Chiropractors

[trinacriabob]

Last Saturday (over a week ago), I am floating around a lake on an air mattress and was essentially dry, enjoying a beautiful day. Between boat wake and some wind, I picked up a few ripples of water. I adjusted myself on the mattress and fell in. Hitting the cold water sent a painful jolt through me and I must have jerked because I had excruciating pain from my shoulder through my fingers on one side. How I drove home is beyond me.

I was miserable at work all week. I went to the doctor and got anti-inflammatory and pain killer meds. People at work even told me I looked miserable. I even took Wednesday off just so I could sleep and take all my medicine doses.

Some told me to see a chiropractor. Today, I'm almost pain free but it ebbs and flows. I'm not too keen on seeing a chiropractor. I'd rather take my meds and soak in the whirlpool at the gym, which seems to help.

Your thoughts and experiences regarding chiropractors?

[scharmer05]

I fractured my back when I was a sophomore in high school and ended up going and seeing a chiropractor but only after I went to the doctor and got it OKed by him. A lot of people just go to the chiropractor first without having any x-rays or scans done to see if there is some actually seriously wrong, and I think that is when you can get into trouble, because from what I have heard chiropractors rarely do x-rays to see whats wrong, they just start pushing here or there to provide temporary comfort. I know a couple people who see one of a bi-weekly basis in order to stay comfortable. I only used one as a last resort, but then after that i did rehabilitation and am now pain free.

[91z4me]

I fractured my back when I was a sophomore in high school and ended up going and seeing a chiropractor but only after I went to the doctor and got it OKed by him.  A lot of people just go to the chiropractor first without having any x-rays or scans done to see if there is some actually seriously wrong, and I think that is when you can get into trouble, because from what I have heard chiropractors rarely do x-rays to see whats wrong, they just start pushing here or there to provide temporary comfort.  I know a couple people who see one of a bi-weekly basis in order to stay comfortable.  I only used one as a last resort, but then after that i did rehabilitation and am now pain free.

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Wow talk about spreading mis-information.

I worked in a Chiropractic office for 2 years and am currently in Chiropractic school I know for a FACT that most chiroprators take X-rays prior to any treatment to rule out things such as advanced osteoperosis, congenital stenosis, congenital or aquired vertebral fusions, and spina bifidas. Basically the only time X-rays are not taken is if a person has had X-rays recently, either at an MD's office or another chiropractor's or if they currently are being actively treated at another chiropractor's office. In fact when a chiropractor looks at X-rays they look from a different prospective than an MD or hospital does. They look at how the bones 'stack up' and how they are shaped to see how they work as a group. MDs and hospitals on the other hand look for fractures and evidence of torn or damaged ligaments. Two totally different things. When you go see a MD or hospital here is their treatment options they have: 1. pain killers and anti inflamatories 2. surgery 3. physical therapy. Trust me all 3 have their place and time when they should be used but think of it this way if something is broken do you go to someone who is a general mechanic or a specialist?

Chiropractors major course of study is the spine and associated nerves. In fact when he is 'pushing' on your back he is feeling or palpating the locations of your spine and 'seeing' how it responds to the induced motion he or she is creating. Also they will feel for things like swollen muscle fibers which are conducive to inflamation and swelling around a nerve which can cause pain, the feel for the location of the spinal processes, and they feel to see how the spine responds to induced motion. Basically if you have a joint that isn't functioning right and you try to induce motion into it then it will resist. This resistance is not just a symptom it is the cause. A properly functioning joint will have some range of motion be it the SI joint or a disc in between two vertebrae. If the motion is not there and there is more stress on one point of the vertebra it will build up a negative charge at that stress point. The body does this to encourage the production of new bone. The calcium in your body, which carries a positive charge, will begin to collect on that stress point and start to produce new bone. The new bone will stabilize the joint, but reduce motion further. This laying down of new bone begins the process known as osteo arthritis. During which the body loses motion in joints and becomes stiffer as a whole.

Also when a nerve is impacted there are literally hundreds of symptoms that could result from: pain at the spot, to radiating pain, to pain that is felt at the fingertips or toes, to numbness, fatigue, a pins and needles feeling, burning feeling, soreness and tightness...Literally thousands of symptoms. Also chiropractors perform orthopedic tests to rule out disc problems such as herniations and disc protrusions. If one is detected the DC can send the patient for an MRI or CT. Also they can request many other procedures that people typically associate with MDs only, Mylograms, NCV tests.

To say that a chiropractor is just a one time thing is also a false statement. If you get sudden pain that comes from just lifting something, and it isn't a pulled muscle then you will likely need to come fairly often to get your body back into shape, both figuratively and factually speaking. Once your spine is back where it needs to be you need to keep it there. I am amazed at how many people I saw and spoke to that said things like "The doctor fixed me a few years ago and then I stopped coming and it crept back up on me." Well it isn't like the pain hunted them down at a new address. It is the same problem that gradually re-appeared because they didn't maintain their body. A great analogy that fits C&G like a glove is car maintaininance: the average person will spend roughly $1000-2000 a year to maintain their car, through oil changes and tire alignments and other little things. But when they think about spending the same amount on your body, something you only have 1 of and something you physically feel when something goes wrong they can't justify it. It just doesn't make sense to me. If you take care of your spine like you do your teeth, check ups every 3-6 months, it can last you forever with little to no problems. But if you don't problems can arise much worse than a cavity.

scharmer05, I didn't mean to go off on you but I cannot let mis information be spread about chiropractic. I just can't. I am not only doing this for my future but the future of my profession, a healing profession, and all future chiropractic patients. If you guys want to seriously take care of your body you need to see a chiropractor and at the VERY least get checked out. I don't like to see people in pain and believe me I have seen people in pain. The reason I am going into this field is not to see people in pain it is to see the smile that comes on a person's face when they can walk out of my office feeling better, because it was ME that helped them.

I will be following this thread and will happily inform/debate anyone who wishes on this subject in an informed and thoughtful manner. There will be no anger or malice to anyone reguardless of what they post.

[91z4me]

Last Saturday (over a week ago), I am floating around a lake on an air mattress and was essentially dry, enjoying a beautiful day.  Between boat wake and some wind, I picked up a few ripples of water.  I adjusted myself on the mattress and fell in.  Hitting the cold water sent a painful jolt through me and I must have jerked because I had excruciating pain from my shoulder through my fingers on one side.  How I drove home is beyond me.

I was miserable at work all week.  I went to the doctor and got anti-inflammatory and pain killer meds.  People at work even told me I looked miserable.  I even took Wednesday off just so I could sleep and take all my medicine doses. 

Some told me to see a chiropractor.  Today, I'm almost pain free but it ebbs and flows.  I'm not too keen on seeing a chiropractor.  I'd rather take my meds and soak in the whirlpool at the gym, which seems to help.

Your thoughts and experiences regarding chiropractors?

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Bob the worst thing you can do right now is to be in or near heat, especially moist heat. Your body is inflamed at the site of your problem, the reason that the MD gave you anti inflamatories is to reduce the inflamation at the site. The inflamation arizes from your body's natural defense mechanism to reduce injury. When we sprain a wrist or ankle we make a splint for the affected area and your body inflamates the area to make its own natural splint. The downside to that is the pain due to pressure on the nerve, based on your comments this is the best diagnosis I can give. The best course of action for yourself if you don't wish to go and see a chiropractor or osteopath, chiropractic's cousin, is to use ice for roughly 15 minutes on the lower part of your neck on the effected side. When I say to use ice I don't just mean put ice directly on the spot, you want to create a moisture rich buffer zone to increase the effectiveness of the cold. The easiest way to do this is to take a wash rag and wet it until it is quite wet and then wring it out. Put that on the place you are icing and put the ice on that, this helps to increase surface conact and make the heat absorption by the ice quicker. Ice is a natural, site specific anti inflamatory. Inflamation is due to increased bloodflow to the area causing an increase temperature at the site. Heat, through a whirlpool or heating pad, will only make the area more inflamed (think about it inflamation see the flam that means heat). After you apply the ice for 15 minutes take it off for around 30 minutes, or until the area returns to body temperature, if you leave it on to long your body will think it is freezing and increase bloodflow to the area and that will counteract what we are doing here. Also don't be lifting heavy things, greater than 10lbs, and don't do things that put your neck in a strained position, things like looking down to read or laying down with your head all cocked to one side (if you do lay down on your side your neck should be in the horizontal line with your spine or on your back your neck should roughly be even with your shoulders).

Also IMO, and be it a baised one, go get checked out by a chiropractor. Prefferably one that is recommended by family or friends who have seen the DC, Docotr of Chiropractic BTW. If they check you out give you X-rays and then bring you back in to hear what they see going on and you don't want to get adjusted they aren't going to force you. Now be-forwarned that typically a person does not get adjusted on the first visit, this gives the DC time to read the X-ray films and compare them to the exam findings and determine what they are dealing with.

Now about an adjustment. Here is the lowdown on those. The doctor will introduce motion to the site and phyiscally move the stuck joint. This does two things: 1 it re aligns the vertebra back to where it should be and 2 it puts motion into the disc, this is important because there is no transport system inside discs they are really like little sacs of jelly and moving them around moves the fluid inside them to get nutrients to different parts of the disc.

I will be watching this thread most of the day to answer any further questions by anyone.

[Charger4U]

Ive always gone to the chiropractor and look how good i turned out, but seriously me and my family have alwas gone to a chiropractor when we have back pains or neck pains, ive never realized they were anything special

[capriceman]

I probably should go but im one of those "Ill be ok" or "I dont need a doctor" type of people.

[Paolino]

I've never used one before, but I would if it was recommended to me and I was in excrutiating pain. I'm a little nervous about all those popping/cracking sounds they make, just because it looks so incredibly painful, but I've heard from at least 3 people that they have felt INCREDIBLE after a visit from the chiropractor.

[NOS2006]

Having been in karate/ju jitsu for 9 years, hockey (if you include street hockey and roller hockey) for quite a few years, and having two jobs stocking shelves with items up to 60 lbs for the last 2 years.. I've definitely used the chiropractor. And I've never had a bad experience. However, make sure you check around for a chiro with a good reputation because if you get the wrong person, they could injure you worse than when you started..

[sciguy_0504]

I have heard some bad stories about chiropractors (more so than any other doctor) so I would probably not go to one. I have almost constant back pain, too, but I'd rather get a massage. For example, I know someone who went to a chiropractor and had a stroke afterwards. It was linked to her little trip.

[91z4me]

I've never used one before, but I would if it was recommended to me and I was in excrutiating pain.  I'm a little nervous about all those popping/cracking sounds they make, just because it looks so incredibly painful, but I've heard from at least 3 people that they have felt INCREDIBLE after a visit from the chiropractor.

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The popping sound is H2 gas that is coming out of solution in the synovial fluid in the discs or joints. It means nothing. if the bones move then the job is done. It is completely painless.

I have heard some bad stories about chiropractors (more so than any other doctor) so I would probably not go to one. I have almost constant back pain, too, but I'd rather get a massage. For example, I know someone who went to a chiropractor and had a stroke afterwards. It was linked to her little trip.

Another misconception. Chiropractic is safer than an aspirin. Take a look at malpractice insurance rates if you want a direct comparison. Chiropractors have some of the lowest rates of any health care professional. My former employer paid less than $1000 a year. Most MDs pay in excess of $40K per year! A surgeon definately tops $80K per year and may be more. A huge reason that it is so high is that DCs cannot and do not prescribe prescription drugs. They account for a huge liability if improperly prescribed.

As for strokes after an adjustment. There have been some studies which do show possible higher risks for strokes after a C1-C2 adjustment but that depends on a number of factors, the highest factor is age and the second is the level of partial blood vessel blockage due to platelet clotting or chloresterol blockage. Either of which are huge indicating factors on their own. Typically older persons, especially those who have either a history of high blood pressure, heart disease, or strokes are not adjusted in the upper cervical region as an extra precaution.

There has been NO direct correlation between adjustments and strokes in any scientifically accurate study.

[Farkas]

I have to agree with everything 91z4me says. My mom works as a chiropractic assisstant, and we have gone regularly for 4 years. In that 4 years, we have learned so much about chiropractic v. the medical system.

I am NEVER sick, almost never have back pain, and all around just feel like I am healthier.

Just thought I'd share

[mute]

ive never been i think its a cool thing and id def go if i had the money . . . i kinda trained my body to crack almost every bone possible . . . under the joints own force so no using other hands to crack my knuckles i crack them by tensing them up and then making a loose fist . . . i can crack my back shoulders neck sternum etc by flexing the muscles around it and ive been told thats healthy as long as its under the force of the muscles around it . . . not like cracking my back over a chair or anything . . . is that healthy or no do you know?

[tipsy420]

My visit was helpful when I went in to get my back and shoulders looked at but I really was expecting to get perscribed some medical marijuana but my chiropractor said that he couldn't I thought thats what marijuana was used for to heal my back and bring peace to my pain...

[Farkas]

Um, I'm pretty sure only people with terminal illnesses are prescribed marijuana, and that is in limited numbers.

I don't know why you wanted your chiropractor to give/get you some? Their job is to fix the problem, not mask it over.

[scharmer05]

sorry 91z, but that is just what i've heard i guess, but that you for all the great information, but im no longer in pain after my back injury, so i don't have a reason to see a chiropractor at this point in my life. There is a good chance i might need one done the road i guess. again sorry

[91z4me]

Um, I'm pretty sure only people with terminal illnesses are prescribed marijuana, and that is in limited numbers.

I don't know why you wanted your chiropractor to give/get you some?  Their job is to fix the problem, not mask it over.

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Medicinal marijuana is also prescribed for Glaucoma treatment, though they use cannabis plants with much lower THC levels than for pain treatment.

A little fact about THC, the active compound prouced by marijuana, it is fat soluable not water soluable. If it were water soluable like alcohol and other chemicals which are excreted out of the body within days. THC gets stored in the fat or lipid cells of the body. Meaning that the effects can reappear months, weeks, or years even decades later.

[91z4me]

sorry 91z, but that is just what i've heard i guess,

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That is why I am replying and answering any and all questions within this thread. There are HUGE amounts of dis-information about Chiropractic. Some of which come from other healthcare providers and some of which is years and even decades old! The AMA and a lot of MDs do not know enough about Chiropractic and rely on stereotypes that are decades old. The only way to change the negative perceptions about Chiropractic is through education and that is why it is the duty of all Chiropractors, their staff, and the patients to educate others who are not informed or mis-informed about the truth of Chiropractic.

[trinacriabob]

I will be going to one tomorrow.

This pain has been going on for 10 days now. It has gotten better, but it lingers and sometimes it's hard to concentrate at work or to sleep properly.

I've taken the meds, taken the hot showers and gotten a massage. Let's see how it goes.

The objections I have (or have heard) is that: 1) they don't give anybody a clean bill of health...everyone has a problem and can benefit from their services, 2) they have you come in for many visits for a particular problem (I went to P.T. about 5 years ago and couldn't stand all the time off I had to take), and 3) with something which could be as elusive as a pinched nerve, how will they "fix" that.

Right now, I'm open to anything.

[91z4me]

The objections I have (or have heard) is that: 1) they don't give anybody a clean bill of health...everyone has a problem and can benefit from their services,

While everyone can benefit from going to a chiropractor on a semi-regular basis, there are people whom have come in because they want to know how they can better take care of themselves and after going through an exam and X-rays they only come in once every few months just to maintain themselves. If you wait until you hurt before you go in then obviously there is a problem there. Heck I go regularly now and before I got free service at school and I have no problems. I just like to take care of my spine, you only get 1 you know.

2) they have you come in for many visits for a particular problem (I went to P.T. about 5 years ago and couldn't stand all the time off I had to take)

Well fixing a problem which has likely be brewing for years takes time. I will come back to this one in a second...

3) with something which could be as elusive as a pinched nerve, how will they "fix" that.

Do you know what a 'pinched nerve' really is? Your DC will explain it to you and it will seem SO much more simple than people think it is. And the fix in theory is really, really simple. Basically if you take a look at a spine there are little spaces behind the body of the vertebra and in front of the posterior and inferior of the spinal processes. In the following picture the nerves are the little yellow things. They come out of the 'nerve holes'.

These nerve hole are actually not as open and large as they appear on models. What the models show are basic structures, you don't get to see all the muscles and ligaments that surround the vertebra and interconnect them. So that 'nerve hole' is not nearly as large as it appears to be. And whenver you have a 'pinched nerve' it doesn't mean that your vertebra is directly impacting the nerve itself, usually pressure on the nerve causes whatever symptoms you have. Whenever you have a vertebra that is twisted, levo- or dextro-rotory, it makes that 'nerve hole' smaller. Also inflamation and other factors can cause pressure on the nerves. Depending on the amount of pressure and location you can have all your different conditions and symptoms.

Now back to your problem bob, if you don't mind can I ask you a few questions about your condition and past medical history on here? If you do not wish to give this information pubically I understand. But I want to demonstrate the process the DC will use to get an idea of what is going on before even touching.

Questions:

1. How long has the problem been going on?

2. Where is the problem?

3. How would you describe it? (sharp, dull, burning, achy, numbness, tingling, pins and needles...)

4. How often has this been bothering you since it began most recently? (0-25% of the time, 25-50%, 50-75%, 75-100% of the time)

5. Have you had a problem with this area before? If so how long ago. What helped and what hurt?

6. What have you been doing for this on your own?

7. Do you have any difficulty moving your neck or back without pain? (This will be done via a Range of Motion test in the office but since I cannot see you or be there to offer help if you have problems I will just ask the question.)

8. Can you rate the pain on a scale of 1-10, with 0 being no pain, 4 being an ouch, and 10 being the worst pain you have ever felt)?

Again if you don't feel comfortable answering then I totally understand, also I am not a DC I am not even in the DC program yet so all advice I give is based upon my individual personal experience and observation it is NOT medical advice on the level of a Doctor of Chiropractic OR a Medical Doctor.

[91z4me]

Bob, How did your visit go?

[trinacriabob]

I've been twice now. Wednesday of last week and on Monday (when I also got a very helpful massage by a LMT in that same practice). I go tomorrow.

It's weird. Each movement and adjustment doesn't get a popping sound, but some do. It seems to help, but then there is still pain that returns about a day later. So it's like 2 steps forward, 1 step back....at least I am 1 step forward per each visit.

This whole thing has been so weird....all from rolling off an air mattress into a cold lake. It's definitely a pull of some kind and it occurred on July 29. God, I swear, I hope I'm back to about 95 % by Labor Day because I plan to be out of town.

[91z4me]

Yeah the popping noise isn't important, the movement is. The noise is actually Hydrogen gas coming out of solution of the snyovial fluid. Sometimes you get it sometimes you don't. The 2 steps forward 1 step back stemms from your vertebra moving back into the position it was before the adjustment. As your body gets used to the changed position of the spine they will stay there longer and you will get longer relief periods. Best of luck to you.