Want to Hear Somebody Take a Dump on the CT6?

[ccap41]

I was thoroughly surprised when I came to read this and read the results and I think it is the best looking of the group and it sounds like it(and all new Cadillacs) have been nailing the driving portion of the car. But a major bummer on the interior and yet again CUE. How long will it take them to sort that out???  It looks like Cadillac was going for "value for size". rather than just being the best and that's disappointing.

CT6 vs E300 vs S90

Here's the intro but you can read the full comparison at the above link.

" Large luxury cars used to be powered by throaty, grumbling eight-cylinder engines. Cadillac had its old Northstar V-8s, Mercedes-Benz a 4.3-liter, and Volvo a 4.4-liter V-8 in the mid-priced offerings. But downsizing is all the rage these days, and all three of those manufacturers’ new mid-priced offerings are powered by diminutive 2.0-liter four-cylinder engines. Our testing suggests that you might not miss those extra cylinders.

The segment stalwarts are the ones leading the downsizing charge. The 2017 Mercedes-Benz E300 Sport is the German automaker’s bread-and-butter mid-priced midsize sedan. Starting at around $50K and selling well-equipped for nearly 70 large, the E-Class targets the heart of the luxury sedan market with semi-autonomous driving technology, baby S-Class luxury, and a four-cylinder engine cranking out a respectable 241 hp.

Cadillac has historically been synonymous with big engines. It sold high-tech V-16 engines through the middle of the Great Depression and has been known for its high-power V-8s since the ’60s. Yet its stunning don’t-call-it-a-flagship 2017 Cadillac CT6 2.0T Luxury offers an engine with a quarter of the cylinders of its V-16 cars, a tried-and-true 2.0-liter turbocharged I-4 making a stout 265 hp.

You can always count on the Swedes to be just a little bit different. Although the 2017 Volvo S90 T6 AWD Inscription makes just as much of a visual impression as the Caddy and Merc, it differs ever so slightly under the hood. Yes, it too has a 2.0-liter four-banger, but the S90’s is twin-charged, featuring both a supercharger and a turbocharger. The end result is a potent little engine making 316 hp. That’s V-8 territory.

So are these small-engined thoroughbreds engaging to drive? Can they deliver flagship luxury?"

[David]

I read this and while I love the CT6, some things still clearly need to be addressed. Yet with that said, I think they also clearly missed issues with the others too.

Over all the biggest issue is the CUE and I do wonder when Cadillac will realize that they need to make a drastic change here on that system. I personally have not had the issue with CUE that many here and in other web sites covering the auto industry have had. With that said, I will say that the touch pad sucks, but then they all do and especially for me as it seems they only work about 10% of the time especially on laptops. The day they stop incorporating the little joystick between the GHB keys I will be forced to always have a mouse.

[smk4565]

I miss the days when every luxury car had a V8, but I guess on the flip side a new E43 with a 3 liter engine is faster than the 5.5 liter V8 in my car and probably gets a least 5 mpg more, so progress is good too. 

I am surprised the Volvo beat the E300, but I do agree with MT about the all black interiors on Mercedes and preferring the light and airy Volvo interior.   Mercedes needs the E43 on sale ASAP, that is the fix because the performance you get will make it worth the money.  At $70k for the 4-cylinder model that car should have every luxury goodie, that is $18k in options.  $70k for 4 cylinders is a big ask, the GLE43 is priced at $67k, if the E43 is the same, I think they have what they need.

Not surprised by what they said about the CT6.

Edited November 24, 2016 by smk4565

[cp-the-nerd]

This article was garbage from the onset. The premise is ridiculous: large luxury cars with 2.0L engines...but we're going to blend sizes to get the CT6 in here, at its expense.

Let's break down the inconsistency:

The CT6 2.0T is restricted to lower trims and RWD, with higher comparable pricing because it's Cadillac's full size car. For the price as-tested of the Luxury 2.0T, they could have bought a Premium Luxury trim 3.6L AWD with comfort pkg and driver assist pkg. Way, way more car for the money.

Meanwhile, the Volvo gets the benefit of checking off the T6 trim with AWD as well as their more powerful twin-charged 2.0L, rather than the 2.0T base engine with 250 horsepower. You know, because reasons.

Then there's Christian Seabaugh's writing, which is frankly awful in this comparison test:

Somehow, the E300 fails to impress with its driver-assist technology and does the worst of the three cars in ride and powertrain--in a large luxury car comparison, mind you--and still beats out the Cadillac because of a long list of largely subjective complaints.

There's such a lack of tangible, consistent criteria in this test. It was practically tailored to make the Volvo come out on top.

[cp-the-nerd]

On 11/23/2016 at 3:37 PM, dfelt said:

Over all the biggest issue is the CUE and I do wonder when Cadillac will realize that they need to make a drastic change here on that system.

For better or worse, the CUE set up in the CT6 and XT5 is drastically revised compared to the ATS/CTS. It's not for a lack of self-awareness, they're at least trying.

[smk4565]

39 minutes ago, cp-the-nerd said:

This article was garbage from the onset. The premise is ridiculous: large luxury cars with 2.0L engines...but we're going to blend sizes to get the CT6 in here, at its expense.

Let's break down the inconsistency:

The CT6 2.0T is restricted to lower trims and RWD, with higher comparable pricing because it's Cadillac's full size car. For the price as-tested of the Luxury 2.0T, they could have bought a Premium Luxury trim 3.6L AWD with comfort pkg and driver assist pkg. Way, way more car for the money.

Meanwhile, the Volvo gets the benefit of checking off the T6 trim with AWD as well as their more powerful twin-charged 2.0L, rather than the 2.0T base engine with 250 horsepower. You know, because reasons.

Then there's Christian Seabaugh's writing, which is frankly awful in this comparison test:

Somehow, the E300 fails to impress with its driver-assist technology and does the worst of the three cars in ride and powertrain--in a large luxury car comparison, mind you--and still beats out the Cadillac because of a long list of largely subjective complaints.

There's such a lack of tangible, consistent criteria in this test. It was practically tailored to make the Volvo come out on top.

I would mostly agree, it is a test that favors the Volvo based on criteria.  It is almost like saying we are out to find the best 4 cylinder all wheel drive sedan for about $30k and having a loaded up subaru vs whatever else all wheel drive you can get like a bare bones Audi A3 and saying the Subaru is best.

Most that want a large or even mid-size luxury car will want at least 6 cylinders, the E300 is really for the old ladies and old men that are in no hurry to get anywhere, and 6.5 seconds 0-60 is adequate, but a V6 E-class will mop the floor with a Volvo.

I don't think the CT6 was unfairly treated due to price though, it was the middle priced car of the test.  The CT6 is a flawed, perhaps compromised car though.  MT said they like the 2.0T more than the V6, I think the 3.6 should be dropped from all Cadillac sedans, put a turbo V6 in its place.

Edited November 26, 2016 by smk4565

[cp-the-nerd]

29 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

I would mostly agree, it is a test that favors the Volvo based on criteria.  It is almost like saying we are out to find the best 4 cylinder all wheel drive sedan for about $30k and having a loaded up subaru vs whatever else all wheel drive you can get like a bare bones Audi A3 and saying the Subaru is best.

Most that want a large or even mid-size luxury car will want at least 6 cylinders, the E300 is really for the old ladies and old men that are in no hurry to get anywhere, and 6.5 seconds 0-60 is adequate, but a V6 E-class will mop the floor with a Volvo.

I don't think the CT6 was unfairly treated due to price though, it was the middle priced car of the test.  The CT6 is a flawed, perhaps compromised car though.  MT said they like the 2.0T more than the V6, I think the 3.6 should be dropped from all Cadillac sedans, put a turbo V6 in its place.

I understand that the CT6 under-delivers in some areas. I can accept that, and I can accept a loss. It was this badly written comparison and sh!tty criteria that burned my balls. Your Subaru vs Audi analogy was solid. I would only add that Christian Seabaugh's take on the CT6 was blatantly negative in a subjective way that wasn't seen in the other cars.

My complaint with the pricing is that it's nearly impossible to option a CT6 RWD 2.0T like that. Like I said, you can buy a higher trim level, V6, AWD, plus option packages for that money.

As for the 3.6L, the latest LGX has been really well received across the board. Motor Trend hasn't even reviewed the CT6, ATS, or CTS with that powertrain, so when the article stated their preference for the 2.0T, they were referring to the Car of the Year test where their CT6 3.0T had strange, wonky power delivery (which hasn't been reported anywhere else).

Edited November 26, 2016 by cp-the-nerd

[surreal1272]

After reading that comparo, I think we can put this "MT is nothing more than a GM propaganda arm" argument to rest. They were ridiculously harsh on the CT6 in a test that was set up for Volvo all the way.

[David]

10 hours ago, cp-the-nerd said:

For better or worse, the CUE set up in the CT6 and XT5 is drastically revised compared to the ATS/CTS. It's not for a lack of self-awareness, they're at least trying.

Yes it is much better in both the XT5 and CT6, but I still think this is one area that Cadillac could truly dump the system and start with a clean sheet design incorporating Apple and Android play and have a superior system to everyone else.

[smk4565]

Well this seems to be a bit embarrassing:

Volvo S90 YTD sales: 959

E-class YTD sales: 41,403

And E-class sales are down this year since the new model just went on sale late summer, and the V6 isn't even on sale yet, but will be soon, as well as this, which is faster than an M5 or CTS-V.

[Suaviloquent]

The complaints levied against the CT6 are all really the interior. 

For it's price it's a bargain, but against it's class its appears as a different kind of car for a different kind of mindset. I see the CT6 as Cadillac trying to recreate itself in a former BMW's image, yet it goes away from traditional Cadillac strong points too far. For a big Cadillac, it isn't a Cadillac throughout. The interior fails to deliver what the, svelte yet imposing exterior promises. 

And Cadillac being a bargain is in itself just the wrong approach. The Escalade can get pricey, but costs less than it's competition. But it has such an immense cost advantage because it shares yet masks so much that is borrowed from it's siblings.

They spent too much effort on engineering a great car to drive, when most drivers of that size a car are not enthusiasts, but are mere badge braggers. Then the interior, while nice for the price, you know fully loaded, it just gets lost in a sea of Designo Mercedes, or Inscription trim S90.

And I think the price comparison is the right thing, but why the CT6? Isn't there a CTS somewhere they could have borrowed for this test. 

The real secret is that this test was a convenient coincidence - all 3 cars were in the COTY test. And tossing in the G90 would have made it an even better bargain than the S90.

 

 

[David]

15 hours ago, smk4565 said:

This is just another butt ugly jelly bean auto that I cannot tell is this an A, C, D, E or S? They all look the same and nothing exciting to stir the passion of driving other than the badge.

[A Horse With No Name]

5 hours ago, dfelt said:

This is just another butt ugly jelly bean auto that I cannot sell is this an A, C, D, E or S? They all look the same and nothing exciting to stir the passion of driving other than the badge.

I still like it better than the Infinity, Lincoln, Volvo, Buick, And VW CC. 

[David]

5 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I still like it better than the Infinity, Lincoln, Volvo, Buick, And VW CC. 

Glad you like it, for me there is nothing special about owning these over priced badge jobs.

You want passion from MB, here are some auto's that stir the passion of wanting to drive them.

[A Horse With No Name]

C class is in many ways a decent luxury car...

[ccap41]

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 10:28 PM, Suaviloquent said:

And Cadillac being a bargain is in itself just the wrong approach

I couldn't agree more. At the level of cars that approach 100k "bargain" shouldn't be a thing. It should just be great, period.

 

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 10:28 PM, Suaviloquent said:

They spent too much effort on engineering a great car to drive, when most drivers of that size a car are not enthusiasts, but are mere badge braggers. Then the interior, while nice for the price, you know fully loaded, it just gets lost in a sea of Designo Mercedes, or Inscription trim S90.

Also, completely agree. It sounds like the driver's car of the luxury barge world but... nobody will ever give a crap about that when looking to purchase. It would have made more sense to go all-in on the interior and leave a less nailed down ride because frankly, it means waaaaay more in cars this size.

15 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

C class is in many ways a decent luxury car...

It's probably the most "luxurious" in its class. It isn't the driver's car but it's the most luxurious.

[ccap41]

On ‎11‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 11:43 PM, cp-the-nerd said:

For better or worse, the CUE set up in the CT6 and XT5 is drastically revised compared to the ATS/CTS. It's not for a lack of self-awareness, they're at least trying.

It might be drastically revised but the issues they had with it are unacceptable at this point.. When it first came out..and some revisions..okay. That's understandable. It's new.  But "as it froze multiple times before eventually crapping out, taking USB connectivity and charging with it." That just cannot happen, to me, in a 50k car let alone the 100k this car can approach. I mean if that happened on a test drive, game over. I wouldn't buy something where the infotainment system is all over the place with consistency.

[Suaviloquent]

Chevy MYLink and Buick/GMC Intellilink are just re-skinned versions of the same system, plus they retain hard buttons much more than the Cadillac.

I think there was a lost opportunity to come back fully to buttons and knobs that Lincoln did recently. While the volume slider does match the overall design of the interior....functionally the better versions of the same system are to be found in less expensive products.

But I guess complicated controls that look hi-tech and screem luxo in pics is the price of  admission of being a luxury car.

 

 

[Cory Wolfe]

Here's another comparison with a similar verdict: Autoguide: Genesis G90 vs. Cadillac CT6

[David]

CT6, the car everyone seems to want to use for it's whipping boy. Wonder if it is that they are all so jealous of the auto that they have to nit pick.

[Cmicasa the Great]

Another MT article that, of course.. no one needed to read to see the outcome. The Chinese showed Seabaugh and his crew a good time and this is what we got from it.

 

 Let's be clear.. with $70K U could have gotten a CT6 3.0L TT with AWD that would have put the weaksauce Chinaman car on the trailer with the Kraut.

 

 In fact.. why was the CT6 in this run at all? Why not simply bring in a CTS 2.0L AWD loaded to the hilt? To MT it made sense to take a 204 inch car and put it up against 2 vehicles that were smaller than even the smaller than CT6s lil sis the CTS. 

 

Can U say BULLCRAP???

[ccap41]

12 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Let's be clear.. with $70K U could have gotten a CT6 3.0L TT with AWD that would have put the weaksauce Chinaman car on the trailer with the Kraut.

The driveline was not the issues that they mentioned though. They didn't mind the 2.0T and they thought the chassis was superb. It was the interior that they didn't like and it would be the same on the TT3.0 AWD.

[Cmicasa the Great]

5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

The driveline was not the issues that they mentioned though. They didn't mind the 2.0T and they thought the chassis was superb. It was the interior that they didn't like and it would be the same on the TT3.0 AWD.

Actually the model they used was the LUXURY.. which is for all intents really the base model on the inside.. For the price they should have gone for the Premium Luxury. 

Bottom line is that Cadillac is penalized because it made its big car more affordable than some of its competitor's mid-size. Personally I think they should say "eff 'em" and charge people for the the CT6 at minimum Premium Luxo. To hell with the two lower trims. I would buy any but the Platinum anyway

[ccap41]

40 minutes ago, dfelt said:

CT6, the car everyone seems to want to use for it's whipping boy. Wonder if it is that they are all so jealous of the auto that they have to nit pick.

Or... Maybe it just isn't as good as we really want it to be.. I would put more weight into our bias than I would professional's bias. they see, sit, and drive basically EVERYTHING on the market. I think they have a better opinion on how things do work vs how they should along with what the competition does.

4 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Actually the model they used was the LUXURY.. which is for all intents really the base model on the inside.. For the price they should have gone for the Premium Luxury. 

Bottom line is that Cadillac is penalized because it made its big car more affordable than some of its competitor's mid-size. Personally I think they should say "eff 'em" and charge people for the the CT6 at minimum Premium Luxo. To hell with the two lower trims. I would buy any but the Platinum anyway

Yes. You don't magically make a car larger and more affordable out of nowhere.. There HAS to be corners cut or sacrifices made to get to that point of a larger car being cheaper. They sacrificed interior things for a superb chassis and engine. Cadillac penalized themselves for doing that.

Does Premium Luxury change any of the issues they had with the car? CUE will still suck, the materials will still be all over the place(according to them), but they already complimented the quality of leather being used.

[A Horse With No Name]

3 hours ago, dfelt said:

CT6, the car everyone seems to want to use for it's whipping boy. Wonder if it is that they are all so jealous of the auto that they have to nit pick.

...or maybe GM needs to just keep bringing its A game to the table?  They are doing it with Chevy, they need to step it up with Buick and Cadillac IMHO.

[smk4565]

The Genesis G90 and CT6 comparison makes more sense, they are about the same size and price, both with a twin turbo V6, although the V8 G90 would cost what the CT6 in that test cost.  I think that auto guide review also hit the nail on the head.  The CT6 is the better drivers car with the better chassis but falls short elsewhere, and most big sedan buyers are looking for luxury and ride quality.  The G90 hits the sweet spot of the market better.

[A Horse With No Name]

2 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

The Genesis G90 and CT6 comparison makes more sense, they are about the same size and price, both with a twin turbo V6, although the V8 G90 would cost what the CT6 in that test cost.  I think that auto guide review also hit the nail on the head.  The CT6 is the better drivers car with the better chassis but falls short elsewhere, and most big sedan buyers are looking for luxury and ride quality.  The G90 hits the sweet spot of the market better.

As much as it pains me to admit it, the G90 has a lot going for it.

[David]

2 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

...or maybe GM needs to just keep bringing its A game to the table?  They are doing it with Chevy, they need to step it up with Buick and Cadillac IMHO.

I would agree, the CT6 is leaps above what Caddy made in the past, but there is the rub, the past is always the next day, so you need to consistently obsolete yourself to be better than the competition.

Welcome to the 21st century of what the High Tech industry has pushed on the world. 90 days later, your out of date.

[smk4565]

Genesis has to try hard as an upstart, they have no name recognition so they have to bring it.  I think need to turbocharge their V8.  Lexus, Infiniti, and Genesis all have NA V8s, which is what the Germans did 10 years ago.  

Luxury cars need torque.  Think of this, the base S-class has 516 lb-ft of torque, Lexus has never made a car with over 400 lb-ft.  Not even the LF-A or GS-F.  That's pathetic.  Genesis doesn't have a 400 lb-ft torque engine, and Infiniti's best is 414 lb-ft.  The companies bring knives to gun fights.  

[Suaviloquent]

The S90 was fully loaded. Fully loaded. I agree totally that the test was stupid to begin with, but Cadillac CT6 Platinum can't touch the Inscription or highly optioned S90 interior.

Cadillac did not just simply charge less for their largest car. I wonder, why didn't Caddy send a Plat or Premium Lux trim to the COTY? Were they lulled into just sending the 2.0T because that was what the enthusiasts liked in the first tests? Well I guess GM is happy that the Bolt won. But hasn't MT or I guess others like heaped praise for the entire model line for the year?

That would have been swell for GM, if they gave COTY to both the CT6 and the Bolt. But I guess those days are gone, and the CT6 isn't the Escala.

 

[Cmicasa the Great]

6 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Or... Maybe it just isn't as good as we really want it to be.. I would put more weight into our bias than I would professional's bias. they see, sit, and drive basically EVERYTHING on the market. I think they have a better opinion on how things do work vs how they should along with what the competition does.

Yes. You don't magically make a car larger and more affordable out of nowhere.. There HAS to be corners cut or sacrifices made to get to that point of a larger car being cheaper. They sacrificed interior things for a superb chassis and engine. Cadillac penalized themselves for doing that.

Does Premium Luxury change any of the issues they had with the car? CUE will still suck, the materials will still be all over the place(according to them), but they already complimented the quality of leather being used.

U disqualified your entire argument when U said CUE sucks.  That's false.  I wonder if U have ever even spent any real time with the interface.  

[ccap41]

I have used it and it worked fine but I wasn't pairing it to my phones and using it on a daily basis which is where every review ever has said it just isn't that good. It's much improved since it's first come to market with hardware and software upgrades but crashing multiple times and eventually $h!tting the bed for the reviewers? That can't happen. As an overall package it does suck.. do I want it to suck? Absolutely not! I freakin want an ATS and eventually a V Series one day. I dig Cadillac. But I also realize that they're still a half step behind on some things. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

8 hours ago, ccap41 said:

I have used it and it worked fine but I wasn't pairing it to my phones and using it on a daily basis which is where every review ever has said it just isn't that good. It's much improved since it's first come to market with hardware and software upgrades but crashing multiple times and eventually $h!tting the bed for the reviewers? That can't happen. As an overall package it does suck.. do I want it to suck? Absolutely not! I freakin want an ATS and eventually a V Series one day. I dig Cadillac. But I also realize that they're still a half step behind on some things. 

Again.. BS. The use of CUE in those reviews is limited even if they are doing it for a week period. I have tried CUE in the Escalade.. the ATS.. my mom's SRX.. a CT6 and recently a after taking my V in for an oil change and routine maintenance, a new XTS which was given as a loaner for 5 days because they had to also perform recall duty on the V and I couldn't wait and had to leave the state on business.. OH.. and also on that aforementioned V.. and while I certainly could see some lag in early models pre-2014.. the software has done nothing but improve.. and not once in my use of it on the newer vehicles including the one I've been living with since Feb.. do I find it difficult to use, whether in pairing it to Bluetooth or merging it via Android auto. maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe it was just their phones. I will reiterate that in instance where I have used any of the other MyLink interfaces as well.. having recently rented a Malibu while in Houston before Thanksgiving and having several family members comment on how easy the car was to use with the phone upon pairing with both Android and Iphones.

Bottom line is that its an issue with these reviewers because its a GO TO for something to complain about. Its like "Hillary's Emails," "White men can't jump," "Philly Fans are crazy," etc. Human conditioning and psychology instantly finds that one things that they feel people will relate to after hearing it over and over again even if the complaint is out dated. I'm surprised, and I may have just missed it... that they didn't complain about Cadillac's of the past being land barges or having names instead of letters.

[Cmicasa the Great]

And sorry if U like this.. but I personally prefer the touch screen world over this plethora of buttons .. JESUS CHRIST.. I would crash just looking for one or the other in this retro of an old ATM machine

 

[Cory Wolfe]

I think the problem with the CT6 is its lack of commitment to any one segment. It's not quite a flagship, not quite an executive in size, price, and features. It's almost like the original CTS in that its size is more similar to the class above its pricing. This has its advantages and disadvantages, as such.

As far as CUE, obviously the more you use it and become accustomed to it, it's not going to be an issue for you. I, personally, can't speak on any of the newly released models with the supposedly updated software, myself. I've only had experience with 2016 and prior systems. Those, however, were truly awful. There is no way around that. Were they unusable? No, of course, not. If you bought the car, you'd likely get used to it just as many have gotten used to MFT over the years. That doesn't make it better than competitors systems.

If you want to truly judge the system, don't do so without spending equal time with Mercedes', BMW's, Audi's, and especially Volvo's infotainment systems. Take away the bias, and you'll probably find they are much more sorted and intuitive systems. Lexus, Infiniti, and Acura, on the other hand are just as irritating as CUE, if not more so.

With that said, I hope that CUE has been sorted out well enough with the most recent updates. Again, I haven't had a chance to use the system in a CT6 or XT5 yet so it could very well be. I've seen a few reviews that noted various improvements, so there is hope to be had. 

[ccap41]

1 hour ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Again.. BS.

I'm genuinely glad that you have never had issues with CUE but you seem to be in the minority with that. 

[A Horse With No Name]

3 hours ago, ccap41 said:

I'm genuinely glad that you have never had issues with CUE but you seem to be in the minority with that. 

One of my co workers is a GM loyalist who raced GM cars for about 4 decades, will always buy GM....tried to warn his daughter about buying a Cadillac...thing has spent a ton of time in the shop due to electrical and infotainment issues.

A sample size of one in terms of Cmicassa does not mean much...you can swing a dead cat by the tail and hit a Cadillac owner who has had electrical and infotainment issues.

Not saying this to bash GM, just saying it in hopes that they turn around and bring their A game.

[David]

12 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

One of my co workers is a GM loyalist who raced GM cars for about 4 decades, will always buy GM....tried to warn his daughter about buying a Cadillac...thing has spent a ton of time in the shop due to electrical and infotainment issues.

A sample size of one in terms of Cmicassa does not mean much...you can swing a dead cat by the tail and hit a Cadillac owner who has had electrical and infotainment issues.

Not saying this to bash GM, just saying it in hopes that they turn around and bring their A game.

Valid point but I could also say this about MB, BMW, Audi, etc. I also have not had any issues with my CUE in my Cadillac. I wonder how much of the issues really boil down to people not being familiar with the interface. 

I could bitch about how bad the MB interface is, that one is to me like an iPhone which I feel is a terrible interface. Never understand people who like that tech, but it clearly appeals to some. So I take complaints by all auto mags with a grain of salt. Just way to many different interfaces that I doubt the writers can stay on top of when they change the software and how it properly works. 

I hold more faith in the JD powers review and when people complain about stuff than the auto reviews.

[ccap41]

If it's like an iPhone interface, I'd buy it. Simple and clean design. Not overly complicated and filled with BS that isn't needed.

I agree to taking their complains with a grain of salt but when they have been as consistent as they have been with CUE it should be taken as a heads-up warning.

43 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

you can swing a dead cat by the tail and hit a Cadillac owner who has had electrical and infotainment issues.

Hahahaha that's a hilarious way to put it!

[A Horse With No Name]

25 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Valid point but I could also say this about MB, BMW, Audi, etc. I also have not had any issues with my CUE in my Cadillac. I wonder how much of the issues really boil down to people not being familiar with the interface. 

I could bitch about how bad the MB interface is, that one is to me like an iPhone which I feel is a terrible interface. Never understand people who like that tech, but it clearly appeals to some. So I take complaints by all auto mags with a grain of salt. Just way to many different interfaces that I doubt the writers can stay on top of when they change the software and how it properly works. 

I hold more faith in the JD powers review and when people complain about stuff than the auto reviews.

Would still own a Cadillac before I would own BMW, Audi, or Benz, by a long, long, long shot.  Do not want to comment further as I do not want to endlessly bash luxury cars...but IMHO modern luxury cars leave a metric crap ton to be desired.

[David]

10 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Would still own a Cadillac before I would own BMW, Audi, or Benz, by a long, long, long shot.  Do not want to comment further as I do not want to endlessly bash luxury cars...but IMHO modern luxury cars leave a metric crap ton to be desired.

So true, you can truly have a very basic auto that could still feel ubber luxury if the right materials are used. I remember the days of my grandparents having a new car with leather seats and the leather accents on the interior and with AM/FM radio and you had a very nice luxury auto.

[Suaviloquent]

One thing for sure, is that the exterior of the CT6 is tight, real good against cars of the same size. But it's not as expressive as i wish it could be. 

 

I think Cadillac should not have restricted the trim levels for the 2.0T model in the U.S. - because I bet that same engine for China wouldn't have the exclusion of higher trim levels.

[A Horse With No Name]

12 minutes ago, Suaviloquent said:

One thing for sure, is that the exterior of the CT6 is tight, real good against cars of the same size. But it's not as expressive as i wish it could be. 

 

I think Cadillac should not have restricted the trim levels for the 2.0T model in the U.S. - because I bet that same engine for China wouldn't have the exclusion of higher trim levels.

Agreed....not as "expressive" is an excellent way of putting it.

[Cmicasa the Great]

2 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

One of my co workers is a GM loyalist who raced GM cars for about 4 decades, will always buy GM....tried to warn his daughter about buying a Cadillac...thing has spent a ton of time in the shop due to electrical and infotainment issues.

 

What year??? What year is the Caddy? I have had a 2005, 2009, 2012 and the current 2016.. Electrical issues were only am issue with the '05, and that was traced back to the Onstar system staying on when the car was off. 

Quote

 

A sample size of one in terms of Cmicasa does not mean much...you can swing a dead cat by the tail and hit a Cadillac owner who has had electrical and infotainment issues.

Not saying this to bash GM, just saying it in hopes that they turn around and bring their A game.

 

But wait.. the exact same thing can be said for BMW owners.. Benz Owners... AUDI OWNERS.. JAGUAR OWNERS. Sorry in terms of electrical issues no company except maybe Lexus is not a target.. and a lot of that has to do with the fact that their absolute best sellers are based completely off of mainstream products that ironed out a great deal of issues in mass. 

We are essentially in year 4 of CUE.. if I remember correctly iDrive was a bitch and a half in that same time period. Quite frankly CUE is being dogged out because it is the go-to for haters to hate on.

The CT6 in this comparo is a BASE car for all intents. The only CT6 that should be sold, if it is gonna be held to the same level of expectation as the S-Class etc.. would be the Platinum.. which I have yet to read an true negative word about its interior even in comparos against the aforementioned leader of the segment. Otherwise.. realize that if U take a car that should only be sold to people with the "XYZ means.." and downgrade it cater to those who only have the "XY" sans the Z.. corners will have to be cut.. and they damn sure are better cut from the insides than the bones. Point is.. if U have a car like the CT6.. on Omega.. and U have to snatch out things to bring cost down.. where do U snatch? Do U add in heavier steel instead of the lighter stuff? Do U put in less sound-deadening?? How about less forgiving sound-proof glass??? No what Caddy did was put less high quality leather in, deleted the MRC, and added no performance tires. U want a real CT6?? Buy a Platinum or even Premium Luxury. 

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

So true, you can truly have a very basic auto that could still feel ubber luxury if the right materials are used. I remember the days of my grandparents having a new car with leather seats and the leather accents on the interior and with AM/FM radio and you had a very nice luxury auto.

dfelt meet Aline.. Aline meet dfelt

 

 

[A Horse With No Name]

7 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

 

What year??? What year is the Caddy? I have had a 2005, 2009, 2012 and the current 2016.. Electrical issues were only am issue with the '05, and that was traced back to the Onstar system staying on when the car was off. 

But wait.. the exact same thing can be said for BMW owners.. Benz Owners... AUDI OWNERS.. JAGUAR OWNERS. Sorry in terms of electrical issues no company except maybe Lexus is not a target.. and a lot of that has to do with the fact that their absolute best sellers are based completely off of mainstream products that ironed out a great deal of issues in mass. 

 

 

 

Couple things...Impala is gorgeous...

Caddy is a 2014 IIRC.  Very sorry to see her having problems, she has a good job but is a single mother with two small children, car drives her nuts.

Not trying to dump on GM, I just want to see them acknowledge they have a problem and fix it.

Agree on Benz, Audi, BMW, everyone but Lexus thing...and have agreed publicly for awhile....Cadillac at least is making an ethical effort to build a first rate car that is interesting and reliable, I cannot say the same about the Europeans in terms of reliability...

Or the Asians in terms of interesting....

[Cmicasa the Great]

3 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Couple things...Impala is gorgeous...

Caddy is a 2014 IIRC.  Very sorry to see her having problems, she has a good job but is a single mother with two small children, car drives her nuts.

Not trying to dump on GM, I just want to see them acknowledge they have a problem and fix it.

Agree on Benz, Audi, BMW, everyone but Lexus thing...and have agreed publicly for awhile....Cadillac at least is making an ethical effort to build a first rate car that is interesting and reliable, I cannot say the same about the Europeans in terms of reliability...

Or the Asians in terms of interesting....

Thanks on the Impala.. but Ed Welburn and Co deserve the credit

 Which Caddy is your friend having an issue with?

[A Horse With No Name]

...and lets be honest, The Asians are quickly giving up previous claims of reliability...

 

 

1 minute ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Thanks on the Impala.. but Ed Welburn and Co deserve the credit

 Which Caddy is your friend having an issue with?

CTS IIRC....

[Cmicasa the Great]

Just now, A Horse With No Name said:

...and lets be honest, The Asians are quickly giving up previous claims of reliability...

 

 

CTS IIRC....

If U kno me U willl kno that I have done nothing but preached about the BS perception of most Asian makes since my days at AWCC and Motor Trend Forum.. 

As for her issues with the Alpha based CTS.. damn. I think that the issue is completely licked tho.. have her trade it in if she is OK with the second chance. I have not had any issues at all with my CTS in these last 7 months. Love it more and more every time I get in her. 

[A Horse With No Name]

19 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

If U kno me U willl kno that I have done nothing but preached about the BS perception of most Asian makes since my days at AWCC and Motor Trend Forum.. 

As for her issues with the Alpha based CTS.. damn. I think that the issue is completely licked tho.. have her trade it in if she is OK with the second chance. I have not had any issues at all with my CTS in these last 7 months. Love it more and more every time I get in her. 

...and that's the sad damn part, the CTS is one of the few interesting cars in the segment. I think she is going to stick with Cadillac when she trades it in...

And the problem with Asian makes is that they often do not innovate.  Camry is still riding on a platform from 2002....

Impala has improved how much since then....?

Nissan 350Z/370Z are largely unchanged from 2003...how much have GM and Ford done with the Camaro and Mustang since then?

is Cadillac building a car like the Lexus GS series, which is just a pricier and less attractive Avalon in many ways...no...they are pushing the envelope....

Honda waited how long to get into Turbos for their motors...how much more experience does everyone else in the market have by now....?

Honda had how many problems with their hybrid systems in the Civic and accord, and now we are supposed to trust them that things are supposedly magically worked out in the new Accord Hybrid....?

Sorry, starting to rant...have a good evening, bud...!

[David]

17 hours ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Electrical issues were only am issue with the '05, and that was traced back to the Onstar system staying on when the car was off. 

Actually they also had issues with select Escalade 2006. My Escalade ESV Platinum which I still own had to have the Nav/Radio/OnStar system replaced twice and the second time they put in a 2007 system due to the 06 units causing the battery to drain in just a couple days plus other funky issues. Since then, all has worked just fine and still going strong.

I do wish the nav was faster responding but then it is an 07 system.  Still love the comfort and have to say that the 2nd generation Escalade is way better than the 3rd generation and the current 4th generation is even better than the 2nd generation. I am considering trading my ride in for a new one. Just not sure if I want a car payment again.

17 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

...and lets be honest, The Asians are quickly giving up previous claims of reliability...

 

 

CTS IIRC....

Bummer, but then all companies no matter, American, Asian, European make a lemon or two from time to time.