Simon C

6 Speed RWD Info

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GM NEWS
PRODUCTION BEGINS OF NEW SIX-SPEED TRANSMISSIONS AT HISTORIC WILLOW RUN FACILITY .... GM is announcing the start of production of a new family of Hydra-Matic six-speed automatic transmissions for rear-drive applications at the upgraded Willow Run facility in Ypsilanti, Michigan. The 6L80 six-speed transmission debuts in the 2006 Chevy Corvette, Cadillac STS-V and XLR-V, and several models of GM's all-new 2007 full-size SUVs.

Production of the transmissions is the culmination of a 450-million-dollar, nearly 3-year investment at the Ypsilanti Transmissions Operations (YTO) facility. A new team working concept has been arranged at the plant, which will serve to help us achieve our goal of producing up to three million six speed transmissions annually. By 2010, GM will introduce 10 variants of six-speed transmissions, including front-drive models, which can enhance vehicle fuel economy by up to 4 percent when compared to four- and five-speed automatics.

"The introduction of these new six-speeds will mark a new chapter in GM's 65-year history of producing efficient, reliable, smooth-shifting automatic transmissions," said Kent Sears, GM Powertrain vice president of manufacturing.

Guys, this is one hell of a transmission.
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2010 for the FWD 6-speed...  <_<

[post="34541"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


From the article:

"GM also will introduce a Hydra-Matic six-speed automatic for front-wheel-drive/all-wheel-drive vehicles; it debuts in the 2007 Saturn Aura sedan."
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I like this line 'GM estimates the wide ratio spread can help cut 0-60 mph times by as much as 7 percent and enhance fuel economy by up to 4 percent'. This could drop a 6 second car's time by 4/10's of a second or a 4 second cars time by almost 3/10's.
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so where does it end? isn't there a packaging issue with more cogs added? will it all just switch to CVTs in the end? there is only so much room under a car for the tranny, where will a 9 speed fit?
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Mercedes uses a 7-speed. I'd say that until CVTs become actual proven technology, we're going to see 6,7,8,9,25 speed autos. Remember what happened last time GM had a CVT, it wasn't pretty, and I'm not just talking about the car itself.
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well which 6-speeds autos were in the 2006 corvettes that we arleady sold and the one in our show room right now? is that a different plant? or is this an old artical
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Mercedes uses a 7-speed.  I'd say that until CVTs become actual proven technology, we're going to see 6,7,8,9,25 speed autos.  Remember what happened last time GM had a CVT, it wasn't pretty, and I'm not just talking about the car itself.

[post="34598"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


rememeber everything GM does to start off with?

CVT has the potential to increase efficency by a lot, and increase acceloration by a lot...

it just has to be done correctly, it can be done with pulleys, cogs, gears, or chains and made just as strong as any manual transmission... but when GM works with Ford to create one... thats why its unreliable...

GM's & Fords CVT is done with metal gear like cones and rubber/kevlar belts... not sufficent... They just gave up at their first try...
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IIRC about 6 months ago GM and another automatic transmission manufactuere (perhaps Jatco) announced a break through on 6 speed transmssions. They independantly announced this was the end of CVT transmissions.
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2010 for the FWD 6-speed...  <_<

[post="34541"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Article states, "By 2010 GM will have 10 varients of the 6 speed auro transmission including FWD". So where do you get the idea that the 6 sped FWD will not be introduced sooner?.
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Article states, "By 2010 GM will have 10 varients of the 6 speed auro transmission including FWD". So where do you get the idea that the 6 sped FWD will not be introduced sooner?.

[post="34626"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Oops... I should have made this clear. I meant full blown across the line like what the 4-speed is now.
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Oops... I should have made this clear. I meant full blown across the line like what the 4-speed is now.

[post="34628"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I believe the transmission GM and Ford designed together is the FWD 6 speed that will debut on the 2007 Saturn. The GM CVT design was built in Eastern Europe, but I don't know who did the design. GM is looking at eventually being able to reduce the cost of manufacturing the 6 speeds because they may be able to eliminate the torque converter, and use the gear clutches only, because of the higher gear ratios available with a six speed (I got this from one of the GM powertrain websites some time ago). Also, I don't think there is much incentive for most of the manufacturers to go much beyond 6 speed automatics, because their is little or no gain in fuel economy or acceleration. GM Powertrain stated in one article I read that they thought the CVT was dead for them. They felt they could do just as good economy/acceleration with the 6 speed at lower cost to produce, and none of the many limitations of the CVT. GM is working on a manual 6 speed built inside the case of an automatic 6 speed that would have the Park feature included in the manual. I also think GM sees the greater fuel economy from Homogenous Charge Combustion Ignition (HCCI) as offering far greater returns in the mpg battle than additional gears.
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Mercedes uses a 7-speed.  I'd say that until CVTs become actual proven technology, we're going to see 6,7,8,9,25 speed autos.  Remember what happened last time GM had a CVT, it wasn't pretty, and I'm not just talking about the car itself.

[post="34598"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]



CVTs are 'proven'..maybe not with GM, but Audi is using them as are others..
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Audi and Honda have been using CVTs for years, Subaru used one in the Justy (not sure if they spread it to any other cars) but GM does not have much experience with CVTs, they put them in some Saturns, but that backfired. DCX doesn't have one in production that I know of (SMART maybe?) Toyota doesn't have one that comes to mind (I dont keep track of their overseas offerings) the only one BMW makes goes into the Mini, Audi is the only member of the VW group that uses them. I'm sure all of these companies have done a good bit of development work on them, but the question is how will the general public accept them? If they can have regular X-speeed autos that everyone is used to, and have a large ratio spread, might as well stay on the safe side.
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so where does it end? isn't there a packaging issue with more cogs added? will it all just switch to CVTs in the end? there is only so much room under a car for the tranny, where will a 9 speed fit?

[post="34594"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Exactly. This insanity with 7 and 8 speed automatics is getting out of hand. Come on people, the more gears in the tranny the bigger it's going to be and heavier. Lets not forget more complex and far far costlier to fix. The Japanese are just trying to cover up there deceptions with hp numbers that were higher than they really were and there lack of displacement and low end torque. The Europeans have 7 speed automatics and just look where their quality is; third place behind us and the Japanese brands.
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Audi and Honda have been using CVTs for years, Subaru used one in the Justy (not sure if they spread it to any other cars) but GM does not have much experience with CVTs, they put them in some Saturns, but that backfired.  DCX doesn't have one in production that I know of (SMART maybe?) Toyota doesn't have one that comes to mind (I dont keep track of their overseas offerings) the only one BMW makes goes into the Mini, Audi is the only member of the VW group that uses them.  I'm sure all of these companies have done a good bit of development work on them, but the question is how will the general public accept them?  If they can have regular X-speeed autos that everyone is used to, and have a large ratio spread, might as well stay on the safe side.

[post="34788"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


I've NEVER liked any CVT-equipped car I'm driving.

The Murano rental-car I have right now irritates me with its CVT. It doesn't feel natural, and the groaning and moaning from staying high in the rev range when accelerating is weird...not to mention the rubber-banding effect when you are off and on the gas....

Murano doesn't feel any better or any worse than any other CVT I've driven....

I like the feel of a traditional automatic transmission upshifting and downshifting through the gears as you accelerate.
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I've NEVER liked any CVT-equipped car I'm driving.

The Murano rental-car I have right now irritates me with its CVT.  It doesn't feel natural, and the groaning and moaning from staying high in the rev range when accelerating is weird...not to mention the rubber-banding effect when you are off and on the gas....

Murano doesn't feel any better or any worse than any other CVT I've driven....

I like the feel of a traditional automatic transmission upshifting and downshifting through the gears as you accelerate.

[post="35098"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

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It seems to me that more and more engines are displaying unusually flat tourgue curves. This should minimize the need for more then 6 speeeds in all but the smallest (less than 1 l.? ) engines.
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Glad to see some of the 6 speeds are finally out. What plant will the new FWD 6 speeds be coming from. Hopefully some other cars will get for 07 along with the Aura.
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The manuals are from GM Powertrain Europe, the autos from Aisin AW, who previously supplied 5-speed autos for GM Europe and the Saturn Vue. The rwd 5- and 6-speed manuals are from Aisin AI.
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