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That's a good question, Mr. 5-HP-more-than-a-HT4100.

RE the Ferrari vs. Corvette discussion, in plucking out 2 adjacent pics I can sum up what I see design-wise right here. Corvette is completely cohesive; it's lines and surface transitions have excellent 'follow thru' - where the rear quarter top line just has a beautiful, gently-varying radius thru the taillight, sharper thru the bumperette, yet still continues down to the bottom edge of the car. The lights are flush and fluid, the exhaust is both neatly concealed yet is located in the brightwork of the bumper port. It's 'hidden' until you spot it as an 'Easter egg'. The bumper, in wrapping around the rear quarter, seems like it may echo the radius of said fender line to the bottom edge, just rotated 90 degrees. Just tons of thought in the design. One can argue against the '58-only chrome moldings sweeping forward up the deck (and many do). As much as I like chrome I could do without them (but I also could live with them). There's no ill-fitting / low-hanging exhaust, no out-of-place rectangular reflectors, no tacked-on bumper with heavy bumper guards, no sudden sharp edges in the middle of the flow of the deck. I also get a strong VW Karman-Ghia vide from the Ferrari's tail lights- there's nothing wrong with them, they just look like they come off of something decidedly pedestrian. Corvette here is head & shoulders above the Ferrari from a standpoint of design. - - - - - That's not to say the Ferrari is not without merit. The general proportions are very nice, and I do love the front fender grille that echoes the shape of the fender's curve. The silver accent there is also peachy against the dark blue. The rear 'bustle' is a tad overly tall, but it still works. And I generally prefer some sort of wheel well lip accent -as seen here- vs. the 'sheer' look at the 'wells... but the Corvette has enough eye candy to do without them here. I do think the Ferrari's rear bumper might look a tiny bit better mounted about 2-in higher on the body... but the front bumperettes are very low and I would not advise increasing that (minor) disparity.

And I am fine with either of these colors.

What I was really going to say: I LIKE this new New York license plate ... simpler, picks up Western New York out to the eastern tip of Long Island (Montauk Point light), and the Adirondacks in between. But the lighthouse at the right does look a little cheesy. Some people in various states get knotted up when they are proposing a new license plate and they focus on one natural or urban feature and ignore the rest of the state. But, man, the old orange and black New York license plate on a black limousine or gangstah car with tinted windows really fit the bill.

@oldshurst442 I'm just starting to see the term Quebecker, like you've used above, more and more. I would always just insert Quebecois into an English sentence. I thought other Anglophones did, too. The Europeans still smoke a lot, but less than before. I don't know if some people (who have exposure to things European) think that smoking equates with being European. If she's a stick, and she smokes, I supposed smoking could make her look chic. Remember how in '70s and '80s movie there was often that "after sex" smoke? (Sort of like "apres-ski" means doing the hot tub and wine & cheese thing at some resort after a day on the slopes.) Now, if she looks like she slam dunks Oreos while watching soaps and talk shows, and then flicks her ashes from the open window of a beat up 1999 Grand Prix, then that would not look chic. It might look more like a wake up call to a casting call for Jerry Springer.

Pulled Forward because it is wonderful. For our Canadian bretheren... For our aphabet loving friends of the Mustang Persuasion...

And for $58K, I'll just a get loaded full size truck that can actually tow without fear of death (read about the towing reviews and issues with the Gladiator). That is just absurd money for that.

Wife & I got our first Moderna shot today. Rode an hour 1-way to get it. My one son who works in a NY hospital got both his shots maybe 2 months ago. Other son doesn't have an app't yet, his GF got the J&J shot Monday.

I like it...this is the only kind of pickup I would really need for real-world use...perfect for Saturday trips to Ace or Home Depot to get mulch and other yard stuff..but still as usable as an SUV. If I could get something like this from Jeep in a Grand Cherokee...

Maybe 'they' have no interest BECAUSE of the bed length...

Nothing you have is really competition oriented, but it is all cool. I do have a speical partiality to the BMW though. Seriously. And I like Albert's 300 more than I thought I would. For Luxury car guys like Drew it's like with Rolls Royce....horsepower figures are always described as adequate.... I was so happy when my younger son decided he wasn't going to Catholic school. He almost got a full scholarship to a very good local Catholic high school. But he visited it and hated it. Smart kid.

Thought of the day - If you're listing a car with the 4100 engine.. you really can't say "power everything" can you...?

?

Yeah, I believe I read it is more targeted at the people cross shopping small SUVs for the space but utility.

Sport Adventure Vehicle is probably a good description for it. Looks like will be good for people who do outdoor stuff or small Home Depot runs for the house, but don't want a bigger, less efficient truck. Ground clearance is 8.6in which is respectable. If they make more efficient, maybe hybrid model, I would probably consider it as a daily.

*Cue the disgruntled truck owners, who have no interest in this anyway, whining about about the bed length.*

Yesterday, April 14, 2021, sitting there to the side at a gas station. AMC Pacer! In fairly good condition, too, considering ...

I hate forced conversions.....

I love the 70 Torino...

Saw a blue-gray Mustang Mach-E in traffic yesterday, first one I'd seen...looked sharp...also saw the rustiest Escalade I've ever seen...2nd gen, around 2005 in that pearl white that was popular then...big rust spots and holes on the doors, rear quarters, front fenders, hatch..

Ran an errand during lunch, saw a cherry of a tan 1982 Z28. Old boomer driving it she had her Farrah Fawcett Hair and listening to ZZ Top. ?

It is surprising to think it has been over six years since Hyundai first showed the Santa Cruz pickup concept at the Detroit Auto Show. But today, Hyundai has unveiled the production version. The automaker isn't calling this a truck, instead using the term "Sport Adventure Vehicle". To us, it's a truck. We need to start with a bit of a reality check. The Santa Cruz is not a direct competitor to the likes of Chevrolet Colorado, Honda Ridgeline, or Toyota Tacoma in terms of measurements. Compared to those models, the Santa Cruz is around 10 to 17 inches shorter in length. Overall height is around 3 to 4 inches shorter. The bed measures 4.3 feet, which is about foot shorter than the Ranger. There is also an in-bed trunk like the Ridgeline. The model is based on the recently redesigned Tucson crossover, which explains why it shares the front end styling - complete with headlights in the massive grille. That also means it shares the same engines as the Tucson. Here's the lineup, 2.5L four-cylinder: estimated 190+ horsepower and 180+ lb.-ft. of torque Turbocharged 2.5L four-cylinder: estimated 275+ horsepower and 310+ lb.-ft. of torque The N/A 2.5 comes with an eight-speed automatic, while the turbo makes do with an eight-speed dual-clutch. Front-wheel drive is standard, while HTRAC all-wheel drive is optional. The interior looks very modern and comes with an eight-inch touchscreen in the center stack. Optional features include a 10-inch touchscreen and TFT instrument display. Hyundai is keeping mum on pricing until the Santa Cruz launches sometime this summer. BTW: If you're wondering why the Santa Cruz took so long to reach production, I recommend this piece from Autoblog which delves into this. Source: Hyundai Hyundai Unveils Segment-Shattering Santa Cruz Sport Adventure Vehicle Highly-anticipated Santa Cruz Sport Adventure Vehicle Shatters Both SUV and Truck Segments, Creating an Entirely New Vehicle Category Multi-utility, Secure Open Bed Provides Diverse Gear-Carrying Flexibility Powerful and Efficient 2.5L Turbo Powertrain with HTRAC® AWD Capability Available Cutting-edge Connectivity, Convenience and Active Safety Features Compact Footprint Provides Superior Maneuverability in an Open-bed Configuration Proudly Built at Hyundai Motor Manufacturing Alabama (HMMA) in Montgomery FOUNTAIN VALLEY, Calif., Apr. 15, 2021 – Hyundai today unveiled its highly anticipated Santa Cruz Sport Adventure Vehicle. The 2022 Santa Cruz breaks new ground within the SUV, Truck and Crossover segments by offering a true Sport Adventure Vehicle unlike anything else in the U.S. market. Santa Cruz boasts bold yet sophisticated design, powerful and efficient powertrain options, a flexible open bed for gear, cutting-edge connectivity and a highly maneuverable all-wheel drive platform that is equally at home in urban and adventure-focused environments. The Santa Cruz Sport Adventure Vehicle begins production in Montgomery, Alabama in June and will be available for sale in summer. The addition of Santa Cruz to HMMA production will add an estimated 1,200 jobs to the U.S. economy. Hyundai is also creating an early reservation system for the U.S.-market Santa Cruz in late April at https://www.hyundaiusa.com/. “Santa Cruz, with its bold styling, breaks open all new segment territory, both for Hyundai and the industry as a whole. Open-bed flexibility coupled with closed-cabin security meets the changing everyday needs of its adventure-oriented buyers, while powerful and efficient engines and superb maneuverability ensure it is a pleasure to drive in urban or off-road environments. Our customers will wonder just how they managed before owning one,” said Jose Munoz, president and CEO, Hyundai Motor North America. Why Santa Cruz? Santa Cruz was developed to be the ultimate Sport Adventure Vehicle, a moniker confirmed in Hyundai’s early consumer research. The research found consumers, often living in urban environments, whose lifestyles include the need to escape to weekend adventures of all kinds. Many of these customers carry various gear and equipment that is better suited to an open bed rather than a typical SUV bodystyle. These buyers want versatile transportation that is equally flexible for urban, adventure, occupational or even home improvement gear. Santa Cruz features a secure, open bed area which includes a lockable tonneau cover, hidden bed storage and versatile bed extension accessories. At the same time, these customers still value the secure utility of a compact SUV, with its comfort, passenger space, fuel efficiency and parking ease. Santa Cruz, with its unique, bold design, created an entirely new segment that meets these specific buyer needs like no vehicle before it. Everything about Santa Cruz reflects a duality of purpose in its design execution. This all-new category-bending vehicle holds a variety of imagery in balanced juxtaposition: Urban life connectivity with escape to outdoor adventure Work and play flexibility Tough yet alluring demeanor Roominess with maneuverability Open cargo area and secured, lockable storage Towing capability and fuel efficiency The forward view of Santa Cruz deploys a hidden lighting signature that becomes visible within the grille only when illuminated. The daytime running lamps (DRLs) present a parametric jewel design with high-tech precision detailing. A bold, cascading grille anchors the front view, supported by a skid plate element in the lower front fascia. Voluminous hood and fenders further communicate an imposing first impression. In profile, Santa Cruz signals a sporty yet capable spirit. The A- and C-pillars present faster forward and rearward rakes than typical open-bed utility vehicles. Large 20-inch alloy wheels with a multi-faceted, triangular design are surrounded by armor-like wheel arches, conveying both wheel-articulation potential and off-road capability. Powerful body side volumes contrast with precise triangular sheer-edged surfaces and tight radius character lines. From the rear, a horizontal “T” lighting signature adds visual width and distinguishes Santa Cruz from anything on the road. The functional rear open bed area features secure, lockable in-bed storage, integrated corner bumper steps and a lockable tonneau cover, seamlessly integrated with the overall design. The rear tail lamps are embossed with: “Designed in California” as a testament to the passion of Hyundai’s California-based design team. Small, discrete design details such as this can be found throughout the exterior and interior. Interior Design The interior of the Santa Cruz expresses a sophisticated and refined appearance. The contrasting rugged yet refined motif matches the boldness of the exterior, boasting a technical ambience that appeals to those who appreciate cutting-edge technologies in their daily lives. It features an enveloping dual-cockpit design that encapsulates each passenger. Design teams focused on ease of ingress and egress and ergonomic comfort on long drives. The premium center stack display features an edgeless infotainment screen appearance, with an impressive 10 inches of visibility. The optional center digital cluster display also measures 10 inches. Under the rear seats is convenient, in-cabin storage. Completing the premium ambience is an available Bose® audio system. Powerful and Efficient Powertrains Santa Cruz offers two powerful, flexible and efficient powertrains. The standard powertrain is a 2.5L direct-injected in-line four-cylinder engine with an estimated 190+ horsepower and 180+ lb.-ft. of torque. This engine couples to an eight-speed hydraulic automatic transmission for quick acceleration and superb efficiency. Santa Cruz also offers a 2.5L direct-injected turbocharged engine with an estimated 275+ horsepower and 310+ lb.-ft. of torque linked to an eight-speed dual-clutch automatic transmission (DCT). This DCT includes steering-wheel-mounted paddle shifters for manual shifting control by the driver. Eight-Speed Automatic Transmission The eight-speed transmission for the standard 2.5-liter engine provides quick and crisp shifts for an engaging and efficient driving experience. This automatic transmission adds ratio range at both the top and bottom of output speeds allowing for extra thrust off-the-line and a quieter, more fuel-efficient trip on the interstate. A multi-disc and individually controlled hydraulic channel torque converter improves responsiveness by expanding the direct connection band, while a downsized oil pump and double ball bearings minimize frictional losses. Advanced HTRAC® AWD and Towing Capability Both 2.5L four-cylinder and 2.5L four-cylinder turbo models offer HTRAC® all-wheel drive capability for complete confidence when pursuing adventures of all kinds or for that extra peace of mind when driving in an unexpected snowfall. The HTRAC AWD system was developed as a multi-mode system, providing an electronic, variable-torque-split clutch with active torque control between the front and rear axles. The Sport setting gives a more agile feel by sending more torque to the rear wheels, for a sporty, dynamic experience. This system has a wide range of torque distribution variability, tuned for conditions such as straight-line acceleration, medium- and high-speed cornering, and hill starts. For those customers who like to tow their weekend gear with them, the 2.5L 4-cylinder is rated at 3,500 lbs. for towing and the 2.5L Turbo AWD model boasts a generous 5,000 lbs. of towing capability. Compact Dimensions Yield Superb Maneuverability Santa Cruz makes efficient use of its compact dimensions by offering high utility with excellent maneuverability. Its shorter wheelbase and smaller overall footprint make it a joy to maneuver and park in challenging urban parking, with an exceptional curb-to-curb turning radius of only 20.0 feet. Specification (in.) Santa Cruz Tacoma Ridgeline Frontier Length 195.7 212.2 210.0 205.5 Width 75.0 75.2 78.5 72.8 Height 66.7 70.7 70.3 70.1 Wheelbase 118.3 127.4 125.2 126.0 Bed Length Upper 48.4 Lower 52.1 60.4 63.6 59.4 Footprint Area (sq. ft.) 101.9 109.7 114.6 103.9 Responsive and Refined Chassis Tuning Santa Cruz was developed with a focus on enhanced driving dynamics and responsive performance for a wide variety of urban and off-road, multi-surface driving conditions. The shorter wheelbase, short overhangs and wide track create a planted stance that results in exceptional agility in urban environments. These specifications also provide confident agility when traversing off-road terrain. Available 20-inch alloy wheels with wide, all-season, all-terrain tires give surefooted, agile handling character on a variety of road surfaces. Available 18-inch wheels with more voluminous tire sidewalls for off-road adventures are also available. View full article

I want to contribute to this thread. I want to say something positive about the Santa Cruz and all its brethren. But I dont see how in the world I could accomplish something like that. I dont see a future with me owning something like this. Ever. I dont have a use for such a vehicle. I guess it looks OK. Nothing really wrong with it. Im sure Hyundai will engineer it so as its useful for its owner and the vehicle's intended purpose. The earth toned colour one that @surreal1272 posted DOES look REALLY good. As much as I love Wranglers, the pic that @David posted makes me wanna look away and NOT see that again. Enough for me to "ignore" David's posts so I dont ever see it again if I click unto this thread again... I dont like the Gladiator...at all! If I was ever to own this thing, Id install a lift kit on it, try to fit larger offroad tires and make it look like an offroader. Im impressed with myself. I succeeded in contributing positive thoughts...

The black and orange plates in NY have long been retired. And yes...I do LOVE them. In fact

The term Quebecker as I have learned to use it IS by some Anglophones. And I sometimes think that Quebecois hate the term Quebecker when a certain type of Anglophone uses it to describe them. I dont hear it as often anymore. On the English media, they now use Quebecois. I think they dont like it because it seems like an English description of a person that hails from Quebec. Just stick an English 'E' and English 'R' at the end of a very French Province of Quebec and we have an English descriptor to describe a French people in a French Province. And coming from a colonial English person...its as close to an insult as it can get. Anyway, back to cars being spotted in April. Going to the bus stop to pick up my son an hour or so ago and I saw a black Pontiac G6 convertible. I wasnt going to mention it as I dont think its that interesting of a spotting. But I didnt want to derail the thread with socio-political terminology from a country that most of you arent a part of anyway...

Ya' think? ?

The Ford Maverick will be more trucky but just as small.

I got the down low torque though. and my car isn’t listed for sale nor would it be listed as “power everything”.

I do not know what is happening in your neck of the woods, but Quebeckers, older Quebeckers were heavy heavy smokers. These folk still smoke today regardless of the health warnings and the general un-cool factor that it has today unlike the status it once had. But...older French Quebecker males DO smoke less than French women today . Also, at least in the Montreal area, YOUNGER females smoke (and vape) far far more than the males. I wanna know why that is?

For those who endured wickedly mean nuns, it would take much more than $ 350. By the time I had some of the few who were left, they had thankfully mellowed out.

Enough said. Especially with the Farrah Fawcett hair. This lady is probably of the variety that relishes, or relished, her smoke breaks outside her place of work with kindred souls. Oh yes, this (stereo)type definitely exists. Don't be arguing with me, folks, and throwing down that PC card.

I think he @ykX is equating a 'wallowy" suspension with crappy ride. To that he aint wrong about the cars having wallowy suspensions during the time he is referencing which is from the late 1960s to the early and mid-1980s. I aint gonna judge nobody for liking and not liking this type of ride. I dont care really what somebody's preference is for car suspensions, but there are some things that I will take exception to. But his or anybody else's preference aint one of them. The thing I WILL take exception to though is about calling it a crap ride as opposed to a tighter European "road hugging, stiffer suspension is that I will DEFEND the wallowy ride for these reasons: BECAUSE our NORTH AMERICAN roads and CAR CULTURE DICTATED that OUR cars RODE like we are in our living room on our sofas in COMFORT. Our highways, to THIS day, are STRAIGHT for THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of miles and when we USED to go on family trips from coast to coast practically, East to West or North to South and EVERYTHING in between, in European terms, many borders of many countries, 5-6 -7 countries, would be crossed. Europe is also very very mountainous, and hence their cars being smaller and because most of their roads were horse and donkey travelled, cars HAD to be tighter for turning. American roads flattened the mountains or go right through them, but NOT travelling around the perimeter of the mountain when on one side is the mountain, the other side is a plummet to your death and you have to share the very very narrow road with cars going the opposite side. Brakes and handling and turning radius had BETTER be tight... City driving is the same. HUGE phoquing boulevards. Street light to street light...racing. Is THAT a better ride over the other? Well, take a North American road trip in a small, tight suspension-ed Japanese or European car of that era and you would realize that those cars were NOT great for OUR roads AND car culture. Id say shytty if we were truly honest about this whole thing. By contrast, traditional big American cars SUCK for Europe...for many many reasons. As many as those 1970s European and Japanese cars were for us. High gasoline prices was probably the SOLE reason why these cars even got a foothold on our shores. Again, if we were truly honest about this whole thing... What I have said is not a secret. I aint teaching anybody anthing knew here. Its just sometimes, we let our biases get in the way...

The first look is a little jarring because the look doesn't say "pick up" at all, which I think is half the point. Definitely going for different here, as far as their approach to this niche market (again, with a nod to the Baja of the early 2000s).

When I first saw this, I thought it was quite ugly. Then I started to see it at different angles and it started to grown on me and I read up on it. It's a really compelling package and I think it ought to do really well. I also think the power numbers have Ford scampering to shove the 2.3T in the Maverick, because most are speculating only the 1.5T and 2.0T. I think the 280hp/300tq version should be fairly quick.

While it has been compared to the last gen Subaru Baja, I don't think that is an apt comparison. It's Tucson roots gives it a taller ride (without being too tall) and upper end engine for it would shame anything that was ever in the Baja. It also looks FAAAAR better. Honestly, I don't know how well it will do in a country full of "critics" and jacked up pick up drivers (who never use them for actual work) but it certainly has potential with the city dweller crowd. Hell, I wouldn't mind one for those short trips to Home Depot. My only issue with it is not having a pass through to the cabin at seat level (not a fan of the pass through manual window). Other than that, I might have to get a closer look at one once they hit the dealerships and then wait for a gently used one to hit the lot (because screw new car prices).

It's gear oil like you would find in a rear differential... the service life for rear diff oil is between 30,000 and 150,000 miles depending on the manufacturer and driving style. For an F-150 for example, normal duty without frequent towing has a cycle of 150,000 miles. If you tow all summer, they recommend every 30,000. With an oil filter, that service interval will be very long... much longer than the length of time the initial leasees will have the vehicle.

For our Buick loving Buddies... Fins...! For the perverted in all of us... Final thought...

To each his own!

Exactly. Everyone likes what they like. For example, I personally like cars from 50s even though they are way before my time, just like their swoopy aerodynamic (or what they thought aerodynamic at that time) shape. It just balthasar and David making comments about how badly designed old Ferraris or Lamborghinis are while adoring some over chromed bricks seems a bit funny to me. But as they say, whatever floats your boat.

There are many things. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and everyone has an opinion. '50s cars don't do it for me...before my time. 60s-70s cars I can relate to, but my sweet spot is the 80s-90s. I like all sorts of cars, from the US and abroad. I try and avoid xenophobia with cars...not partial to any particular brand or country of origin. How a car drives is irrelevant to the styling; many 60s-70s cars are horrid to drive by today's standards, many vintage exotics look gorgeous but are ergonomic/packaging nightmares.

Personally to me Mehh is most American cars from the late 60s, early 70s and 80s you guys are posting. Huge, misproportionate, land yachts full of chrome and bad taste. I don't see them as beautiful at all. Plus they drove like crap too. The only cool cars from that period are muscle and pony cars. But that's just my personal opinion

My grandfather drove a car identical to this in blue, my fathers best friend had one in white. Sbulime cars....

The only car I could tell who was driving was the Porsche. And like you, it was a Boomer. A 70-ish year old man. He looked good and proud driving it. He deserved a high five from me! ?

'The Death of Automotive Styling Progress'. - - - - - 10 years :

Spotted this beauty on the way home from my sons tonight. Could tell it was a Plymouth, bit not sure what model. Yoda of old, can ya help me out here? @balthazar