Northstar

GM Reports 260,922 Deliveries in April

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GM Media Release

* Retail Car Sales Up 6 Percent

* Chevrolet Car Retail Sales Up 24 Percent Led By a 147 Percent Increase in Malibu, 17 Percent Rise in Cobalt, 13 Percent Increase in Aveo and 8 Percent Hike in Impala Sales

* Pontiac Retail Car Sales Up 6 Percent With a 39 Percent Increase in Vibe, 3 Percent Climb in G5 and G6 Sales

* Buick Retail Trucks Up 32 Percent Led By 4,000 Enclave Crossover Sales

DETROIT - GM dealers in the United States delivered 260,922 vehicles in April. Retail car and crossover sales were up more than 9 percent. A sharp sales increase in fuel efficient cars and crossovers could not make up for soft truck demand and a sharp decline in fleet deliveries impacted by the American Axle strike. On a non-adjusted basis, retail sales were down 11.5 percent and total sales for the month were down 16 percent.

On an adjusted basis, total sales declined 22.7 percent.

Dealer inventories were at their lowest level since September 2005 with about 824,000 vehicles in stock, down about 206,000 vehicles compared to last April, and down more than 84,000 vehicles compared with December 2007.

"Consumer preference is shifting and we're shifting with it as evidenced by our strong car and crossover sales. Our new products such as the Chevrolet Malibu, Cadillac CTS and Buick Enclave were hot throughout the month," said Mark LaNeve, vice president, GM North America Vehicle Sales, Service and Marketing. "Throughout the industry, truck sales have been soft. We've been able to match the current economic slowdown with historically low total inventories, and as we look for ways to increase car and crossover production, we are improving our competitive position for the economic recovery."

Chevrolet Malibu total sales were up 29 percent with retail sales up 147 percent, Aveo sales were up 14 percent total and 13 percent retail, and Cobalt sales were up 16 percent total and 17 percent retail. Pontiac Vibe total sales were up 36 percent and retail sales were up 39 percent compared with April 2007. Saturn Aura was up 19 percent total and 16 percent retail, and the Astra had its fourth consecutive month of increasing sales with more than 900 vehicles sold. In the luxury car segment, the award-winning Cadillac CTS saw total sales increase 8 percent with a strong retail increase of 12 percent.

GM's popular crossover Buick Enclave, GMC Acadia and Saturn Outlook together accounted for nearly 13,000 retail vehicle sales in the month, an increase of 7 percent compared with the same month last year. There were more than 6,600 Acadia, 4,000 Enclave and 2,300 Outlook retail sales. The Saturn Vue had a total sales increase of about 600 vehicles compared with April 2007.

"Our sales performance in mid-cars and crossovers shows the power of new products to attract consumers - even in a tough market," LaNeve added. "So as the mix shifts from trucks to cars, we're ready in our dealers' showrooms with vehicles that provide industry-leading value, great fuel economy and the best warranty coverage of any full-line automaker."

Certified Used Vehicles

April 2008 sales for all certified GM brands, including GM Certified Used Vehicles, Cadillac Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles, Saturn Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles, Saab Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles, and HUMMER Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles, were 44,479 vehicles, up nearly 7 percent from April 2007 results. Year-to-date sales are 168,087 vehicles, down 7 percent from the same period last year.

GM Certified Used Vehicles, the industry's top-selling certified brand, posted April sales of 38,861 vehicles, up 6 percent from last April. Cadillac Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles sold 3,565 vehicles, up 27 percent. Saturn Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles sold 1,159 vehicles, down 21 percent. Saab Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles sold 727 vehicles, up 14 percent, and HUMMER Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles sold 167 vehicles, up 109 percent.

"Our certified sales momentum continued in April, as GM Certified Used Vehicles sales grew for the fourth consecutive month, a 6 percent increase over last April's results," said LaNeve. "The Cadillac, Saab and HUMMER Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles programs also generated robust increases as consumers take advantage of the great value and peace-of-mind assurances that come with the purchase of certified GM vehicles."

GM North America Reports April 2008 Production, 2008 Second-Quarter Production Forecast Revised to 950,000 Vehicles

In April, GM North America produced 242,000 vehicles (128,000 cars and 114,000 trucks). This is down 93,000 vehicles or 28 percent compared to April 2007 when the region produced 335,000 vehicles (120,000 cars and 215,000 trucks). (Production totals include joint venture production of 22,000 vehicles in April 2008 and 16,000 vehicles in April 2007.)

Approximately 130,000 units of production have been lost in April due to the American Axle work stoppage. Since the dispute began in late February, approximately 230,000 units of production have been lost. GMNA has revised its forecast for 2008 second-quarter production to 950,000 vehicles, down 130,000 units from the prior forecast to reflect April production losses. Due to the current American Axle work stoppage, there is considerable uncertainty with regard to the second quarter production forecast.

Yesterday, GM's annual total vehicle sales forecast for the industry was revised to an expected mid-to-high 15 million vehicle SAAR. The previous forecast provided in January of this year was in the low-16 million unit range. The revision reflects actual industry sales rates for the first four months of 2008 and the current assessment of the recovery of the U.S. economy.

____________________________________________________________________________

Terrible month for trucks, as expected. Malibu still isn't at 20k/month yet, which is disappointing. I don't understand how the Fusion is outselling it. G8 is almost at the maximum it can do in a month because of production restraints, so that's a good sign.

Not many bright spots...

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Where are the ready-made excuses?

Has GM management failed to get the monthly checks to C&G's faithful?

Another awful, embarassing performance by the formerly greatest company on the planet.

RW has to be on borrowed time now, no?

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Where are the ready-made excuses?

Has GM management failed to get the monthly checks to C&G's faithful?

Another awful, embarassing performance by the formerly greatest company on the planet.

RW has to be on borrowed time now, no?

Car sales were basically flat (up 6 percent in retail sales). There's nothing they can do with gas at $3.50+ to stop the slide of large SUVs and pickups, where the main declines are at; total sales were down 51k, sales of T900s and T360s were down 37000 combined; that's a decrease of 14000 outside of large trucks, and with the market having a bad month in general (so far, at least), I'd say that's not terrible. When you look at everything as a whole, yes, GM still had a very bad month and it's their fault they depend so much on large trucks, but it also can be shown that they aren't doing that bad otherwise.

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Where are the ready-made excuses?

Has GM management failed to get the monthly checks to C&G's faithful?

Another awful, embarassing performance by the formerly greatest company on the planet.

RW has to be on borrowed time now, no?

the results will have to depend on the rest of the market. if declines are equally massive throughout, then the results are GM is not to blame....the first results of a struggling economy and high gas prices are in. of course none of that addresses that GM wouldn't be in this position if they designed and engineered highly competent and desirable efficient cars in the first place.

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Car sales were basically flat (up 6 percent in retail sales). There's nothing they can do with gas at $3.50+ to stop the slide of large SUVs and pickups, where the main declines are at; total sales were down 51k, sales of T900s and T360s were down 37000 combined; that's a decrease of 14000 outside of large trucks, and with the market having a bad month in general (so far, at least), I'd say that's not terrible. When you look at everything as a whole, yes, GM still had a very bad month and it's their fault they depend so much on large trucks, but it also can be shown that they aren't doing that bad otherwise.

Was the market as a whole down 23%?

It's all in the numbers, brother. Simple math. Market goes down X% and you're off more than that, you lose. Toyota, Hyundai & Mazda are all claiming monthly increases (whether ADR or not, I don't know)...and I haven't seen the broader market figures yet either.

I'll bet everything I have that the overall market is down by 1/2 of GM's decline.

Just so I know, is the 'unforeseeable' decline in the large truck market going to be GM's excuse du jour? GM's executive monkeys JUST downgraded their annual overall US sales to 'just below 16 million.'--everyone else has been talking about the mid 15's or lower since December.

And, yes, there IS something you can do about the Truck slide--make great cars! Or are the GM execs also not able to keep up with current (or not so current) events like Katrina, war in the Middle East, the rise of demand for the BRIC countries for petroleum? Absurdity at its highest levels--let's give these guys a raise!...oops, too late. :)

Please. You're sounding like a battered wife making excuses for her abusive spouse.

Edited by enzl
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...on the great cars thing, an interesting thought. Ran into one of the maintenance guys from the local Honda dealer at the Electrical Supply house this A.M. while I was picking up some cable.

He said the wait is a minumum of six weeks for a new Fit. Wow, If Gm could have seen this (fuel crunch) coming and brought out a class leading small car....

Chris

Edited by 66Stang
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Can anybody produce the sales figure table? I was trying earlier, but it never came out right.

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Was the market as a whole down 23%?

It's all in the numbers, brother. Simple math. Market goes down X% and you're off more than that, you lose. Toyota, Hyundai & Mazda are all claiming monthly increases (whether ADR or not, I don't know)...and I haven't seen the broader market figures yet either.

Toyota was down 4.6% on a selling days basis, Mazda up 4.1%, Chrysler down 29.4%, BMW up 1.2%, Nissan down 1%, VW down 8.4%, Hyundai was down 7%, Ford down 19.3%. GM down 22.7%.

I'll bet everything I have that the overall market is down by 1/2 of GM's decline.

Currently GM is down 16% and the market is down 9%, not on an adjusted basis. On an adjusted basis GM is down 22.7% and the market is down 16%. You lose.

And, yes, there IS something you can do about the Truck slide--make great cars! Or are the GM execs also not able to keep up with current (or not so current) events like Katrina, war in the Middle East, the rise of demand for the BRIC countries for petroleum? Absurdity at its highest levels--let's give these guys a raise!...oops, too late. :)

Look at the Malibu's increase in sales. I think it's quite obvious GM is making inroads there. Again, GM's car retail sales increased 6%. The Cobalt is 3-4 years old, when the new one comes if it does not start selling better then GM is in trouble, but it's currently one of the oldest, if not the oldest vehicle on the market in that segment.

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...on the great cars thing, an interesting thought. Ran into one of the maintenance guys from the local Honda dealer at the Electrical Supply house this A.M. while I was picking up some cable.

He said the wait is a minumum of six weeks for a new Fit. Wow, If Gm could have seen this (fuel crunch) coming and brought out a class leading small car....

Chris

GM knew the fuel crunch was coming more than a year ago, but hey, lets push those cars and trucks with V8's, because that's the future, right? :rotflmao:

Welcome to Opel and GMDAT America! :smilewide:

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Toyota was down 4.6% on a selling days basis, Mazda up 4.1%, Chrysler down 29.4%, BMW up 1.2%, Nissan down 1%, VW down 8.4%, Hyundai was down 7%, Ford down 19.3%. GM down 22.7%.

Currently GM is down 16% and the market is down 9%, not on an adjusted basis. On an adjusted basis GM is down 22.7% and the market is down 16%. You lose.

Look at the Malibu's increase in sales. I think it's quite obvious GM is making inroads there. Again, GM's car retail sales increased 6%. The Cobalt is 3-4 years old, when the new one comes if it does not start selling better then GM is in trouble, but it's currently one of the oldest, if not the oldest vehicle on the market in that segment.

I was off by 1% point...GM was almost down TWICE the market average (although I haven't seen total figures). I stand by my statement, regardless. ADR was only 50% WORSE than market average!--I guess you've got me.

Again, parsing words for feeble victories...you'd have a bright future in GM's exec suites. As I stated above, if you're losing sales at more than the rate of the next company, you're not holding marketshare & therefore, failing.

As to the rest of your 'defense'--the 'bu is up...how about the other nameplates they're trying to foist on a market that simply won't have it? They have, what, 60+ products--and they're not all big trucks, my friend. Nice cherry pick.

I'm going to beat this dead horse for some time...exactly how long depends upon when RW, Fritz and the rest of the gang gets to pull their golden parachutes.

It's disgusting, embarassing and just flat out incompetence at its highest levels. Sadly, everyone here knows this already. Why doesn't GM's Board of Directors?

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...on the great cars thing, an interesting thought. Ran into one of the maintenance guys from the local Honda dealer at the Electrical Supply house this A.M. while I was picking up some cable.

He said the wait is a minumum of six weeks for a new Fit. Wow, If Gm could have seen this (fuel crunch) coming and brought out a class leading small car....

Chris

Cobalt XFE

Malibu 4-cylinder/6-speed auto

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Outlook tanked. Aura sales are up but still disappointing overall. The next gen-Aura can't come soon enough for Saturn. The only thing keeping Saturn afloat right now is the VUE.

I can't help but wonder how the VUE would sell at B-P-G dealers if there was an upmarket Buick version with Enclave interior/exterior influences. I have absolutely no need for an 8-passenger CUV, regardless of how beautiful, well-built, and quiet the Enclave is.

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I was off by 1% point...GM was almost down TWICE the market average (although I haven't seen total figures). I stand by my statement, regardless. ADR was only 50% WORSE than market average!--I guess you've got me.

As to the rest of your 'defense'--the 'bu is up...how about the other nameplates they're trying to foist on a market that simply won't have it? They have, what, 60+ products--and they're not all big trucks, my friend. Nice cherry pick.

Actually, you'd be off by around 5% if you look at it from the daily selling rate (what really matters), but whatever. Either way you'd lose everything :P

What other nameplates are you talking about? GM's car lineup is terribly old, wait for another year or two and they'll have a new Cobalt, new LaCrosse, new Aura, new Astra isn't too far off. If those cars do not sell well then GM is in huge trouble, but right now you can't expect the current LaCrosse, Cobalt, and Aura to be lighting up the sales charts when they're mediocre products at best. GM also is going to have the new Equinox and GMC counterpart out in not too long, which should help truck sales. Also, don't forget the Volt and the addition of more hybrid vehicles. The Prius sold 21k this month, there's no reason the Volt can't be doing 150k/year or more depending on price.

Like I said, if GM's next round of cars are not good, they're in huge trouble. But signs point to them being good (see Invicta concept, and the new products GM has put out over the last year or two), almost all of them are competitive with the best vehicles in their classes.

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It seems to me the decline is all in the trucks. The days of trucks and full sized SUV's as personal use vehicles is coming to an end, and the adjustment for GM may be painful.

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GM knew the fuel crunch was coming more than a year ago, but hey, lets push those cars and trucks with V8's, because that's the future, right? :rotflmao:

Welcome to Opel and GMDAT America! :smilewide:

considering i read recently where like 2/3 or more GM's sales were outside NA, it does seem more plausible every day that the overseas GM may usurp NA GM sooner rather than later.

methinks ford may trump GM in this global consolidation game. only 2,3 brands, and the ford euro products will transition well in NA. Opels as saturn is still fuzzy to the general buyng public.

on a positive note, aura is up and vibe and g8 did well. i think g8 will meet sales goals. at least until zeta is cancelled.

vue uptick is encouraging. i still think outlook is fine as a saturn if they can just hit 2k a month. the whole problem right now in this bitch of an economy with the lambdas is their high prices. hopefully GM is smart and keeps traverse priced good out of the chute and won't make the huge pricing miscue ford is about to make by overpricing the flex.

in fact, aura and vue both up means saturns core product is starting to get some love. this has to bode well for retention of the saturn brand.

Edited by regfootball
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Actually, you'd be off by around 5% if you look at it from the daily selling rate (what really matters), but whatever. Either way you'd lose everything :P

What other nameplates are you talking about? GM's car lineup is terribly old, wait for another year or two and they'll have a new Cobalt, new LaCrosse, new Aura, new Astra isn't too far off. If those cars do not sell well then GM is in huge trouble, but right now you can't expect the current LaCrosse, Cobalt, and Aura to be lighting up the sales charts when they're mediocre products at best. GM also is going to have the new Equinox and GMC counterpart out in not too long, which should help truck sales. Also, don't forget the Volt and the addition of more hybrid vehicles. The Prius sold 21k this month, there's no reason the Volt can't be doing 150k/year or more depending on price.

Like I said, if GM's next round of cars are not good, they're in huge trouble. But signs point to them being good (see Invicta concept, and the new products GM has put out over the last year or two), almost all of them are competitive with the best vehicles in their classes.

Then I guess we'll see.

If current management isn't responsible for the mess, who is?

Based on the success rate at Saturn, 2/3rds of Buick being a joke, 2 real Pontiacs, & the death of the large truck market, along with macro forces they have NO control over...well, let's just say that I sincerely hope you're right.

How could it have been allowed to get to this?

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Well enzl, now that you’re penniless and homeless (j/k), look at the upside :smilewide:

It's all about the Camaro... but seriously...

None of the divisions are plagued with "tacky" styling. All divisions have consistent identifiable (subjective - attractive) looks. Every division has a vehicle that offers AWD; Most with multiple offerings of AWD. Chevrolet, Pontiac, Saturn (Sky), & Cadillac now offer RWD vehicles for enthusiasts. GM's initial and long term vehicle reliability trumps the best in the world from just a few years ago and continues to climb. Interiors are unmistakably improved and world class in many of GM's new car offerings.

None of those things could have been said in the 1990’s. The areas in which most demanded improvement have been addressed. Consumer Reports even thinks GM's vehicles are greatly improved and recommends many of them. You can't ask for a better critic to praise your vehicles considering their historical position about domestics. You've stated several times it takes time for the public to catch on. Well, we're now in the sit-and-wait period.

In truth, GM isn't late to the game with small fuel efficient cars... GM has just never made small fuel efficient cars very well. Large cars were great, but small ones were awful. As much as "Daewoo quality" still incites jokes and criticisms, GM has recently invested billions to bring Daewoo up to world class standards. Their next batch of vehicles, which should make their way to several American GM Brands, will determine if that money was well spent.

No amount of product is going to solve the gluttony of dealerships for GM. Sales will never be able to sustain the network again.

In the Seattle area, we now only have 3 Cadillac dealerships. That’s the same amount as Lexus. One BPG franchise was recently closed and not replaced. It’s taking time, but the dealer issue is improving… albeit slowly. The downturn in sales will continue to work in GM’s favor consolidating dealerships. It’s sad that several long-standing businesses will declare bankruptcy, but it’s good for GM (and those that survive)in the long term.

Be glad you’re with a bullet-proof and well-managed dealer group and that you’re not actually going to lose everything because of GM.

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Not a good month... The car market better start shaping up and also GM has to get hybrid pickups out. Soon still they are selling plenty of Yukons/Sierras/Tahoes/Suburbans and Silverados. Gas is slowing sales but not that slowly. When are Malibu sales going to boom it looks like a mere 180,000 will be built this year... I was hoping for closer to 300,000.

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Well enzl, now that you’re penniless and homeless (j/k), look at the upside :smilewide:

It's all about the Camaro... but seriously...

None of the divisions are plagued with "tacky" styling. All divisions have consistent identifiable (subjective - attractive) looks. Every division has a vehicle that offers AWD; Most with multiple offerings of AWD. Chevrolet, Pontiac, Saturn (Sky), & Cadillac now offer RWD vehicles for enthusiasts. GM's initial and long term vehicle reliability trumps the best in the world from just a few years ago and continues to climb. Interiors are unmistakably improved and world class in many of GM's new car offerings.

None of those things could have been said in the 1990’s. The areas in which most demanded improvement have been addressed. Consumer Reports even thinks GM's vehicles are greatly improved and recommends many of them. You can't ask for a better critic to praise your vehicles considering their historical position about domestics. You've stated several times it takes time for the public to catch on. Well, we're now in the sit-and-wait period.

In truth, GM isn't late to the game with small fuel efficient cars... GM has just never made small fuel efficient cars very well. Large cars were great, but small ones were awful. As much as "Daewoo quality" still incites jokes and criticisms, GM has recently invested billions to bring Daewoo up to world class standards. Their next batch of vehicles, which should make their way to several American GM Brands, will determine if that money was well spent.

No amount of product is going to solve the gluttony of dealerships for GM. Sales will never be able to sustain the network again.

In the Seattle area, we now only have 3 Cadillac dealerships. That’s the same amount as Lexus. One BPG franchise was recently closed and not replaced. It’s taking time, but the dealer issue is improving… albeit slowly. The downturn in sales will continue to work in GM’s favor consolidating dealerships. It’s sad that several long-standing businesses will declare bankruptcy, but it’s good for GM (and those that survive)in the long term.

Be glad you’re with a bullet-proof and well-managed dealer group and that you’re not actually going to lose everything because of GM.

From where I sit, it is the strike and the over abundance of dealerships that are GM's biggest problems. What has happened to the truck market was both inevitable and predictable. GM had absolutely no choice but to defend its market share in the truck arena. Can you imagine the screaming for Wagoner's head if the 900s weren't rushed to market at the expense of RWD cars? If gas prices had stayed at $2.50 a gallon for you guys and pick ups sales at a million, they would have looked like heroes. Toyota made no secrets of its new Texas plant: GM could not afford to let that go unchallenged.

GM-DAT is rushing new product to market, I am told. The '09 Aveo is going to fill a gap. Not sure where the Daewoo jokes are coming from. I drive one. Love it. I've had a lot of repeat business on the Aveo. The Epica was a mistake, which GM quickly yanked from the market here. Customers I have talked to love their Aveos. Several have leased second ones. I am currently involved in a gentleman who bought a base 4 door in September who wants to trade it in for a loaded 4 door now.

The mess at Saturn also could be predicted. Legally, I am not sure what choices GM has, but from a business model point of view, Saturn has to go. The sales of the Outlook and Aura prove that.

'08 is going to be an ugly year. No questions there.

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The automotive industry is very susceptible to economic downturns. Most of the time, people don't buy a new car because the old one is so broken they absolutely must have a new one. When times get tough, people tend to hang on to durable goods like cars because they can make them last a little longer than they were planning. It is for this reason that investing in a durable goods company like GM is risky, but the higher than market returns when times are good make people jump in. Of course, when the market goes down, GM fares even worse.

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From where I sit, it is the strike and the over abundance of dealerships that are GM's biggest problems. What has happened to the truck market was both inevitable and predictable. GM had absolutely no choice but to defend its market share in the truck arena. Can you imagine the screaming for Wagoner's head if the 900s weren't rushed to market at the expense of RWD cars? If gas prices had stayed at $2.50 a gallon for you guys and pick ups sales at a million, they would have looked like heroes. Toyota made no secrets of its new Texas plant: GM could not afford to let that go unchallenged.

GM-DAT is rushing new product to market, I am told. The '09 Aveo is going to fill a gap. Not sure where the Daewoo jokes are coming from. I drive one. Love it. I've had a lot of repeat business on the Aveo. The Epica was a mistake, which GM quickly yanked from the market here. Customers I have talked to love their Aveos. Several have leased second ones. I am currently involved in a gentleman who bought a base 4 door in September who wants to trade it in for a loaded 4 door now.

The mess at Saturn also could be predicted. Legally, I am not sure what choices GM has, but from a business model point of view, Saturn has to go. The sales of the Outlook and Aura prove that.

'08 is going to be an ugly year. No questions there.

Saturn's lower sales are only due to the mentality of the common folk. I just am not one to focus on a "name". While I wouldn't (nore did I ) buy a saturn since they came out I was very interested when the Aura and Sky came out. Now we own a Aura XR. It's a good looking car! I still think there will be a turn around in sales with saturn in the next year. Give the astra a year. It is the only decent looking small car in the market right now. It just needs an updated interior.... badly! But to say that Saturn has to go?? Compare them to Buick, Aura sales are up, Lucerne down. LaCrosse less that 4k. Maybe buick should be looked at.

I just don't get the design of the aveo... or any small car in the US. Why do manu's think a small car has to look bubbly or like a cartoon character???

Edited by BuddyP
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I'm still holding out for a V8 Camaro for next year, but it's all about gas prices right now. I just don't know if I want something that's only going to average me 20 mpg all the time now. It has certainly taken the fun out of thinking about owning something cool.

Small cars are the answer to GM's problems right now. I think they need to advertise the Astra more on TV, and get that Corsa over here too (I think the Corsa looks like an awesome small car) and get that thing up on billboards and TV commercials too. I'd consider the Astra with the turbo engine from the Cobalt (instead of a Camaro) if I thought that I could get consistently get high 20s (like 27 or 28) in mixed driving.

This may not be the time nor place to think about this, but I'm still wondering if GM is going to move forward with a large rear drive flagship for Caddy based off of Zeta? If gas continues to go up, I wonder if they'll ax that plan because that platform couldn't be shared with Pontiac/Buick , etc./??? Whatever they do, I still hope they keep Sigma alive at Caddy - if not, then you can watch the 16k/month sales at Caddy turn into 8k a month in an instant (plus it would simply be embarrassing to not have a proper RWD American luxury car anymore).

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Give the astra a year. It is the only decent looking small car in the market right now.

Lol you're right, it is the only decent looking small car; and it probably isn't selling well because of all the good looking small cars.

Assuming that the Astra is the nicest looking small car, it's going to need a lot more than looks to sell. Worse power/weigh ratio than its competition combined with mid-pack FE numbers, and of course no cup holders --a big one there!

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I like Saturn, as is evidenced by the vehicles in my driveway, but that being said, I am of the opinion that GM does have too many mouths to feed. I know it is a highly debated topic but I do believe GM needs to kill off a couple of brands. If one of them was Saturn, so be it. Personally, I think grouping Buick, Pontiac and GMC and Cadillac, Saab and Hummer into two sales channels is the first step toward killing a brand or two. With few stand alone dealerships, it should make it easier to kill one or more of them off. Hummer would be the first one I'd wack. I've also always though GMC was a bit redundant but I know GM won't kill it. At this point, I'd argue Pontiac is a more damaged brand than Buick but looking at it with no sentimentality at all, one or the other of those brands could probably be killed. As a GM fan, I'd hate to see either of these legacy brands go, though.

Edited by 2QuickZ's
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