Jump to content
Create New...
  • Drew Dowdell
    Drew Dowdell

    FCA Pooling Fleet with Tesla in EU for Emissions Requirements

      ...worth hundreds of millions for Tesla...

    FCA is paying Tesla hundreds of millions of dollar to pool their vehicles with Tesla to avoid EU fines over emissions. Tesla put out an invitation to other automakers to use its fleet to lower their emissions totals and FCA took them up on it.  Neither company released financial specifics of the deal, but it is estimated by the Financial Times to be worth hundreds of millions of dollars.  

    Similar to California which allows manufactures with a surplus of ZEV credits to sell them to manufacturers who need them, the EU Commission allows manufacturers to pool together their fleets to avoid paying fines. Tesla makes significant money selling these credits in the US, earning $103.4m in 2018 and $279.7m in 2017. Once set up, the pool in Europe is good for several years.

    Vehicles in 2018 are allowed an average CO2 emission of 120.5g per kilometer. That figure will drop to 95g per kilometer next year.  FCA's average for 2018 was 123g per kilometer, one of the largest off the mark of the 13 major manufacturers. FCA is seen to have fallen to near the back of the pack when in comes to reigning in CO2 emissions.

    FCA was forecast to be facing fines exceeding €2 billion ($2.25 billion) without pooling with Tesla. 

     


    User Feedback

    Recommended Comments

    This tells me that FCA products sold in Europe are far more destructive to the environment than here in the US with the Hellcat. So Fiat, Alfa, Maserati, Ferrari all must pollute way worse than they state. Makes one rethink why would you want such a polluting noisy Ferrari?

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    39 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    Makes one rethink why would you want such a polluting noisy Ferrari?

    LOL

    Sometimes @dfelt you are something.  What do you mean why would you want a Ferrari? As opposing to what, Tesla, Bolt?  

    Noisy?  Ferrari engines have one of the most beautiful sounds in the industry.

    Anyway, most this type of cars get to be driven very little to make a difference,  Probably Fiats and Jeeps are the majority of FCA vehicles in Europe, and I doubt they have higher emissions than the rest of European manufacturers.  It just the standards are strict and getting stricter so it makes sense financially to buy credits from Tesla, than to pay fines.

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    5 minutes ago, ykX said:

    LOL

    Sometimes @dfelt you are something.  What do you mean why would you want a Ferrari? As opposing to what, Tesla, Bolt?  

    Noisy?  Ferrari engines have one of the most beautiful sounds in the industry.

    Anyway, most this type of cars get to be driven very little to make a difference,  Probably Fiats and Jeeps are the majority of FCA vehicles in Europe, and I doubt they have higher emissions than the rest of European manufacturers.  It just the standards are strict and getting stricter so it makes sense financially to buy credits from Tesla, than to pay fines.

    That's the point.. they do have higher emissions per mile... their engines, particularly their diesels, aren't as clean as those from other manufacturers. 

    GM would probably have been on that list also, but they mostly pulled out of Europe.  Peugeot was even upset and wanted a refund from GM because their cars were that much further behind in emissions ratings.  Peugeot is hard at work replacing GM engines in the Opel lineup with PSA ones. 

    Then there is the issue that a Jeep, just due to its shape, isn't going to be as efficient per mile as an equally powered wagon or hatch. That's a big reason why Europe will be getting the Compass PHEV and Renegade PHEV while we don't. 

    But you're right, it is cheaper for FCA to pool with Tesla than it is for them to pay the fine. 

    • Thanks 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    2 hours ago, ykX said:

    LOL

    Sometimes @dfelt you are something.  What do you mean why would you want a Ferrari? As opposing to what, Tesla, Bolt?  

    Noisy?  Ferrari engines have one of the most beautiful sounds in the industry.

    I would take a Tesla or Bolt over Ferrari. My PERSONAL preference. Ferrari is over rated and that engine that you says makes a beautiful sound, NOPE, Corvette has a better deeper sound than the over rated V12 Ferrari engine. High Pitch Cracking that is ear piercing from Ferrari I put into the same bucket of garbage as all of Harley Davidson bikes excluding the awesome LiveWire.

    Since I play Trumpet and Piano, I guess my ear is just more accustomed to a tuned sound than loud noise.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I don't think I've ever heard somebody dislike the flat plane crank V8 of a Ferrari. But, if there was going to be one it would of course come from a full on EV fanboy... ironically driving two of the least efficient vehicles on the road... 

    • Haha 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    2 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    I don't think I've ever heard somebody dislike the flat plane crank V8 of a Ferrari. But, if there was going to be one it would of course come from a full on EV fanboy... ironically driving two of the least efficient vehicles on the road... 

    Like I said...

    You do nothing but try to pick fights with people...

    You are a troll...

    Why dont you contribute to the phoquing thread instead of trying to be an internet social warrior?

    Who the phoque cares what Dfelt says about Ferrari?

    Your first contribution to this thread is to try to stick it to DFELT.

    Have a conversation with him. But NO!  You want to stick it to him!

    What are you gonna do?

    Get @Drew Dowdell to make me stop harassing you? 

    PHOQUE YOU!

    Downvote this post to if you wanna. I dont care.

    But Im gonnna expose your troll ass today though! 

     

     

    Edited by oldshurst442
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    15 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    I would take a Tesla or Bolt over Ferrari. My PERSONAL preference. Ferrari is over rated and that engine that you says makes a beautiful sound, NOPE, Corvette has a better deeper sound than the over rated V12 Ferrari engine. High Pitch Cracking that is ear piercing from Ferrari I put into the same bucket of garbage as all of Harley Davidson bikes excluding the awesome LiveWire.

    Since I play Trumpet and Piano, I guess my ear is just more accustomed to a tuned sound than loud noise.

    Personal opinion is personal, but even if you read Corvette forums, a lot of owners themselves dislike the Vette engine sound.  

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    I don't think I've ever heard somebody dislike the flat plane crank V8 of a Ferrari. But, if there was going to be one it would of course come from a full on EV fanboy... ironically driving two of the least efficient vehicles on the road... 

    I have from day one always said the DOHC High Horsepower low torque engines put into the ultra pricey toys from Italy were garbage and even the move by all auto companies to that form of engine over a traditional pushrod V8 are still garbage.

    We have discussed how GM has built many excellent engines that had plenty of torque to get you moving and up to speed yet had them destroyed by TROLL Auto magazines as it did not match the Asian or European DOHC engine garbage.

    Maybe the high pitch sound does not bother you, but to me, it is unrefined, noisy and not impressive to have 600HP / 3XX LB-TQ. compared to a solid 400 hp / 410 lb-ft of torque V8 with a proper tuned exhaust so you have a nice deep mellow but distinct sound..

    I agree to disagree with you on the Tone of one auto over another as this is the preference we both like. I am happy for you that you like the Italian auto's, for me, I will stick with my Tuned American V8 on a Borla OEM Exhaust for my TB till I get the full size Truck / SUV EV. :) 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    No @Drew Dowdell

    I wont let it go!

    The Mexico thread really ticked me off with @ccap41's fake , trolly,   righteousness.

    And here he goes again doing the same shyte! 

    You knew Drew, you banned me for a week for being less abusive to @Paolino last year than what @ccap41 is doing here today with TWO posters...me and @dfelt.

    Send him a phoquing message to STOP trolling! 

     

     

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    11 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    I have from day one always said the DOHC High Horsepower low torque engines put into the ultra pricey toys from Italy were garbage and even the move by all auto companies to that form of engine over a traditional pushrod V8 are still garbage.

    We have discussed how GM has built many excellent engines that had plenty of torque to get you moving and up to speed yet had them destroyed by TROLL Auto magazines as it did not match the Asian or European DOHC engine garbage.

    Maybe the high pitch sound does not bother you, but to me, it is unrefined, noisy and not impressive to have 600HP / 3XX LB-TQ. compared to a solid 400 hp / 410 lb-ft of torque V8 with a proper tuned exhaust so you have a nice deep mellow but distinct sound..

    I agree to disagree with you on the Tone of one auto over another as this is the preference we both like. I am happy for you that you like the Italian auto's, for me, I will stick with my Tuned American V8 on a Borla OEM Exhaust for my TB till I get the full size Truck / SUV EV. :) 

    Definitely agree to disagree and I think the application make a huge difference to me. A strictly track-like toy is a fantastic place for a high revving engine as you rarely spend any time in the bottom of the rev range anyway but if it was a daily driver or just a cruiser, I would absolutely prefer the low end of a push rod or larger displacement engine. 

    Also, too much instant torque can overwhelm the tires pulling out of a corner. A high revver with little bottom end actually has an advantage doing certain things. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Add me to the list of people who don't find a flat plane V8 sounding attractive.  It may not have as much power or rev as high, but an LT1 or Hemi at full tilt still sounds like my ideal regardless of the actual numbers.

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    20 hours ago, ykX said:

     

    Anyway, most this type of cars get to be driven very little to make a difference,  Probably Fiats and Jeeps are the majority of FCA vehicles in Europe, and I doubt they have higher emissions than the rest of European manufacturers. .

    Jeeps are mostly diesels in Europe also...that is probably the big issue.   Anyway, this seems like a very strange approach to meeting emissions standards. 

    Edited by Robert Hall
    • Like 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    36 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

    Jeeps are mostly diesels in Europe also...that is probably the big issue.   Anyway, this seems like a very strange approach to meeting emissions standards. 

    What is strange about it? It's the same thing in concept as buying/selling emissions credits in California. 

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    41 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

    Jeeps are mostly diesels in Europe also...that is probably the big issue.   Anyway, this seems like a very strange approach to meeting emissions standards. 

    Most of the cars are diesels in the Europe.  I guess the Fiats and Jeeps are more polluting than others.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    15 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    What is strange about it? It's the same thing in concept as buying/selling emissions credits in California. 

    Which is also strange and fake, IMO.  Credits are just artificial nonsense in lieu of building cleaner products.

    Edited by Robert Hall
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Some one has to use the Tesla emission credits since they do not need them, might as well make some money on it. Good business sense here. Keeps us in the Hellcat game while also supporting green tech auto's. :P 

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites



    Join the conversation

    You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
    Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

    Guest
    Add a comment...

    ×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

      Only 75 emoji are allowed.

    ×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

    ×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

    ×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • google-news-icon.png



  • Community Hive Community Hive

    Community Hive allows you to follow your favorite communities all in one place.

    Follow on Community Hive
  • google-news-icon.png

  • Subscribe to Cheers & Gears

    Cheers and Gears Logo

    Since 2001 we've brought you real content and honest opinions, not AI-generated stuff with no feeling or opinions influenced by the manufacturers.

    Please consider subscribing. Subscriptions can be as little as $1.75 a month, and a paid subscription drops most ads.*
     

    You can view subscription options here.

    *a very limited number of ads contain special coupon deals for our members and will show

  • Similar Content

  • Posts

    • Plastic cladding = off road.  Instead of killing the Sonata, they should just put plastic body cladding down the side and raise the price by $10k and call it the Sonata HD Overlander X.  Instant hit.
    • Considering a planet with 8 Billion and he sold almost 2 million cars, then he is covering .025% of the population compared to other auto companies. I think 2024 going into 2025 we will see other auto companies top Tesla. You and I are two peas in a pod as I also was up on a hill watching the implosion and thinking what a waste as it was a great building. I love the Kingdome and hate the new stadium.  Agree it was surreal to see the ship hit the support pillar and the whole building just collapse. Be interesting to see what replaces it as today bridges built like that are not allowed due to the exact nature of how it collapsed.  Yes, Tesla is a love or hate and the minimalist approach is not for everyone. I honestly have to agree with the comment @smk4565 I believe made that the touch screen only will be the future of cheap autos and switches and buttons will be the higher end autos. Interesting times we live in for sure.
    • Decent upgrade to the aging 2024 model. Nice to see they are reducing costs of the curved screen in the EVs by pushing it out across the Hyundai Family and into Kia. The one thing I do not like is all the Chrome. 🤢 🤮
    • Today at the New York International Auto Show, Hyundai unveiled an update to its little truck, the Hyundai Santa Cruz. The refresh to the exterior is relatively mild, though it features a more menacing grille with bolder verticle lines.  Updated running lights and new wheel designs add to the fresher look. Inside, there is a new steering wheel, infotainment system, and instrument panel. on upper trims, an optional panoramic curved display houses dual 12.3-inch displays for driver and entertainment. The plenty-capable powertrains carry over with either a 191-horsepower direct injected 2.5-liter 4-cylinder or a turbo-charged version of of the same engine with 281 horsepower.  The transmission for the entry-level engine is a traditional 8-speed automatic, while the turbo-charged model gets an 8-speed dual-clutch transmission. Santa Cruzes with the turbo engine gain a new tow mode for enhanced towing control.  Both powertrains are towing capable with a 3,500 lb rating for the entry engine and a stout 5,000 lb rating for the turbo models when equipped with all-wheel drive. New for 2025 is an XRT trim geared even more towards outdoor adventure. It features a trim-specific front fascia and grille, special 18-inch wheels with all-terrain tires, an increased approach angle, front tow hooks, and surround-view monitoring.    The 2025 Hyundai Santa Cruz goes on sale this summer. View full article
    • Regarding Tesla - it's either love or hate with these vehicles.  A college friend I'll be seeing when in SoCal next month has 2 of them, and I'll probably be riding in both of them - one is his sleeker S model and I forgot which the other one (that his wife drives) is.  In certain places, people have a lot of disposable income and having a Tesla goes with the landscape. Minimalist(ic) isn't necessarily bad.  We all remember the adage "less is more."  I'll vouch that the workmanship of the interior is good and I can also vouch that the overall look (including the centered everything on one display) is ugly.  I will say that EV motors are supposed to last a long time but the battery replacement is very expensive and the range is currently not that optimal. I did not like the model Y I had for less than 1 day.  Also, its exterior is mostly ugly.  That's my opinion. This isn't a discussion I want to get into.  I would much prefer a more user-friendly EV ... and not just yet. - - - - - What I was randomly going to say: I'm not sure whether I'm in shock or still feeling surreal as to what happened in Baltimore.  At first, I thought a ship just hit something on a bridge.  Then I saw the footage and that's the surreal part ... the domino-like collapse of the entire structure and the size of the ship.  I remember having to figure out the forces of either tension or compression on each member of a truss-like structure when I was in school.   A group of us sat there for about 3 or 4 hours one night - with some Mountain Dew - to work that out. I don't believe I've been on that bridge since it's on the outer beltway, but it's numbered as part of the U.S. interstate system.  From looking at the map, it is the major bridge on the entrance to/exit from Baltimore Harbor.  I hope they find the 6 individuals who were working on it fixing potholes in the middle of the night who fell down with the bridge.  The ship giving a mayday is what allowed them to shut down both approaches to the bridge just in time.   The weird thing is that it happened on March 26.  IIRC, the deliberate (domino-like) implosion of the reinforced concrete Kingdome in Seattle happened on March 26, 2000 (no rain that day) and people were sitting on slopes overlooking downtown to see that happen.  But that's how it is with planned implosions.  I went there that morning and have photos of the Kingdome's last day somewhere. https://www.seahawks.com/video/kingdome-implosion-hd It was indeed March 26, 2000.  I was one of the few who liked the Kingdome.
  • Who's Online (See full list)

    • There are no registered users currently online
  • My Clubs

×
×
  • Create New...

Hey there, we noticed you're using an ad-blocker. We're a small site that is supported by ads or subscriptions. We rely on these to pay for server costs and vehicle reviews.  Please consider whitelisting us in your ad-blocker, or if you really like what you see, you can pick up one of our subscriptions for just $1.75 a month or $15 a year. It may not seem like a lot, but it goes a long way to help support real, honest content, that isn't generated by an AI bot.

See you out there.

Drew
Editor-in-Chief

Write what you are looking for and press enter or click the search icon to begin your search

Change privacy settings