It blows my mind they only gave this like two years before announcing it was canceled. 

5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

It blows my mind they only gave this like two years before announcing it was canceled. 

Mary Barra's GM.... cut your way to prosperity. 

Just read this on the Cadillac Society site. GM bean counters are just making more bad decisions canceling a model that they spent hundreds of millions of dollars on R&D and never really even marketed it, Volt is another car that comes to mind. They could have kept the XT6 on the CT6's Omega platform to help with costs and just build CT6 in limited quantities like MB does with the S and BMW does with the 7, they've never really been big volume cars in the fullsize luxury sedan class.

I'm going to go drive a CT6-V Blackwing that my go to Caddy dealer has. They had 6 sold 3, 2 black, 1 white left on this shipment.

10 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Mary Barra's GM.... cut your way to prosperity. 

 

Mary's just the messenger for the top brass bean counters, you know that.

I read about Holden this morning and now this. What is wrong with GM? They cannot get anything right, out on time , or be competitive. How did so a mighty storied company be cut down to what it is now? Killing those brands solved no problems. It exposed the many issues of GM. It left many countries globally too.  Buick is now an suv/crossover brand in the United States.  Cadillac after ten years is still not fixed. I guess the bigger issue is how do you fix all of GM?  What is wrong with GM? It is getting harder for enthusiasts to support GM. It is sad when you say "they make nothing for me".  Sad truth is... they do not.  I guess the enthusiast are not the the majority and we are the minority. Sad indeed....

8 minutes ago, NINETY EIGHT REGENCY said:

  What is wrong with GM? It is getting harder for enthusiasts to support GM. It is sad when you say "they make nothing for me".  Sad truth is... they do not.  I guess the enthusiast are not the the majority and we are the minority. Sad indeed....

Very true...the masses that lease generic CUVs are the core of the market.    GM is focusing on vanilla lease appliances, trying to be like Toyota.    Vehicles so boring that most will not be remembered in 5-10 years. 

And they are wasting names that had some potential like Trailblazer and Blazer on generic CUVs;  what if the Ford Bronco is successful?  GM has nothing like that and is unlikely to do anything like that because it doesn't fit the transverse engine generic mediocre configuration... 

I suspect the CT4 and CT5 are doomed also...

38 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Mary Barra's GM.... cut your way to prosperity. 

 

I mean, I understand it but, if you're trying to rebuild a luxurious reputation, you are going to have to take losses until the brand catches fire and gains(regains) its reputation. 

This just doesn't seem like the direction Cadillac should be heading. It's just a feeling they're almost "giving up" and letting the Germans stay up top. 

They seemed like they were in a really good spot with the most recent generation and these new generations should have built upon those instead of feeling like they're going backward. 

4 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

 

This just doesn't seem like the direction Cadillac should be heading. It's just a feeling they're almost "giving up" and letting the Germans stay up top. 

 

I think they are settling for competing at the tier 2 level, against Lexus's FWD based generic CUVs rather than competing at the top level...since transverse engine/FWD mediocrity fits their model.   Basically rebodied mediocre appliances also seen at Chevy, Buick/GMC dealers with different chrome trim and styling, but the same soulless gray plastic mediocrity at the core.  Forgettable appliances. 

RIP CT6, killed by GM's board room bean counters before your time really was up and not able to show what you could bring to the world globally.

RIP CT6

This truly keeps me in SUVs as the 4 & 5 are just too small.

3 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I think they are settling for competing at the tier 2 level, against Lexus's FWD based generic CUVs rather than competing at the top level...since transverse engine/FWD mediocrity fits their model. 

In some ways, it's like the 80s all over again when GM went all in for mediocrity w/ FWD generics at every brand.

This approach at GM is what could make my next auto purchase a non-gm product.

4 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I think they are settling for competing at the tier 2 level, against Lexus's FWD based generic CUVs rather than competing at the top level...since transverse engine/FWD mediocrity fits their model.   Basically rebodied mediocre appliances also seen at Chevy, Buick/GMC dealers with different chrome trim and styling, but the same soulless gray plastic mediocrity at the core.  Forgettable appliances. 

 

It's just a shame because only a couple years ago everybody's view of Cadillac was that they're 7 tiers above Lincoln and now they're struggling to compete with anything Lincoln has come out with recently. Granted, some of that is Lincoln escalating their portfolio but, a lot of it is Cadillac laying down. 

5 minutes ago, dfelt said:

RIP CT6, killed by GM's board room bean counters before your time really was up and not able to show what you could bring to the world globally.

It's still sold outside of the US. 

Just now, ccap41 said:

It's just a shame because only a couple years ago everybody's view of Cadillac was that they're 7 tiers above Lincoln and now they're struggling to compete with anything Lincoln has come out with recently. Granted, some of that is Lincoln escalating their portfolio but, a lot of it is Cadillac laying down. 

I have some serious doubts that the new Escalade is going to go to the next level like the Navigator did in the most recent iteration. I just no longer have the confidence that GM will do the right thing.  Dropping the Blackwing from the option sheet on the Escalade is what convinced me of that. 

2 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

It's just a shame because only a couple years ago everybody's view of Cadillac was that they're 7 tiers above Lincoln and now they're struggling to compete with anything Lincoln has come out with recently. Granted, some of that is Lincoln escalating their portfolio but, a lot of it is Cadillac laying down. 

It's still sold outside of the US. 

China only, so that to me is not global, GM seems to be repeating mistakes they made here in the US. Sad, very sad!

6 minutes ago, dfelt said:

China only, so that to me is not global, GM seems to be repeating mistakes they made here in the US. Sad, very sad!

Two countries is "global" to you? 

11 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I think they are settling for competing at the tier 2 level, against Lexus's FWD based generic CUVs rather than competing at the top level...since transverse engine/FWD mediocrity fits their model.   Basically rebodied mediocre appliances also seen at Chevy, Buick/GMC dealers with different chrome trim and styling, but the same soulless gray plastic mediocrity at the core.  Forgettable appliances. 

 

No, they just released the RWD/AWD CT4 and CT5. GM top brass never even gave it a chance being it just came out in 2016 and it didn't sell well because they never properly marketed it...and again it just came out in 2016. They're just making room for the BEV3 platform at D-HAM. Sucks...

6 minutes ago, USA-1 said:

No, they just released the RWD/AWD CT4 and CT5. GM top brass never even gave it a chance being it just came out in 2016 and it didn't sell well because they never properly marketed it...and again it just came out in 2016. They're just making room for the BEV3 platform at D-HAM. Sucks...

Oh I know about the CT4 and CT5....never see them, though...part of the problem with the CT4 and CT5 as far competing against others in the compact and midsize luxury market (M-B, BMW) is the lack of body styles...no coupes, no convertibles...albeit those are a small niche, but for luxury cars, why not?   Instead Cadillac keeps pushing the generic XT* crossovers....volume lease appliances.

Just now, Robert Hall said:

Oh I know about the CT4 and CT5....never see them, I suspect they will fail...

They're not really out yet. Just about hitting dealers now. 

Though I suspect you are right if only because sedan sales are tanking so hard lately. 

13 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I have some serious doubts that the new Escalade is going to go to the next level like the Navigator did in the most recent iteration. I just no longer have the confidence that GM will do the right thing.  Dropping the Blackwing from the option sheet on the Escalade is what convinced me of that. 

I'll ask my Cadillac guru at the dealership to see what he's hearing from Corp.

Navigator is TTV6 only so Ford isn't making the best decisions either.

2 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

They're not really out yet. Just about hitting dealers now. 

Though I suspect you are right if only because sedan sales are tanking so hard lately. 

I just can't see them succeeding against the established brands...so many models in the compact and midsize luxury segment...there is nothing special about them. 

3 minutes ago, USA-1 said:

I'll ask my Cadillac guru at the dealership to see what he's hearing from Corp.

Navigator is TTV6 only so Ford isn't making the best decisions either.

The navigator's engine is perfectly fine. It has gobs of torque and it pulls hard. 

and I'm not one who particularly likes the Ecoboost engines. 

14 minutes ago, dfelt said:

China only, so that to me is not global, GM seems to be repeating mistakes they made here in the US. Sad, very sad!

They build the CT6 in the Chinese factory and ship them throughout EMEIA. Sedans just aren't selling here, sales are down for all manf's in all classes of sedans. Still think CT6 could be offered in limited quantities here. It comes down to plant space and BEV3 is the big push now.  

1 minute ago, Drew Dowdell said:

The navigator's engine is perfectly fine. It has gobs of torque and it pulls hard. 

 

and I'm not one who particularly likes the Ecoboost engines. 

And the Navigator has 500 ft/lbs of torque while the Escalade has 460.   Sounds like it's more than adequate.

6 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

They're not really out yet. Just about hitting dealers now. 

Though I suspect you are right if only because sedan sales are tanking so hard lately. 

I hope they can make it and they're priced right compared to the ATS and CTS. They actually did a great job at making room in the CT4 compared to the ATS too. I can still comfortably fit in the new CT4 at 6'3", but the ATS was cramped in front and back.

510lb-ft @ 3500rpm vs 460lb-ft @ 4100rpm 

I don't think there's any issue there. 

3 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

And the Navigator has 500 ft/lbs of torque while the Escalade has 460.   Sounds like it's more than adequate.

It's still a small V6 however you slice it. More moving parts to fail hauling that much weight around and the EB is still a fail. Have a buddy who is a mechanic for Ford, good for him, but not for Ford. Love live the small block V8 if only at GM and FCA/PSA. 

4 minutes ago, USA-1 said:

It's still a small V6 however you slice it. More moving parts to fail hauling that much weight around and the EB is still a fail. Have a buddy who is a mechanic for Ford, good for him, but not for Ford. Love live the small block V8 if only at GM and FCA/PSA. 

99% of the buyers probably won't care or notice if it's a V6 or V8, and as long at lasts 3 years for a lease that will be fine for most consumers....yes, enthusiasts might prefer a V8, but most of the market aren't enthusiasts...