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Oracle of Delphi

Sticker Shock

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Well my wife has been whispering in my ear that she wants a new SUV to replace the 2005 Chevrolet Equinox LT AWD that she drives. I told her that's fine but I was not happy with the Chevy dealer that we used last time and her choices would be anything that Buick, Pontiac, GMC sells, so I can continue to get the great service from my Buick/Pontiac/GMC dealership that I receive. We are looking to buy about this time next year.

Tonight we happened to be going by the dealership so we stopped to only looked at the Buick Enclave. This was a pretty loaded SUV (I might add it was hard to read anything on the sticker as the window was heavily tinted) and when I got to the sticker price of $42,550 dollars, I got a bad case of sticker shock. I automatically figured in my GM Employee discount and it was still more than I am willing to pay.

So now my choices are down to the GMC Envoy (lots of rebate money for this 4 - 6K), Pontiac Torrent (always around 2k in rebates) and the GMC Acadia (no rebate as of today according to my dealer), I have a feeling I may have sticker shock with this too, but a lot can change in a year.

If I am not willing to pay that price even with my GM Employee discount, I wonder how many Joe Sixpacks will?

Edited by Pontiac Custom-S
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You can get a less loaded model for cheaper, but as balthy said the Enclave isn't going after Chevy's buyers. The Acadia is also available with nice options for $35k and below.

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Loaded Park Avenue Ultras stickered for $44,000. Its not unprecendented, but this time, its worth it.

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I too will be in the market next year when our '05 Envoy lease is up. The GMC Acadia (SLT-2, AWD) and Saturn OUTLOOK (XR, AWD) is what I'm considering, although the wife does like the Enclave too. Being that I am going to purchase instead of leasing, I want a pretty well loaded AWD model. So I'll be in the $38-$40k sticker range BEFORE I factor in my GM Supplier pricing or my GM Card earnings (depending on which deal is better). So far I'm leaning more to the Acadia, but who knows where I'll lean in a year?

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Why would you replace the Equinox with the same vehicle with a Pontiac badge? The Envoy is erm...outdated...rubbish? At least the 7-7x or TrailBlazer SS have good suspension tuning. If you have to cheap out, go for the Acadia.

As others have said, the Enclave isn't aimed at "Joe Sixpack"

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Just find one with less options! Our Enclave CXL has the 19" chrome wheels, power sunroof & skylight, CD changer, Bose audio, remote start, ultrasonic rear park assist and a few other things... it stickered for less than $38k!

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Why would you replace the Equinox with the same vehicle with a Pontiac badge? The Envoy is erm...outdated...rubbish? At least the 7-7x or TrailBlazer SS have good suspension tuning. If you have to cheap out, go for the Acadia.

As others have said, the Enclave isn't aimed at "Joe Sixpack"

We love the Equinox, we don't like the Chevy dealer, however I do like our Buick/Pontiac/GMC dealer and their service department is top notch. Therefore if I buy the Pontiac Torrent I get the vehicle we love along with the best service department for miles around. I'm leaning to the Torrent, then Envoy and in a distant 3rd place is the Acadia. The Acadia looks to square for my taste and I don't buy Saturns so the Outlook is out because it is a Saturn and it also suffers from the same squareness in my view.

In the end it boils down to how much SUV can I get for the least amount of money, so rebates/incentives and GM Employee discount will pull me into making a decision either for or against a particular SUV. So Enclave is out for me as I am unwilling to pay that amount of money for any SUV. Anyway as I said, a lot can happen in a year, perhaps GM will have a Fire Sale to get inventory moving, you never know!

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Yeah I do feel it is expensive and I dont see it selling here at all...

I've seen them at the dealerships...and i've only seen one on the road...only one...the same ones have been sitting at the dealerships for ages....if you ask me it's the price...if i'm going to blow 50 grand (read canadian) it's sure as hell not going to be a vehicle...

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Of course, you do realize they are just coming out. As with the Solstice, Sky and other recent models, better pricing come to he who waits..............

I drove to Peterborough two weeks ago and was tripping over Acadias. I am sure the chattering classes in Riverdale and Rosedale will at least look at the Buick because the Press is telling them to. In a sea of shiny BMWs and Lexi, there will be a few trail blazers (no pun intended) who will want to show up to Mitzi's fundraiser in something different.

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Why lower the price when it's selling faster than they can make them? If anything they should raise it...

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Why lower the price when it's selling faster than they can make them? If anything they should raise it...

As I am sure you know, there are two sets of "lowering prices." The first when the dealer won't budge on sticker because there is a line for the vehicle, and the second when the manufacturer realizes it goofed on the "market price" and has to throw in incentives and rates. When a vehicle is hot, the dealer won't come off MSRP, or at least not by much. So wait a few months. Or see if you can get a better deal on a factory order.

If the manufacturer "raises" prices, the media goes ballistic; if the dealer charges over list, C&G posters go berserk! :AH-HA_wink:

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In the end it boils down to how much SUV can I get for the least amount of money, so rebates/incentives and GM Employee discount will pull me into making a decision either for or against a particular SUV. !

Envoy it is then.

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I don't buy Saturns so the Outlook is out because it is a Saturn and it also suffers from the same squareness in my view.

Off topic, but I'm curious about this statement. You've made it no secret that you work closely with Opel. Since more and more of Saturn's lineup is becoming Opel-derived, why would you not buy one "because it's a Saturn" and you "don't buy Saturns"

The Outlook specifically I can understand since it is not an Opel-derived vehicle and you don't care for the styling. But it sounds like you're dismissing the brand entirely.

Back on topic, since $42K is out of your price range (and understandibly so), what is your price range. Would you consider a new Vue?

-RBB

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When I brother-in-law and I stopped to look at an Enclave, there was an Acadia parked right next to it, both had stickers of $38k. Yikes.

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Off topic, but I'm curious about this statement. You've made it no secret that you work closely with Opel. Since more and more of Saturn's lineup is becoming Opel-derived, why would you not buy one "because it's a Saturn" and you "don't buy Saturns"

The Outlook specifically I can understand since it is not an Opel-derived vehicle and you don't care for the styling. But it sounds like you're dismissing the brand entirely.

Back on topic, since $42K is out of your price range (and understandibly so), what is your price range. Would you consider a new Vue?

-RBB

You want to know about my Saturn stance huh, well ok but remember you asked for it! :AH-HA_wink: The 1st and most important issue with Saturn for me is the Dealer network here in DE, MD & PA, where I live in Delaware all Saturn Dealerships are owned by one automotive group, in Delaware, West Chester, PA, and the Eastern Shore of Maryland. I was not impressed with the company and how they run the Saturn dealership network in these 3 states. To say their service department is lacking is putting it mildly in my opinion, and even having warranty work done correctly was a constant battle. I got tired of bringing my wife's Saturn at that time, back 3 or 4 times before they got it fixed correctly. Also why would I buy Saturn with their no haggle pricing when I can now buy the same vehicle platforms for the most part at any other GM dealership and wheel and deal and still get my GM Employee Discount. I also am not willing to drive to New Jersey about an hour away to purchase a car there and have it serviced there. So in this regard Saturn is dead to me, not a choice at all.

Secondly, there is history between the Wilmington plant and Saturn, let's just say it was not a happy marriage. It was funny when Saturn 1st came to Wilmington, they actually thought they were a seperate car company (Does that sound like any car company you know in Australia?). I used to tell them that they were owned by GM and they would eventually be assimilated by GM when it suited GM to do so. I actually remember a meeting at Wilmington where Saturn said it would Saturnize all of GM, I laughed outloud, and said you mean, they will asimmilate you, don't you? That was 10 years ago, the Wilmington plant has been turned back into a GM plant and low and behold so has Springhill, TN. :P Try as Saturn did to have me removed from the Wilmington plant, they did not succeed, you see I report to a higher authority, no it's not God, but it's close! In the end Saturn became a car company in name only, just as I had predicted it would so many years ago. :smilewide:

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If they could potentially take sales away from the GMT-900s, since they are so similar in size, they will need to charge a similar price.

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When I brother-in-law and I stopped to look at an Enclave, there was an Acadia parked right next to it, both had stickers of $38k. Yikes.

I AM SURE THE ACADIA HAD MORE OPTIONS.
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You want to know about my Saturn stance huh, well ok but remember you asked for it! :AH-HA_wink: The 1st and most important issue with Saturn for me is the Dealer network here in DE, MD & PA, where I live in Delaware all Saturn Dealerships are owned by one automotive group, in Delaware, West Chester, PA, and the Eastern Shore of Maryland. I was not impressed with the company and how they run the Saturn dealership network in these 3 states. To say their service department is lacking is putting it mildly in my opinion, and even having warranty work done correctly was a constant battle. I got tired of bringing my wife's Saturn at that time, back 3 or 4 times before they got it fixed correctly. Also why would I buy Saturn with their no haggle pricing when I can now buy the same vehicle platforms for the most part at any other GM dealership and wheel and deal and still get my GM Employee Discount. I also am not willing to drive to New Jersey about an hour away to purchase a car there and have it serviced there. So in this regard Saturn is dead to me, not a choice at all.

Secondly, there is history between the Wilmington plant and Saturn, let's just say it was not a happy marriage. It was funny when Saturn 1st came to Wilmington, they actually thought they were a seperate car company (Does that sound like any car company you know in Australia?). I used to tell them that they were owned by GM and they would eventually be assimilated by GM when it suited GM to do so. I actually remember a meeting at Wilmington where Saturn said it would Saturnize all of GM, I laughed outloud, and said you mean, they will asimmilate you, don't you? That was 10 years ago, the Wilmington plant has been turned back into a GM plant and low and behold so has Springhill, TN. :P Try as Saturn did to have me removed from the Wilmington plant, they did not succeed, you see I report to a higher authority, no it's not God, but it's close! In the end Saturn became a car company in name only, just as I had predicted it would so many years ago. :smilewide:

I miss my dealer..they had excellent service. :(

Anyway, if you're fixed on having one of 3 vehicles, and don't like the Acadia, get a Torrent GXP.

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You want to know about my Saturn stance huh, well ok but remember you asked for it! :AH-HA_wink: The 1st and most important issue with Saturn for me is the Dealer network here in DE, MD & PA, where I live in Delaware all Saturn Dealerships are owned by one automotive group, in Delaware, West Chester, PA, and the Eastern Shore of Maryland. I was not impressed with the company and how they run the Saturn dealership network in these 3 states. To say their service department is lacking is putting it mildly in my opinion, and even having warranty work done correctly was a constant battle. I got tired of bringing my wife's Saturn at that time, back 3 or 4 times before they got it fixed correctly. Also why would I buy Saturn with their no haggle pricing when I can now buy the same vehicle platforms for the most part at any other GM dealership and wheel and deal and still get my GM Employee Discount. I also am not willing to drive to New Jersey about an hour away to purchase a car there and have it serviced there. So in this regard Saturn is dead to me, not a choice at all.

Secondly, there is history between the Wilmington plant and Saturn, let's just say it was not a happy marriage. It was funny when Saturn 1st came to Wilmington, they actually thought they were a seperate car company (Does that sound like any car company you know in Australia?). I used to tell them that they were owned by GM and they would eventually be assimilated by GM when it suited GM to do so. I actually remember a meeting at Wilmington where Saturn said it would Saturnize all of GM, I laughed outloud, and said you mean, they will asimmilate you, don't you? That was 10 years ago, the Wilmington plant has been turned back into a GM plant and low and behold so has Springhill, TN. :P Try as Saturn did to have me removed from the Wilmington plant, they did not succeed, you see I report to a higher authority, no it's not God, but it's close! In the end Saturn became a car company in name only, just as I had predicted it would so many years ago. :smilewide:

OK, thanks. Sounds reasonable enough.

-RBB

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This is what will be the final nail in the coffin for Buick and Pontiac. GM's insistence that these are "premium" brands when in reality they are sold by dealers who, as a whole, don't compare well to Lexus or Acura in terms of dealer service or modern facilities. PBG dealers look and feel closer to Chevy dealers. Enclave will snag few Lexus RX and Acura MDX buyers for this reason alone. Meanwhile, GM cuts Buick's throat. Just wait until Chevy's version comes out. Look out below!!!

Tonight we happened to be going by the dealership so we stopped to only looked at the Buick Enclave. This was a pretty loaded SUV (I might add it was hard to read anything on the sticker as the window was heavily tinted) and when I got to the sticker price of $42,550 dollars, I got a bad case of sticker shock. I automatically figured in my GM Employee discount and it was still more than I am willing to pay.

So now my choices are down to the GMC Envoy (lots of rebate money for this 4 - 6K), Pontiac Torrent (always around 2k in rebates) and the GMC Acadia (no rebate as of today according to my dealer), I have a feeling I may have sticker shock with this too, but a lot can change in a year.

If I am not willing to pay that price even with my GM Employee discount, I wonder how many Joe Sixpacks will?

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This is what will be the final nail in the coffin for Buick and Pontiac. GM's insistence that these are "premium" brands when in reality they are sold by dealers who, as a whole, don't compare well to Lexus or Acura in terms of dealer service or modern facilities. PBG dealers look and feel closer to Chevy dealers. Enclave will snag few Lexus RX and Acura MDX buyers for this reason alone. Meanwhile, GM cuts Buick's throat. Just wait until Chevy's version comes out. Look out below!!!

Joe Sixpack isn't the target audience for the Enclave at all. Joe Sixpack would rather have an Envoy any day.

The target audience for the Enclave is Martha Homemaker-Realestateagent.

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