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YEAR :: Plymouth -- Dodge -- DeSoto -- Chrysler 1957 -- 762,231 -- 287,608 - 117,514 -- 124,675 1958 -- 443,799 -- 137,861 - 49,445 -- 63,110 1959 -- 458,259 -- 156,385 - 45,724 -- 69,970 1960 -- 447,724 -- 367,804 - 25,581 -- 77,285 1961 -- 350,285 -- 269,367 -- 3,034 -- 96,454 Chrysler's entry-level Newport Series was new for '61, and ChryCo assuredly knew they were going to pull DeSoto's plug when developing the Newport (that announcement came only 6 weeks after the '61s debuted). It was still priced above DeSoto, but it closed the gap. Plymouth gained the Valiant compact in '60 but was seeing an erosion of appeal due to styling after the high-water designs in '57-58. Forget the '57 Chevy; it's impossible to dismiss the sheer appeal the '57 Plymouth design had with consumers (1956: 552K). Dodge had the Dart in '60 but it was still basically full-size in '60-62 (wheelbase 118-116"). Dart didn't go compact until '63, but the 1st gen Darts at least were price leaders. Dodge had a great year in '60 with a lot of appeal, but the '61s dimmed the porch light. DeSoto saw a shocking contraction. Why the '59s didn't gain in sales is a question. Buick did a lot of the same thing despite being in Chrysler's price tier; sales dropped from the banner year of '55, every year thru '58, and only saw a tiny increase for '59 (240K > 285K). The compacts really did add to the legacy brand's bottom (volume) lines in the '60s. Buick didn't eclipse its '55 volume of 737K until 1973.

I think people need to take some responsibility so they don't end in the hospital and burden the system. Obviously, more elderly people are ending up in the hospital. That will be Medicare and Medicaid dollars paying for those stays for the most part. It's an outright waste. My friend's mom was in the hospital for 5 to 6 days with covid. I wonder what that tab looks like. My friend, and her mom and nearby relatives, all have the packaged demographics that go with the "statement" they need to make. And this lady made the same statement others who have gotten sick and landed in the hospital have made: 'I'm glad I didn't get vaccinated.' Just where are the brownie points, the pats on the back, or cutting in line at the Pearly Gates (if that's what you believe) going to come from? I haven't said anything like 'this could have been avoidable' to my friend, but I'm also getting radio silence from the other end. It's sad that this is dividing people. I didn't think it would. I go with what I remember from basic statistics - bell shaped curves, probability, etc. and, if I am doing just fine almost a year after receiving my first 2 injections, I will probably continue to do just fine. Maybe some side effects may show up later. Hopefully and probably not. I'd rather not be fighting long-term covid.

Did so a few days after Christmas. I've have the Pfizer (2) + Moderna (1) combination. I feel fine.

I like those Eldos. I like the two generations of Sevilles of that era also..

Not that I dislike the El-Dogs you posted @Robert Hall and @oldshurst442 But this was one of the last gasps of the Cadillac styling department until the CT6 came about. (With some minor brainstem activity for the '03 CTS)

Unibody v. BOF ride quality comes down more around what the manufacturer does beyond that decision. My BOF Avalanche rides fantastic on the highway, most of the Ram pickups and Magnaride equipped Denalis do too. The F-150 rides terrible unless there is one version out there with an active suspension that I haven't driven yet. The Ford Mach-E rides like crap if you don't get the active suspension. The Telsa Model 3, which is unibody, rides like a Conestoga wagon. You may be thinking of the really old tech stuff, but even then the Town Car v. DTS, the Town Car rode better, but the DTS handled better. Part of the reason was that the DTS was so stiff for its time that Cadillac had trouble dialing out the road imperfections. All of the last generation GM G-Bodies have that issue.

Top of the line '59 DeSoto Adventurer convertible, 1 of only 82 built. Prolly a quarter million dollar car in this flawless shape.

The Atlas I-6 was a modern (for the time) engine that was bolted to non-modern stuff. It was incredibly smooth and loved to rev, it really got its power higher up in the RPM band, which isn't ideal for a heavy SUV, but compared to what we have today with DOHC V6es it was fine. But then GM stuck a 4-speed automatic behind it so it always felt like it was screaming or lugging. In typical GM fashion, they canceled it right when it had the potential to flourish... the new 6-speed autos were coming out, direct Injection was being introduced to the mainstream, and turbo technology was entering a renaissance phase. An Atlas I-6 with DI and a Turbo would have beaten Ford to the punch with Ecoboost and probably been a better performer to boot. Heck, even a turbo I-5 would have been great for the re-return of the Colorado/Canyon or as 1-2 matchup against the Ford 2.7EB and 3.5EB. Both the I5 and I6 would probably have been de-bored a bit in turbo applications but it still would have been a great matchup.

If the timing is right, please consider getting your third.

Watched what I could find on Hummer EV assembly. GM has only released a bit of video, which numerous different videos sample from, it seems. From what I saw, I feel the Hummer best fits in the 'unibody' category, as the raw shell moving down the line getting spot welded up already shows chassis structure attached. Later on, the battery pack is seen being lifted up from below into the chassis's bottom. While I accept that there is a 'structural contribution' via the battery pack, I wouldn't be surprised if it's largely to do with the large bottom plate that bolts to the body structure & seals the battery compartment, making a huge, solid, rigid 'squaring' of the body. I don't think it would be advisable to have liquid-cooled batteries themselves subjected to repeated torsional stresses, esp in an intended off-roader like the Hummer.

God it's ugly.

They'll all be shaped like a Tylenol. I never really understood why DeSoto didn't sell, they were pretty good looking. Dodges of the era were painfully ugly. Plymouth was "beneath" it. It was probably something dumb like the Chrysler Windsor being roughly the same price and at least that sat in the same dealership with the Imperial.

Nailed it. My parents had an Envoy XL with the Atlas and that's exactly how I felt about it. The crappy 4spd 100% ruined how that engine felt. if it just had a decent 6spd behind it, it would have felt so much better. It would have felt at least as good of an engine as it was.

GM marketing is so dumb.

And my favorite Eldorado..the '67. Such a crisp, clean design. Love the proportions and roofline.

Possible theme song? So long ago I don't remember when That's when they said I lost my only friend Well they said she died easy of a broke heart disease As I listened through the cemetery trees I seen the sun comin' up at the funeral at dawn With the long broken arm of human law Now it always seemed such a waste She always had a pretty face I wondered why she hung around this place Hey-ey-ey Come on try a little Nothing is forever Got to be something better than in the middle Me and Cinderella We put it all together We can drive it home With one headlight She said it's cold It feels like independence day And I can't break away from this parade But there's got be an opening Somewhere here in front of me Through this maze of ugliness and greed And I've seen the sign up ahead at the county line bridge Sayin' all is good and nothingness is dead We run until she's out of breath She ran until there's nothing left She hit the end, just her window ledge Hey-ey-ey Come on try a little Nothing is forever Got to be something better than in the middle But me and Cinderella We put it all together We can drive it home With one headlight Well this place is old It feels just like a beat up truck I turn the engine but the engine doesn't turn Well it smells of cheap wine and cigarettes This place is always such a mess Sometimes I think I'd like to watch it burn I'm so alone Feel just like somebody else Man, I ain't changed, but I know I ain't the same But somewhere here in between the city walls of dying dreams I think her death, it must be killing me Hey, hey, hey-ey-ey Come on try a little Nothing is forever There's got to be something better than in the middle Me and Cinderella We put it all together We can drive it home With one headlight We can drive it home With one headlight Through this maze of ugliness and greed It feels just like a beat up truck I turn the engine but the engine doesn't turn Well it smells of cheap wine and cigarettes Sometimes I think I'd like to watch it burn S 3 X Y So hot and sexy, they are on fire!

Who says Corvettes are not muscle cars? I believe all these pics are 'vintage'. The one thing that I loved about the '70s.

I came, ahem, across this ad while googling 'motor wheel spyder rim' I would like to blow Miss Muffet's doors off too. And then, she could, ahem, blow my doors off after I blow hers... But then I found out she has a....brother. I am not one to mess around with somebody else's gal. ?

DeSoto had a banner year in '57, largely due to the gorgeous styling. But the '58 recession hit them very hard- down 60% (the mid-price tiered brands all got hit), and they never recovered.

The number of vaccinated + boosted in hospitals for Covid is so low it wouldn't be statistically significant. A recent report from New Haven Hospital shows that 20% of Covid patients are vaccinated, but of those, the vast majority are not boosted. This really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. We already know that the body's immune memory for this virus degrades over time and variants accelerate this decline. In most healthy people, the immune memory for this virus declines by 7% - 10% a month. It doesn't matter if your immunity is from a vaccine or from being infected with the virus itself, but getting vaccinated starts you off at a higher immunity than being infected. So in my case when I got my second vaccine back in Feb 2021, I would have had my full ~93% effective immunity by beginning of March, but by November when I got my booster, that effective immunity had likely dropped to around ~50%... below the effectiveness of the typical flu vaccine. Getting boosted should have bumped me back up over ~90% again. The narrative around the vaccine really needs to change to one of "you aren't fully vaccinated unless you're getting regular boosters" because of this immune memory decline. While I don't have the studies in front of me...we can prove that Covid patients are causing non-covid deaths. All you have to do is take the excess deaths number and subtract the number of known covid deaths. In 2021 we had over 15% higher than expected deaths for at least a total of 452,000 extra deaths (not all of the December data is in yet). Can *I* prove it? No, I'm not a data scientist... but that knowledge exists and is out there. Back in November we exceeded the entirety of deaths from the HIV pandemic all the way back to the '80s... but we did it in 2 years. What would be absurd is assuming that dropping the entire 40ish year case load of the HIV/AIDS pandemic on the US health system in a matter of 2 years wouldn't impact the health system. When hospitals have to shut down non-urgent but still pretty serious surgeries or cancer treatments due to Covid patients, there are going to be some negative outcomes. Where have you been for the last 18 months? This has been going on for a while. Before the vaccine hospitals were having to make choices on which patients to try and save and which not to use up valuable resources on. If a 50 year old obese man with a smoking habit and a 23 year old relatively healthy woman who never smoked both check into the ER with severe covid and there's only one ventilator or ECMO machine... guess who is getting it.... Now that we have a vaccine.. the decision usually becomes even easier. The one who was vaccinated or boosted is probably getting more care primarily because it is more likely to have a positive outcome. We already know the results of not getting vaccinated and being checked in to get vented, the proof is stacked up in refrigerated trailers. The statistics have gotten better since the beginning of the pandemic, but if you were admitted for covid and got vented there was a ~75% chance you were leaving the hospital in a freezer truck. There's a video going around of a guy who needs a kidney transplant turning down the kidney and preferring to die of kidney failure rather than getting the vaccine. Talk about absurd. He's willing to die twice to "pwn the libs". This also isn't new for transplants. Transplant patients are required to be up to date on ALL their vaccines because they will be immunosuppressed after surgery. That's been the case for decades. Active alcoholics don't get livers either.

I have a particularly contrarian view on the Maverick

I agree that it doesn't matter... but I disagree that BOF can't ride well or inherently rides better/worse than unibody. Both can ride well, both can ride like crap. It's all the other stuff that goes into it that makes the difference. The 2011 Pathfinder was a truck based vehicle with some respectable off-roading chops. The 2012 was a Mommymobile that Nissan built for soccer moms. You might as well compare a Wrangler to a new Pathfinder. The old Trailblazers rode better than the new Traverse. That's probably a more apt comparison.

Never rode in a 2011. But I can tell you that a 2022 Wagoneer rides like Town Car to the point that Albert hated driving it because it was too mushy.

Perhaps...but a core value of Escalade is excess, so too much is never enough... they could offer a 950hp V-series Blackwing Blingmaster w/ 24 inch chrome wheels for $200k and sell a few...

Leaving some room to later add moar power for a Blackwing version..

@oldshurst442 Check the label on the photos. Dannon makes these yogurt cups, so you may very well have them in Canada. Not all American grocery stores carry all these flavors. Once certain ones do, and I do know the rhyme and reason as to how they choose to carry, and not carry, certain flavors of yogurt. It's the same situation with salad dressing flavors.

What's 'too many'? 300K Cadillacs or 2,213K BMWs?

Consumers still think a toyoter is an excellent, problem-free vehicle, too. Agreed that mass-volume, mainstream vehicles are no longer 'luxury' because they're everywhere. Add in glacially-paced styling updates and it appears like there's 100s of 1000s on the roads around you. The antithesis of exclusivity. But... smh says whatever sells the mostest, is the bestest.

The X5 outsold the 3-series last year (in the USA), the X5 starts at $60k and the M is over 100k. So it isn't like they are just selling cheap cars. The X3 was their top seller, but Lexus and Cadillac's top sellers are the SUV's of the same price also. 20% gain last year for X5, up 32% for X6, up 12% for X7, up 20% for 7-series, brand was up 20% overall. So their expensive stuff is gaining just as much as any of the low cost stuff. Worldwide BMW sold 163,542 M cars, up 13.4% for a record high. They didn't water anything down, they are just selling more, so the consumer must like what they are building.

That's not a good goal for a 'luxury' brand. That means they have watered down the brand to the lowest common denominator to appeal to the vapid masses. CUVs, automatic transmissions and 4 cyl engines. No longer building 'the ultimate driving machine' for driving enthusiasts, but building a lot of vanilla lease appliances for generic consumers.

That must mean they're the bestest brand of all the brands, eh? Time to switch allegiance!

And yet they were #1 in the USA last year and #1 in the world in sales. So people seem to like what they are building.

I think it was a teenage bear. It looks like it might have just recently parted ways with its mother and any siblings. Lucky for the Amazon delivery guy. He was so damn relaxed about the whole thing. - - - - - I had mentioned Greek yogurt before and how much I liked the flavor Toasted Marshmallow. I then tried one called Creme Brulee because I couldn't find Toasted Marshmallow. I didn't like it. (Their basic Strawberry and Strawberry Cheesecake are good.) With basic Greek yogurt being blander in taste, it's great to have the addition of some flavor so I'll eat it more readily. I like that it's good for the gut. So, I again found and stocked up on this Toasted Marshmallow flavor. So damn good.

Diesels have no future in passenger cars, though..it's pretty clear automakers are moving to BEV development full throttle...maybe 10 years ago there was an opportunity for diesels... They have made smaller versions of the HF 3.6, though. A 3.0 IIRC.. And the full-size trucks still have the pushrod 4.3 V6 available. (Edit--apparently the 4.3 is gone for '22, except in the ancient Express/Savana vans).

The comments say he made himself bigger blah blah blah. While true, it looked like that was a baby bear and well baby bears usually dont look for a fight. And while Im trying to talk a big game, I dont know how I would have reacted. Probably not as brave as this driver, but I do know one thing, had momma bear been around, no amount of making one's self bigger would have worked... Best comment goes to this gentleman though: (Im a sucker for bad puns and dad jokes!) Alan Smith 1 month ago Porch Pirates are becoming unBEARable! (pun)

Yup. I hear ya!!! I sometimes do forget. I sometimes dont. Weird how I didnt forget when the discussion a couple of pages ago was about a need for an Escalade V a decade ago... Its funny how the thought process goes. When one is passionate about a certain idea, how that passion clouts judgement...

A diesel sports sedan would not have gone over very well in the US...though in Europe they loved that shit. Keep in mind the time frame...GM was circling the drain in the mid-to-late 00s... cutting costs, dropping platforms and divisions, bankruptcy, etc.

- - - - - This whole 'they don't make it anymore so it's a "failure"' mindset has to die. It's illegitimate. Trends/ needs/ regulations/ demographics/ product planning change all the time, and many times, 'good things' get discontinued for the same reasons. I'll repeat myself ; when GM keeps something around for years & years, it's 'bad'. When they discontinue something after a few years it's 'bad'. Are we sure it's the longevity/lack thereof that's the problem... or is it just because it's GM?

Or..... use the 277 HP/460 TRQ all-aluminum, DOHC/4-valve Duramax TD in the sport sedan. Same configuration, 1.2 less liters displacement, 200 more TRQ... undoubtedly could be tuned higher; win-win-win. 5 displacements, 10 different model lines... what was the production volume??

Why spend all that money, time and effort only to get a single usage out of them? Even if these engines were scalable to have base small Canyon pick-up trucks use the 4 cylinder version, the H3 Hummer and the upper level pick-up trucks to use the 5 cylinder and with the various versions of the GMT360 SUV (Trailblazer, Envoy, ,Rainier, SAAB, Bravada and Isuzu) use the 6 cylinder and not being able to use them further in cars? To repeat my point, these engines were seemingly great for sport sedan usage.

Yes, the CTS and RWD STS were engineered to have V configured engines in their engine bays. But that is what is intriguing me. Is there something that I dont know about the Atlas family of inline engines, especially the 6 cylinder one, that makes them ONLY truck based engines? Because clearly GM could have engineered, (maybe NOT a 1st gen CTS, because it was already engineered for a V6) but the 2nd gen CTS and 1st gen RWD STS, (same platform too right?) to have this inline 6 under the hood and thus prolonging the life of the Atlas family. Recycling of these engines as SMK put it above, would have been great for Cadillac's BMW fighting image... I wanna know if the Atlas family of engines were only truck engines. But they were aluminum in construction so technically they were light enough for car usage. Its clear that GM had scalable usage in mind when designing these as the 4,5 and 6 cylinder versions all shared components with each other. They were the same engines basically...

Yeah, never used beyond the GMT-360s. But the 00s were a turbulent time for GM, they eventually gave up on the GMT-360s so the engine went away when they went away. Probably would have been too big for Cadillac RWD sedans which were designed for V6s and V8s..and the rest of GM's sedans in the US were FWD then.

I would call the cancelation of the Blackwing a fail on General Motor's part (and Cadillac's) because billions of dollars of R&D went into it with the idea to make it an exclusive V8 for Cadillac. To elevate Cadillac's image with a 'modern' V8 (no in-block cams, OHV and pushrods) only to offer it in a 1 year only, high performance sedan that billions of dollars of R&D also went into, just to kill them off both with only a handful being sold. The REAL stupid thing about that is that the CT6 V Blackwing was sold out within minutes of it being on the market changing Cadillac's mind and making another limited but short production run of them. Sold out within minutes yet again... Another stupid thing about the Blackwing V8, not with the engine and engineering itself, but with the engineering of the consequent vehicles after the CT6. The Blackwing V8 does not fit into the CT5. The engine is too high and too wide to fit inside of the CT5's engine bay. OK...an argument SHALL be made in that why do people think cam in-block, OHV, pushrod V8s are old and inferior tech? Shytty biased automotive journalism and self hatin', fake car enthusiasts could be blamed. So...a 'lesser' V8 continues to power the Cadillac super sedan negating the supposed need for a 'modern' DOHC, 32 valve, hot vee turbo engine. The LT1 V8 aint so bad after all watching all the real and fake automotive journalists and youtubers and enthusiast sport car drivers swoon over the CT5 V Blackwing AND wishing the LT1 ALSO powered the CT4... IF billions of dollars of R&D money went into the Blackwing V8, and the Escalade had too many expensive upgrades to initially launch the Escalade with a Blackwing V8 under the hood, that also eludes to the Blackwing V8 being a mistake and a fail. GM and Cadillac didnt count on canceling the CT6 program that early.

'71 GP SSJ ~

Giving up on the 'failing' EVs already, Daimler?

Cancel a model / powertrain and its "failed". Continue a model / powertrain and its "recycled". OK, bucko.

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2021/03/cadillac-chief-engineer-hints-at-high-performance-escalade-v/ Reason why Escalade does not get Blackwing designation is that Cadillac engineers and marketing folk want to reserve that for vehicles that will be the pinnacle of performance and track capabilities. And an Escalade, due to weight and high center of gravity, will not have that. From March 7, 2021 when Cadillac head engineer Tony Roma was hinting at an Escalade V. He said that not all Cadillac vehicles need to be Blackwings and proceeded to explain that statement.

More Eldo Brougham love ~