cadillac Cadillac LYRIQ Reveal Coming

[David]

Cadillac division sent out this email saying that the Cadillac Lyriq reveal will be August 6th 2020 @ 7PM. 

Now the interesting part is what time zone? EST, MST, PST,.......... 🤔

[Robert Hall]

Probably EST since Detroit is in EST. Didn't GM do something like this before with a reveal announcement, a time without a timezone? 

[David]

2 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

Probably EST since Detroit is in EST. Didn't GM do something like this before with a reveal announcement, a time without a timezone? 

Yes, it was the corvette reveal that they did not state the time zone for and had people upset.

[David]

Latest sneak peek of the charging area on this upcoming EV.

 

 

[ocnblu]

What a dumb idea for the charge port cover.  Can you say... DAMAGE/FAILURE MAGNET?

[balthazar]

I wonder if that's a power panel, or manual.

[Robert Hall]

18 minutes ago, balthazar said:

I wonder if that's a power panel, or manual.

Hopefully power and controlled by a phone app...that would be slick.

[ocnblu]

It's exactly where mud, snow and ice get thrown up by the wheels, depending on the seasons... in the real world.

[Robert Hall]

30 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

It's exactly where mud, snow and ice get thrown up by the wheels, depending on the seasons... in the real world.

Which is why one would drive with it closed..presumably it seals..not really different from how the Bristol had a spare tire compartment on one side and a battery compartment on the other side of the front fenders...

Edited July 31, 2020 by Robert Hall

[balthazar]

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

Hopefully power and controlled by a phone app...that would be slick.

Needlessly stupid.
Should be enabled by the fob - press the Crest and it opens like the doors do.

Edited July 31, 2020 by balthazar

[Robert Hall]

4 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Needlessly stupid.
Should be enabled by the fob - press the Crest and it opens like the doors do.

With EVs a lot of things are moving to phone apps though.(like with the Model 3)...I could see the fob also, though.  

Edited July 31, 2020 by Robert Hall

[David]

3 hours ago, balthazar said:

Needlessly stupid.
Should be enabled by the fob - press the Crest and it opens like the doors do.

For less techy people I can understand your view point. Like the Cadillac ELR, it was a button on the fob that would pop open the sealed charging port. 

I would expect that here too but also GM has already stated with their new Nervous system that is more powerful than many super computers, over air updates with complete Phone App control of your auto.

I expect you to be able to program based on what GM has already stated the auto to handle all 4 seasons. You can set or choose if you need heat, AC, Heated seats or cooled as well as heated steering wheel, etc.

The future is phone apps to customize your EV for the region you live in.

[balthazar]

For you less techy people; it’s not a button; it’s a proximity signal. Fob is on your person, you press the emblem and the panel opens electrically. 
No fumbling with your phone/ access code/ finding-opening an app. Progress should mean faster, not slower.

[ocnblu]

4 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

Which is why one would drive with it closed..presumably it seals..not really different from how the Bristol had a spare tire compartment on one side and a battery compartment on the other side of the front fenders...

Tsk... not talking about driving with it open.  I am talking about operating it after ice, snow, mud, etc. is on it.

[David]

5 hours ago, ocnblu said:

Tsk... not talking about driving with it open.  I am talking about operating it after ice, snow, mud, etc. is on it.

One would assume they have tested for this since that seems a logical QA test case in development be it an auto or any other product.

[oldshurst442]

@ocnblu

Tsk  Tsk  Tsk

The charging panel  is on the side of the car.  Gravity and physics takes care of the sides of the car...for the snow part of your argument

THAT above, is a lot of snow, woudnt you say?  Its a hefty snowfall.  Just brush it off. The top of the car is more work anyway....  If it snows more than that, and the WHOLE car is covered,

Id say your job of getting your car out of THAT mess is a tad more grueling than just lightly brushing off a few flakes in a normal snowfall...  Id say, in a snowstorm like that, the LEAST of your problems is a charging door buried in snow... The whole phoquing car is buried.  You need a phoquing shovel to clear a path for your car to be able to drive off.  But then again, the Lyriq is an CUV. AWD...   (laughing at the irony and sarcasm) 

Same with ice.  If there is an ice storm, getting your windows clear of ice is more of a concern...

and Im sure that the motors of that sliding panel, kinda like a van/mini-van,  will break off the ice as the mechanism will probably make the panel detach itself popping up forward, cracking the ice, then sliding back.  Unless of course its a real ice storm and the ice is 2-3-4  millimeters thick.  THAT is a lot of ice accumulation and it does happen from time to time.  At least in Montreal it does.  But then again...what may happen next as you drive on your merry way may be more of a concern then a charging door panel not being able to open from ice accumulation...

As far as mud goes...and snow accumulation...

Yes. Yes...  cars DO get dirty from time to time.   A good wash does a car good from time to time. 

The ONLY problem I sees though, and Im actually agreeing with your concerns...is this scenario.  And a scenario of which many EV lovers LOVE to flaunt. Is that charging is done at home. SHOULD be done at home...

 

NOT an ideal situation...  

So your post is somewhat legit...

Edited July 31, 2020 by oldshurst442

[Robert Hall]

I do see ice as a potential problem, is it is on Teslas with their stupid door handles..I've read of them freezing and not popping out.   But with any expensive EV, it should be inside in a garage..wouldn't have one if it had to be parked outside.

Edited July 31, 2020 by Robert Hall

[balthazar]

Would be SO simple to run a mild, low voltage heating element around the perimeter if testing showed that would be a possible scenario.
Tesla should have already done that, but they're not really a luxury product.

[Robert Hall]

1 minute ago, balthazar said:

Would be SO simple to run a mild, low voltage heating element around the perimeter if testing showed that would be a possible scenario.
Tesla should have already done that, but they're not really a luxury product.

Or just use normal door handles instead of gimmicky garbage.    

[balthazar]

I can understand the flush handles WRT aerodynamics (where apparently every 0.0001% is worthy of pursuit)... but what's laughable to me is the actual operation.

1. you push the handle inward (Model S)
2. you pull your hand back
3. the handle extends
4. you extend your hand, grip the handle, pull the handle and pull the door open.

The door would already be open at step 2 for any other vehicle.

One of the hallmarks of 'Luxury' is LESS effort, not more. That's where the 'gimmickry' comes in.

[David]

10 hours ago, ocnblu said:

Tsk... not talking about driving with it open.  I am talking about operating it after ice, snow, mud, etc. is on it.

That is no different than an ICE auto especially during say a NJ or Texas ICE Storm and you have no access without chipping at the gas lid to get it open when you are out of gas and need to fill cause you did not fill it up the night before. Yes in places of harder winter weather there will always be challanges for EV or ICE. After all, if you get water in the tank you ICE Auto is not going to run very well a problem you never have to worry about with EV's.

EV versus ICE Auto Revelations:

1. REVELATION - ICE owners say they do not have range anxiety because of the sheer number of gas stations across the US. Even on some of the longest stretches of road you still can find a gas station within 150 miles of each other. Example is the I70 in Utah, one of the longest stretches of highway without gas service, 110 miles. On average, AAA states you can find a gas station every 50 miles in the US. If the gas stations also included EV chargers like what is happening in Europe, Fast DC chargers, an EV with even only a range of 100 miles could easily do a road trip, Sadly the gas industry has fought this as it would have disrupted the auto industry decades ago. Tesla has supercharging stations within 150 miles of 99% of the US Population and the Tesla's have far greater range than 100 miles.
2. REVELATION - If you forget to fill up with gas, you in no better situation than an EV owner who forgot to plug in the night before at home and ends up leaving home in the morning with minimal charge. More than a CENTURY LATER, we still have people running out of gas all the time on the side of the road. So this is about Planning that is NOT attributable to the auto's range performance in any way. Range anxiety only happens when your on a road, 80 miles from the closest gas station or charging station and you only have 20 miles left of charge or gas. That is bad planning, even that excuse is no longer valid due to the number of Charging Stations including Tesla charge points available on all major highways. Statista says the US has 24,807 official charging stations as of March 3rd 2020 with 78,544 Charging outlets. This is also supported by our own U.S. Department of Energy. https://afdc.energy.gov/fuels/electricity_stations.html   https://www.statista.com/statistics/416750/number-of-electric-vehicle-charging-stations-outlets-united-states/ We also have other source sites that break this data down for those of us that do not pay for the detailed access and publish it such as Electrek on how the stations break down across states. https://muchneeded.com/electric-vehicle-charging-network-statistics/ We also have options on how we charge which can be done so easily when we plan. 
3. REVELATION - IEA matches pretty much what Europe and Asia have stated that EV's / Plug-in Hybrids will rich critical mass by 2030 due to regulations and consumer preference in how ICE declines and EV's become the new standard. EV's cut CO2 emissions by Half even when you take into account Electricity produced by dirty energy means, AKA Coal, battery production compared to ICE auto's. Healthier air for all to breath and less noise pollution.  https://www.iea.org/reports/global-ev-outlook-2019
4. Both Statistica and IBIS world report that the US has approximately 150,000 gas stations. Unable to get specific number as I do not have paid membership to either so can only go by their high level quote about their own report. Statistica says as of 2018 we have 273.6 million registered auto's. As such that means we have 1 gas station for every 1,824 auto's registered. Compared to the current 3,283,200 EV / PHEV auto's registered in the US. This would equate to 1 charging station for every 132 EV auto's. This would imply that it is easier to find a charging station than a gas station. So this cearly shows a 1 to 1,824 ratio for ICE and 1 to 132 ratio for EV.  https://www.statista.com/statistics/183505/number-of-vehicles-in-the-united-states-since-1990/ https://www.statista.com/topics/4421/the-us-electric-vehicle-industry/
5. REVELATION - The median average range of an ICE auto is 412 miles which means that half of the auto's on the road cannot go 400 miles on a full tank of gas. This shows how impressive a 300 mile battery pack is for an EV.

So what does all this mean? We are very close to a tipping point for the majority of auto buyers where ICE / gas will no longer be the pull one would expect and folks will be giving up their old way of thinking about range anxiety, charging stations concerns, stuck on the road with no power. After all AAA now comes to you with either gas or a charge to get you to the next station.

Over all while most people do not really need 300 miles of range, we are at that point where people are not going to think about it and will just go with the low cost maintenance appliance to get from point A to B and back.

Are we there yet? No but we will be in the next 5 years.

[balthazar]

Not unless EV prices crater. There is no ‘tipping point’ where people spending an average of $35K are suddenly going to be able to afford $75K.

[Robert Hall]

Time to insert standard cliche cache phrase..

'Reality is complex'

'There are many things'

[David]

22 hours ago, balthazar said:

Not unless EV prices crater. There is no ‘tipping point’ where people spending an average of $35K are suddenly going to be able to afford $75K.

Yes reality is complex and prices are high as most people focus on them, but there are EV options that cost less, but people want everything, they want all the bells and whistles as to why it seems humanity ignores the lower priced options.

2020 starting prices of on sale EVs from Edmunds. Prices before rebates

https://www.edmunds.com/electric-car/articles/cheapest-electric-cars/

• 2020 Mini Cooper SW - $30,750
• 2020 Nissan Leaf - $32,535 
• 2020 Hyundai Ioniq - $34,000
• 2020 Chevrolet Bolt - $37,495
• 2020 Tesla Model 3 - $41,190
• 2019 BMW i3 - $45,445
• 2020 Jaguar i-Pace - $70,875

Plug-in Hybrids

• 2020 Hyundai Ioniq Plug-in  - $26,300
• 2020 Toyota Prius Prime - $28,555
• 2020 Kia Niro Plug-in - $30,610
• 2020 Subaru Crosstek Plug-in - $36,155

These are the cheapest starting prices for the models and there are still more but not covering the higher priced models here.

Edmunds did a good job for those looking for an EV.

[ocnblu]

14 hours ago, David said:

Edmunds did a good job for those looking for an EV.

One statue in the PNW

[David]

Tomorrow @ 7pm EDT the Reveal of the Cadillac LYRIQ EV will happen.

 

 

[David]

Cadillac Lyriq is here and to me it says STATION WAGON! Huge Gallery at the web site.

The picture of the Charge Port shows it is an automated door that pushes out and away from the auto.

https://www.cadillac.com/showcar/lyriq

Using the big screen found in the Escalade.

Considerable attention to detail.

[riviera74]

I would give the exterior a 6.5, while I give the interior a 9.5.  I do hope most of the interior ends up in future Cadillac vehicles sooner than later.

[Robert Hall]

Sexy.  I like the unique taillight treatment, the long hood, the greenhouse and proportions...

[balthazar]

Watched the 12 min video; Cadillac is totally 'talking the talk' with that piece. If most of the lighting & detailing makes it to production, the vehicle is going to reshuffle the hierarchy and see incredible demand.

 

[David]

30 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Watched the 12 min video; Cadillac is totally 'talking the talk' with that piece. If most of the lighting & detailing makes it to production, the vehicle is going to reshuffle the hierarchy and see incredible demand.

 

Agree, this auto shows why Cadillac was the standard of the World at one time. It can very much be again with this station wagon.

[balthazar]

You're not going to make 'station wagon' stick.
It has no rear cargo area (visually); the roofline is nearly an unbroken arch from the windshield header to the rear beltline.

[David]

10 hours ago, balthazar said:

You're not going to make 'station wagon' stick.
It has no rear cargo area (visually); the roofline is nearly an unbroken arch from the windshield header to the rear beltline.

Seems to me that is Cargo Area inside and in regards to visually from the outside, granted Cadillac made the world biggest BLIND spot with the rear quarter panel area and that little tiny rear window on the cargo area.

Still this side profile says to me Station Wagon, Not CUV or SUV.

 

[David]

@Robert Hall @balthazar As per the comment from all things EV hater @ocnblu stated about this icing up and not able to open up in winter, I disagree.

Clearly GM / Cadillac took the automation of this door opening up into account as you have plenty of space below the panel that is where the ice, mud, road debris will get on and I do not see this affecting the operation of opening up for charging.

[Robert Hall]

6 minutes ago, David said:

@Robert Hall @balthazar As per the comment from all things EV hater @ocnblu stated about this icing up and not able to open up in winter, I disagree.

Clearly GM / Cadillac took the automation of this door opening up into account as you have plenty of space below the panel that is where the ice, mud, road debris will get on and I do not see this affecting the operation of opening up for charging.

I also like how there clearly is an actual window in the C-pillar behind the door and not fake trim...  they must not have let the CT5 designer near this.

10 hours ago, balthazar said:

You're not going to make 'station wagon' stick.
It has no rear cargo area (visually); the roofline is nearly an unbroken arch from the windshield header to the rear beltline.

wagon, CUV, or non-sedan... it's interesting however it gets categorized...

Edited August 7, 2020 by Robert Hall

[David]

5 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I also like how there clearly is an actual window in the C-pillar behind the door and not fake trim...  they must not have let the CT5 designer near this.

wagon, CUV, or non-sedan... it's interesting however it gets categorized...

Yes, while not a huge window, at least there is one before the big blind spot. I can understand the thick pillar with Roll over requirements now for not allowing it to crush down.

I too also wonder how it will be classified and referred to by the auto press.

[Robert Hall]

5 minutes ago, David said:

Yes, while not a huge window, at least there is one before the big blind spot. I can understand the thick pillar with Roll over requirements now for not allowing it to crush down.

I too also wonder how it will be classified and referred to by the auto press.

The black lower body trim certainly gives it the appearance of a slimmer profile...but I think it's more CUV tall than wagon slim...I see a bit of Lincoln Aviator in the lines, with that vertical narrowing as you go front to back.   

[balthazar]

A station wagon, for comparison's sake :

 

 

Is this also a 'station wagon'? How come nobody is calling every SUV & CUV out there 'station wagons'?

Edited August 7, 2020 by balthazar

[Robert Hall]

I see a lot of similarity to the Velar in the shape and lines (not the details).  The Velar is my favorite of the LR/RR models.   The Flex I would call a CUV,  I guess...the labels wagon and CUV seem to be hazy as to what is what.  

For example, the Volvo V90 I would call a wagon, but the XC90 I'd call a CUV or SUV... body height definitely plays into what is a wagon or CUV.....if the body height is more or less the same as an equivalent sedan, then it's a wagon IMO...

Edited August 7, 2020 by Robert Hall

[David]

2 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

For example, the Volvo V90 I would call a wagon, but the XC90 I'd call a CUV or SUV... body height definitely plays into what is a wagon or CUV.....if the body height is more or less the same as an equivalent sedan, then it's a wagon IMO...

Totally agree with this, if this LYRIQ is on a ride height as the CT series, it is a station wagon to me, if it is that much taller, then at least a CUV. I also agree the V90 is a station wagon where the XC90 is a CUV.

[ocnblu]

It's not a station wagon.  It's a hatchback.   See photo below of a similarly styled vehicle (inspiration?) for reference.

I will say something nice:  I am glad Cadillac is pronouncing it "lyric" and not something fruity, like "leer-EEK". 

Edited August 8, 2020 by ocnblu

[balthazar]

^ C'mon Willem, you're not going to conflate styling & motive power, are you?

Wait... I ask this, then think about you gushing over some horrible shitbox of an '80s car just because it has a stick.

I withdraw the question.

[ocnblu]

11 minutes ago, balthazar said:

horrible $h!box of an '80s car

Which one?

Oh, the Lyric would be music to a thinking man's ears if it were powered by a Blackwing V8.  As it is, it is a silhouette car, sadly a shiny, empty wrapper.

[riviera74]

21 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Which one?

Oh, the Lyric would be music to a thinking man's ears if it were powered by a Blackwing V8.  As it is, it is a silhouette car, sadly a shiny, empty wrapper.

If you want a Blackwing V8, get an Escalade.  Full stop.

[balthazar]

23 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Which one?

It was the '80s; close your eyes & throw a paint-filled balloon.

 

Quote

Oh, the Lyric would be music to a thinking man's ears if it were powered by a Blackwing V8.

All right - just wanted to make sure you were still (able to) separate the two.
Carry on.

Edited August 8, 2020 by balthazar

[oldshurst442]

Shooting break, anyone? 

Anyone?

No?

OK...  Ill tell you what... 

Its not a wagon.  Station or otherwise. 

Not to you.  Not to anyone.

Anyone!   

 

Its an old fashioned...body on frame, sports utility vehicle.   

SUV for short.   (put that in your pipe and smoke it) 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2020 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]

14 hours ago, David said:

granted Cadillac made the world biggest BLIND spot with the rear quarter panel area and that little tiny rear window on the cargo area.

Ummmmm....

I havent seen the promo vid of this thing just yet.  But hasnt GM  been touting something about cameras in the rear that will be broadcasting the feed live via the interior rear view mirror?  Something or other in the C8 Corvette?

Of course GM has!

Could it be that Cadillac would have the same thing?

 

 

[oldshurst442]

3 hours ago, ocnblu said:

 

I will say something nice:  I am glad Cadillac is pronouncing it "lyric" and not something fruity, like "leer-EEK". 

 

I dont like the name. I dont like the reason why they came up with that particular name.  (Because Cadillac is the music world's most sung brand.)

I dont even like the idea  going with "iq"as the last two letters of a name they come up with as a naming theme for their vehicles.  

But hey!  At least Cadillac got real names now.   Its just that I think Cadillac needs commanding, arrogant yet elegant names for their cars.    

Lyriq pronounced lyric is still fruity.  It could be elegant. Its just that its goofy spelled with "iq" at the end. Making it fruity nonetheless. 

Im OK with the styling,  Its elegant.  Its sporty, kinda.   Lets be honest though.  You were wishing for a Blackwing V8 in it.  Well, it does not have V8 worthy, in your V8 face kinda styling.  Its looks are too tame for a growling V8.   The name Lyriq is too fruity for a V8...   The styling of it is perfect for battery electric...   So...

 

Edited August 8, 2020 by oldshurst442

[ocnblu]

7 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

Shooting break, anyone? 

"Shooting brake" < you're not by yourself on that though, a lot of ppl over onto the internet mistake the shooting brake.

So if it is only 80-85% of reality, it could be a lot worse when it actually goes into production in 2042.  We know that fine details on show cars disappear once they reach the daily slog of series production, however tiny the series might be.

[oldshurst442]

On 8/8/2020 at 12:38 AM, oldshurst442 said:

I dont like the name. I dont like the reason why they came up with that particular name.  (Because Cadillac is the music world's most sung brand.)

I dont even like the idea  going with "iq"as the last two letters of a name they come up with as a naming theme for their vehicles.  

But hey!  At least Cadillac got real names now.   Its just that I think Cadillac needs commanding, arrogant yet elegant names for their cars.    

Lyriq pronounced lyric is still fruity.  It could be elegant. Its just that its goofy spelled with "iq" at the end. Making it fruity nonetheless. 

Im OK with the styling,  Its elegant.  Its sporty, kinda.   Lets be honest though.  You were wishing for a Blackwing V8 in it.  Well, it does not have V8 worthy, in your V8 face kinda styling.  Its looks are too tame for a growling V8.   The name Lyriq is too fruity for a V8...   The styling of it is perfect for battery electric...   So...

 

I just thought of another reason why Im not really into this "IQ" naming scheme.  

 

Hyundai has it going with Ioniq.  

*SIGH*