A Horse With No Name

#12. Governmental plans than force change against peoples will such as prohibition or the outlawing of narcotics often fail spectacularly, government coercion will actually slow down the change over to EV vehicles. It could be argued that by doing nothing change will happen at the rate society deems best. Advocacy for things like global warming/climate change and other environmental issues may be best done by social movements and not the government. #13. Supposing the government was actually able to force the issue and cause widespread EV conversion in the short term (5-10 years) this may well convince people that we had solved issues relating to climate change and global warming. Counsel from Lancaster, PA OCNblu was essentially correct in postulating that many sources of C02 would have to be regulated/changed for a significant impact. #14. Automobiles are therefore non unique in terms of being polluters causing gross economic damage. As mentioned previously, regulating other sources may be beyond the scope of both current human technology and current human willpower to solve.

#8. Aircraft are uniquely unsuited to EV propulsion, and our lives are made infinitely better by aviation. Commerce is encouraged by aviation and a reduction in aviation may well lead to increased alienation between countries. This could well lead to un-desireable impacts like nuclear war, economic stagnation, increased racism and intolerance as people become alienated from their fellow humans, a drastic reduction in tourist income, a loss of religious freedom as people are no longer able to make religious pilgrimages. #9. ccap41, counsel from St Louis, needs to mow his damned yard and forced conversion to EV would be a form of governmental tyranny and also a pain in the but for the above mentioned. Plus ccap needs something cool like a mustang Gt to cruise around in, an EV lawn mower would put him further from that goal. #10. As mentioned by Balthazar, tons of things are made from petroleum, it isn't going away any time soon. #11. Social change works best when it is done on a gradual basis, our infrastructure for petroleum has taken well over a century to build, the EV infrastructure will be over a century replacing it.

Actually, let me play devils advocate, because there is a case for fossil fuels. We stand resolved that fossil fuel vehicles have value; Points of contention- #1. Vintage vehicles are a valuable and unique art form and should be preserved, we should allow fossil fuel to be used indefinitely to power them. #2. Motorcycles are available as EV but there are aspects of motorcycling where fossil fuels are inherently superior, we should allow artistic freedom and freedom to riders in terms of their motorcycling experience. #3. As mentioned by intrepedation, two stroke internal combustion engines are torque monsters, certain types of motocross competition would be adversely affected by an Ev changeover, we should allow indefinite use of fossil fuels for motocross. #4. As mentioned by Drew, certain portions of branch line railroad are unprofitable in the extreme to electrify, such as low volume track-age utilized primarily to move food after harvest. there may be an indefinite need for older internal combustion locomotives in this case. #5. Shipping is uniquely difficult to adapt to full EV, this will remain internal combustion for the foreseeable future. #6. Developing nations have the right to automotive transport, and may lack the electrical infrastructure in rural areas to support large scale vehicle charging. We should allow and encourage fossil fueled vehicles in this case, as it brings needed commerce, tourism, medical supplies, religious freedom in that it allows religious people to make pilgrimages, etc. This is of very high value to humanity. #7. As brought up by Balthazar, counsel from new Jersey, we have a lot of ICE cars currently on the road and large scale scrapage of these vehicles is unprofitable and environmentally wasteful. To be continued. The Affirmative will take this counsel into advisement...

Looking good!

If that $75 an hour consulting ever goes south you have a fantastic future herding cats. So you admit your mind is completely closed...self honesty is a good thing at times.

Perfect case for the use of fossil fue I honestly don't understand why you cannot love both fossil fuel and electric vehicles. I do!

We could re open the cars and girls thread and talk about bush. Some of the ladies from the seventies could use a gasoline powered implement to trim that.

My son works in a department for an insurance company called escalation where he takes calls no one else will handle. The other day he had a nut job Pentecostal preacher keep insisting that he could give us a special thanksgiving blessing straight from Jesus in liu of premium payment. I want to dump extra oil in the fuel and make it smoke like a freaking freight train just to prove a political point... I prefer to think of myself as a Trotskyist with liberation theology trappings myself.

Ahhh yes... so much better than the idiot my son dealt with on the phone.

I think we can all agree the electric mower is sexier than most of the current Toyota line up. Might be a little cold for Ohio guys like cubical and I during the winter though...

It's a conspiracy!

Our political irregularities and some of our less spectacular automotive oddities bring back my favorite quote about Canada...from Robin Williams..."Canada is like a really nice apartment on top of a meth lab.."

Without a spare battery it is like $600 and does not require gasoline to be stored in my garage. I may just pull the trigger.

Not every alternative fuel is as good as electric... Strong, Sturdy a will of it's own...this for certain people...

Back to cars.... With a heart of gold... That is just awesome... ...and yes to an electric 86!

Damn, Vladimir Putin drives a Pontiac...who knew? I need pasta I think. Maybe we could merge this into the random thoughts thread? Anvil....

I learned that people actually collect Anvils. A Hay Budden Anvil sold for over fourteen grand on Ebay. The anvil might be the most useful part of that equation...

I would love a small electric sports car...that would be the Cats Ass.... And yes, your average Toyota has all of the appeal of Joe Biden on a bad day. And actually that is wildly unfair to Toyota.

They have to show off their Fiat parentage somehow... It is a neat idea.

Yes, i know you have had Fords in a previous life...we will still respect you in the morning.

With an electric lawn mower at least we could hear you scream. Given the Toyota 86, sticky tires, and a curvy road, i could make you scream. The lack of a sensible response from the anti EV crowd makes me want to scream. There are arguments against EV's they just are not presented rationally here. i could drop that in my back pocket...

Depends on the Toyota...would love to drive a Toyota 86...which brings us right back to cars, internal combustion, and manual transmissions.

I generally charge at least $40 for side work...and have no trouble selling labor for that. Figure the amount of time I spend waiting in line to buy gasoline and an electric car starts making sense really fast. Thinking CPO Bolt might just be in budget...

My favorite car was a 66 Mustang fastback 289 4 speed, Wimbledon white, not a spot of rust on her. I would give my eye teeth for a 68 Mustang California Special...or a 69 Fastback...or a 70 Boss 302. Calypso Coral or Grabber Green on the 70 Boss 302...gold was a signature color in 69 for the Mustang. make that one a GT (last year for the early year GT cars, and fairly rare) with gold paint and a black interior. Modern cars...of all of the cars on the planet the only two that actually excite me as modern cars to own are the GTI/Golf R and WRX/STI. Everything else leaves me pretty cold as an ownership proposition. In terms of fandom, I really like Audi and Porsche...but I am a blue collar guy so I would look silly driving either of them. Only GM car I could see myself pulling the actual trigger on is the Bolt...only car I could see buying from Ford would be the Focus ST. Only chryco product I could see spending my own money on is the Renegade with a Trailhawk package. ....hate to say it but I think given the choice of Camaro, Mustang or Challenger I would take the Challenger. At least today...ask me tomorrow and my answer would change.

Damned if I know...I love the vintage blue oval stuff. I just try to be honest with myself and deal with what I feel. We have had several Fords lately as rentals and they have performed flawlessly.