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  • Drew Dowdell
    Drew Dowdell

    Renault and Nissan want to Formally Merge; Make Bid for FCA

      .. Move from alliance to formal merger

    Financial Times is reporting that Renault wants to make the marriage to Nissan more official and formally merge.  Renault wants to start talks within the next 12 months and include a potential bid for automaker FCA .  The combined companies of Nissan, Renault, Fiat, and Chrysler would be a conglomerate that rivals the size of Toyota and Volkswagen.

    Carlos Ghosn tried to start merger talks prior to his arrest for financial wrongdoing, however, the French government stopped his proposals. Renault currently owns roughly 43% of Nissan.

    FCA has recently been in the news for potential talks with Peugeot to merge. Those reports were squashed when it came to light that the Agnelli family, who has a controlling stake in FCA, was not interested in a deal that was paid for with PSA stock.

    Edited by Drew Dowdell

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    Bet the Agnelli Family is more interested in getting cash out of their controlling stake and moving on in various directions. Just makes sense that usually next generation family is not always interested in past family investments.

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    The merger is necessary given that Renault and Nissan are so close.

    As for the Agnelli family, it reminds me of the sale of the Buffalo Bills after founder Ralph Wilson died.  The kids want the cash and move onto their own interests. 

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    Just now, dfelt said:

    Is the family involved like the Ford family is in the business?

    That much I don't know. I know that Sergio was their designated spokesman and he largely did what they wanted, which was expand the Italian brands. 

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    1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

    The ghost of Carlos Ghosn lives on.  Sound like the super merger he always wanted will happen anyway.  If they combine all 3 into one company they will have to kill some brands.

    I vote Fiat, Alfa, Lancia.   Combine Renault and Nissan into a simple rebadge brand (based off Renaults). Nissan can use rebodied Rams for the truck and SUVs. Keep the Z and the GTR.  Dunno what to do with Mitsubishi... it doesn't do well in the US but it sells in emerging markets.  Maybe convert it to Datsun and kill it in the US. 

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    FCA does not want or need a partner right now. The American arm is in good shape, but they wont let go of the European arm. Why take on more burden with junk European cars and lousy European management?

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    3 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    I vote Fiat, Alfa, Lancia.   Combine Renault and Nissan into a simple rebadge brand (based off Renaults). Nissan can use rebodied Rams for the truck and SUVs. Keep the Z and the GTR.  Dunno what to do with Mitsubishi... it doesn't do well in the US but it sells in emerging markets.  Maybe convert it to Datsun and kill it in the US. 

    Renault and Nissan both would have to stay, they can share mechanicals on probably everything, Renalut seems better at small cars and Nissan more so on SUV but they can merge all that and rebage stuff.  That covers main stream.  Maybe Dodge stays as a performance brand but Renault has an F1 team maybe they do cheap person instead of Dodge and Dodge is killed too.   Chrysler dies move the Pacifica to Nissan.  Fiat and Lancia die as Renault has small cars.

    Ram and Jeep are safe, Alfa Romeo or Maserati need to stay as a luxury brand with Infiniti.

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    5 hours ago, smk4565 said:

    The ghost of Carlos Ghosn lives on.  Sound like the super merger he always wanted will happen anyway.  If they combine all 3 into one company they will have to kill some brands.

    The ghost of?  Carlos Ghosn? Or do you mean Sergio Marchionne?  

    Anyway, I see what you mean by it because Sergio wanted to merge desperately and yeah, several brands need to be killed off. 

    Merger or not, several brands need to go as of now actually.  

    Edited by oldshurst442
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    2 hours ago, thedriver said:

    FCA does not want or need a partner right now. The American arm is in good shape, but they wont let go of the European arm. Why take on more burden with junk European cars and lousy European management?

    The American arm is doing great on the Jeep and Ram part.

    The Dodge and Chrysler part...well...lets be honest...they are on borrowed time as it were.  Because of the lack of attention and R&D money that the "F" part of FCA is doing to them...

    Maserati and Alfa Romeo still have some cache. In Europe and in North America. Its just that the FCA leaders are not tapping into that cache properly. 

    Maybe its reliability issues or product or both that are hindering success,  but I think Alfa and Maserati could still be salvaged and be worth something and BE brands that many would want to own. 

    If both brands die off though, I wouldnt be shedding any tears. 

    If Renault and Nissan merge for an eventual FCA merger....YIKES!!! Too many brands!!!

    58 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

    Renault and Nissan both would have to stay, they can share mechanicals on probably everything, Renalut seems better at small cars and Nissan more so on SUV but they can merge all that and rebage stuff.  That covers main stream.  Maybe Dodge stays as a performance brand but Renault has an F1 team maybe they do cheap person instead of Dodge and Dodge is killed too.   Chrysler dies move the Pacifica to Nissan.  Fiat and Lancia die as Renault has small cars.

    Ram and Jeep are safe, Alfa Romeo or Maserati need to stay as a luxury brand with Infiniti.

    Even with this scenario...too many brands that just dont do anything and would be encroaching each other...

    Come to think of it, Renault-Nissan really does NOT need FCA...

    Especially the way you described it...

    Nissan does not need Jeep as Nissan could dig deep into their very own heritage and do rough and tough SUVs.  Not too long ago their very own XTERRA was impressive let alone what they had with their Pathfinder several decades ago...

    Their former XTRAIL was a great off roader too. So they got offroading know-how...

    Family haulin' CUVs/SUVs?   Id say their Pathfinder and Rogue do a great job in that area. Qashqai too maybe? No better, but no worse than everybody else Id say...

    Renault has it alright with small cars in Europe. Nissan sells alright in the US. Maybe a better focus on quality is all it takes to be a leader in both markets?  Now that Ghosn is gone, because I think HE was the one to phoque up the quality, well that could be fixed in a jiffy...

    Mitsubishi? Well...better focused vehicles for the US market and that too is an easy fix.

    AWD for offroading or sports cars is a Mitsubishi thing...couple that with Nissan and its sport car division (or offroading)and Renault with their F1 racing program and I dont really see how Mitsubishi cant be fixed easily?

    Infiniti...  whatever. 

    Does Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi really need FCA that whatever Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi is lacking that they cant fix by themselves? 

    What? Renault is nostalgic about Chrysler that they want Chrysler in their lives again? For Jeep? They dont need Jeep.  Mitsu bishi too is nostalgic about Chrysler?  Lee Iacocca is loooong gone. 

    They got Nissan and Mitsubishi that could be a good competitor to Jeep if they played their cards right...

    FCA needs help. Let them die...

    Jeep and Ram could survive together, on their own  Jeep could go on the reverse trend introducing a sedan if they need one and they could call it the Eagle...and it be a cool way to celebrate their own past when Chrysler owned AMC and Jeep and the first ever crossover was the Eagle...

    It be a pity for Dodge and Chrysler, but hey...

    Fiat, Alfa, Maserati...well...good riddance...

     

     

     

     

    Edited by oldshurst442
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    On 3/27/2019 at 11:56 PM, daves87rs said:

    And they thought GM had too many brands....

    You keep the 4 strongest brands and get rid of everything else.

     

    Build long and hard on those.....

    The problem is that some brands are regional.  The French won't buy Nissans, nor will the Chinese.  They'll buy Renaults.  Everyone buys Jeeps. Americans won't touch Fiats, but Europeans are fine with them.  Nissan does well in the US with cheap financing. 

    So there will likely need to be some heavy rebadging going on and each brand stay in its home territory. 

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    5 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    The problem is that some brands are regional.  The French won't buy Nissans, nor will the Chinese.  They'll buy Renaults.  Everyone buys Jeeps. Americans won't touch Fiats, but Europeans are fine with them.  Nissan does well in the US with cheap financing. 

    So there will likely need to be some heavy rebadging going on and each brand stay in its home territory. 

    I agree...but the question is do that have a choice?

    Even the rebadging is going to cost money they don’t really have....

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    21 hours ago, daves87rs said:

    I agree...but the question is do that have a choice?

    Even the rebadging is going to cost money they don’t really have....

    FCA isn't hurting with Jeep and RAM doing well. Nissan-Renault seems to be going okay too. 

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    6 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    FCA isn't hurting with Jeep and RAM doing well. Nissan-Renault seems to be going okay too. 

    Now, yes very much so.... but this success is after a struggle they had for a while ...

    That said- FCA seems to have the best line going right now...and the Jeep trucklet is only going to make it better.

    Now if they could use a little Nissan to shake a car or to into FCA, it could work! 

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    On 3/30/2019 at 11:18 PM, daves87rs said:

     

    Now if they could use a little Nissan to shake a car or to into FCA, it could work! 

    Alas, Nissan's reputation these days in the US is cheap cars w/ CVTs.  They long ago lost their mojo here. 

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      Press Release is on Page 2


      Nissan’s product transformation continues with Ariya, a 100 percent electric crossover for a new era
      The next step of Nissan’s transformation is here with an all-new EV that delivers driving excitement, confidence, comfort and connectivity; set to go on sale in U.S. in 2021 with a $40,000 starting price NASHVILLE, Tenn. – Nissan today introduced the all-new Nissan Ariya, an electric crossover SUV that lets customers travel up to approximately 300 miles per charge (preliminary Nissan estimate for long-range 2WD model) while enjoying greater driving excitement, confidence, comfort, and connectivity.
      Its debut marks a key milestone in the Nissan NEXT transformation initiative, a four-year plan building on Nissan's reputation for innovation, craftsmanship, customer-focus and quality, alongside an ongoing cultural transformation. As the company's first all-electric crossover SUV, the Ariya embodies the company's vision to enrich people's lives.
      Representing the pinnacle of Nissan's technologies and design, the 100% electric Nissan Ariya debuted during a digital event in Yokohama. Ariya promises powerful acceleration and smooth, quiet operation and advanced driver assistance and connectivity technology– wrapped in a sophisticated yet simple exterior design with a spacious, lounge-like interior.
      CEO Makoto Uchida and Chief Operating Officer Ashwani Gupta unveiled the Ariya to a global audience during a livestreamed event at the new Nissan Pavilion in Yokohama, Japan.
      "The Ariya, a key model in Nissan's plan to roll out 10 new models in 20 months, demonstrates our commitment to meeting customer demand for crossovers with the most advanced electrified, automated and connected technologies," Gupta said. "The company expects sales of its EVs and e-POWER electrified models to be more than 1 million units a year by the end of fiscal 2023. The Ariya will play a significant role in attaining that goal."
      Nissan also aims to introduce advanced driver assistance technologies in more than 20 models in 20 markets, and to have sold more than 1.5 million vehicles equipped with these systems in that same period.
      The all-new Nissan Ariya is scheduled to go on sale in Japan in mid-2021, followed by the U.S. and Canada later in the year. U.S. pricing will start around $40,000.
      Powerful performance for a wide range of needs
      Nissan was the first automaker to introduce a mass market electric vehicle with the Nissan LEAF in 2010, which has resulted in nearly 500,000 sales to date. Building on Nissan's strength as an EV pioneer, the Ariya takes the powerful performance and capabilities of zero-emission vehicles to the heart of the electric vehicle market.
      The car's all-electric drivetrain combines excellent power delivery, charging capabilities and range. Customers can choose from multiple configurations to meet their individual needs. These include two-wheel-drive and new "e-4ORCE" all-wheel drive versions, as well as two different battery sizes. The e-4ORCE all-wheel control system balances the powerful performance with a smooth, comfortable ride and all-weather capability. The system's twin electric motors provide balanced, assured handling with sports car-level power.
      Advanced design and technology for stress-free driving
      Ariya is also the most advanced embodiment of Nissan Intelligent Mobility in a car to date.
      Drivers will feel more confident and less stressed thanks to the available, next-generation ProPILOT Assist 2.0 advanced driver assistance system that uses driver attention monitoring to enable hands-off single-lane highway operation. Ariya will also offer e-Pedal, which allows the driver to start, accelerate and decelerate using only the accelerator pedal.
      Standard across the Ariya lineup is Nissan Safety Shield® 360, a suite of six advanced active safety and driver-assist technologies. This includes Automatic Emergency Braking with Pedestrian Detection, Rear Automatic Braking, Lane Departure Warning, Blind Spot Warning, Rear Cross Traffic Alert and High Beam Assist. Ariya will also feature Nissan's Intelligent Around View Monitor, Intelligent Forward Collision Warning and other technologies aimed at making the drive easier and more enjoyable.
      A human-machine interface lets customers use natural speech to adjust car settings. Over-the-air firmware updates keep the Ariya feeling fresh and exciting. The Ariya also includes Amazon's Alexa to help customers simplify and organize their lives.
      Ariya will also feature wireless Apple CarPlay® and Android Auto™ standard to help drivers seamlessly integrate their smartphone into their vehicle experience.
      Spacious, flat-floor cabin
      The Ariya's striking looks represent Nissan's new design language, Timeless Japanese Futurism. It is characterized by a distinctive Japanese approach, conveyed in a simple yet powerfully modern way.
      Nissan's designers took advantage of the car's new EV platform, which allows for a flat floor, and its compact climate control components to give the Ariya a very spacious cabin. The lounge-like interior, featuring thin profile Zero Gravity seats, provides a welcoming and comfortable environment for driver and passengers alike.
      "Nissan was a pioneer in the world of mass-market electric vehicles a decade ago with LEAF, setting the standard for affordable, mass-market electric vehicles. We expect nothing less for the new Nissan Ariya," said Gupta. "While the driving exhilaration of its acceleration and torque levels is undeniable, the Ariya offers balanced, customer-centric technology that is perfect for everyday use."
      Nissan Ariya Key Specifications
      Passenger configuration
      2-row, 5-passenger
      Drive configuration
      Front-wheel drive or e-4ORCE all-wheel drive
      Platform
      Newly developed Alliance CMF-EV
      Powertrain
      Single (FWD) / dual (e-4ORCE AWD) electric motor, Externally Excited Synchronous Motor (EESM)
      Battery capacity
      63 kWh / 87 kWh usable (total 65 kWh / 90 kWh)
      Thermal management
      Active battery management system
      Estimated range
      Up to approximately 300 miles (preliminary Nissan estimate)
      Level 2 charging
      Up to 7.2 kW
      DC charging type
      CCS standard up to 130 kW
      Output
      160 kW – 290 kW
      Torque
      221 lb-ft – 443 lb-ft
      Wheelbase
      109.3 in.
      Overall length
      182.9 in.
      Overall width
      74.8 in.
      Overall height
      65.4 in. – 65.7 (depending on roof rack)
      Cargo volume
      16.5 cu ft (FWD)
      14.6 (e-4ORCE)
      Wheel size
      19-inch or 20-inch
      Tire size
      235/55R19 or 255/45R20
      Available interior features
      Lounge-like space created by flat, open floor and slim-profile Zero Gravity seats; large, minimalist instrument panel with integrated capacitive haptic switches; innovative center storage box with fold-out tray, adjustable center console
      Available Advanced Driver Assist (ADAS) Technology
      ProPILOT Assist 2.0 featuring hands-off highway operation with Driver Monitoring System
      Available safety technology
      Nissan Safety Shield® 360 with Automatic Emergency Braking with Pedestrian Detection, Blind Spot Warning, Rear Cross Traffic Alert, Lane Departure Warning, High Beam Assist and Rear Automatic Braking
      Model configurations
      Ariya standard and long range (FWD)
      Ariya standard range e-4ORCE and long range e-4ORCE (AWD)
      * NOTE: All specifications are as of July 2020 and are subject to homologation. Model names, features and specifications may vary by market. Subject to final validation.

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