• Sign in to follow this  
    Followers 0

    Automakers In Europe To Go Back To Larger Displacement Engines


    • The small displacement engine in Europe is going away

    The current trend in powertrains is to downsize engine displacement to meet emission standards. Paired with a set of turbochargers, three-cylinder and even two-cylinder engines can produce enough power to move large vehicles. But this trend is coming to an end in Europe.

    Reuters reports that a number of European automakers are beginning to scrap their small displacement engines for larger displacement ones. With a number of real-world tests showing these engines produce higher CO2 and nitrogen oxide (NOx) emissions than in the lab, and stricter tests coming in the next few years, automakers are making a costly reversal.

    "They might be doing OK in the current European test cycle, but in the real world they are not performing. So there's actually a bit of 'upsizing' going on, particularly in diesel," said Pavan Potluri, an analyst with IHS Automotive.

    Industry sources gave Reuters some examples of automakers going bigger in terms of displacement.

    • General Motors will ditch the 1.2L diesel in 2019. The smallest engine will be 25-30 percent bigger in displacement
    • Renault will be increasing an almost 10 percent increase on the 1.6L diesel engine in the near future
    • Volkswagen will replace the 1.4L three-cylinder diesel for a new 1.6L in their Polo subcompact

    "The techniques we've used to reduce engine capacities will no longer allow us to meet emissions standards. We're reaching the limits of downsizing." said Alain Raposo, head of powertrain at the Renault-Nissan alliance.

    We can't help but wonder if this change will extend into the U.S. There are a small number of three-cylinders engines on offer, but many automakers have been swapping V6s for turbocharged four-cylinders. 

    Source: Reuters

    0


      Report Article
    Sign in to follow this  
    Followers 0


    User Feedback


    Proof that smaller is not always better. Just look at the emissions. I hope this continues till the Hybrids and EVs take over. After all, bigger is greener! :P

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I'd assume they will still be under 2 liter engines, but they have probably found they can rev it less and put less stress on a 1.6 liter, than they do on a boosted like crazy 1.2 or 1.4 that revs higher.  I don't think they'll be going back to widespread V6s.

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    46 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

    I'd assume they will still be under 2 liter engines, but they have probably found they can rev it less and put less stress on a 1.6 liter, than they do on a boosted like crazy 1.2 or 1.4 that revs higher.  I don't think they'll be going back to widespread V6s.

    How many cars in Europe even have v6 engines in them?

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Its still all relative though. 

    Adding 10% to a 1.6L diesel ( Renault ) is only adding 160cc..

    GM of europe small diesel will be 1.8L

    They're not ditching tiny engines for  " large displacement " Large displacement in Europe is what, like a 2.5L?

     

     

     

     

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    It's just a reversal of a trend... and a good reversal too. I originally felt that displacement reduction + turbo charging was the answer, but it hasn't seemed to be the case. 

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    1.5 in my malibu is pretty good little small displacement mill and actually gets pretty good mpg.  would love the power of a 2.0 but it would suck lots more gas.  A 1.75 turbo would be about perfect.

    Like the turbo mid range punch so much, driving the pentastar van makes me think the midrange is sluggish on it.  Ford Edge sport has the 2.7 turbo v6, but that isn't super on gas either.  Wonder if a 2.5 turbo 6 wouldn't be a great mill for good power and mpg mix for vans and SUV's

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    loki

    Posted (edited) · Report

    most of us probably remember Dwightlooi's many technicals about large displacement, low piston count engines and such...  good times, and interesting.

    22 minutes ago, regfootball said:

    1.5 in my malibu is pretty good little small displacement mill and actually gets pretty good mpg.  would love the power of a 2.0 but it would suck lots more gas.  A 1.75 turbo would be about perfect.

    Like the turbo mid range punch so much, driving the pentastar van makes me think the midrange is sluggish on it.  Ford Edge sport has the 2.7 turbo v6, but that isn't super on gas either.  Wonder if a 2.5 turbo 6 wouldn't be a great mill for good power and mpg mix for vans and SUV's

    why not an atkinson cycle ~3L I4 using ~2.6L of it with a low/medium pressure turbo probably good for 230+HP possible, but really good low/mid torque and decent FE...?

    Edited by loki
    changed the equivilent displacement estimate.
    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    9 hours ago, loki said:

    most of us probably remember Dwightlooi's many technicals about large displacement, low piston count engines and such...  good times, and interesting.

    why not an atkinson cycle ~3L I4 using ~2.6L of it with a low/medium pressure turbo probably good for 230+HP possible, but really good low/mid torque and decent FE...?

    Mazda has done excellent work along just this line.

    On 10/17/2016 at 10:37 AM, Drew Dowdell said:

    It's just a reversal of a trend... and a good reversal too. I originally felt that displacement reduction + turbo charging was the answer, but it hasn't seemed to be the case. 

    The devil is in the details. I really like some of the small displacement Turbo stuff. I want to drive a JCW 2017 Mini really badly.

     

    But yes, the trend can go too far, and I think we need to see a bit more displacement.

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    10 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

    Mazda has done excellent work along just this line.

    The devil is in the details. I really like some of the small displacement Turbo stuff. I want to drive a JCW 2017 Mini really badly.

     

    But yes, the trend can go too far, and I think we need to see a bit more displacement.

    about mazda, yeah, but just make a mazda3 speed already?! haha.
    I do like the torque peak mine has at 3250... it can tool around in 5th from 30-40mph fairly well.and if the road is flat estimates at 60MPG on my DIC is common.

    be interesting if mazda skipped the 2.0L and turboed the 1.5L for ~150HP... just because.. hehe. you think that'd be better than the 2.0L in the MX-5?

    1

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites
    13 hours ago, loki said:

    about mazda, yeah, but just make a mazda3 speed already?! haha.
    I do like the torque peak mine has at 3250... it can tool around in 5th from 30-40mph fairly well.and if the road is flat estimates at 60MPG on my DIC is common.

    be interesting if mazda skipped the 2.0L and turboed the 1.5L for ~150HP... just because.. hehe. you think that'd be better than the 2.0L in the MX-5?

    Not sure, the MX5 is pretty tempting as is.

    And yes on a speed three, although I am thinking maybe WRX for my next car.  You only live once!

    0

    Share this comment


    Link to comment
    Share on other sites


    Your content will need to be approved by a moderator

    Guest
    You are commenting as a guest. If you have an account, please sign in.
    Add a comment...

    ×   You have pasted content with formatting.   Remove formatting

    ×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

    Loading...



  • Popular Stories

  • Today's Birthdays

    1. §carlet §wordfish
      §carlet §wordfish
      (27 years old)
  • Similar Content

    • By William Maley
      The Environmental Protection Agency has today proposed to keep its vehicle emission targets through 2025, shocking a lot of people and possibly setting up a major fight between regulators and the automotive industry. 
      According to Automotive News, the proposal will now enter a 30-day comment period. After this period, the EPA administrator could finalize this proposal and begin enforcing these standards a bit quicker. By 2025, automakers will need to increase their  to 54.5 miles per gallon corporate average fuel economy (CAFE) numbers to 54.5 miles per gallon.
      Why move the proposal up now? A proposal was expected next year with a final decision in 2018. The EPA said in a statement their “extensive technical analysis” has shown no reason as to why the timeframe or standards should be changed. Also, automakers will be able to achieve those 2025 standards at “similar or even a lower cost”.
      “Due to the industry’s rapid technological advancement, the technical record could arguably support strengthening the 2022-2025 standards. However, the administrator’s judgment is [that] now is not the time to introduce uncertainty by changing the standards. The industry has made huge investments in fuel efficiency and low emissions technologies based on these standards, and any changes now may disrupt those plans,” said Janet McCabe, acting assistant administrator for the EPA’s Office of Air and Radiation on a conference call.
      That analysis started back in July and is used to determine whether or not the EPA needs to make adjustments to the regulations or schedule.
      But there might be another reason. With President Obama leaving the White House on January 20th and President-elect Donald Trump, there are concerns that Trump's administration could challenge the regulations. By doing this now, it would make the process of undoing these regulations more complicated - notice and comment requirements, possible court battle with environmental groups, etc. McCabe denied this, saying the decision was based on analysis and a “rigorous technical record,”
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
      Pic Credit: William Maley for Cheers & Gears

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      The Environmental Protection Agency has today proposed to keep its vehicle emission targets through 2025, shocking a lot of people and possibly setting up a major fight between regulators and the automotive industry. 
      According to Automotive News, the proposal will now enter a 30-day comment period. After this period, the EPA administrator could finalize this proposal and begin enforcing these standards a bit quicker. By 2025, automakers will need to increase their  to 54.5 miles per gallon corporate average fuel economy (CAFE) numbers to 54.5 miles per gallon.
      Why move the proposal up now? A proposal was expected next year with a final decision in 2018. The EPA said in a statement their “extensive technical analysis” has shown no reason as to why the timeframe or standards should be changed. Also, automakers will be able to achieve those 2025 standards at “similar or even a lower cost”.
      “Due to the industry’s rapid technological advancement, the technical record could arguably support strengthening the 2022-2025 standards. However, the administrator’s judgment is [that] now is not the time to introduce uncertainty by changing the standards. The industry has made huge investments in fuel efficiency and low emissions technologies based on these standards, and any changes now may disrupt those plans,” said Janet McCabe, acting assistant administrator for the EPA’s Office of Air and Radiation on a conference call.
      That analysis started back in July and is used to determine whether or not the EPA needs to make adjustments to the regulations or schedule.
      But there might be another reason. With President Obama leaving the White House on January 20th and President-elect Donald Trump, there are concerns that Trump's administration could challenge the regulations. By doing this now, it would make the process of undoing these regulations more complicated - notice and comment requirements, possible court battle with environmental groups, etc. McCabe denied this, saying the decision was based on analysis and a “rigorous technical record,”
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
      Pic Credit: William Maley for Cheers & Gears
    • By William Maley
      The diesel emission scandal has left Volkswagen at a bit crossroad in a number of areas. One of them deals with their brand identity in the U.S. For a better part of a decade, Volkswagen was known as the brand that sold 'clean diesels'. But the company is working to rebuild and change their identity. Part of that plan is taking diesel and putting it on the backburner.
      Volkswagen Group of America CEO Hinrich Woebcken tells Automotive News that diesel will not be a core element of their identity going forward. That isn't to say diesel will be banished from the brand. Woebcken said the fuel are still in their plans from 2017 to 2019 if they can get regulatory approval. But he did say they are re-evaluating diesel in their future lineup for the U.S.
      “We are not stopping diesel. Wherever diesel makes sense as a package to the car, we’ll continue. But in reality, we have to accept that the high percentage of diesels that we had before will not come back again,” said Woebcken.
      “The regulations from 2019-2020 are going to be so hard that we would have had to find an alternative to a certain extent anyhow. The diesel crisis is forcing us simply to think about this earlier.”
      Volkswagen's image rebuilding process in U.S. will see them at the beginning putting more emphasis on crossovers and all-wheel drive offerings. The first part of this process kicks off with the Golf Alltrack launching later this year. This will be followed by the long-awaited three-row crossover next March or April, and the long-wheelbase version of the Tiguan sometime in the summer.
      In 2020, Volkswagen will launch the first of many electric vehicles using their MEB modular platform in the U.S.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      The diesel emission scandal has left Volkswagen at a bit crossroad in a number of areas. One of them deals with their brand identity in the U.S. For a better part of a decade, Volkswagen was known as the brand that sold 'clean diesels'. But the company is working to rebuild and change their identity. Part of that plan is taking diesel and putting it on the backburner.
      Volkswagen Group of America CEO Hinrich Woebcken tells Automotive News that diesel will not be a core element of their identity going forward. That isn't to say diesel will be banished from the brand. Woebcken said the fuel are still in their plans from 2017 to 2019 if they can get regulatory approval. But he did say they are re-evaluating diesel in their future lineup for the U.S.
      “We are not stopping diesel. Wherever diesel makes sense as a package to the car, we’ll continue. But in reality, we have to accept that the high percentage of diesels that we had before will not come back again,” said Woebcken.
      “The regulations from 2019-2020 are going to be so hard that we would have had to find an alternative to a certain extent anyhow. The diesel crisis is forcing us simply to think about this earlier.”
      Volkswagen's image rebuilding process in U.S. will see them at the beginning putting more emphasis on crossovers and all-wheel drive offerings. The first part of this process kicks off with the Golf Alltrack launching later this year. This will be followed by the long-awaited three-row crossover next March or April, and the long-wheelbase version of the Tiguan sometime in the summer.
      In 2020, Volkswagen will launch the first of many electric vehicles using their MEB modular platform in the U.S.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
    • By William Maley
      Hyundai has a major revamp of its crossover lineup on the horizon. Speaking with Automotive News, Hyundai Motor America CEO Dave Zuchowski outlined plans to meet the current demand of crossovers for the U.S.
      Beginning with their current crossover lineup, the Santa Fe and Santa Fe Sport will grow in size and separate from one another. The Santa Fe will grow into an eight-seat crossover, and the Sport will get a name change along with a new design to make it more rugged. The Tuscon will grow as well but will not get a major change in its mission.
      Hyundai will also be introducing a new B-segment crossover in 2018 to compete with the likes of the Honda HR-V, Jeep Renegade, and Mazda CX-3. Further down the road, a subcompact crossover will be introduced.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
  • Recent Status Updates

  • Who's Online (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online