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turbo200

Cadillac to Lutz: Stop with the mush

63 posts in this topic

STS and SRX are calling, they want thier eyes back

AND

Caddy: How bout a little more CTS and XLR [and Sixteen] and a LOT less STS!


My Design Analysis

The '07 Escalade without a doubt is beautiful. It is incredibly classy, elegant, and with an air of snobbery. But there's nothing shocking about it this time around. There's nothing that will make you stare at it for a while. Why are the headlights so round? Why are they shaped like an old Deville? Why don't they continue the lines that run through the fender? I think that might be my biggest problem with this design, and also the lack of much definition in the sides or rear. I saw like a million current Escalades right after seeing the new one, and there's something about that front end that still says aggression, tautness, and elegance in a high tech, imposing fashion. This has lost that "imposing" presence, I feel, I don't know, maybe different colors would make me feel differently about it. But these headlights, well, we are all too familiar with them already. They are exactly the same as the STS. So again, I am flipping my opinion, I went from slightly underwhelmed with the presence of the front end to ecstatic with the overall accomplishment of everything to now again slightly underwhelmed with the presence. There's nothing about it that seems intimidating and I think Cadillac will lose a huge market with the male rap stars. I really don't think it will sell as well as before. It's a tremendous redesign, but the presence of the 2nd gen Escalade, that robotic feel, that large imposing grille, those large imposing headlights that were so unlike anything seen before on an SUV, well that feel just isn't there anymore. They've almost femmed up the 'Slade mate. I don't know, maybe my opinion will change slightly later on. I hate to say this. The side profile shot especially to me shows the melted look, and it is defined, punctuated by those melted headlights. WTH?? Why did it have to go this way, why are they shaped so similarly to the Yukon's? From a side profile I bet the shape of the headlights of the Yukon would look exactly the same. This bothers me. There is no shock in A&S anymore. It might be a serious drawback now. Cadillacs have to be shocking. Shocking and beautiful and balls-in-your-face. They HAVE to be. It's the reason why so many purchased the CTS, because it was shocking and like nothing else!BMW, MB, even Lexus are all setting up for a distinctive fashion about thier cars, now is not the time to water down Caddys! This might hurt them. On the plus side, the interior looked great! :P :CG_all:

Pictures below, please feel free to disagree with me or show me where I am wrong.....I really want to love this design, a part of it leaves me cold.....

By the way, this is an exclusive :CG_all: :CG_all:

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Added: After seeing a picture of the SRX, I've noticed the headlights shape is exactly the same and that is possibly why I don't like this Escalade, I wanted and expected something different. Here's a shot of the SRX for comparison, sorry fot the clarity it's my camera phone


Posted Image Edited by turbo200
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the pearl color was great, I've always been a fan of it. No interior pics, sorry, I was trying to get out of there, and since it was closed up there was no real reason to take pictures of it. The leather sure looked nice though, and the interior looked even more upscale in person than in pictures. I do remember having the thought that the interior was more like what I would like to see in Buick or GMC or Saturn than in Cadillac though.
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I don't think it's as raw and in-you-face as the old design. But then again, the rapper-style thing has gotten old. Diddy and company have been donning Armani lately. This is an Escalade in a Prada Tuxedo. To be honest, even as a big fan of the raising spline-line, it's been co-opted by everybody from Mercedes to Honda. It may be time to move on from it.
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Hm, I think I know what it is:

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[post="42392"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Go sit in the corner, young man. :P
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I don't think it's as raw and in-you-face as the old design.  But then again, the rapper-style thing has gotten old.  Diddy and company have been donning Armani lately.  This is an Escalade in a Prada Tuxedo.

To be honest, even as a big fan of the raising spline-line, it's been co-opted by everybody from Mercedes to Honda.  It may be time to move on from it.

[post="42385"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


not sure what you mean by the raising spline-line, but as for it not being distinctive, well I have a problem with its feminity and lack of distinction. The Land Rover is not like nothing else, well except other Rovers, and clearly is a masculine looking truck. This is softer than the Rover and less distinctive, imo...
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The raising spline line I referred to is the distinct line from the trailing edge of the front bumper that passes through the doors and ends at the tailights. It was at it's purest form in the Evoq, CTS and XLR, and started getting watered down in the STS. Everybody is doing it now. As much as I think Cadillac does it best, in some cars it may be best to let it go. It is softer. It looks like it was thought of first, and not like it was a lot or chrome and leather thrown on an existing truck. Bu to me, it still looks like an Escalade. And I don't even like SUV's
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i wish the headlights were more crisp, but the front grille and lines running from it are really stunning... why are then fog/signal lamps stacked? my mom was very upset by this!!!
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I don't understand why GM didn't change the sheet metal between the 900 models. They did it for the 360's. It really helped the SAAB stand apart from the TrailBlazer. Their was a time that GM had completely differen't sheet metal from model to model and even year to year. And this was a time of less technology and less flexibilty. It's not that I don't like the Caddy, but that one atleast should have stood out from the others...and a different grill just don't cut it for me.
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LOTS OF NEW PICTURES OF THE 07 ESCALADE FROM AUTOSPIES

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...0&categoryId=21

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...9&categoryId=21

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...8&categoryId=21

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...7&categoryId=21

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...6&categoryId=21

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp...5&categoryId=21

[post="42417"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Holy pics, Batman! Thanks for those links. Nitpick alert: The rear climate control unit needs more style, as does the center stack up front. Choosing to run it out in the streets already shows just how close this is to coming out. How quickly will the reach the dealers? I'm betting they might begin showing up in late Jan...
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That crease that goes from the edge of the D-pillar down into the taillights is pretty cool, and now we know what the standard wheels look like. Ebony interior is much, much nicer than tan. All the materials look fine, and my beefs are limited to the unlock pull thing on the door panels and the non-matching trim on the passenger side dash. Overall, good job with the details, GM. I wonder if the storage compartments in the doors are carpeted.
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ya the standard wheels are ok, the non-nav system looks awful, the new flip down screen looks so much better because its lost all of that extra plastic, did you notice the key in the ignition looks just like the old key (you cant see the buttons but same two piece key)
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The interior in the Autospies pics freaking sweet. I'd definetly go for the ebony interior if I was buying one. There's a lot of pics of the interior without NAV too, and there is a lot of empty space but it doesn't look bad, IMO. I'm not sure about the exterior yet (I like it in black when you can see all the detail in the grill the best), so I'll have to see it in person to make a final judgement. EDIT: Some gripes I have with the interior after looking through all the autospies pics: - The overhead controls for the sunroof, rear seat control (flip and fold), and the rear liftgate look cheap, as does the light. That whole area looks cheap, but at least you don't have to look at it regularly. - Third row seat area looks cheap, mainly the "arm rest" area and cupholders (though there isn't much you can do back there I guess). - The climate and entertainment controls for the second row passengers look really bad. In the press pics it looked like there was wood around them but here it just looks like a big blob of plastic. It looks pretty good for the most part and the gripes are pretty minor, but it pains me that GM gets an interior so damn perfect only to leave out minor details that take away from it somewhat. How hard is it to make nice looking overhead controls and lights? Why must there be a big black blob of plastic for second row passengers' controls? I don't really know how you would fix the third row area, as I don't think any vehicle has nicely appointed leather and such on the "armrest" areas in the third row, so it's probably exusable.
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The interior in the Autospies pics freaking sweet. I'd definetly go for the ebony interior if I was buying one. There's a lot of pics of the interior without NAV too, and there is a lot of empty space but it doesn't look bad, IMO.

[post="42430"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]


Yep, the more I look at it, the more I approve of it. I still think it could be more Cadillac-looking, but OH YES, GM, YOU'VE MADE A PROPER INTERIOR! Honestly, I'm very happy for GM.
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The rear climate controls and center stack are awful...especially without the Nav...they could have done a whole hell of a lot better than all that black plastic...and the clock looks really cheesy and chintzy...but other than those, the interior looks pretty decent overall... Edited by Nick
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The rear climate controls and center stack are awful...especially without the Nav...they could have done a whole hell of a lot better than all that black plastic...

[post="42436"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Yeah, I was looking through all the pics and edited my post. In the press pics I thought it showed wood around the rear climate controls?

EDIT: Looking at the press pics again, it would appear that there wasn't wood there, I just thought there was and didn't pay close enough attention.
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Wow... the interior is GORGEOUS. Immediately I noticed 2 things that were going to be complained about by critics, and it seems people have beaten me to it here: the climate controls on the center stack--too jumbled. In the 2nd row, too generic... I can already see a comment like "Looks like it came out of a Cobalt" in a mag. But overall, the interior is just HOT as fucking hell! OMG, I love that interior!
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Am I the only one that is disappointed by the column mounted shifter? What a great opportunity to REALLY differentiate the Escalade interior. What am I missing?
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Am I the only one that is disappointed by the column mounted shifter? What a great opportunity to REALLY differentiate the Escalade interior.
What am I missing?

[post="42493"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]



I have been reading the various debates all week. Here are my comments and opinions:

Column shifter: To free up console space in the 7 and new S Class, this appears to be a new design direction for vehicles that will not offer a manual. I see your point from perceived sportiness and design, but is it really necessary in this type of vehicle where space and packaging are more important (and saves spending unnecessary cash). The interior is about as perfect as GM has gotten in recent memory.

Styling: I think the biggest question people should ask is, will Cadillac continue to sell 30k + Escalades a year with this vehicle. In my opinion, easily if the market segment holds.

Content: GM hit the head on the nail.

For those that do not like the new grill, get used to it. It is Cadillac's new signature grill. IMO, given realities, this is the best Cadillac yet and all the GMT900 utilities appear to be best in class and generate plenty of money for the General while continuing in changing peoples negative perceptions about the company.

Would I have prefered an Escalade that shares no metal with the other 900's and featured more distinctive sheetmetal, yes. Given what we got, and not a 100% rebadge or no Escalade, I will take this vehicle. And I think the market will have no problem agreeing with me.

This is by far the best vehicle GM has ever made and will show where they are going.

This vehicle is about the details, and by God, GM got the details right. That is by far the most important revelation about this vehicle and the rest of the 900s. Details, details, detail.........

The Sleeping Giant has awoke... now if they can stay in business. Edited by evok
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AMEN!!!!!


Turbo200 just BEAUTIFULLY summed it up.

The current Escalade, and Cadillac cars, while stylish and nice ARE NOT A&S and ARE NOT what Cadillac needs to stay ahead of the competitors.

I mean, the new Escalade has REALLY grown on me but it did need to be more distinctive and Lutz needs to stay the hell out of the Cadillac wing... Leave the curves and blobs for more timid and classic brands like Buick and Chevrolet.

As far as the interior is concerned.... I *STILL* think the Denali interior is better.
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Thanks for posting the AutoSpies pictures. The center stack without the nav looks horrible. The buttons and knobs in the Tahoe/Yukon look a lot better, too, because they have a chrome surround. I like how the wood flows through the center console to the bottom of the 2nd row climate controls, though they look cheap, too. I was really impressed with the interior in the press pics but my excitement has gone down a bit. Turbie hit the nail on the head. The front is the closest thing to A&S and even that looks somewhat melted down, as with the rest of the car. The Tahoe is the biggest improvement of the GMT900s and, IMO, is the whole package.
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Some thoughts: -The Black Escalade looks far and away the best of all the colors I've seen. It looks frickin amazing that color. It really makes the hint of chrome in the grille stand out. -The Ebony interior looks the best as well. I think the black interior doesnt bode well with the brighter shade of wood they put in it. They should have gone with a darker shade of wood for the black interior. -The design is still a bit jellybeanish, and I cant understand what would drive GM to not even differentiate the sheet metal from the Yukon if they did it so in the GMT-800s. It just doesnt make sense, at all. -The center stack looks crummy without the GPS. -Im starting to think that the new CTS, not the Escalade, will be one of General Motors most important vehicles in the next few years. Seeing as how the market is shifting, and better Chryslers (300) and foreigners (BMW 3 series, Audi A-4, VW Passat, etc.) are starting to be produced, the CTS, not the Escalade, will show exactly how important the consumer and quality is to Cadillac. I dont really care that the Escalade was watered down. It's a nice vehicle. Perfect for what it is. An upscale iconic truck, made for 22 inch wheels and driving to front row seats at a ballpark. The CTS is different. Anyone from a company exec to an average joe can look into one, for different reasons. That car is where my hope for Caddy, and GM lie. If that car doesn't come through, flawlessly, then I'll throw my arms up in the air. They have time to produce it. If it gets watered down and looks like a damn A4...
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