Suaviloquent

Now if Mercedes puts that engine into their supposed truck as an AMG version...

Well, the footprint of the vehicle was dictated by the function. But it also looks long because the GT is absurdly low. Like the ratio of length to height is crazy, and I am also reminded of the Ferrari Enzo, another track focused beast... In terms of results at the 24 Hours Daytona. I was not surprised at all at what happened. A brand new vehicle, getting its first real shake down... I think the media hype train really played up the prospects of the car, because of the coincidence of being a 50 year anniversary of their Le mans win. This is what I think conventional mass brands should do for their exotics. More of a commemorative kind of deal, less a permanent fixture. Ferrari and Porshce and Mclaren and Mercedes, BMW, Honda, GM (the mass brands of which to an extent) make a living out of being at the forefront of performance in every aspect.

Hey Ccap... you know what I think of Ford GT (especially the GT-LM) if it didn't have a Ford badge on it? It honestly makes me think of Lotus. Or what could have been something that Lotus would have attempted if things went their way. For example, Lotus also uses a fairly conventional V6 and supercharges it (from a Toyota Camry!). And that is mighty praise. No one has the brand like Lotus of just pure sports car. They're going for the extreme light weight and aero and great power. Not exactly crazy power, but more of the fundamentals of light weight and extreme aerodynamics... I think driving the Ford GT will be a pure experience. I kind of think a long the lines that the Gt might be the 'Miata/S2000/Mr-2' of supercars. Space(age), grace and pace.

True. The S65 (is it still called that?) has something like 700+ ft-lbs of torque. That's a lot. But at some point you get to that point where the acceleration just has to feel effortless (that's how Lincoln will exist!!!). It's more the prestige of having the larger engine to pay more running costs for, not really like anyone hustles either luxo barge. Otherwise I guess the CT6-V or VSport with the 4.2 V8 will lay waste to any sedan in that segment on a track in terms of lap times. But I agree, the S-Class despite being one model year older, I feel is the better luxury flagship package than the BMW. However, I think the interior execution is pretty close, and both use a lot of metal switch gear.

Well, automakers are profiting for the popularity of crossovers, so I think we can all expect midsize sedans and minivans to remain amongst the best values. What I like reg is that you purchased the vehicle for its true purpose. Minivans are the automotive equivalent of a swiss army knife. The possibilities are endless... you can tow a little, you have some decent payload capability whether people or some light but large cargo... I actually have a bit of a soft spot for the Pacifica hybrid. That paint job (that blue is so dashing) and the styling makes it look like a bullet train. And whenever I think of bullet trains, I think of advanced tech, and a transportation means that is so compelling, yet isn't available in North America. It has a 30 mile electric range. And every tech bit revealed so far likens it to the Volt re-imagined as a minivan. Or like what some people wanted the Orlando to be - atleast the concept. Setting all the tech and fancy options aside, it's very difficult these days to find honest utilitarian rigs. at their very core. I hope the Pacifica maintains the same ethos of function, albeit in a very striking form.

Maybe it's because they're stuck under the rules of being politically correct. One, there's a tuner that actually has a history of making basically a M branded car analogue for the BMW buyer segment, but also how it's perhaps perceived as a step even above M. The flagship in a sense gets even more unique treatment. Two, again, under the rules of being politically correct... their SUVs are called "Sports Activity Vehicles." So they're okay with the forgone perceptions of utility as long as they can make SUVs that have truncated roof-lines and more speed juice than is appropriate for a vehicle of that size. I can see the appeal of the Alpina name paired with BMW because it doesn't appear the same as the M brand's almost corporate playbook for making a souped up version. It's different and it perhaps helps make the flagship appeal well tended to.

I agree....BUT WHY?

Actually, what the future competition has realized is that electric vehicles are harder to half-ass... If you half-ass it, you're left with a Golf Cart. Seriously, the Bolt will enjoy a lower center of gravity for having its battery down low. That's why it had decent handling, even for the beta prototype models. Let me make another analogy. In no way are Rolls Royce and Bentleys half-assed. But we know that Rolls Royce existed before Bentley. They both build highly substitutable products. They're not commodity products. But live off of masterful differentiation. Really, all cars compete with one another at some fundamental level. What Tesla has done, is that it has carved a name brand recognition among the likes of which no start-up automaker has been able to do, for a long time. What does that mean? Tesla might become a take-over target by a larger automaker or other interested party. Why? Because their stock even right now is grossly overpriced. That means there's value inside the name brand and the technologies they have going which cannot be captured in the total value of their net assets. A bigger parent could supply Tesla with all the support it needs. Put it another way... Tesla is closer to selling 500,000 cars a year beyond 2020, than say a brand that is equally or even more recognized, Maserati, is to selling 250,000 cars by 2020. Looking at the big picture.... in some way shape or form, Tesla is here to stay, and you will see a Model 3 in customer hands before Porsche even comes out with their Mission E. That's what people forget. The Bolt is nice. But it's also still about 12 months away. The time-table for electric vehicles is still until 2025 really before anyone expects them to have a real presence. And then 2050 becomes the hard cut-off for ICE powered passenger cars in many state jurisdictions. Plenty of time, and plenty of reasons why electric cars make sense. Oh I also learned that Tesla's drive motors only have 3 moving parts. So you can have AWD with two dual motors, with no centre tunnel hump in 6 moving parts. Crazy, and that's what the other automakers are learning. Crazy is what describes just how different and better that electric cars can be.

I wouldn't have made that post if I hadn't been force-fed that video from actually an operations related thing. I had NO idea that any automaker was doing anything similar to what is being hyped by auto journalists about the GM Omega platform on the interwebs. Especially the honeycomb like structures... All I'm saying is see for yourself and then ask if anything what is being hyped is actually a competitive advantage for GM for the long-term, when it's already in many production cars. And then you hear that GM is going to use platforms for much longer, and I'm starting to see why El K said it might have some problems. Except I didn't think it's come from lowly Tesla of all places!!!

So it's a sleeper. Stealth wealth. I like it. As long as there's a thriving market for this kind of thing, I don't think it matters at all who does it. But it is intriguing how the M division shuns the full-size car in favour of the bloated SUVs...

Look, if I wanted a hybrid for real fuel economy gains and a proven system...I'd hands down get the Prius. It's the same hybrid technology for 15 years. I mean, I don't buy into reliability claims, but it's already the 4th generation of their hybrid system. It gets 40% thermal efficiency, the most of any ICE car and honestly the base model is thousands of dollars less than a stripper midsize sedan hybrid. So you get fuel savings on top of fuel savings. Yeah the new Malibu has nice mpg and a good silhouette, styling which if not original, just a follow-up to design trend started by Hyundai of all makes. The front end of the new Malibu just doesn't jive with the rest of the car's clean look, IMO. It's a cheaper car, gets better mileage if driven like a hybrid should be driven, and really what more do Prius owners want? It's finally a daily livable car as proven by the new MotorTrend Test. Mostly it's just that I don't like to really put domestic car company blinders on when evaluating a car from what the auto journalists have to say about it.

So we got to watch how Tesla's are actually made... now this was more of a technical video which I actually can't find on the interwebs. And you know that really hyped up Cadillac Omega platform with all these castings that make 10s of parts into one? Well I saw the same thing happening in the Model S. You have all these exotic looking polygon shapes that are a single piece. And they have this organic looking honeycomb like structure... yup it's there! So like... how do I say it? They've already been doing something just now we think has been pioneered by GM. So I found this video, by Tesla, which in some moments shows off where it actually is in one of the parts of the car. Anyways... up to you folks to see if you're hallucinating when you see what's before you. Got 00:36 mark on the video and you see a clear shot at what I'm talking about. What do I think of this... well you don't win awards, become the upstart company that everyone wants to succeed everywhere by building a $h!ty car. Yeah they're going through a major transition... but that excellence of execution tough. It's there, laid bare to see. Go to the 00:36 second mark and see for yourselves.

Actually the driver was a 25 to like 29 year old, and he had a baby seat in the back as. Well. The car looks kinda long, for a hatchback. And the aside from the surface treatment, the proportions of the car are pretty good. Like I said, many people think it's ugly...I just it's different. It's like the Jeep Cherokee. Styling that is wayyy out there, and even if it's from their hydrogen car. I like the way it looks. It's nothing else on the road, and it's true to the Prius brand identity. Before it was staid, but it looks alright. It helped that it was red, and red really works on it.

Well I done did better than I thought. I thinks.

I actually saw one of the new Prii in person, it was on the campus. I gotta say, I'm totally reversed on my opinion of it. It's so ugly and so different that it actually looks really frickin' good. No, really, I actually like the way it looks. It looks like nothing else, and it projects exactly the kind of person you are. I love it. Seriously. (Expecting instant permanent colossal reduction in Present Value of Future Upvotes)

Anyways, putting Tesla in the companies of Bentley and Audis and Porsches... does it increase the brand image of Tesla or does it bring down that of others? Either way, pretty shocking, how a company, with its first in-house developed car can be catapulted with the likes of the most well recognized and prestigious automakers in the world.

Everyone says Tesla competitor. Really, the EV is burgeoning into its entire class of vehicle with many segments. The same as gas cars. Does a Bentley compete with a Chevy because they both run on gas? Because that's what's being insinuated here. At the fringes EVs compete with ICE as well. So what's the point being made? For christs sake, Tesla lives not really because of just how excellent its product is - it's because the company is so well differentiated. They don't just build a conventional car on top of a battery. They build cars so differently. There's not even a push button start, for example. The starts as soon as you sit down. See? I just laugh how everyone says EV = Tesla competitor. Not always. Not everywhere Tesla doesn't just build EVs. Factually, they build some of the best cars in the world. Worthy of their price. They already have autonomous ready cars - which they had to curb the features of because of the slow regulations. It's all about market strategy. A person who has a Bentley in their garage also has a Tesla Model S and Model X already..... see? They're complementary products at that point NOT competing goods.

There's quantitative aspects to performance and qualitative. As for the comparison, it was probably done before the Camaro was available. As for the victory - it only won by two points. Which mean's it didn't win and it tied. Which in of itself is still pretty rad. You can get a Mustang which can come close to Corvette performance, but with the soul of something a little more. About even. Now the price is something else... but people are paying that amount. Or even more. Which says something about the allure of the car... I'd get a GT350. It's production numbers are super low compared to a Corvette Z51 even. It's a special car. And no, it's not the engine. No the entire package. It's special, the whole thing. And so is the Z51. But they are different in their flavours.

You know, I never expected for the GT350 to even be close to a Corvette Z51 in anything, and they didn't even have an R model. The car has a soul 'na mean? And I would agree, if a car is thrilling to drive, then the numbers get lost to the surge of adrenaline. Remember, sometimes the fastest way isn't always in a straight line.

There's no point in Tesla having TV commercials. On the contrary, watch some of their recent YouTube videos, and they're epic videos to be honest.

Your son gets the best vehicle possible at the hands of your benevolence. I wouldn't worry about image. But then again I don't have a son.... I figure I'm your son's age, and your son could do worse, like the glorified poverty wheels I use... I figured it out... Dodge Magnum!!!!

Like, why is it that it's so much harder for cars to be beautiful these days? I mean, these recent trend of compact wagoniods on stilts look ugly. HR-V, Bolt, Fiat 500X... all of them just are basic function over form, but in trying to deliver form, like the 500X they have less space than a bloody compact hatch of a lower class...

What's worse though? Seems like to me your vehicle of choice is already for low yearly miles and utility usage. When it comes to utility, who the hell cares about image? If I had, I just had to have the capability to do hardware/construction materials store runs and buy tons of materials, tools and contraptions, and I wanted it all done in a enclosed vehicle, I would have to by default get a minivan - given by what I think you do a lot of.... Unless you want a microvan. Then there's the soon to be defunct Mazda 5, which of course is not domestic. Ford Transit Connect, but absurd miles.

Nope, finance. So all kinds of timey-wimey, mumbo jumbo gumbo, Durango Tango Mango Fango Lango... err.. math calculations. I $h! not, I don't know how to do the questions even though I got most of my answers right the first time.

So Mopar Minivan off the table? What about a Ford Freestar? Or Freestyle or Taurus X? Someone with no money down and an amortization period for a loan into 48+ months range with negative credit and no income and maxed out lines of credit, defaulted 3rd mortgage.... yeah that's what the 200,000 miles plus vehicles are for.