FUTURE_OF_GM

It's important?!?! LOL. Well, it's IMPORTANT that GM maintain 20% of the market and remain the worlds largest automaker via it's portfolio of brands that cover the entire market. It's IMPORTANT that GM not downsize for the sake of our economy and for the sake of middle class workers everywhere. Should I go on?

Shoot, I wouldn't even wish for that... If only GM would buy me a plane ticket to Detroit, or pay for my gas up there and then actually LISTEN to what I want to tell them. I'll volunteer as a motivational speaker for the company I might not be a positive person, but I think we all know that I can light a fire under anyones ass if there's an impending battle. LOL.

MY POINT EXACTLY! Having multiple division with TONS OF EQUITY, both positive and negative is probably one of the biggest advantages GM has going forward in an increasingly schizophrenic market (Both from a sales and marketing standpoint) There are too many factors that can influence this market for homogeny across the globe to work and be successful for long periods of time. The 90's were a fluke and the automakers will learn the hard way that selling the same thing everywhere won't cut it. Unless 1 of 3 things happens. 1) We see a massive global economic slowdown that happens for a very long time (In which case most of the automakers wouldn't survive anyway. 2) The green movement saps the REST of our individual freedoms in the automarket "for the greater good" or 3) Electric vehicles are so expensive or easy to produce that the field is completely homogenous and our culture accepts it. And that would be the point in the first place. Wall Street analysts are guilty of the same short-sighted rhetoric as the automakers HAVE been for years. It's all about the "here and now" in america. We want profit and we want it NOW! Yet, in order to get that profit now, we're happy to screw ourselves down the road. Look at the shape this country as a whole is currently in and then think about WHY it is in this condition. We wanted our McMansions and we wanted them NOW, not when we were able to actually afford them... We wanted growth economics and we wanted results NOW, now when the actual market could support the results. GM needs to think long and hard about what it should do with it's remaining divisions. Oldsmobile has been squandered and Hummer will certainly BE squandered. Do we really need to lose anymore equity? Was selling GMAC, Allison Transmission, EMD, Hughes or GM Defense a good idea in retrospect? We all know the answer.

This is especially true given the 'fragmenting markets' we've been reading about from the automotive media for the last 10 years. AND the increasing diversity in america and to a lesser extent across the world. GM could SERIOUSLY leverage it's vast portfolio of divisions to cater to the consumer like no other automaker does. But it seems that management would rather squander that opportunity in a Henry Ford-like "black model T for everyone" approach. You can't sell the EXACT same car across the globe and be wildly successful... Even the 'king of homogeny' japanese companies know that.

+1 What really needs to happen is GM needs to tell the union and the dealers to eff off. GM needs to shed dealers anyway, so there's no time like the present IMO. GM could run very efficiently at 20% market share... Hell, the plan unveiled in 2005 had a TARGET of 20% market share. But they refuse to focus the brands. And BTW, this whole shrinking argument is part of the problem as well IMO. It's almost like GM has accepted defeat and accepted that they're basically dying. Where are the innovators? Where are the movers and shakers that pick the corporation up off of the mat? Where are the inventive marketing people that make a splash in the eyes of the public? (AHEM... *FOG smiles*) GM needs to develop a plan for growth instead of accepting defeat IMO. And I understand that there must be consolidation first, but make no mistake that GM CAN still be a competitive GROWTH enterprise if it gets it's house in order.

I think you've touched on the problem in it's entirity. GM needs to find out how to BUILD it's brands into something instead of trying to sustain them at their current level. If GM's only goal is to sustain it's current trends, then it's a fight that isn't worth fighting in the first place, because it'll be a slow suicide. We don't need to be talking about sustaining dying brands, we need to be talking about growing/rebirthing dying brands. And I know everyone is going to throw rocks at me because GM is basically bankrupt. But it isn't about money, it's about a culture of DEFEAT or a mindset that says "this is as good as it's ever going to be" It's something that has been programmed into most Detroit employees/fans for 20 years now. So, instead of reaching for the sky, the industry seems to try to 'hang on to what it has for dear life'

I've become somewhat of a YouTube addict recently, so I thought I would create a thread (Much like the "What Are You Listening To" thread) where we could post cool and random stuff from YouTube. Here are a few of my favs. (Most of these will be heavy metal related because that's what kick I'm on right now) But I'd like to see a variety of cool things. The 1930 metal eating bird is kind of what inspired the topic. WARNING: virtually all of the metal vids contain profane language, so be prepared. MOSH PITS: 1) This is DevilDriver, one of my favorite bands, at the Download festival in 2007. What's significant is the size of the "circle pit" (Mosh pit where everyone runs in a circle as opposed to bouncing off of each other... A lot of metal bands have been championing this concept because it is safer than traditional mosh pits) This is the biggest one I've ever seen, apparently it's about a football field in length and width. 2) This is Lamb of God, another one of my favorite bands, with their patented "Wall of Death" pit. This is freakin' insane. I've been to a lot of metal shows and Lamb of God is the only pit I've ever been injured in. 3) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95W84l7C4Dg...feature=related Emo kid gets leveled in a Hatebreed (pretty good band) mosh pit. If any of you don't know it, metal kids (such as myself) generally dislike emo kids because they give us a bad name. Everyone thinks Emo is metal music when the reality of the situation is that the two are polar opposites. He was asking for it, I guess. 4) Mosh Pit breaks out into a fight. The fighters get called out by the lead singer. I'm not sure where this was or who it is, but it's an example of when things get too heated. GUITAR CAM: 5) Guitar cam for number seven from Slipknot (Mic Thomson) during an early performance of "People = Sh*t" This is awesome! SPEED METAL: I hope I can play this fast someday! 6) Slayer playing "Raining Blood" live at Download 2007. This is one of my perennial favs because of the sheer speed. 7) Speaking of speed. This is Megadeth at Download 2007 playing a medley of "Holy Wars... The Punishment Due" and "The Mechanix". (Dave's version of "The Four Horsemen") Classic Thrash at it's best! 8] More speed... MetallicA performing "Whiplash" last year. I really love this song and unfortunately I've never seen it live. 9) Speed... +1. Backstage with MetallicA for a little fun, then a live version of "Damage Inc." from earlier this year. You can never go wrong with MetallicA. OTHER STUFF: 10) Flaming shots 101.. Bad example #2 always cracks me up, LOL. Poor guy was just sitting there and his friend lit him ablaze. 11) An extremely funny condom commercial (It's not riske at all) 12) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2mbeSAmUP4 And of course, My all time favorite YouTube video. Drumroll please.... "Burger & Fires"

(Special thanks to Sin City for the picture )

That grosses me out too... I would never talk on my phone when I'm predisposed. Heck, I'd probably get stage fright anyway if I were talking to someone. There is just some things that a man (or woman) should do alone. LOL.

Which further qualifies my opinion of F*CK HIM and anyone that disagrees with me. And besides, it doesn't matter if it is opinion. You know as well as I do that it will be taken as fact by a large majority of our ignorant population. You've seen it already! Stop being so naive as to believe that the public will give these companies the benefit of the doubt. Okay, 1) Don't EVER pretend like you know me... Your pompous posts in this thread alone are enough for me not to get to know you on a level personal enough for you to know anything about why and how I view these companies. 2) Don't make the mistake of *thinking* you understand how my system of values works in relation to these companies or anything else in this world. To you, I am a screen name that is free to type whatever the hell I want. For all you know, everything I write on here could be lies. 3) I HATE Porsche because it is the MOST OVERRATED automotive company on the planet. RESEARCH IT, I've said that MANY times on this board. It has absolutley NOTHING to do with profit, or the lack of profit made by the company. Why would any of that even matter to me anyway if, as you put it, I have "no affiliation to either". Given my profession and my education, when it comes to 'feelings and perception' me thinks you're out of your league if you're trying to tell me anything. ESPECIALLY anything about myself. Yep... Just like it "moved on" from corporate jets in the face of 3.5 million people losing their jobs. My issue doesn't lie with your differing opinion. My issue lies with how you addressed me about a reply that is none of your damn business in the first place. If you don't like my opinions, then don't read them. But apparently A LOT of people do like them because I seem to have a 'fan club' that tries to shoot me down all of the time. And that in itself is the SUCCESS I wanted in the first place.

I can't believe this slipped under the radar... http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/08/06/peta-mclean.html

And BTW, the only reason the industry is at the brink of ruin is because GM and Ford are SO SUCCESSFUL that the whole industry hinges on them. Too bad I wasn't there, I would've said what I said to his face and seriously contemplated throwing punches. To me, this (the state of these companies) is the line and you're either with us, or I don't have the time of day for you. This "scenario" is as much Detroit's fault as the SUV craze of the 90s, the lack of small car sales, infant death syndrome and polar bears dieing of starvation. So don't even TRY to hang yet another noose around these companies necks.

Hence my original response; it's nothing more than a smear campaign. Because tons of jobs depend on it and he is doing nothing by contributing to the mess that will inevitably fire up tomorrow anyway. This quote will be bounced back and forth in the media machine until it break in half. That will 1) Create more ill will toward the domestics and 2) Get Porsches name out there. The better question is; why are you not offended? If someone blatantly spreads malicious lies about something that you whole heartedly believe in, would you not go on the offensive and try to rally the troops (which is what the spirited reply was meant to do) It's obvious that you're not as passionate about GM or the domestics as 95% of the other posters here. This has to stop. If someone wants to have valid criticisms about Detroit, then it needs to be facts instead of a soundbite and that's what pisses me off the most. How is he defending the little guy again?!?! By 'piling on' to the idea that we should let 3.5 million of the little guys jobs go away. Oh, and then I guess Porsche will swoop in and employ tons of people right. You're delirious if you think his remarks were meant as anything other than a piss-poor dig at competition that does a better job at what his companies wish to accomplish. EDIT: for content

Bu...But... This is the BLOSSOMING INDUSTRY that will move in and replace GM, Ford and Chrysler when we allow those greedy, corrupt, outdated organizations to fail. ?!?! I hate to be this way, but part of me hopes that Detroit doesn't get the bridge loans, just for the sheer fact of vengeance.

Just remember to cut fresh vegetables with the same knife you use for raw chicken. And remember, the burger is done when it looks done, real men don't use thermometers. Oh, and, mold = penicillin, so the more, the better... Just give it a good stir to make sure the mold is fully integrated with the rest of the ingredients.

Maybe all of those people can get jobs in a gun factory, because we're going to need lots of those if things keep going the way they're going. (We can fight the impending invasion on foot, old skool brit style... You know, since we won't have an auto industry... Or very little other manufacturing)

Flowmaster 40s on a 5.0 Mustang = TEH S3X!!!!!

F*CK HIM... Porsche is overrated and just looking for PR, so they're jumping on the bandwagon. I'd like to know exactly how he thinks this is all GM and Fords fault. If anything, the Japanese are AS MUCH to blame. Of course, just like all of the 'know-nothing' talking heads he spits out his opinion for a soundbite, then offers no logic to back his worthless ass up. The root of the problem is OBVIOUSLY the american government and Wall Strett for their lack of oversight and restraint.

But remember!!! Just like the global economy cannot fail, the global economy will prevent major conflicts! And everyone will live in a field of daisies and not have to work. Oh, wait, nevermind....

Again, I'm not talking about present tense. I'm talking "what if". Mini moves a lot of volume, but it's appeal is a niche and BMW must walk a fine line in order not to damage the image of the division (Which some, especially owners, believe that they are already doing)

Well, that settles it then... (For now)

ROTFLMMFAO!!!! GXT must be a member of the media. (Draw your own conclusions from that)

As I've said on this website before... My loyalty lies with GM, my community and those that serve this country. Not this country as it stands. I choose not to fly the flag and I choose not to vote. I won't go as far as disrespecting the flag (yet) for fear of offending those that sacrificed for it. If GM is saved, then so to will be the workers that depend on them. I refuse to support a society that promotes greed, and self worth above honesty and integrity. Just as I refuse to support a society that shepards the destruction of it's soul for the benefit of other societies that do not share the same goal of 'prosperity for all'.

More wasted money I agree! I had forgotten how awesome they look. Good to hear. The market and NO PROMOTION (!!!) Hell, I even forget about the G8 and I'm a Pontiac enthusiast... Maybe it has to do with the lame name or lack of advertising in general. As ugly as it is, I'm sure it'll sell WAY better than the Cruze... It isn't "mercan" after all (Or, people aren't smart enough to realize it is, at least) Sounds like you had the same reaction I did.. The refresh is nice, but it's not exceptional. Saw the concept in Charlotte complete with giant "TOYOTA PROTOTYPE VEHICLE" letters on the windows. I walked right past it without even stopping, as did most of the crowd.

I STILL think it's a really sweet car... At least Lincoln is attempting to have a cohesive line up of fresh cars with even fresher marketing (That actually SEEMS to be working) That's more than I can say about Cadillac or Buick.