MIDSIZE SEDANS

[Cory Wolfe]

I'd say...

Subaru Legacy

Chevy Malibu

Honda Accord

Mazda6 (current)

Nissan Altima

Saturn Aura

VW Passat

Mercury Milan

Ford Fusion

Pontiac G6

Kia Optima

Hyundai Sonata

Dodge Avenger

Mitsubishi Galant

Toyota Camry

Chrysler Sebring

[regfootball]

this is exactly why motor trend does a disservice to its readers only testing 4 cars. any of the cars that BV mentioned above or that any of us have mentioned are all decent cars. maybe not all 'gotta haves' but certainly all are good vehicles.

[regfootball]

is it time for an UPDATE?

[regfootball]

so lots of new rides. where is this segment at? that new legacy looks damned impressive to me. and the fusion is better than the accord now.

[A Horse With No Name]

Agreed that the Fusion is better than the Accord.

Chris

[smk4565]

Edmunds or Motor Trend just had a comparison ( I think Edmunds) and they ranked Fusion #1, followed by Mazda 6, Accord, Sonata, Malibu and they left the Camry off because it was a distant last in their previous comparison. I thought that was a reasonable finishing order, but the Legacy and Altima were not included, and the Altima usually does well in comparisons.

[Paolino]

Agreed that the Fusion is better than the Accord.

Chris

Hmm... see, I'm still not digging the interior of the Fusion (that blob of plastic in the middle of the passenger side dash annoys me), and I'm not enjoying the overdone grille.

I still think the Accord Coupe looks hot.

[A Horse With No Name]

Can't get into the Accord coupe for some odd reason. I think Oldsmoboi likes them as do several others here.

Paulino, what is your pecking order for the midsizers?

Chris

[Paolino]

Can't get into the Accord coupe for some odd reason. I think Oldsmoboi likes them as do several others here.

Paulino, what is your pecking order for the midsizers?

Chris

Well, if we're going on strictly sedans here (and I'm looking at just the exteriors right now)

Malibu

Mazda6

Passat

Aura

Altima

Fusion

Milan

Accord

G6

Camry

Sonata

Optima

Avenger

Galant

Sebring

[pow]

Edmunds or Motor Trend just had a comparison ( I think Edmunds) and they ranked Fusion #1, followed by Mazda 6, Accord, Sonata, Malibu and they left the Camry off because it was a distant last in their previous comparison. I thought that was a reasonable finishing order, but the Legacy and Altima were not included, and the Altima usually does well in comparisons.

http://blogs.edmunds.com/strategies/2009/0...;mktid=cj260233

[A Horse With No Name]

Well, if we're going on strictly sedans here (and I'm looking at just the exteriors right now)

Malibu

Mazda6

Passat

Aura

Altima

Fusion

Milan

Accord

G6

Camry

Sonata

Optima

Avenger

Galant

Sebring

You and I are pretty close in our rankings. Mine Changes from time to time...but I think you pretty much nailed it.

Chris

[regfootball]

time for updates?

tier 1A

Legacy (assuming it drives ok) value for the money, wide variety of configurations, could end up being the best of the Japanese brand midsizers, mpg w/ awd, nice interior

Milan / Fusion - hybrid plus the rest of a complete and capable lineup with new exterior and great value

Mazda6 - less tacky than the accord and camry

tier 1B

Accord - fails based on ugliness, cheap interior, and not as much refinement

Altima - cheesy interior and tired aesthetic

Passat 2.0 - expensive, smaller, and often in the shop. interior is not the best in some configs.

Malibu - needs a better interior, better model packaging, and more configurations, i.e. manual trans and a sport model

Aura - left for dead

Sonata - good value and warranty, improved interior, making progress

tier 2

Galant / Ralliart - a good capable car needing styling and interior updates

optima - better value than camry for an equally dull car.

Camry - too much competition exposes the ordinary nature of this car

tier 3

Impala - better than a camry for some folks.

G6 - neglected.

Avenger - no words to say

Sebring - even the avenger thinks the sebring is ugly

*LaCrosse excluded

*Kazashi not here yet

there are so many strong cars here i just don't think you can rank them.

Edited August 5, 2009 by regfootball

[Drew Dowdell]

Can't get into the Accord coupe for some odd reason. I think Oldsmoboi likes them as do several others here.

Paulino, what is your pecking order for the midsizers?

Chris

The current Accord coupe is one of the better mainstream Asian designs in a while. The sedan, not so much.

My list:

1. Malibu - I know you'll probably think I'm just GM humping, but I think they are the most handsome mainstream sedan out there. I'll take an LTZ in black with the Black/Brick two tone interior please.

2. Milan - I liked the previous one and I like the new one.

3. Aura - Not as visually appealing as the Malibu, but not bad.

4. Fusion - I like the new one better than the previous, but the aesthetic just doesn't grab me like the Malibu and Milan.

5. Legacy - Finally an attractive Subi. I've long respected Subarus as vehicles but I just couldn't get into the styling.

6. Impala - Big car feel for not a lot of money. For those wanting a more "classic" feel without going all out and getting a Grand Marquis, this would be a good old reliable. I happen to like the styling, but wish it would get the new Chevy nose.

7. Sonata/Optima - Fine as an appliance. Mildly more interesting than a Camry simply because it's not a Camry. I'd never buy one.

8. Mazda 6 - The car itself is fine, but there just seems to be something missing in the exterior design. I can't put my finger on it, but something just seems off.

9. Passat - The design is tired but not bad. They've been milking that Passat roofline for about as long as they're going to be able to. Seeing plenty of Skodas in person, the Passat reminds me of them.

10. Accord - The exterior is just off. Coupe is nice though.

11. Camry - Very tired. There are much more solid platforms out there.

12. G6 - Never appealed to me. Interior completely sub-par.

13 Altima - Ditto G6 without the benefit of being a domestic.

14. Avenger - A slightly more attractive Sebring

15. Sebring - A complete basket case. Had a rental in May that should have qualified for Cash for Clunkers right off the lot.

16. Galant - As bad as the Sebring but without any of the "interesting personality".

*Lacrosse is left off because I haven't seen one in person yet. If it's everything it's cracked up to be, it'll probably take the top slot and bump all the others down one.

[regfootball]

REload....based simply on my order of preference. not necessarily the market's view as a whole.

(borderline valid for this comparison based upon high prices)

Regal

CC

2011 Sonata - I am assuming the drive is good....seen one in person and it has the goods visually, on the spec sheet, and in price.

Legacy - assuming it drives ok, having the 2.5GT really helps here

Milan / Fusion - more or less a tie with the Legacy. I think the subie offering cheaper AWD gives it a light nudge ahead.

Kizashi - awaiting test drive, assuming that the sporting nature of the car sets it apart, having sat in one i can say the interior is very nice..

Malibu - pretty much I would tie the Altima and Malibu simply because I like GM and am being a homer here. GM needs to spruce up some interior bits.

Altima - spending almost 1000 miles in one, while not exciting, makes me at least move it ahead of the Mazda and Accord, with a cautious endorsement of the CVT. Aesthetic is getting old.

Mazda6 - less tacky than the accord and camry. it seemed dynamic when it was new but for some reason it already feels tired to me.

Accord - fails based on ugliness, cheap interior, ugliness and being ugly.

Passat 2.0 - lacks the style the CC has. Would be rated higher if it cost less.....be before a few more of the others.

Optima

Galant

Impala

Camry

Avenger - no words to say

Sebring - even the avenger thinks the sebring is ugly

what did i miss this time

-edit-

after consideration I think the Legacy is a better product than the Hyundai. Props to Hyundai for their improvements however. The Mazda and Honda and maybe even the Nissan all may be better products possibly. I rated the Hyundai high due to its value, interior, mpg, warranty, and certain aspects of its styling being out in front. Certainly the ugly front end is not included in that.

If I was shopping I would be happy to purchase anything through the Mazda6 on my list. Domestically I would drive a Malibu or Fusion, although I think I would lean to the Fusion a bit. A regal when it arrives if it is considered with this class would probably go to the front once the better engines come on line.

I think the Legacy for the Asian brands combines more of the best attributes that interest me than any of the other ones. A Kizashi interests me from the sportiness and value equation. The Hyundai as noted above. The Mazda an Nissan are competent (if dull). The new Legacy has a lot going for it for me, styling, interior is nice, size is big enough now finally. awd, good prices and mpg. Subaru in the past suggests the product will be somewhat reliable.

I think ultimately incentives and current deals weigh in so much on this segment that if you don't have a particular allegiance to a brand, or absolute styling fave, you could be very pleased with most of the vehicles in this segment.

As an example, even with the cheap interior in more basic trims, if i got the right deal on a Malibu over a fusion or Legacy, i would enjoy the car a lot.

Edited February 26, 2010 by regfootball

[regfootball]

I posted this in the Saturn Aura topic and thought it would make good banter as its own thread.

With all the new entries, tell us what or rank your family sedans.

Please try to exclude lux and near lux cars. This is middle class bread and butter cars.

I originally started comparing Aura vs. Fusion

then it brached out.

Here's my pecking order, taking into account to a small degree what the buff books may say and how complete a car it is for what you get. this does not neccessarily reflect what i would buy first.

1. 07 Altima

2A. Accord

2B. Aura

2C. Passat 2.0T

3A. Milan

3B. Fusion

4A. Cam-lee

4B. Impala

4C. 07 Sebring

5A. Mazda 6

5B. Malibu SS

5C. G6

5D. Galant Ralliart

6. LaCrosse

7. Grand Prix

8. Subaru Legacy

9. Chery

10. Sonata

11. Kia Optima

12. Suzuki Verona

which ones did i miss?

BUMP

is it time to revisit this thread for 2013/2014?

Edited September 7, 2012 by regfootball

[Robert Hall]

Hmmm...just off the top of my head ('13 versions)..judging by styling, value, space..

1. Fusion

2. Passat

3. Accord

4. Optima

5. Altima

6. Malibu

7. Camry

8. Sonata

9. Legacy

10. 200

[regfootball]

this is probably how i would slot them to my own preference today. very well could change. The Camry and Chrysler twins are prob the only ones you could not give me for free.

1. Fusion

2. Mazda6

3. Accord

4. Altima

5. Malibu

6. Passat

7. Sonata

8. Optima

9. Legacy

10. Camry

11. Avenger

12. 200

pretty amazing when you consider how many models got weeded out. Aura, Grand Prix, Galant, Milan

malibu as high for me is a homer pick. it would probably make sense to have it a little lower but at the same time i think its refinement and quietness have to account for something.

Edited September 8, 2012 by regfootball

[Robert Hall]

I forgot the Mazda6..it's so invisible in the market..the new one looks quite promising, though...I'd rank it high..I forgot the Avenger was still in production, it's such a non-entity.

[regfootball]

the midsizers really crossover into the large cars now also, and the lux / near lux. you can option a new fusion to 38+ grand.....

Impalas, MKZ's Regals, TSX or TL, they all seem to crossover.

Edited September 8, 2012 by regfootball

[A Horse With No Name]

this is probably how i would slot them to my own preference today. very well could change. The Camry and Chrysler twins are prob the only ones you could not give me for free.

1. Fusion

2. Mazda6

3. Accord

4. Altima

5. Malibu

6. Passat

7. Sonata

8. Optima

9. Legacy

10. Camry

11. Avenger

12. 200

pretty amazing when you consider how many models got weeded out. Aura, Grand Prix, Galant, Milan

malibu as high for me is a homer pick. it would probably make sense to have it a little lower but at the same time i think its refinement and quietness have to account for something.

this is probably how i would slot them to my own preference today. very well could change. The Camry and Chrysler twins are prob the only ones you could not give me for free.

1. Fusion

2. Mazda6

3. Accord

4. Altima

5. Malibu

6. Passat

7. Sonata

8. Optima

9. Legacy

10. Camry

11. Avenger

12. 200

pretty amazing when you consider how many models got weeded out. Aura, Grand Prix, Galant, Milan

malibu as high for me is a homer pick. it would probably make sense to have it a little lower but at the same time i think its refinement and quietness have to account for something.

this is probably how i would slot them to my own preference today. very well could change. The Camry and Chrysler twins are prob the only ones you could not give me for free.

1. Fusion

2. Mazda6

3. Accord

4. Altima

5. Malibu

6. Passat

7. Sonata

8. Optima

9. Legacy

10. Camry

11. Avenger

12. 200

pretty amazing when you consider how many models got weeded out. Aura, Grand Prix, Galant, Milan

malibu as high for me is a homer pick. it would probably make sense to have it a little lower but at the same time i think its refinement and quietness have to account for something.

Pretty Accurate, actually, the fusion is still the best of the bunch...however, the chances of my buying a midsize sedan are about the chances That Rick Perry will be the next democratic nominee for president....

[Robert Hall]

Pretty Accurate, actually, the fusion is still the best of the bunch...however, the chances of my buying a midsize sedan are about the chances That Rick Perry will be the next democratic nominee for president....

Yeah...I wouldn't buy one, but I'll probably rent one again soon, though.... though I prefer to rent full sizers (stupid Alamo is putting Malibus in the full size row these days).

Next weekend's upcoming rental from Enterprise is supposed to be a 'premium', we'll see what that turns out to be---driving over to Fontana for the Indy Car Series final race of the season.

Edited September 8, 2012 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[A Horse With No Name]

Enjoy the race!

Fullsize premium car is another matter, were I in another state of life, I could see owning a CTS or a 300...both really nice cars.

[Robert Hall]

Enjoy the race!

Fullsize premium car is another matter, were I in another state of life, I could see owning a CTS or a 300...both really nice cars.

I had a CTS rental in Sonoma, CA over Labor Day weekend....the first time I'd driven one for several days...sweet car (though the front air dam is too low...kept scraping it on kerbs). When I was at the Porsche Rennsport Reunion at Laguna Seca last year I had a 300. Really like both cars, either would be a great next daily driver for me.

[Cory Wolfe]

These days its pretty hard to pick one over all the others. Each has a lot of strengths, few have weaknesses (except for the Chrysler twins). Honestly, its probably a toss up between the new 6, Fusion, Passat, Accord, Altima, and the Korean twins and packaging/pricing would end up being the decider.

[Drew Dowdell]

Seeing as you can get a 300 for higher end mid-size money, I'd go with that.

Passat TDI would be my runner up if I was feeling economical.

[David]

I think there are some great mid size sedan choices, just wish they would give these mid size sedans the ability to get a torque monster diesel besides the Passat TDI unless I have missed some others in our US market.

[regfootball]

I have been lot cruising many fusions and malibus lately and to be honest the Fusion is less impressive in lower trims especially than what you would think as far as presentation. Still a nice car....but I really like the look of the Malibu more......looks sexier and has more presence, arguably than the Fusion.....

Altima has way too thick of chrome on the window surround.....

[David]

I have been lot cruising many fusions and malibus lately and to be honest the Fusion is less impressive in lower trims especially than what you would think as far as presentation. Still a nice car....but I really like the look of the Malibu more......looks sexier and has more presence, arguably than the Fusion.....

Altima has way too thick of chrome on the window surround.....

Altima / Nissan is hoping to blind people with their chrome so you miss all the other shortcomings of this auto.

[regfootball]

BUMP

I've driven a lot of these lately so I will try to add some notes.

[ocnblu]

MACARENA

OK, sounds good.

[regfootball]

After driving the Mazda yesterday, (my review is in reader reviews), this is how I think a Car and Driver or a Motor Trend might rate them (averaging out the strengths of all the various trim and powertrain levels)

1. Accord

2. Mazda6

3. Fusion (haven't driven this one yet, just guessing)

4. Altima

5. Passat

6. Optima (have not driven but it may share some things with the Hyundai

7. Sonata

8. Legacy

9. Camry (Have not driven and I do not intend to)

10. Malibu

11. Avenger (sort of a throw in to make sure there was a bottom dweller)

Here are some notes of what i think

Mazda is probably a more balanced offering than any of these cars. The Sonata is a good mainstream public car. But the C/D type magazines will continue to give Honda the crown for whatever reason. A Motor Trend will probably move the Camry way up as well.

If I were re-sorting my preferences again just based on the ones I know, this is probably how it would sort out.....

Like a lot

-Mazda6, Malibu (probably will like the Ford too)

Like enough

-Sonata, Passat, Legacy (prob Optima too) Passat would move up if it didn't have sh1tty base engine.

Like some but not completely, would not really look to owning one

-Accord, Altima note: both of these cars would move up a lot if they took care of noise issues / NVH. Altima feels cheesy to a degree.

No thanks

-Camry and Avenger

Really just about any of this bunch I would enjoy but my observations so far, I would have no problems aside from a small back seat picking up a Malibu, despite its flaws. It's the best highway car, and it seemed to me to be the most quiet car as well. I think the 2.5 is a really good powertrain.

Edited January 28, 2013 by regfootball