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What brands need to leave the US market?

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We all know that the US market is VERY overcrowded with brands, so leaving the big ones out of it (Toyota and Honda aren't going anywhere) what brands need to disappear? Think of the ones that simply drain away sales from more viable brands and don't have much going for themselves.

Who needs to go?

And, what would be a "good mix" afterward?

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Mitsubishi seems barely there... not sure what value Kia adds (seems largely redundant w/ Hyundai). And what about Suzuki and Isuzu? Invisible..

I don't see any of the European brands leaving, though Saab seems to be barely a blip on the radar these days..

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Everything except Chevy, Pontiac, Saturn, Oldsmobile, Buick, Cadillac, Hummer, and Saab.

I mean really..... what else could you possibly want?

What's good for GM is good for the country.

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Everything except Chevy, Pontiac, Saturn, Oldsmobile, Buick, Cadillac, Hummer, and Saab.

I mean really..... what else could you possibly want?

What's good for GM is good for the country.

C'mon, be serious. I saw that you responded and I was expecting a well thought out list. :AH-HA_wink:

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What Drew said.

But realistically, Mitsubishi, Volkswagen, and Kia need to leave. Make way for Alfa-Romeo and Citroen.

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Trying to be objective here, so this is a list of possibles.

Mitsubishi

Kia

VW

Saab

Lincoln

Mercury

Scion

Isuzu

Pontiac

Buick

Hummer

Land Rover

Suzuki

Volvo

Subaru

Maserati

Infiniti

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Mitsubishi

Kia

Isuzu

Suzuki

Scion

Saturn

Infiniti

Land Rover

Volvo

Lotus

Jaguar

Acura

They should probably go

Edited by Screaming Trees
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I think this group needs a hard look:

Lincoln

Mercury

Land Rover

Volvo

Jaguar

These are the "no-brainers":

Mitsubishi

Suzuki

Kia

Isuzu (except medium duty trucks)

On the cusp:

Volvo

Saab

Mercury

Scion

VW

Land Rover

Maserati

Pontiac (trying to be objective here, I don't think this would be wise)

EDIT: Can't really list Pontiac without listing Buick in this category. If Doomsday were upon us, I could see making Buick China -only and having Pontiac do Luxury as well as Performance - it wouldn't be too much of a stretch as they have done that before. No flames please, I don't think this is necessary.

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I'm listing them in my personal order of probability... give or take ten positions... lol.

Import Brands (regardless of ownership) & Domestic Brands (regardless of ownership)

Import Brands:

1 ) Isuzu - obvious

2 ) Mitsubishi - obvious

3 ) Volkswagen - mostly obvious

4 ) Maybach - rolling eyes at the obvious

5 ) Suzuki - low market penetration, poor retention of customers, and low satisfaction coupled with everyone wanting in on the compact/sub/micro-compact market. They’re getting squeezed out.

6 ) Jaguar/Land Rover - If they're sold, who can guess?

7 ) Audi - Have you checked their sales? if VW leaves, I can picture Audi planning a similar exit strategy.

8 ) Saab - GM is very stubborn. The brand doesn't even have a pulse at the moment, but GM will continue to pump cash into it

Domestic Brands:

1 ) Chrysler/Dodge tie for first - Despite being sold and taken private, their operations are extremely unprofitable. If the turn-around fails, there will be no salvation for Chrysler and Dodge. Jeep would be sold to the highest bidder.

2 ) Pontiac - With no real international presence and waning market appeal locally, the last Pontiac-Attack may be of the heart. I feel it would be more sensible to invest in premium touring compact and mid-size vehicles and sell them under Buick in America and China instead of fighting budget constraints to keep them affordable under the US-only Pontiac. Let Chevrolet sell affordable versions globally to help control costs. Although, see Saab’s description about GM being stubborn.

3 ) Mercury - Once the crown jewels are sold, Ford may end up pursuing what several auto-analysts have suggested and follow a Toyota approach: two divisions... Mainstream & luxury - Ford & Lincoln. (Ford has a controlling stake in Mazda, but doesn't own it.)

4 ) Buick - Regardless of how I feel, there's no guarantee Buick will survive in America unless GM becomes serious about saving its founding brand. However, China keeps Buick on life support at the moment.

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I would love for all asian cars to leave, especially Toyota and Honda, Euro cars can stay even though I don't care them could stay except for VW, Volvo and BMW, but we all know that will never happen.

So these could be realistc

Mitsubishi

Isuzu

Kia

Suzuki

Mercury

VW

Land Rover

Acura

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I'm listing them in my personal order of probability... give or take ten positions... lol.

Import Brands (regardless of ownership) & Domestic Brands (regardless of ownership)

Import Brands:

1 ) Isuzu - obvious

2 ) Mitsubishi - obvious

3 ) Volkswagen - mostly obvious

4 ) Maybach - rolling eyes at the obvious

5 ) Suzuki - low market penetration, poor retention of customers, and low satisfaction coupled with everyone wanting in on the compact/sub/micro-compact market. They’re getting squeezed out.

6 ) Jaguar/Land Rover - If they're sold, who can guess?

7 ) Audi - Have you checked their sales? if VW leaves, I can picture Audi planning a similar exit strategy.

8 ) Saab - GM is very stubborn. The brand doesn't even have a pulse at the moment, but GM will continue to pump cash into it

Domestic Brands:

1 ) Chrysler/Dodge tie for first - Despite being sold and taken private, their operations are extremely unprofitable. If the turn-around fails, there will be no salvation for Chrysler and Dodge. Jeep would be sold to the highest bidder.

2 ) Pontiac - With no real international presence and waning market appeal locally, the last Pontiac-Attack may be of the heart. I feel it would be more sensible to invest in premium touring compact and mid-size vehicles and sell them under Buick in America and China instead of fighting budget constraints to keep them affordable under the US-only Pontiac. Let Chevrolet sell affordable versions globally to help control costs. Although, see Saab’s description about GM being stubborn.

3 ) Mercury - Once the crown jewels are sold, Ford may end up pursuing what several auto-analysts have suggested and follow a Toyota approach: two divisions... Mainstream & luxury - Ford & Lincoln. (Ford has a controlling stake in Mazda, but doesn't own it.)

4 ) Buick - Regardless of how I feel, there's no guarantee Buick will survive in America unless GM becomes serious about saving its founding brand. However, China keeps Buick on life support at the moment.

Thanks for the post, Ven!

How could I have left Maybach off of the list?!! :duh:

I mostly agree with you on the imports, but I see the domestics a bit differently. I would place Mercury at the top of the list. I simply see no further purpose for that brand.

Buick and Pontiac, along with GMC, will be just fine as a grouping as long as GM can get the product rolling soon. I really do believe in the BPG concept.

Dodge and Chrysler will live or die together as one isn't worth much without the other. Jeep will survive no matter what. The jury is about as out as it can be for all of Chrysler Corp. right now as it is too soon to say how the turnaround is going.

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I would love for all asian cars to leave, especially Toyota and Honda, Euro cars can stay even though I don't care them could stay except for VW, Volvo and BMW, but we all know that will never happen.

So these could be realistc

Mitsubishi

Isuzu

Kia

Suzuki

Mercury

VW

Land Rover

Acura

:yes: Those names are all on my list as well.

Thanks for the post!

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1. Suzuki

2. Isuzu

3. Saab

4. Saturn (use the Oldsmobile name again)

5. Kia

6. Scion (the answer to the question no one ever asked)

7. Land Rover

Edited by Brougham-Holiday
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Anything and everything non-GM should GO. If they bitch about fair competition may be keep Ford and Chrysler, may be BMW and MB as foreign competitors.

Although I do have soft corner for the S2000, TSX and the TL for their spectacular manual transmissions.

That is it.

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I think I'll take this in corporate chunks with GM first:

1. We all know that GM doesn't want to kill any brands.

2. I think BPG will eventually work out just fine.

3. Hummer and Saab are loose ends.

4. Isuzu (50% GM, right?) is pointless as a retail brand.

5. Saturn is on the rise, so what about a Saturn, Saab, Hummer grouping?

6. Kill Isuzu as a brand for anything but medium-duty trucks

Now to think about Ford for a while, their corporate situation is tougher to science out.

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OK, Ford.

1. Kill Mercury

2. Sell Jaguar/Land Rover as a unit. These might survive under other ownership

3 Group Lincoln with Volvo and give Lincoln a Major overhaul.

4.Grab as much of Mazda as possible.

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SAAB needs too much work for too little return. Keep fostering SAAB's development overseas and just import various models for the states. Don't develop vehicles necessarily geared for the US-market. No one actually gives a crap in this country. Purists bitch about the cupholder opening counterclockwise instead of clockwise while the general public is apathetic.

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The Asian Makes:

1. Mitsubishi: exit the market

2. Suzuki: exit the market

3. Isuzu: exit the retail market

4. Kia: exit the market

5. Scion: should exit the market but Toyota will prop it up forever if necessary.

6. Infiniti: Nissan thinks they have a good shot with this brand, and if things go wrong they will

prop it up for quite a while.

7. Acura: Doing too well to leave anytime soon and Honda will prop it up forever if need be.

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SAAB needs too much work for too little return. Keep fostering SAAB's development overseas and just import various models for the states. Don't develop vehicles necessarily geared for the US-market. No one actually gives a crap in this country. Purists bitch about the cupholder opening counterclockwise instead of clockwise while the general public is apathetic.

Agreed.

All the more reason to sell them at Saturn stores.

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The Europeans:

1. Maybach: exit the market

2. Jaguar: Can't survive without the US market - needs a new owner.

3. Land Rover: go with Jag or die alone.

4. Maserati: exit the market, can't compete here now that it's split from Ferrari

5. Saab: see GM list

6. Volvo: see Ford list

7. VW: one more remake, then give up and exit the market if it fails

8. Audi: cozy up to Porsche or exit the market

9. Lotus: exit the market

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So here's my final list of those that should go now:

1. Mercury

2. Isuzu

3. Kia

4. Mitsubishi

5. Suzuki

6. Maybach

7. Maserati

8. Lotus

Those that likely should go:

1. VW

2. Infiniti - the weakest of the Japanese luxury makes

3. Jaguar - very weak sales and an ailing parent

4. Land Rover- see above

Thanks everyone for helping me formulate this list, now I have a question.

Can anyone tell me how many total sales the above brands represent in total?

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Hyundai

Kia

Mitsubishi

Acura

Scion

Land Rover

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Those that likely should go:

1. VW

2. Infiniti - the weakest of the Japanese luxury makes

3. Jaguar - very weak sales and an ailing parent

4. Land Rover- see above

Infiniti's line-up is well-rounded and stands up against the direct competition better than Acura. FWD/AWD sedans and two Crossovers don't make the most premium of line-ups... especially when the only true-luxury car you have is floundering. Also, Acura's target "luxury market" only spans from the $25k-$50k range (but be honest, who's paying full price for an RL?!? No one around here.)

So, I'd say the weakest luxury brand out of the Japanese is Acura.

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