[The O.C.]

I agree that skip shift, as it's currently set up, isn't a really graceful solution.  Would a 1-3-5-6 shift pattern work better do you think?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think you need ANYTHING other than a normal 6-speed manual tranny.

Let ME decide if I want to skip shifts as I accelerate.....and usually, I do. Frequently I go 1st-2nd...and THEN sometimes into 4th....then 6th.....

But I almost always use 1st and 2nd to some extent.

The ONLY reason GM uses skip-shift is to get by the EPA tests so that Corvette doesn't succumb to a gas-guzzler tax.

I'd rather pay the gas-guzzler tax then have to deal with such a ridiculous system that NO OTHER high end sports car/sports sedan maker makes you deal with (other than the Viper...which has it too.)

V8 BMW 5-and-6 series with manual transmissions don't have any such feature.....neither does V8/manual Audi S4s.....or any manual tranny Porsche.....I could go on-and-on....

[The O.C.]

Sounds annoying. I would find some software to remove that if it were my car.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOL

There is....I just haven't ordered it yet.

$19.95 from online Corvette parts suppliers.

Installs easily by any typical mechanic. Basically just a bypass "switch" that gets you around the skip-shift function and does NOT invalidate the warranty and does NOT interefere with the ECM, or any of the emissions stuff, or even any of the service diagnostics.

It's widely known and used by Corvette enthusiasts.....and one of my Managers that I work with, who has an '04 Z06, recently installed it on his car.

[The O.C.]

Yes, that is so annoying, when your going a little too fast for second, but too slow for 3rd, so instead of a surge of power, you get a gradual increase while you get back into the powerband. 5 and 6 speeds are an improvement over 4 speeds, but I dont think 7 or 8 is necessary, or of any benefit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I'd agree with you on a 5-6 speed being optimal.....however, the benefit of the Benz or Lexus 7-or-8 speed trannys is that the transmission is designed to totally skip gears as necessary on acceleration or deceleration in order to give you the proper gear for the driving conditions.

In other words, this is said to severly reduce the "hunting" sensation you might otherwise experience with a transmission with this many gears.

Example....cruising at 55mph in 8th gear in the Lexus. You floor it to pass on a two-lane. The tranny automatically selects, say, 3rd gear from 8th....DIRECTLY....instead of downshifting from 8, to 7, to 6, to 5, to 4. It's kind of like how you would do it in a manual.....you don't downshift a manual through the gears (typically) you grab the gear you need for the situation.

That's how the Benz 7-speed operates. While it wasn't my favorite tranny, it was pretty good at masking any sort of hunting between gears. It just always seemed to be in the right gear whether you were accelerating or decelerating.

[The O.C.]

I have it... it's great.  You unplug the wires going to the skip-shift solenoid, and plug in a resistor (in place of the solenoid) to keep the computer thinking everything is OK.

And, yes... a 1-3 skip would be better then a 1-4.  But, it's not a natural shifting motion.

Also... to whoever is using hi-po (Vette, CTSv) cars w/ 6-speed manuals to argue that 6-speeds doesn't equal a crappy torque curve... Those cars have a double overdrive, so it's more like a 4-speed.  That kinda works in favor of Oldsmoboi's case.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah yes....BUT

Regardless of what the actual ratios are, in my C6, only 6th gear "feels" like a long-geared "overdrive."

On the freeway, even in 5th the thing has ample torque to accelerate quickly. It's only 6th that seems to knock the breath out of it.

Thank you torque!

[CaddyXLR-V]

Well, I'd agree with you on a 5-6 speed being optimal.....however, the benefit of the Benz or Lexus 7-or-8 speed trannys is that the transmission is designed to totally skip gears as necessary on acceleration or deceleration in order to give you the proper gear for the driving conditions.

In other words, this is said to severly reduce the "hunting" sensation you might otherwise experience with a transmission with this many gears.

Example....cruising at 55mph in 8th gear in the Lexus.  You floor it to pass on a two-lane.  The tranny automatically selects, say, 3rd gear from 8th....DIRECTLY....instead of downshifting from 8, to 7, to 6, to 5, to 4.  It's kind of like how you would do it in a manual.....you don't downshift a manual through the gears (typically) you grab the gear you need for the situation.

That's how the Benz 7-speed operates.  While it wasn't my favorite tranny, it was pretty good at masking any sort of hunting between gears.  It just always seemed to be in the right gear whether you were accelerating or decelerating.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wouldn't a dual clutch 6 speed be better for that? It can have the gear preselected. And at what cost do you get a slight benefit of having basically inbetween gears? If there would only be a 500-1000rpm difference in gears then is it really worth the added weight/cost/complexity? I assume it is not a small transmission, and would have adverse effects on packaging as well.

[Oldsmoboi]

Well, I'd agree with you on a 5-6 speed being optimal.....however, the benefit of the Benz or Lexus 7-or-8 speed trannys is that the transmission is designed to totally skip gears as necessary on acceleration or deceleration in order to give you the proper gear for the driving conditions.

In other words, this is said to severly reduce the "hunting" sensation you might otherwise experience with a transmission with this many gears.

Example....cruising at 55mph in 8th gear in the Lexus.  You floor it to pass on a two-lane.  The tranny automatically selects, say, 3rd gear from 8th....DIRECTLY....instead of downshifting from 8, to 7, to 6, to 5, to 4.  It's kind of like how you would do it in a manual.....you don't downshift a manual through the gears (typically) you grab the gear you need for the situation.

That's how the Benz 7-speed operates.  While it wasn't my favorite tranny, it was pretty good at masking any sort of hunting between gears.  It just always seemed to be in the right gear whether you were accelerating or decelerating.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think from the press releases, the most number of gears the 7 and 8 speeds can jump at a time is 2. I think a jump from 8 to 3 would be a bit drastic don't you?

[Oldsmoboi]

Wouldn't a dual clutch 6 speed be better for that? It can have the gear preselected. And at what cost do you get a slight benefit of having basically inbetween gears? If there would only be a 500-1000rpm difference in gears then is it really worth the added weight/cost/complexity? I assume it is not a small transmission, and would have adverse effects on packaging as well.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know what the Toyotas are like, but apparently GM managed to get their 6-speeds into a package smaller then their old 4-speeds.

[Imaj]

great, toyota idiot and hondaface asshole are at it again

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

lol.

[The O.C.]

Wouldn't a dual clutch 6 speed be better for that? It can have the gear preselected. And at what cost do you get a slight benefit of having basically inbetween gears? If there would only be a 500-1000rpm difference in gears then is it really worth the added weight/cost/complexity? I assume it is not a small transmission, and would have adverse effects on packaging as well.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, many modern 5-or-6 speed transmissions have somehow been even more compact than their historic 4-speed predecessors.....I think I read somewhere that the 6-speed in the Corvette and STS-v is actually smaller and lighter than the old 4T65-E...?

I like the idea of VW's DSG.....however, I'm only guessing that by offering up 7 or 8 ratios, you (the manufacturer) really is trying to give the consumer THE perfect ratio for whatever driving situation you are in.

I don't THINK I need 7 or 8 gears.....I like most modern 5-or-6 speed automatics. The 6-speed tranny BMW uses is one of my favorite all-time automatic transmissions.

What I don't like.....are CVTs.....

[The O.C.]

I think from the press releases, the most number of gears the 7 and 8 speeds can jump at a time is 2.  I think a jump from 8 to 3 would be a bit drastic don't you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know how many they can jump......but I do know that the 7-speed we had in the S500 never seemed to "hunt" and always seemed to pick the right gear for whatever the driving condition was. It never seemed to have "too many ratios or gears."

MY only bitch with the Benz 7-speed was that it was too easy to induce shudder in the driveline if you "tripped" it up....say by getting on the gas hard....then lifting suddenly....then getting back on it SOFTLY. OR, from a stop, you had to feather the throttle to get a smooth engagement of the torque-converter-clutch.....almost like it didn't have ENOUGH torque-converter-cusioning of the transmission...

Make sense???

[ToniCipriani]

Don't you ever have anything intelligent to post?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Aw come on... you got to have the smart asses and the idiots to balance out. It's all about ecology, and how the earth works as an ecosystem.

[Oldsmoboi]

I don't know how many they can jump......but I do  know that the 7-speed we had in the S500 never seemed to "hunt" and always seemed to pick the right gear for whatever the driving condition was.  It never seemed to have "too many ratios or gears."

MY only bitch with the Benz 7-speed was that it was too easy to induce shudder in the driveline if you "tripped" it up....say by getting on the gas hard....then lifting suddenly....then getting back on it SOFTLY.  OR, from a stop, you had to feather the throttle to get a smooth engagement of the torque-converter-clutch.....almost like it didn't have ENOUGH torque-converter-cusioning of the transmission...

Make sense???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can do that in the CTS in non-sport mode. Tap the throttle enough to kick it down a gear then let up suddenly and the poor confused transmission says, "Now wait a minute here, I thought you said.... damnit.. ok!"

In sport mode, it will actually hold that lower gear and keep the engine revs high in anticipation of some more spirited driving. It'll only upshift if you cruise like that for a while or take it out of sport.

I think any automatic can be tripped up if you're trying to trip it up. They can't know when you're with them.

[Paolino]

I can do that in the CTS in non-sport mode. Tap the throttle enough to kick it down a gear then let up suddenly and the poor confused transmission says, "Now wait a minute here, I thought you said.... damnit.. ok!"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I used to do that on the 93 Tracer I had... I'd punch the gas moderately, then at the end of the rev, ease up and the shift would go very smoothly, versus the drink-spilling shift it used to cause before.

[pow]

I can do that in the CTS in non-sport mode. Tap the throttle enough to kick it down a gear then let up suddenly and the poor confused transmission says, "Now wait a minute here, I thought you said.... damnit.. ok!"

In sport mode, it will actually hold that lower gear and keep the engine revs high in anticipation of some more spirited driving.  It'll only upshift if you cruise like that for a while or take it out of sport.

I think any automatic can be tripped up if you're trying to trip it up. They can't know when you're  with them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think he's complaining about the driveline shutter that accompanies it. That's the only advantage of FWD I can think of, well, apart from economy and snow performance.

[MyerShift]

You know what's nice... good news like this. (The Toyota tranny thing, looks like things diverged off-course.

This post has been edited by MyerShift: 23 April 2006 - 04:22 PM

[CaddyXLR-V]

Well, many modern 5-or-6 speed transmissions have somehow been even more compact than their historic 4-speed predecessors.....I think I read somewhere that the 6-speed in the Corvette and STS-v is actually smaller and lighter than the old 4T65-E...?

I like the idea of VW's DSG.....however, I'm only guessing that by offering up 7 or 8 ratios, you (the manufacturer) really is trying to give the consumer THE perfect ratio for whatever driving situation you are in.

I don't THINK I need 7 or 8 gears.....I like most modern 5-or-6 speed automatics.  The 6-speed tranny BMW uses is one of my favorite all-time automatic transmissions. 

What I don't like.....are CVTs.....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So then the question remains, would the money be better spent on dual clutch autos, or on 7-8 gears? I just pray they don't come up with a silly idea for a 7 or 8 speed manual.

[Camino LS6]

O.C. is absolutely correct about skip-shift. It is complete garbage and I view it as potentially dangerous as it can really throw a driver buy not allowing expected accelleration during quick-reaction situations. As far as the 6spd. itself goes I have found that it depends on the setup of the engine. My Firehawk and my GTO act very differently even though both are LS1 6spds. Even around town all 6 speeds are useful in the GTO with its increased torque (different cam) vs. the Firehawk where 5th is often too high to use at slower cruising speeds.

[Flybrian]

Okay, for an outsider's perspective on skip-shift...

It saves you about $1,300 from the guzzler tax, but its defeatable with a $19.95 kit that is easy to install and doesn't interfere with anything in/on the car nor does it invalidate the warranty.

Net savings from GM to you - $1280.05. This nearly pays for Magnaride, the transparant roof set, or navigation.

What's the problem?

[Camino LS6]

Okay, for an outsider's perspective on skip-shift...

It saves you about $1,300 from the guzzler tax, but its defeatable with a $19.95 kit that is easy to install and doesn't interfere with anything in/on the car nor does it invalidate the warranty.

Net savings from GM to you - $1280.05. This nearly pays for Magnaride, the transparant roof set, or navigation.

What's the problem?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good point,Fly. Touche.

[Oldsmoboi]

Okay, for an outsider's perspective on skip-shift...

It saves you about $1,300 from the guzzler tax, but its defeatable with a $19.95 kit that is easy to install and doesn't interfere with anything in/on the car nor does it invalidate the warranty.

Net savings from GM to you - $1280.05. This nearly pays for Magnaride, the transparant roof set, or navigation.

What's the problem?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The voice of reason enters....