FUTURE_OF_GM

The 'Holden smaller Commodore replacement' thread disappeared too. I figured PCS had just deleted that one though... :shrugs:

Yeah, I remember when you said we wouldn't get the ST. I guess other people have just as much charm, eh?

Don't worry, I remember the days of GME bleeding to death (Not too long ago, in fact) while GMNA showered in SUV profits.

Hey, it's a Mazda, judging by the side!!! No.. Wait... It's a Nissan at the front... Actually, on second glance at the nose, maybe this is an upmarket Toyota Yaris. A Lexus version of that car maybe?!?! Hell, who knows what it is. Sure is ugly though.

Not to go too far off subject, but did everyone hear about the malibu besting the Camry in J.D. Power this time around? Looks like the domestics are finally getting the respect they deserve (naturally, since it's too late to save the companies)

No surprise there... I guess the Lambdas are suddenly "outdated" or "gas guzzlers" or some other stupid, subjective complaint. I'd buy a Flex over a Traverse any day. The Traverse is the worst looking Lambda IMO, and soon it seems that the entire Chevy line up will look this generic.

2001 was the last year of huge profits and share growth. 2001 also saw the dawn of the Bob Lutz era if I'm not mistaken. Those factors alone made interest in GM rise.

We have a Pontiac, Buick, GMC, Cadillac, Saab dealer here... The place is nice, but they need more room. (Well, actually, if the market keeps tanking and GM keeps acting dumb they might not) I know the owner of the dealership. His dad started the place with Cadillac and he added Pontiac and GMC later. When GM approached him with the new channel strategy (Long before they made it public and before they were 'struggling with damaged brands' BTW -- It sees that GM really is run by the dealers) he said no. So he ended up buying out the Saab and Buick franchises from another dealer here in town. That dealer at one point sold Saab, Buick, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, VW, Audi, Porsche and Lotus all at the same dealership. It now sells VW, Audi and Porsche. We also now have a Cadillac, Pontiac, GMC, Chevrolet dealer here. Our local (as in the small town I'm from -- literally the only dealership there) Chevrolet dealer was swallowed up by a national chain. The national chain got in trouble (for bad deals, they weren't paying off trade-ins when customers bought new cars) and had to close parts of their network. So this Cadillac, Pontiac, GMC dealer down the road bought the Chevrolet franchise. Another strange pairing, this time in Charlotte: Folger Kia & Buick.

Well, GM and it's employees have been told for years that they aren't "good enough" (by the media, the government, the other automakers, the public, etc.) So maybe this is a case of learned helplessness and GM is finally throwing in the towel and resigning to defeat. Or at least, that's what it looks like to me. It's just too bad that the company, it's management and it's employees are such push overs. And that the company itself isn't smart enough to figure out, or care, NOT surrender like all of the afore mentioned entities want.

Funny story: We recently attended the "Blues, Brews & BBQ" festival here in Charlotte. They had a neighborhood competition that some of our friends competed in (and won). At the entrance of the competition sat a brand new Tundra. My GF looks over at me with the most sincere and innocent look on her face and says; "Hey, they actually brought a mascot for the competition! It's a big mechanical pig!" The Toyota dealer didn't really know what to say and I laughed my ass off. BTW, that same competing friend had wild blackberries soaked in moonshine -- we are from the mountains after all. (For V.I.P.s only ) Man it was good stuff! Tasted like fruit and Kerosene, LOL.

Me thinks that 'ain't gonna happen' If anything, China will use their (our) money to leverage their position and make things worse for us. Let us remember, China never was our friend and as far as I know, they still aren't. BTW, this is known as economic warfare. As for all those american companies that people think will somehow find esprit de corps and come to our aid... www.notgonnahappen.com Thes companies view themselves as GLOBAL entities now, thanks to deregulation and they will simply go where the money is. Look at GM, for instance... From what PCS says, they have pretty much given up on america and moved out already, despite the 'illusion' of being an american company.

I think a lot of it has to do with GM in general. Back when this site started, GM and being a GM fan was 'the cool thing' But now that the company is failing, the government has destroyed fun cars and GM seems to be back to it's old ways... Well, it's almost not even worth being a GM/car enthusiast. I hate to say it, but I think GM has lost a lot of supporters over the last 3-4 years.

Doesn't matter... The point is the innovation in relation to the image the media has built around GM. The first Prius and Insight weren't exactly mainstream products either. But my origianl point was that Toyota has, yet again, missed the market (big time) and no one seems to notice.

Sure you wanna take that chance? :AH-HA_wink: I might have to declare a jihad in the name of Pontiac and take you hostage. J/K. Seriously though, I'd be open to that if you ever get out this way.

Where is the media tirade chastising Toyota about missing the market and poor management? (Remember in 2002-2003 when all we read in Big 3 headlines was "Gas guzzler this" and "Gas guzzler that") Yet again, Toyota screws up big time and it's virtually ignored by the media. Yet GM brings out an electric car that destroys the Prius and pretty much makes it obsolete, and people are already starting to pick it apart and claim that "it won't make a difference"

LMFAO... Right you are!

Can well sell it through Saturn here?

Yes. Because the govenrment mandates that it do so. The loans weren't given to the automakers to "keep the business running"

Well, that is typical GM logic... "Umm, we need a lot of programs on this platform" and in the same breath; "Holden and Pontiac don't need RWD models." I'm sure the Buick Riviera will be cool, but I doubt GM will have the focus and/or the $$$ to optimize sales of such a car. If money really is THAT much of a concern, then they should peddle the car as a Buick in China and put a new nose on it for Pontiac here. I just don't see an affordable, performance minded Buick being able to sell here.

We're back up to $4.00+ here because of the damn shortage. I sat in line for 40 minutes the other day.

I tried to go to Cheesecake Factory here once. I've never been, but my GF loves it. I didn't feel like waiting the 1 hour plus to get in, so I went to P.F. Changs instead (The 2nd of my 3 bad experiences) I've been going to Waffle House (usually after a night having a lot of Tequila) for years. I never tried the waffles until about 2 months ago. I remember (barely) saying "These waffles are delectable!" Everyone thought it was funny and I just said it because I was drunk off my ass, but seriously, whoever was making the waffles that night was good! Another place I enjoy going is Quaker Steak and Lube. The food usually sucks, but it's cool to look at and they have good car & bike shows. http://www.quakersteakandlube.com/

So basically you'd have the exact same thing you had prior to 2006, except from the dems?!?!? The idea behind government is 'the greater good' Bush sucks, the republicans suck too. And from where I stand, the democrats suck just as much.

You've been passing off your sheltered opinion as fact on this board for years now. Not all of us make "6 figures a year" like you. So yes, I think it's pretty damn 'status quo' and insulting for a POLITICIAN to talk out of one side of his mouth and then do the exact opposite (blow money for no reason) We're in the midst of the worst financial disaster this country has experienced (save the great depression) and Obama is traveling the globe like he already has the job? there will be plenty of time to improve foreign policy IF and when he becomes president. This is a RANT thread, not a f*cking 'political discussion'

I think that's a bit of a stretch... The concept debuted to HUGE positivity and everyone I talk to seems to still be excited about it.

Asinine... Nah, I gave her asineight and her facinine. Asinine? Does that mean brilliant? (Yes, I am using sarcasm... Much like I was in the statement this quote relates to, just in case anyone else failed to make the connection.)