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Rumorpile: Cadillac LTS To Debut At New York: Comments


William Maley

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A new report from Autoblog says Cadillac is planning on premiering their flagship sedan, possibly named LTS, at next year's New York Auto Show. A source at the company says the brand is preparing their competitor to the Audi A8, BMW 7-Series, and Mercedes-Benz S-Class to be shown at New York.

The source dismisses the current XTS as a placeholder, and not a "real" Cadillac. The source admits that the new S-Class is a tough competitor to upcoming model.

Sadly, no information on powertrains or other key details were revealed.

Source: Autoblog

William Maley is a staff writer for Cheers & Gears. He can be reached at william.maley@cheersandgears.com or you can follow him on twitter at @realmudmonster.


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I'd be surprised if they aren't competing with the Hyundai Equus, Lexus LS460 and the 6 cylinder A8.    More in that $70k range of 2nd tier big luxury sedans.  Even the 7-series is an ambitious target, and none of these cars are giving the S-class much competition right now.  If they parts bin the engines and interior of the LTS and price it over $80k they are going to get ELR like sales volume. Even the A8 only sells about 400-500 cars a month, and it is an established car from a growing brand.

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Cadillac didn't "parts bin" either interior of the ATS/CTS, so there's zero reason to even mention such here.

Cadillac doen't care how many of these sedans it sells; Cadillac is not in the crushing volume game that MB is. 250 units/mnth is a fine target, if a target is even made public (I wouldn't approve making public mention of one). Would keep the car very exclusive, instead of seeing yourself in the next row at WalMart in the 7 / S.

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It could cost over $1 billion to develop a new model on a new platform.  Some car companies spend more.    But lets suppose GM spends $1 billion on the Omega/LTS.  If they sell 300 per month at a profit of $10,000 per car (over a 10% margin which is better than what Audi or Mercedes operate at) Cadillac over a 6 year life cycle would make $216 Million in profit, against the cost of $1 billion, a loss of $784 million.  They can't only sell 300 a month.  Surely though some at GM has "built the business case" which makes you wonder if the budget is more like $500 million, in a hope that if they sell 500 a month they could break even on it. 

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But according to your common diatribe, that uber-sedan flagship automatically translates into increased sales of ANY AND ALL other Cadillacs AND GM products via the so-called 'halo effect', thusly lesser models selling at a profit will increase in sales & offset a possible bottom line loss on the Omega/Fleetwood. No one in the Company is looking at it in a vacuum, but as part of the brand catalog.

 

By your math; audi is taking a huge beating on the A8 too, no? 500/mnth at a lower margin means that model had to have been cancelled years & years ago because it's costing VW hundreds of millions over a 6-yr timespan. Explain.

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LTS, REALLY? Come on GM, Time to use the names that truly drive prestige. The Top of the line should be an Eldorado, Fleetwood or De Ville

 

Even GM Insider News states how much they hate the 3 letter BS.

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But according to your common diatribe, that uber-sedan flagship automatically translates into increased sales of ANY AND ALL other Cadillacs AND GM products via the so-called 'halo effect', thusly lesser models selling at a profit will increase in sales & offset a possible bottom line loss on the Omega/Fleetwood. No one in the Company is looking at it in a vacuum, but as part of the brand catalog.

 

By your math; audi is taking a huge beating on the A8 too, no? 500/mnth at a lower margin means that model had to have been cancelled years & years ago because it's costing VW hundreds of millions over a 6-yr timespan. Explain.

Audi has already sold 1.4 million cars this year, in the United States they have only sold like 120,000 this year, Audi could sell zero cars in the USA and turn a profit.  The American market isn't that important to Audi, but crucial to Cadillac who has little global presence.   Plus the A8 platform is used for Bentley which has crazy markup, so they get to recycle some engineering there.

 

Halo effect does work, and is needed not only to sell more of your lower end cars, but also to expand globally.    Cadillac needs the Omega car, but if they botch it and it is one and done product it won't have the desired Halo effect.  Whether or not Cadillac can pull off a success here is the question, but I look forward to seeing the debut.

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I think Cadillac would expect to move at least 2,000 a month of these.  And I do think it wouldn't be hard, if they keep a version of it accessible price wise, and if the interior is truly ON PAR with a German car.  Also they can distinguish the LTS with a v8.

 

ATS is botched due to small back seat and bland dash.  CTS is botched a bit due to some funny styling and questionable pricing.  LTS ont he upper end would allow Caddy to move some ATS and CTS pricing down also, get some more volume back there.

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But according to your common diatribe, that uber-sedan flagship automatically translates into increased sales of ANY AND ALL other Cadillacs AND GM products via the so-called 'halo effect', thusly lesser models selling at a profit will increase in sales & offset a possible bottom line loss on the Omega/Fleetwood. No one in the Company is looking at it in a vacuum, but as part of the brand catalog.

 

By your math; audi is taking a huge beating on the A8 too, no? 500/mnth at a lower margin means that model had to have been cancelled years & years ago because it's costing VW hundreds of millions over a 6-yr timespan. Explain.

Audi has already sold 1.4 million cars this year, in the United States they have only sold like 120,000 this year, Audi could sell zero cars in the USA and turn a profit.  The American market isn't that important to Audi, but crucial to Cadillac who has little global presence.   Plus the A8 platform is used for Bentley which has crazy markup, so they get to recycle some engineering there.

 

Halo effect does work, and is needed not only to sell more of your lower end cars, but also to expand globally.    Cadillac needs the Omega car, but if they botch it and it is one and done product it won't have the desired Halo effect.  Whether or not Cadillac can pull off a success here is the question, but I look forward to seeing the debut.

 

 

Do you know how Audi is able to make a profit on those cars?  By "parts-binning" from VW.   But I guess it's okay with you when VAG does it.

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Do you know how Audi is able to make a profit on those cars?  By "parts-binning" from VW.   But I guess it's okay with you when VAG does it.

 

The A8 though has a V8 and a W12, neither of which are found in any of the VW cars, they are found in Bentleys, though modified.  The A8 interior is pretty good too, also not found in a VW.  It does ride on the VW modular platform thing, but the A8 is aluminum unlike other Audi or VW models.  So there is a lot to make the A8 unique, but it is still outsold by the Panamera, 7-series and LS460 most months, and the S-class outsells it like 5 to 1.

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I think Cadillac would expect to move at least 2,000 a month of these.  And I do think it wouldn't be hard, if they keep a version of it accessible price wise, and if the interior is truly ON PAR with a German car.  Also they can distinguish the LTS with a v8.

 

ATS is botched due to small back seat and bland dash.  CTS is botched a bit due to some funny styling and questionable pricing.  LTS ont he upper end would allow Caddy to move some ATS and CTS pricing down also, get some more volume back there.

2000 a month?   That is what the ATS and XTS sell per month.  The S-class sells 2,000 per month in the USA.  Keep in mind that Audi, Lexus and BMW all have starting prices in the $70k range to undercut the S-class class and they still manage to sell about 500 each per month, 1,000 on a good month.  Cadillac can't undercut the A8 or 7-series in price, otherwise they'll be with the Hyundai Equus in price, and that is not where they should be.

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No way in hell is Cadillac looking for 2000 units/mnth. Nor should they. Like I said, there should be 'no comment' if asked for sales goals.

Cadillac is not interested in playing 'one-up' on sales numbers, nor should they. BMW & MB MUST in order to survive, hence the push into FWD appliances. 

 

If one subscribes to the theory that halo cars work downmarket to move cheap stuff, the inverse must be true; that cheap stuff will have a 'reverse halo' effect on the high end stuff.

 

-- -- --

If Cadillac brought out a 4-dr hardtop version of the Ciel & named it "Fleetwood', that would be just about perfect IMO.

Edited by balthazar
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Do you know how Audi is able to make a profit on those cars? By "parts-binning" from VW. But I guess it's okay with you when VAG does it.

The A8 though has a V8 and a W12, neither of which are found in any of the VW cars, they are found in Bentleys, though modified. The A8 interior is pretty good too, also not found in a VW. It does ride on the VW modular platform thing, but the A8 is aluminum unlike other Audi or VW models. So there is a lot to make the A8 unique, but it is still outsold by the Panamera, 7-series and LS460 most months, and the S-class outsells it like 5 to 1.

You and your wandering goal posts. Audi doesn't sell 1.4 million A8s, they sell 1.4 million of their entire model line. They make a profit on it by snatching parts off of VWs.

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I know they sell 1.4 million cars in the whole line, that is what I said, although this year it looks like they are on pace for 1.6 million.  I also said the A8 is a weak seller, Audi lives on the volume of the cars below the A6 in most parts of the world and the A6 in China sells well.  The A6 was the number 1 selling luxury car in China in 2012, they sold 138,000 of them.  They are now selling about 14,000 A6's per month in China.

 

The A8 on the other hand is pretty much a non-factor in most parts of the world, China is its best market too with 18,500 sold in 2012.   But in the USA the A8 sells about 5,000 cars a year, and in Europe they are down from 10,700 per year in 2006 to just 5,400 last year (financial crisis I suppose).  I'm sure the A8 has a decent profit margin on it because they do rip parts of other VW products, mainly the A6.

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There's the twin-turbo 4.5 liter that was featured in the El Miraj. 500hp/500lb-ft

I remember that, but they also gave almost no specifics on that engine, I think it was more a hypothetical engine.  I wonder if they will actually build an all new V8.  Cadillac ought to make a 3.0 liter straight six turbo based on the 2.0T, but that would probably be more suited for an ATS or CTS, it might not be enough for a base engine for the LTS.  Even though a lot of the other guys have a 3 liter six as the best engine in their flagships, I think Cadillac has to go bigger than them.

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It drives, but they could have put a 3.6 V6 in the concept car.  I haven't seen any pictures with the hood open or where they detail the engine.  Plus what a concept car has isn't what a production car will have.  I think though what they release next April will be near production ready, so time will tell.

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LTS, REALLY? Come on GM, Time to use the names that truly drive prestige. The Top of the line should be an Eldorado, Fleetwood or De Ville

 

Even GM Insider News states how much they hate the 3 letter BS.

It's a boring name, sounds like a trim level, like Chevy's LTZ...'Fleetwood Brougham' would be a much better name, IMO.

Edited by Cubical-aka-Moltar
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Yes, it would be ideal for Cadillacs to actually have names again, but there is a reason for this.  Names do not always translate globally.  Think about it: China is a bigger luxury car market than the USA.  A name for a model may not always work in that case.  Moreover, NONE of the luxury marques use names on their models, and have not do so for a long time.

 

Besides, the old names may not be the best way forward.  What new names would you recommend instead?

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Having difficulty getting behind the above theory. No manufacturers change their BRAND name in China, do they?
If a Chinese consumer can handle 'mercedes-Benz' they should be able to handle 'Fleetwood'.

Or in the worst case, just use an alpha-numeric for China alone, and a name everywhere else.

 

 

When Lamborghini went to China, their model was dubbed the "Lamborghini Murcielago LP670-4 SuperVeloce China Limited Edition".

Edited by balthazar
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      V-Series Blackwing: Ultimate Track Capability, Zero Compromise
      The 2022 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing and CT5-V Blackwing, two of the most powerful Cadillacs ever, raise the bar on performance The 2022 Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing and CT4-V Blackwing represent the pinnacle of Cadillac performance and craftsmanship, leveraging championship-winning racing heritage to create the most track-capable Cadillacs ever, while continuing to set new standards for luxury and comfort.
      Leveraging a Cadillac racing history that began in 1949 and has seen sustained success over the last two decades, the V-Series Blackwing models were developed with driver engagement and performance at the top of mind.
      “V-Series Blackwing stands for the very highest level of execution from Cadillac and offers a distinctly American vision of performance: incredible power and luxurious craftsmanship, with absolutely zero compromise,” said Brandon Vivian, executive chief engineer, Cadillac. “We looked to our championship-winning racing heritage and brought an uncompromising eye for detail to create two cars that elevate the V-Series experience.”
      V-Series Blackwing vehicles build on the already excellent performance dynamics of the CT5-V and CT4-V to create the top tier of the Cadillac sedan lineup.
      Highlights include:
      Evolutions of the track-ready Cadillac 6.2L Supercharged V8 in the CT5-V Blackwing and 3.6L Twin-Turbo V6 in the CT4-V Blackwing Upgraded TREMEC six-speed manual transmission standard Available 10-speed automatic transmission Electronic Limited Slip Rear Differential enhanced to reduce mass and improve on-track reliability Advanced suspension refinements providing greater body control and a more agile feel Magnetic Ride Control 4.0, the world’s fastest reacting suspension technology, sharpening the balance between daily-driving comfort and high-performance track capability Unique structural enhancements improving steering response and handling on the track Cadillac’s largest ever factory-installed brakes, available on the CT5-V Blackwing Extensive validation including 12-hour and 24-hour track testing Customizable integrated digital gauge cluster with Custom Launch Control and Performance Traction Management settings Liberating performance
      The CT5-V Blackwing uses an upgraded 6.2L supercharged V8 that, thanks to a higher flow air-intake and revised exhaust system, is rated at 668 horsepower (498 kW) and 659 lb-ft of torque (893 Nm), making it the most powerful production Cadillac ever. Each engine is hand-built at GM’s Bowling Green Assembly facility in Kentucky and features a signed engine builder’s plate.
      The CT4-V Blackwing sports an evolution of the Cadillac 3.6L Twin-Turbo V6 that features revised control system software and an improved air intake system to create 472 horsepower (352 kW) and 445 lb-ft of torque (603 Nm). The turbos’ low-inertia (titanium-aluminide) turbine wheels enable more precise and responsive application of torque throughout the rev range.
      Highlighted features and output:
      CT5-V Blackwing: 6.2L Supercharged V8 - 668 hp, 659 lb-ft of torque GM-estimated top track speed: over 200 mph GM-estimated 0-60 mph: 3.7 seconds (automatic transmission) Most powerful Cadillac ever Air intake airflow is improved by 46 percent vs. the CTS-V Compact, high-output 1.7L four-lobe Eaton supercharger with small-diameter rotors that enable boost to be generated earlier in the rpm band for instantaneous response Rotocast A356T6 aluminum cylinder heads are stronger and handle heat better than conventional aluminum-alloy heads Lightweight titanium intake valves Track-capable wet-sump oiling and vent system with external oil separator and drainback CT4-V Blackwing: 3.6L Twin-Turbo V6 - 472 hp, 445 lb-ft of torque GM-estimated top speed: 189 mph GM-estimated 0-60 mph: 3.8 seconds (automatic transmission) Most powerful and fastest Cadillac in the subcompact class Air intake restriction is improved by 39 percent vs. the ATS-V Turbocharger compressors matched for peak efficiency at peak power for optimal track performance Titanium connecting rods (manual transmission only) and revised crankshaft counterweights reduce main/rod bearing reciprocating loads Re-targeted piston oil squirters, which direct engine oil at the bottoms of the pistons, for improved temperature control The manifold-integrated water-to-air charge cooling system contributes to more immediate torque response Airflow routing volume is reduced by 60 percent when compared to a conventional design that features a remotely mounted heat exchanger Track-capable braking systems
      Both V-Series Blackwing models feature advanced high-performance braking systems that have been extensively track and road-tested. The exclusive V-Series Blackwing wheel designs enable an even larger rotor over the previous CTS-V, making the CT5-V Blackwing braking system the largest factory-installed brakes in Cadillac history. Additionally, an available carbon-ceramic brake package for the CT5-V Blackwing, featuring cross-drilled rotors, deliver several benefits including weight savings, durability and heat management.
      Highlighted features:
      CT4-V Blackwing: 14.96 x 1.34-inch (380 X 34 mm) front rotors and 13.4 x 1.1-inch (340.5 x 28 mm) rear rotors CT5-V Blackwing: 15.67 x 1.42-inch (398 X 36 mm) front rotors and 14.7 x 1.1-inch (373.5 x 28 mm) rear rotors Staggered Brembo® six-piston front calipers and four-piston rear calipers Available on the CT5-V Blackwing, the lightweight carbon-ceramic brake package significantly improves heat management, as well as greater resistance to wear under extreme conditions on the racetrack, while also reducing unsprung mass and rotating mass: 53-pound (24 kg) reduction in unsprung weight 62-pound (28 kg) reduction in rotating mass High-performance copper-free brake linings comply with California law and deliver superior fade resistance with an excellent pedal feel on and off the track Brake systems are integrated to each vehicles’ selectable drive modes, including brake pedal feel. Brake pedal feel can also be assigned within My-Mode and V-Mode Manual transmission is standard
      Rare for sport sedans today, a six-speed TREMEC manual transmission is standard on both vehicles. It has been optimized for each V-Series Blackwing vehicle to provide an engaging experience on the track or on the road. Details include:
      LuK twin-disc clutch for high torque capacity and great pedal feel Active Rev Matching accessible via a console mounted toggle switch to automatically adjust engine speed to match anticipated downshifts No-Lift Shift allowing the driver to shift gears without letting off the gas pedal. In the case of the CT4-V Blackwing, it allows the turbos to remain spooled, resulting in faster lap times Transmission and rear differential cooling – the manual and automatic transmissions use the same track-performance cooling system for greater track performance Clutch and brake pedals positioned for optimal driver ergonomics A physical barrier stop for the clutch pedal rather than a hydraulic master cylinder stop provides greater driver feedback during clutch operation A shorter shifter ratio than previous generations for more precise shifts Ten-speed automatic transmission
      The CT5-V Blackwing and CT4-V Blackwing are available with a 10-speed electronically controlled automatic transmission. It is tuned to complement the dual-personality experience of each respective model.
      Highlighted features:
      Tap Shift/Manual Mode allowing the driver to use integrated magnesium paddle shifters to select a gear and hold it until selecting the next gear, up or down Sport Mode providing real-time interpretation of driving conditions, adjusting the transmission to reduce shift busyness and improve performance, while retaining aggressive driving dynamics Twenty-four-hour track testing resulted in several improvements in response to the demands of a high-g track environment, including a unique oil pan design and priority valve changes Unique control systems with performance calibrations tailored for each model Ten forward gears offer the most available transmission speeds in each sedans’ respective segments, helping keep the engines within their optimal rpm bands, while also anticipating the next shifts Dynamic Performance Mode is calibrated specifically for V-Series Blackwing to deliver track focused shift patterns and automatically activates when high-g forces are experienced in Sport or Track mode An auxiliary pump primes the automatic transmission system from the time the vehicle door is opened for improved cold-shift performance. Both V-Series Blackwing models also feature an enhanced Electronic Limited Slip Rear Differential. It weighs less and has been optimized for each driving mode and each Performance Traction Management setting.
      Highlighted features:
      More control of the rear differential compared to traditional open and mechanical limited-slip differentials Enhances road grip by automatically allocating torque to the rear wheel with the most traction during hard cornering — with the capability of sending up to 1,475 lb-ft (2,000 Nm) of locking torque across the axle High-performance differential cooler An aluminum housing replacing the previous generation cast iron housing, reducing mass by more than 22 pounds (10 kg) Exclusive integrated heat exchanger for enhanced cooling Advanced suspension systems and strengthened chassis
      V-Series Blackwing combines the fourth generation of Magnetic Ride Control (MR 4.0), with improvements to the front and rear suspension systems. Stiffer spring rates, unique hollow stabilizer bars, higher-rate bushings and more enable a driving experience that isolates the driver from road imperfections, while also providing a precise, engaging connection with the road.
      MR 4.0 highlights:
      Immense performance envelope that gave Cadillac engineers the freedom to optimize everyday driving and aggressive track performance New accelerometers and an inertial measurement unit that transmit and process changes in road conditions four times faster than the previous generation system Secondary temperature maps that enable engineers to compensate for changes in damper fluid temperature for more consistent performance, even during performance driving Inertial measurement unit that provides more precise measurements of body motion relative to the wheel for more accurate readings under heavy braking, hard cornering and other driving conditions Improved magnetic flux control that creates a more consistent and accurate transition between rebound and compression Improvements to transient body control that allow the vehicle to remain more level while transitioning between corners MacPherson strut front suspension:
      Ride link includes an all-new 100-percent elastomer bushing on the CT4-V Blackwing and a retuned hydro bushing on the CT5-V Blackwing, for improved ride response Handling link has cross-axis ball joints for improved lateral control and quicker steering response Five-link independent rear suspension:
      Lateral link features stiffer bushings for faster response and increased cornering agility Toe link has cross-axis ball joints for increased stability and driver confidence Rear knuckles have increased stiffness for improved braking and better control during cornering Rear cradle mounts have been stiffened for optimum balance between road comfort and track performance V-Series Blackwing models are built on Cadillac’s award-winning rear-wheel drive architecture and feature unique structural enhancements including shock tower braces, an underside shear plate and thicker rear cross members to improve chassis rigidity. Along with the unique suspension elements, the stiffer structure enhances steering response, handling and the everyday driving experience.
      All-day performance, on and off the track
      The CT5-V Blackwing and CT4-V Blackwing build on Cadillac’s racing heritage and were developed to be track-capable straight from the factory. That includes an intensive validation program to ensure consistent performance during the most challenging track conditions.
      Validation for both models included:
      Twenty-four-hour continuous track testing with the available automatic transmission, available carbon fiber aero package, aluminum wheels and available carbon ceramic brake package Twelve-hour continuous track testing with the standard manual transmission, available carbon fiber aero package, aluminum wheels and available carbon ceramic brake package Functional aerodynamics, including an available carbon fiber aero package, contribute to the V-Series Blackwing models’ track prowess to support a variety of cooling needs for the cars’ respective engines, transmissions, axles and other supporting systems.
      Additionally, MICHELIN® Pilot Sport 4S tires developed exclusively for the V-Series Blackwing models contribute to their balance of track capability and road comfort. Highlights include:
      Unique, multiple-compound tread composition: Contact patch composed of three unique tread rubber compounds Racing “R compound” used for the majority of the tread Compounds optimized for wet traction, enhanced street and track durability, as well as rolling resistance The mold shape of the tire has been specifically engineered for Blackwing models to optimize contact with the road Tire sizes: CT5-V Blackwing tire size: 275/35ZR19 (front) and 305/30ZR19 (rear) CT4-V Blackwing tire size: 255/35ZR18 (front) and 275/35ZR18 (rear) Both V-Series Blackwing vehicles feature standard forged aluminum alloy wheels with staggered widths, front to rear. These forged wheels are stronger and lighter than conventional cast aluminum.
      Wheel sizes:
      CT5-V Blackwing: Front – 19 x 10 inches / Rear – 19 x 11 inches CT4-V Blackwing: Front – 18 x 9 inches / Rear – 18 x 9.5 inches Coming this summer
      Reservations for both vehicles open on Feb. 1, 2021 at 7:30 p.m. ET on Cadillac.com, with deliveries later this summer. Pricing begins at $59,9901 for the CT4-V Blackwing and $84,9901 for the CT5-V Blackwing.
    • By David
      Here you will find the latest teaser videos from Cadillac.
      Cadillac CELESTIQ
      Cadillac-CELESTIQ-Teaser.mp4
      Cadillac BLACKWING teaser
      BLACKWING-teaser.mp4
      Will add more teasers as Cadillac releases them.
       
      Here is the link for the Cadillac BLACKWING Reveal on February 1st 2021 @ 7pm EST.
      Cadillac Pressroom - United States - V-Series Blackwing
    • By William Maley
      The COVID-19 pandemic has possibly caused another auto show to rethink their plans. According to Automotive News, organizers of the show are planning to delay the show from November to next May. Three sources tell the outlet the new dates are May 21st to 31st. Two of sources go on to say that an announcement could come this week.
      Automotive News tried to get comment from Terri Toennies, president of the show, but did not reply.
      By possibly moving the LA Auto Show to May, automakers and organizers of the New York and Detroit shows find themselves in a difficult spot. The LA show sandwiches between New York (April) and the revised Detroit show (June), which may cause automakers to make difficult decisions as to which shows get the most significant unveilings or whether to attend at all.
      Auto shows in general have been struggling before the onset of the pandemic. With automakers deciding to hold their own events to have more time in the spotlight and save cash, the spectacle of the show has gone down.
      We'll keep you posted.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      The COVID-19 pandemic has possibly caused another auto show to rethink their plans. According to Automotive News, organizers of the show are planning to delay the show from November to next May. Three sources tell the outlet the new dates are May 21st to 31st. Two of sources go on to say that an announcement could come this week.
      Automotive News tried to get comment from Terri Toennies, president of the show, but did not reply.
      By possibly moving the LA Auto Show to May, automakers and organizers of the New York and Detroit shows find themselves in a difficult spot. The LA show sandwiches between New York (April) and the revised Detroit show (June), which may cause automakers to make difficult decisions as to which shows get the most significant unveilings or whether to attend at all.
      Auto shows in general have been struggling before the onset of the pandemic. With automakers deciding to hold their own events to have more time in the spotlight and save cash, the spectacle of the show has gone down.
      We'll keep you posted.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
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