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I like to leave people's personal beliefs alone. If it works for them; great. People believe all SORTS of things, as long as they aren't hurting others, go to town. Especially if it brings them comfort / guidance. Life is hard enough without fighting off people who want to call you stupid all day long.

I do not think its the car manufacturers that are pricing the consumers out of new cars. I think its the consumer itself that does it. Why is it that Ford is cutting its sedans in favor of producing and selling CUVs and SUVs? Why is GM almost doing the same? Why are Toyota Camrys and Honda Accords selling at a slight lesser rate than once before and why is it that Toyota's and Honda's CUVs outselling their sedan counterparts? When was the last time you actually saw or heard a suburban wife talk about how she wants to buy (not lease, because leasing too causes the consumer to out-price himself out of a new car) a base bare bones compact car? It seems suburbanites all want the most recent, option filled truck or SUV and who cares how much it costs... There was a time when down and out folk used to buy pick-up trucks, no options pick-up trucks, because these were the cheapest means of transportation anybody could buy... The consumers DEMANDED fully equipped cars over the decades and have migrated to higher priced CUVs and SUVs and 100 000 doallr work trucks to outshine their neighbors... Even if car manufacturers make and produce "affordable" no frill CUVs, the masses will NOT buy them or lease them. America has become a voracious consumer oriented society that just wants to outdo their neighbor...

I am happy for you. Honestly, if I had a magic wand I would wave it and you would stop overcompensating by evaluating items as status purchases to give you the most status in the room. Status is important as a luxury car....but buy what you like...no one in their right mind gives a shit if you buy a Lincoln or a Lexus...or a Benz or a BMW.

It didn't. GM sold 9,668 CT6es, whereas BMW sold 8,271 7-series vehicles inthe USA in 2018. BTW, the M-B sold 14,978 S-Class cars in the US in 2018. Regardless, when you launch a product in the large luxury sedan segment, only an idiot product planner will not realize that it is going to be a 10,000 unit/year (give or take) product. It might do worse if it sucks, it may be about 15K if it is really successful. It will NEVER be a volume model; it is not a Camry. R&D expenditure, pricing and production scaling should be designed around the low volumes, period.

We were going to go to Cleveland to Help with a high school debate tournament Saturday, that might not happen. When I get into a debate with a religious person, I usually say that I am not very religious and don't want to talk about it. Works 90 percent of the time. If they choose to get ugly and push the issue, I am very good at pushing back and usually make people angry/uncomfortable/enraged/want to beat my ass/seething... until they leave me alone. People that want to have an intelligent discussion about religion are entirely different...will also have intelligent discussions with respectful people all day long if they want to.

Well, looks like winter is on the way.... They are talking 8-12 inches with 40-50MPH wind gusts. Sounds like I will be spending my weekend inside!

They are ugly as dog feces, but this... Oh I'd have a baby with this Cadillac ?

Very possible, if Cadillac cannot deliver on spacious fast luxury EVs, then you might as well close the doors as other start ups will eat them up if they do not pay attention to what is being shown as 21 century rides.

I have been to England and Spain, but I would like to go to Paris, somewhere in the Alps where they film all those James Bond movies, and driving the Nurburgring would be cool also.

As much as he cheer leads Germany... I have a real feeling that he's never been there

Yeah... uuuum.. if I see a CT6 Taxi.. I'm not gonna boast on its numbers Raises hand

Find an (online) clean Chevette and marvel at the interior. It had nothing inside, and you sweated. It was 10,000 miles away from a Cadillac/mercedes. Now a kia forte HAS to have a leather-wrapped steering wheel, touch screeen, full power features/A/C, active safety warning features, 17" alloy rims, etc etc etc. It even looks like a low end mercedes. How they hell could it possibly be $8000?? Then we have the supposed wave of electrics coming, just about ALL of them priced 25% higher than their gas counterparts. Heading right toward $40K average price? Yep, I think so; electrics are supercharging that price push. If a brand was to offer a quirky, futuristic, Minimalist Kar with a base sound system, A/C, crank windows/manual seats, no heated seats/wheel, no screen, peppy performance, upper class MPG- it has a chance but at those levels it starts to simply compete with used stuff, better equipped. So it hopes to 'win' volume on those who are willing to do without but HAVE to have a brand new car. How many consumers is that pool comprised of? I blame the massive upgrading of entry level cars in features and design; it's eroded the degree of difference vs. upper crust cars, and upended the pricing range. Ultimately, a lot more model lines are going to fall- as amenities greatly overlap and size differences are minimal and everyone has 3 or 5 CUVs- the industry sags with oversaturation. I've advocated for this before and I still think it has major merits. Less model lines, more variants within the model line. Mainstream brands STILL have too many model lines- it's not going to last ESP if new EV brands actually start producing.

Totally agree, I saved up for 3yrs to buy my Escalade and still financed 1/3 of the price. Mortgage, car loans, student loans, regular credit cards, home costs, maintenance, costs have gotten out of control in comparison to income.

Absolutely. Not everybody has a family income of 100k. It isn't uncommon for younger people to start making 30k out of college with monster loans. Seriously? This is average? ?

VW Full size van in the pic for this story is not bad looking, actually better looking I think than Fords.

That is the most contradictory statement I have ever heard. Yes, status is important for lucury cars. People in their right mind buy them specifically because they give a damn about what others perceive of their brand of choice. That is a huge part of the buying decision.

I am NOT impressed with the "Blackwing" V8. I am not impressed because:- It is not particularly high specific output (about the same as a 260hp 2.0L engine). Engines which making more notably torque than HP -- by definition -- spends it time running out of breathe as revs build The Hot Vee is a stupid idea because it limits turbocharger sizing for minimal to no benefits to responsiveness The only reason I'll advocate for a Hot Vee is to use a larger turbo vs two smallers ones for better efficiency and/or costs and that is not being done on the Blackwing. It did not include GM's new Tri-power cam switching valve train despite being based on the Ecotec 4-cylinder family That said, the Inline-6 is an even worse idea. The Inline-6 is VERY LONG and harder to fit in a car than a V8. Basically, if you can fit an I-6 you can fit a V-12 and it takes a heck of a lot of hood length to fit either. Also, just because it is an I6 and I6es are naturally 1st and 2nd order balanced does not mean an I6 is necessarily more refined. GM's last I6, the 4.2L DOHC-24v 291hp Atlas (LL8) was... well... blah. I'll very much prefer a V8TT to the tune of 500 lb-ft @ 2,600~6,600 rpm and 640 bhp @ 6,800 rpm with a 7,000 rpm redline. The key here isn't the power output per say, but the fact that you WANT an engine that gives you more and more as you progress up the tachometer. You don't want an engine that pushes you back like a freight train then spend half the tach sweep running out of breathe. It is very un-enticing to drive. People buying sports sedans are not exactly looking for the Peterbilt experience.

You couldn’t find a better example of a two tone paint job? That looks like an aftermarket job done in someone’s garage with 20 cans of Krylon 2 in 1. Even this photoshop job looks better than that (and yes to a CT8 variant like this). Sorry but the others are right regarding the MB front ends. When one has to look around the side to tell the difference between a $30K CLA and an $120K S-Class, that is not a good thing. The Cadillac’s at least look distinctive in that department, much more so the Benz (for now anyway). If you’re going to go two tone, at least do it right.

You can tow/haul with shockingly low torque ratings, but you won't be going fast. Or even posted speeds. It's all about the gears. My 1940 had a registered/loaded weight of 15,975 and only has 180 torque. I have a 2500HD Duramax, rated at 520 torque. It's getting on it years/miles now, but judging off of that I don't think anyone 'needs' torque in a 2500 to be over 650-700. It's all a pissing match over that, IMO. Not that 'need' is the only factor driving sales, of course.

LOL! Yeah. I was kinda joking. But I was kinda not. There is always a hint of truth to everything I say. Before I got car crazy, I was an airplane nut. During my teen years, I was more into airplanes than I was into cars (and I was car crazy then too). WW2 fighters. Jets fighters of any era. Commercial aircraft. You name it. This makes for an interesting debate. I did say that modern V8s could power WW2 fighters. I was being serious. (Im going by memory, its been a loooong time since I discussed WW2 aircraft. Im too lazy to google or reach out for my WW2 books on airplanes.) I did know that WW2 fighters had a minimum of 1200 HP. Some reached 1700HP. Some even surpassed 2000HP. Some were inline 12 cylinders while others were 18 cylinders in a radial configuration. Some were in an inverted V and some were supercharged. While others used nitrous oxide to achieve superior performance in high speed or to achieve high altitudes and faster climb rates and what not. OK...the part where I think that a modern V8 could have powered WW2 aircraft and obviously achieve the same performance numbers as those war birds. Those Rolls Royce/Merlin V12s that were in Spitfires and Mustangs, those radial 18 cylinder BMW engines that were found in the Focke Wulf 190s and all the others were huge, big, clunky and heavy. Sure, they produced about double what a Hellcat Hemi or the ZR1 LT5 produces, but I bet you that those V8s weigh less than half of what those old piston aircraft engines weighed. They definitely take up less space. Less space means the fighter could be that much smaller. Less weight means that a fighter needs less HP to propel it through the air. So...could a 840HP Demon Hemi crate engine propel a Mustang P51D to be as fast as the real Merlin powered P51d Mustang? (Which the P51D was the fastest piston engined airplane of the war. I do not know how to answer that. But I will try. I googled this part. Although I knew some things about it... The Red Bull airplane race planes use a Lycoming horizontally opposing 6 cylinder engine. Displacement is 541.5 cubic inches or 8.9 liters. Producing about 300 - 320 HP give or take. I knew that these planes go at about 280 MPH. (I googled-between 252 and 265MPH) Its a smaller airplane compared to a WW2 fighter. But it may be a tad more maneuverable. So...no clear answer. But I would simply say that most of the performance specs of a WW2 fighter would be intact if powered by a modern LT5 or Demon engine V8. So yeah. I stand by what I say. Joking or not!

Nice try; try again ~ And if consumers have to squint into the headlight cluster to try and figure out if they should be impressed at how much money you're willing to drop in depreciation (S-Coupe) or how much of a poser you are (CLA), you've failed at Styling.

^ It's sad how they all look exactly the same up front- the $100K models wear the same nose as the $30K. Imagine if Cadillac put a Sonic nose on the CT6-V.

Yes. But in Europe. Not here in North America. Cadillac was NEVER a full line brand with commercial trucks, military trucks, buses, taxis... There were Cadillac hearses and ambulances, but those were aftermarket outfitters that did the conversions. Not from the factory. Mercedes, if marketed properly, could succeed as a full line brand in North America. They keep slippin though. Cadillac cant. No amount of marketing would make Cadillac a full line brand. If Cadillac succeeded in making an alternative to a Chevrolet Malibu Premier, People would not buy the CT6 Blackwing if Cadillac would succeed to be an alternative to a Malibu Premier. And honestly, do we, the people of North America, really want Cadillac to sell us their version of the Malibu Premier and their competitor to the Mercedes Sprinter? I dont think GM CEOs want that either. Maybe owners of Cadillac dealers want that... I fell in love with the Mercedes Sprinter this past summer on our family vacation to Greece. But its not the Sprinter that inspires me to own a Mercedes one day... Is this how we should look at Mercedes and Cadillac? Boy, that Sprinter hauls so much stuff...I must buy the SL Black Series right now!!! In Europe, there is no disconnect with a Mercedes in every garage philosophy. There is no lapse from traveling in the subway and then getting on a Mercedes city bus and then seeing a rich dude pull up in front of the bus in his SL when you get off the next bus stop. In the US...we havent seen that, have we? Cadillac tried that sort of thing and failed, because Cadillac should ONLY sell to the 1%ers. THAT is how we view Cadillac and we should continue to do so...because Cadillac always sold dreams to us and actually sold those dreams for real to the 1%ers...

There are also those who look down those who buy German lux cars, believe it or not.

I don't get that. I love GM.. more than most.. but I see what they are doing, from a business standpoint, as the way to run a car business. People can hate them for closing plants.. that were under utilized. They can hate them for killing certain car models.. that weren't selling or were redundant... They can hate them for going for profit.. over sales and debt. They can even hate them for going EV in 10 years.. even as everyone else is going have to go there... but from a business stand point they are doing what's right. Only as ENTHUSIASTS can we really get pissed.. only as Cadillac fans can we really be pissed. But then I look at their ENTHUSIAST products.. Corvette.. a world beater whose reputation proceeds it and is typically only able to be dogged out for its interior versus cars costing $20K+.. We have the Camaro.. undoubtedly the best performance sports coupe on the market that is not called a genuine Sports car.. we have the ATS-V Coupe.. the CTS-V .. two of the absolute best super luxury vehicles on the market.. and now we have the CT6-V. Truthfully my only issue with GM really tends to be with them not offering more variations of vehicles that they have on the lots by utilizing parts they already have on the shelf.. ie... XT6 with a 3.6L but no Twin Turbo variant.. ie Cruze not having a 2.0L Turbo even though they are gonna offer an SS in South America.. etc

Most people I know who drive luxury cars are much more known for thier achievement that enabled them to buy the car than they are by the car.

I am not a fan of the new CAFE standards put in several years ago. The real issue is keeping up with the Joneses when it comes to everything, not just cars. I cannot blame the president of NADA for lamenting high new car prices. He should blame the automakers for the start of leasing cars 35 years ago in the first place. Without car leases, the race towards higher-priced vehicles slows down. There are also too many 60-72 month car notes out there too. I thought that Hyundai/KIA would actually force prices down. Instead they joined all others in their car pricing too, with slightly lower pricing. Also, cars are not falling apart like they used to 30-45 years back, so new car replacements are less likely. If it wasn't for used car pricing, car sales may end up being half of what they are. Where is the $10,000 small crossover? Where is the $8000 small sedan and/or hatchback?

You should buy the car you like given your budget. Then again, there are a LOT of badge snobs out there who will look down at you for owning a Cadillac since they LOVE German luxury. The effect is not quite as extreme with those who love Japanese luxury cars for some reason.

That will not happen. China is NOT STUPID. They understand Merchantilism. They understand that the wealth of Nations rise on Trade Surpluses and diminishes on Trade Deficits. They understand that ONLY trade that generates surpluses is of any benefit to a country and Trade that generates deficits impoverishes a country. That is why they have the HIGHEST IMPORT TARIFFS overall in the world and they REQUIRE foreign manufacturers building cars in China to avoid tariffs and to do it in factories at least 51% Chinese owned. You see, Free Trade doesn't work. It doesn't work because unlike in stupid economics classes, absolute and comparative advantages measured in man-hours is irrelevant. It is irrelevant because Chinese and other 3rd world workers make $1.90 an hour and US workers make 10 times that. Are you willing to lower wages in the US to $2 an hour and eliminate social entitlements to compete? No? Then you will LOSE with Free Trade. You will never be 10 times more productive or skilled to make up the difference. Free Trade ensures the outflow of wealth, industry and influence from Rich Countries to Poor Countries. That is great for China, great for the 3rd World and great for the Globalist opportunists profiting in the process. IT might even be the best Social Justice and Redistribution program in history. But, it is terrible for any affluent country. What we can expect and hope for is for barriers to be erected to impede Free Trade with countries with whom we have a deficit and to cause a global manufacturing diversification away from China -- our chief strategic rival. We'll be a little less harsh on the Chinese if they play ball, but that's about it. Unlike the swamp creatures in Congress (from both parties) Orange Man is very smart and Orange man is laser focused on the things that matter.

I remember a decade ago, when the politicians and the greenie folk were scolding the Detroit Big3 CEOs why do they keep on producing gas guzzling SUVs and the Detroit Big3 CEOs defended themselves by saying that that is what the consumers want. The politicians and the greenie folk all said bullshyte on that and forced FoMoCo, GM and Chryco. to produce smaller more economical cars... This is how Obamas new mileage standards came to be... THIS is how we got small displacement 4 bangers with turbos in our cars. THIS is how FoMoCo. got the name ecoboost from... https://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/19/business/19emissions.html As you coud see, a decade later and the consumers NEVER gave two shytes about what greenies and politicians cared for...

And my point is that it would be better if more people thought like enthusiasts and just bought what made them happy. I have two mothers...was adopted...know and get along well with both. Birth mother drove a Jag....got hit and the jag got totaled...replaced it with a Lincoln. She hangs out in all of the right country clubs and social circles. No one really cared that she switched brands. Pretty much everyone thought the lighter color of the Lincoln (some shade of metallic dune, kind of a nice tan) would be better in the Florida sun than the black of the (now crumpled) Jag. And that was about it. One of her neighbors is an incredibly cool guy and drives an E class Benz...but no one cares that he bought that a Benz...they like the dude because he is a great guy. If Chevrolet built the Peto Bismal pink Aveo in the ken and Barbie limited edition and it brought SMK Status...you can bet the family jewels it would be in his driveway. And a 1930's V16 Cadillac would be just another used car if it didn't bring him Status. I like a lot of Benzes...but all i ever hear from SMK is sales numbers and status. Dammit man...live life on your own terms a little bit. Americans were not born to be sheep...which is probably why Cadillac is out for certain people. Cadillac has an edgy nature that should appeal to tech types, entrepreneurs, athletes, and people who take risks, But I might suggest the brand Checker and the model Marathon for SMK. Low risk financially as it is already depreciated....outsold every other taxi for decades so a sales leader....moar interior room than most modern Luxury cars...and he can lecture us on how smooth that inline six is. Drunken Wino as passenger not included.

I agree in majority with your statement, till you get into select neighborhoods and cities where the population is nothing but fanboi idiots caught up in the name. I could care less what others think of my ride as long as it fits me and is what I like. While I do debate heavily with some here, I still respect that they are driving what they want, what they like and good for them. Even our SMK SUPER FANBOI of MB, glad he is so in love with his E-Class Taxi.

The point is that just because it is an Inline-6 doesn't mean it is more refined. You can have a truck engine that is very refined -- go drive the 2.7T 4-potter (L3B) in the Silverado and you'll see. You can have a car engine that really isn't like the LLT 3.6 DOHC V6 -- despite GM's exhaustive attempts to claim to the contrary, it is louder, more granular and more clattery than the 3.5L and 3.9L Pushrod V6es it replaced (thanks largely to the curse of Direct Injection). The point is that while certain engine layouts have naturally superior balance (line the I6, I8, V12 and any of the horizontally opposed designs), adopting any such layouts is not sufficient to guarantee refinement. If GM REALLY wanted ultimate refinement they will incorporate Dual Injection (so direct injection can be disabled at idle and low engine loads where it is not needed and has no tangible benefit). If GM is REALLY interest in ultimate refinement, they will actually get rid of the Start-Stop nonsense or allow it to remember that it's turned off when the driver disables it. But, obviously, there are or have been other priorities.

Yeah...I don't know how people manage big car payments...especially with big mortgages.

I was saying that in the average population people really don't care that much what kind of car you buy. Show up in a BMW or Benz and you have the status of a luxury car...but unless you have a brand fanboi 99 percent of the population does not give a rats ass which one you bought.

Nah, these are just commercial appliances. The current VW Crafter is a VW only product, but the previous on was based on the Sprinter.... so if the next Transit and Crafter share some dirty bits for various markets, no biggie...

At any rate...and I agree completely with your fine post Dwight... Can we all start looking at cars as enthusiasts rather than having a @!c& waving contest in terms of who outsells who by 300 units? We might as well whine about why one apartment building in a sim city simulation has more electronic residents. And I am all in on the CT6...fine automobile.

Like these...but that XT5 is a sexy beast in that color! Looks like something a sexually starved Miami Widow would drive...not reeking of Luxury in any real way. Enough remains to keep merit in the brand though. It beats the living Dog $#!+ out of the BMW products...for damned sure.

Every time you post something like this it makes you look dumb. You still don't know how horsepower and torque and RPM work after all these years here? @balthazar and I have failed in teaching you.

Similar to what they are forecasting for here in Cleveland...ugh. Already have 3-4 inches on the ground from last weekend. And if it gets windy, that means power outages...ugh.

I wonder if a lifer GM Cadillac-er was thinking there's ...there's kids out there that want to buy their parents a classic Cadillac. Referring to me. He/she is part of the deep GM. The deeep GM. .... And then the deep GM commandeth "BARRA! KEEP THAT CARRR!"

CT6 LIVES!!! People who can't except that are either in denial or just plain ugly and stupid. They stink too...

Just be honest with your lack of belief.

Yet the S-Class is so Butt Ugly, in fact the whole family has a glaring problem, They have a Cat Butt front and center!

Our prayers MAY have been answered with respect to the CT6. Now if only GM would use the Omega platform for other vehicles as well. . . . .

It didnt make any sense to drop billions into a platform and all that metallurgical technology for it and a brand new state of the art V8 just to kill it off a couple of years later... But then again. This is GM we are talking about. It wouldnt have been the 1st time to kill off a brand new billion dollar project car. Hell, it wouldnt have even been the 2nd or 3rd time either after a short time being sold in the market place... So...anything coulda/woulda happened with the news of the plant closures and certain car models being killed off...

Worst post ever....ever....by you folks from Jersey....obviously Both Ford and GM need a nitro-methane fueled quad turbo V twin for the Aviator and XT5...and this thing needs eight Turbos on a three cylinder variant of that same design. Would win over the Harley guys and the Drag racing guys both...as well as suburban shoppers in the heartland. Because somewhere in the black forest with elves and Elvis an Benz engineer is designing a similar power-plant. And we know if people don't ape the Alpha dog in the room...the wreath and crest, the Blue oval and the Ram all three will be gone in three to five years. Just sayin...

Noooooo; the Rivian MARKETING MATERIAL is big into the outdoors. The Rivian truck is big into the garage it was hand built in.