doubt the 2.0T usues 8.5 qts of oil(like the large majority of Benz/BMW use - in the ball park of 7.0-8.5qts is normal for them) and still has intervals of around 10k miles...so again..cheaper..

Again, your bull$h! cherry picking is not going to fly here. If you think that certain model Buicks don't compete with the cheapo CLA, then you are further deluding yourself. Again, I can post that MT comparo where the Regal handed the CLAs ass to it if you want. Doooo iiiiitttttt!

GM covers these two markets with 3 brands, Mercedes covers it with one. There is a valid debate to be had over which strategy is superior, but comparing sales numbers without acknowledging these facts is dishonest. Then you have to give BMW all Mini sales, because the cheapest Mini costs the same as a Verano and the Clubman is the same price as an Encore. Mini sales aren't any good, but if you want to compare sales down to $21,000, BMW should get them too, Audi should get to add the Volkswagen CC, Tiguan and Toureg, because those are priced higher than similar Buicks. Bottom line is Cadillac is GM's luxury brand, it is the one with the task of targeting Lexus and the Germans. Cadillac is targeting the non-cheap-$h! Germans. Not all German made MB/BMW are to the same built quality/standard as the S Class and 5 Series. The CLA costs more than a Buick LaCrosse, and no BMW or Mercedes or Audi costs $21k like a Verano. The Germans have more up market products, say $75k and up, than the American and Japanese brands also. The Escalade and The LS460 and LX570 are it. What's funny is GM makes a car in that price category that'll roast the Germans in about any form of race you can think of.. it just wears a Bowtie loud and proud.

And at just a tad under 30k you get REAL LEATHER, 18inch wheels, 42hp, and 2tq over the CLA starting at 32k which gets "MB-tex", 17's and 208hp/258tq. but you do get a shiny Tri-Star logo!

And I will be sure to look at all of them! That "what if" with cars has always been fun to me, for who-knows-why reason.

I can tell you neither one have hit the press fleet yet. I was told this a few weeks ago when scheduling some GM vehicles for review. I don't know when they'll be hitting, but I have to guess it will be sometime in the near future. That didn't take too long.. lol http://www.motortrend.com/news/2017-cadillac-xt5-awd-first-test-review/

Agreeeeeeed I always liked Frisky's threads! I just didn't always have time to get and upload the pics because I have to do that on my phone from work(can't use work computers for that crap - lol ) so it's really time consuming to upload a bunch of pics.

1- I am still am...long in the tooth or not. The now 10 year old Jeep twins are beating sales pretty well.....and they are not even giving them away! Who knows....I'm seeing a truckload of new Malibus....could be the reason.... 2 Agreed!! Yeah no clue how those old as F Jeep twins sell..at all.. unless they're throwing heavy discounts on them. They just look so dated inside and out. With the Nox being a Chevy I expect it to sell fairly well even if the product was sub par just because of availability and if it weren't selling hot GM can afford to throw some money at it regardless to get them to move. My local dealer has a TON of the new Malibus already. Very sharp looking car. I originally hated it, thought it looked terrible. Now, it's grown on me quite a bit. The only thing that kind of annoys me about it is the LED fog lights.. I feel like they should be flipped over. I don't like the angle of the bend. Picky? Yep. It wouldn't keep me from buying one though.

Yes..and no.. I mean the reliability of an engine/drivetrain isn't going to sell me but if it is known for expensive issues it will turn me off of the vehicle. Not all used cars have the same operating costs though and while you won't admit it MB/BMW/Audi run on the high side of that. Also, tires and brakes are easily observable and I would never buy a car that would need tires by the end of the next season.

Cadillac ATS Alright guys.. First it isn't a buy or sell really.. but more the idea. I've got the itch again for another vehicle but I'm not really sure why. I've been throwing around the idea of a used(40k and under miles) Cadillac ATS but it would have to have the 2.0T or 3.6. But after looking it seems the 3.6 are a little more than I'd like to spend and it isn't that perfect of a vehicle to overspend. So I was thinking.. First, as anybody driven one? What are your personal feelings about the car? Second, are there any known issues with the 2.0T that I should avoid or not? Is that the same 2.0 that was in the HHR SS and Cobalt SS? Third, what are all of your opinions on the car in general? For me to get it it would also have to have the LED/HID head light setup that makes a Caddy distinguishable from a mile away. I've found a couple that meet my criteria of sub 40k miles, black/white/silver/grey, and had the headlights that I want(which at that package level it also includes CUE that I need to fiddle with as well) Opinions, GO!

Winner winner!!! Very good point.

While this is true.. you will hardly be able to drive the car if you're looking for appreciation. And for that reason, I want the Benz. i want to be able to drive it whenever and wherever. This is also the era of Mercedes that I really started to like them across the board...

Surreal, That's one sexy looking wagon you pictured there!

Oh sorry I forgot my Beretta's door handle broke(stupid vertical style handle for anybody who remembers) and it was about $115. Trend or aerodynamic laws are forcing that body shape? https://spaceflightsystems.grc.nasa.gov/education/rocket/shaped.html