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New Buick to be called LaCrosse, has been butchered.


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Looks boring, Accord style headlights with 5-series ripoff tail lights. The interior is similar shape to a Malibu LTZ but only a mild upgrade from it, the Lincoln MKZ is nicer than the new LaCrosse. Plus the new MKZ comes out before this and will have some upgrades.

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Don't get me wrong, I like it. But what happened to the concept? It's so warmed over...

The grille? Keep the more-aggressive chrome grille... it looked nice! the faux wood, well, damn.

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Unlike the concept images, this photo, as it is, to me doesn't look very exciting - like a refresh of a plain car, which will not help Buick at all. With that grille and those rims and wheel size, it doesn't say "luxury" or "premium" to me.

Compare the "spy" photo to the Concept Vehicle. Subtle, but very real differences (in my opinion, just like how they watered down / dumbed down the Pontiac G6.)

I thought that someone claimed it could only be called "LaCrosse" if it were built in Oshawa; the assembly plant for this vehicle has been given as Fairfax, Kansas, right?

What kind of game has GM been playing then, when Rick Wagoner referred to this as an (unnamed) Buick sedan? I never read a single post asking for the LaCrosse name to be retained. Can't GM listen to the public?

So, to sum up my feelings at the moment:

:cussing:

Edited by wildcat
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WOW!!!

What an ugly, generic looking S.O.B.

But hey, what else would one expect from GME?

Man alive... Did they just bolt the ass of an Avalon/BMW on there or what? I mean, I know both the Germans and Japan Inc. had been aspiring to become Buick (even as the press ridicules Buick, yet doesn't bat an eye at the ugly, generic foreigners) but really?

That's sad... Especially since the concept was so awesome.

But alas, same GM, same mistakes.... Buick concepts have ALWAYS been show stoppers (Better than both Cadillac and Chevy) and their production cars have always benn plane-jain watered down to nothing.

Edited by FUTURE_OF_GM
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Looks boring, Accord style headlights with 5-series ripoff tail lights. The interior is similar shape to a Malibu LTZ but only a mild upgrade from it, the Lincoln MKZ is nicer than the new LaCrosse. Plus the new MKZ comes out before this and will have some upgrades.

Yep... Same "Accord style" headlights that can be also found on the new Cruze, the new Aura, the new Insignia and pretty much anything else from GME.

I remember when everyone (including me) bitched about how similar and BLAND the G6 and Cobalt were when they launched together. I guess history will repeat itself.

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Aside from no chrome on the grill and smaller wheels, I'm not seeing what's so different.

The interior still looks good...

FWIW, I'm sure the higher trim levels will still have all of the 'extras' (At least I hope, since that is all that will save this car from being another Century)

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The more I think about it, the more that silver spy photo looks like some generic rental car...

not a premium, luxurious, stylish new Buick.

:censored:

Get used to it my friend...

Saturn killed Oldsmobile, and now has apparently now successfully paralyzed Pontiac to its death. Didn't any of you Buick fans realize that Buick is next in the battle of brands? CPF has already said that he has no use for the division.

MARK MY WORDS: The Saturn Aura, despite having less sales, less name recognition and less prestige (even to the average customer) will debut NICER than the Buick whatever-it-is-to-be-called. This will be for 2 reasons; 1) GM thinks it can get a higher price for the Saturn since it "has no baggage" and 2) Saturn is dieing to claim it's spot right under Cadillac as GM's middle brand.

I hate to say it, but I envision a day in which GM consists of Chevrolet, Saturn and Saab if management keeps playing the cards like this. The ONLY reason Chevrolet will survive is 1) because of its size and 2) because the 'blue bloods' at GME don't want their brands peddling Daewoo junk. Cadillac will turn into what Lincoln is today, (From the looks of product plans) except it'll be held to a higher standard, and eventually be laughed out of existence.

Edited by FUTURE_OF_GM
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This car looks generic, much like the current Buick sedans that have almost disappeared in the market place. I bet this car bases around $25k, more than the current LaCrosse, but less than the Lucerne. $25k is a Malibu LTZ, so I'd expect a slightly better interior and a DI or turbo 4 with the V6 optional, but cheaper wheels and cloth seats standard to keep production costs down. Plus if they sell it for $26-27k, they can sell it to the rental car agencies to rent as a "premium car" like they do with Chrysler 300s.

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This car looks generic, much like the current Buick sedans that have almost disappeared in the market place. I bet this car bases around $25k, more than the current LaCrosse, but less than the Lucerne. $25k is a Malibu LTZ, so I'd expect a slightly better interior and a DI or turbo 4 with the V6 optional, but cheaper wheels and cloth seats standard to keep production costs down. Plus if they sell it for $26-27k, they can sell it to the rental car agencies to rent as a "premium car" like they do with Chrysler 300s.

Well, rental cars are one of GM's strengths. They keep Avis, Enterprise, and Alamo rolling..

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This is what I expected, GM makes bland sedans that compete with each other. Two years ago I thought they should kill Buick and Saab off and divert those resources to Cadillac. Now Buick and Saab sales are down 50% and Cadillac is getting models cut due to lack of funds.

GM is being stupid with Saturn. They tried to take an econo-car brand up market, and did it with products that have similar materials and features as run of the mill Chevys. Saturn was like the Kia of the 90s, and all of a sudden they think it can get a premium price? At least Hyundai with the Genesis put a lot of development into the car and made a good product, and they still have the lower end cars that they always had.

Cadillac is on the path to become Lincoln, a new Impala could replace the Buick sedans, Pontiacs and GMCs are rebadges anyway. I could see a cash strapped GM one day being Chevy-Saturn-Cadillac, much like Ford-Mercury-Lincoln. And Saturn will still suck.

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Well since most people cut back on rentals, except Chrysler, there is a demand for rental cars, that Pontiac and Buick seem eager to fill.

What's sad is that Century in the picture was sold until 2004. A 1994 BMW or Lexus looks more modern than that.

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Looks like a hopelessly generic Kia/Hyundai product.

The main thing I didn't like on the concept was the side crease, which is horribly cheap looking. Even the hood vents weren't bad. The concept looked pretty damn good actually. What happened? This production vehicle carries absolutely none of the feeling that the concept did. Perhaps it is just the angle and picture, but I think not.

Did I mention the side crease looks bad? The one thing they could have changed from the concept and they didn't. :toiletpaper:

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I thought that someone claimed it could only be called "LaCrosse" if it were built in Oshawa; the assembly plant for this vehicle has been given as Fairfax, Kansas, right?

Oshawa owns the rights to Regal and Impala... not LaCrosse.

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Looks like a hopelessly generic Kia/Hyundai product.

The main thing I didn't like on the concept was the side crease, which is horribly cheap looking.

Did I mention the side crease looks bad? The one thing they could have changed from the concept and they didn't. :toiletpaper:

The whole point of the side crease was to make it look Buickish (i.e. Buicks have had side creases like that in the past). Without the character line, it would like just another midsize generic.

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>>"They keep Avis, Enterprise, and Alamo rolling.."<<

Enterprise by me is 100% nissan & toyopet.

>>"What's sad is that Century in the picture was sold until 2004. A 1994 BMW or Lexus looks more modern than that. "<<

a 1994 bmw looks exactly like a 1968 bmw; in other words- decades older.

>>"The main thing I didn't like on the concept was the side crease, which is horribly cheap looking. "<<

How are you coping with the accord's horribly cheap looking side crease?? Or are you referring to that as a scrape or dent?

>>"Oshawa owns the rights to Regal and Impala"<<

I struggle to think of a more absurd scenario- a location owning a trademarked name instead of the legal coporation that created it.

The Buick in this awful spy shot looks awful in comparison to the awesome concept. Invisible. I do think a lot of it is the pic itself, but I'm not holding my breath on the real thing anymore.

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>>"They keep Avis, Enterprise, and Alamo rolling.."<<

Enterprise by me is 100% nissan & toyopet.

Toyopet hasn't been in the US since the '50s...they are renting old cars? :)

>>"What's sad is that Century in the picture was sold until 2004. A 1994 BMW or Lexus looks more modern than that. "<<

a 1994 bmw looks exactly like a 1968 bmw; in other words- decades older.

You are exaggerating. A '94 BMW has some styling cues in common with the '68, but totally different and modern.

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To me, the photos are still too grainy to pass any final overall judgements about the car. I want to see some clear images from different angles before I label it as a success or failure. It do think it looks somewhat diluted from the Invicta Concept (which was to be expected), but I also think it looks much better than the current LaCrosse (which wouldn't be hard to do).

I do have some preliminary suggestions for Buick about this car based on the grainy picture:

1) The grille needs some type of metallic finish. The black finish on the grille just makes it look cheap.

2) The car needs some fog lights; it would look much more upscale with them. That is one of the major gripes I have about Buick and Cadillac; fog lights should be standard equipment on products that are supposed to be luxury vehicles.

3) Chrome door handles would also be a nice, upscale touch. Again, Buick is supposed to be a luxury brand; make it look like one.

4) Lose the dorky "LaCrosse" name. That car has essentially been a loser for the brand; why use it on a car that is supposed to signal the renaissance of the brand? Buick has a wealth of historic names that would be better suited to this car than continuing with the lame "LaCrosse" name.

Other than that, I am going to leave it alone until clearer pictures are shown that really give a better indication of the overall execution of the design.

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I understand a lot of people's disappointment, but this is probably a Chinese-spec lower trim level. We don't know enough about the car in the pic to know for sure. Also, the exterior front pic is of terrible quality. Combine that with a silver color that washes out all the body character lines & brightwork and you have an almost worthless, but definitely damaging, spy pic of an unreleased vehicle.

I'm not disappointed by the overall understated look of the car. It's very similar to how the Enclave is understated. If I wanted "a lot of flash" like the CTS, I'd buy a CTS.

I recommend many should wait until official pics are released (and hopefully in a different color) before bashing GM, GME, God, etc. As much as some people want to "focus" on certain things possibly wrong with the car, there are many things intact from the concept that are exactly right.

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Lose the dorky "LaCrosse" name. That car has essentially been a loser for the brand; why use it on a car that is supposed to signal the renaissance of the brand? Buick has a wealth of historic names that would be better suited to this car than continuing with the lame "LaCrosse" name.

GM (or GME), are you listening?

:hissyfit:

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Toyopet hasn't been in the US since the '50s...they are renting old cars? :)

'toyopet' is what we here often call toyota, you know- in a derogatory, dismissive manner... not unlike someone who would take every single, solitary opportunity to dismiss a brand as existing solely to be whored out only as a rental. Same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over..........

:)

You are exaggerating. A '94 BMW has some styling cues in common with the '68, but totally different and modern.

"totally different"? You must be high, sir.

1968:

bmw75_6.jpg

1994:

530i1.jpg

Same damned, reguritated, tired, worn-out, boring, predictable, design. This is a longer design run than the '68-82 Corvette !! 4 round lights, horizontal plastic grille, pig nostrils, bland sheetmetal (actually, at least the '68 has some interest & flair to it). Even the hood emblem is in the exact same spot, twenty-five f@#king years later. It never changes (well, until it got Bangled). I hope to hell (like I care) bmw didn't pay any sort of design staff all those years, for what ??? Sure wasn't for interior design.

You still consider quad circular headlights 'modern' in 1994??

Same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over..........

:P

Edited by balthazar
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"totally different"? You must be high, sir.

Just calling out your BS..

Same damned, reguritated, tired, worn-out, boring, predictable, design. This is a longer design run than the '68-82 Corvette !! 4 round lights, horizontal plastic grille, pig nostrils, bland sheetmetal (actually, at least the '68 has some interest & flair to it). Even the hood emblem is in the exact same spot, twenty-five f@#king years later. It never changes (well, until it got Bangled). I hope to hell (like I care) bmw didn't pay any sort of design staff all those years, for what ??? Sure wasn't for interior design.

You still consider quad circular headlights 'modern' in 1994??

Same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over..........

:P

Round headlights were certainly nicer than the ugly flush headlights that were the rage then... the grille, badging, etc are design cues carried on through time over multiple generations. The '68-82 Corvette was the same car with updates, BMW's '94 models were not updated '68s.

Mid '90s BMWs are certainly nicer and better designed than the forgettable FWD generics GM was churning out at the time. Face it, the '90s GM products were by and large forgettable crap.

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>>"BMW's '94 models were not updated '68s."<<

Then, that's even a more sad scenario, isn't it? Total redesigns (multiple?) to produce... the same car visually. Imagine if GM redesigned the '68 Nova multiple times in 15 years and all it came away with visually by 1994 was molded plastic bumpers ?? Oh, the knashing of teeth & the tearing of hair that would ensue !!!! Look at what we already have with the W-Body "rebadges" :rolleyes:

>>"Face it, the '90s GM products were by and large forgettable crap."<<

The entire 1980s and 1990s were by & large forgettable crap. These era cars will never reach even a fraction of the collectibility or following or value of vintage American vehicles. Face it yourself.

Edited by balthazar
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>>"Face it, the '90s GM products were by and large forgettable crap."<<

The entire 1980s and 1990s were by & large forgettable crap. These era cars will never reach even a fraction of the collectibility or following or value of vintage American vehicles. Face it yourself.

Whatever, that's neither here nor there..what's more important is what GM is going to building in the next decade...can they overcome what 25+ years of mediocrity has done to them?

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I understand a lot of people's disappointment, but this is probably a Chinese-spec lower trim level. We don't know enough about the car in the pic to know for sure. Also, the exterior front pic is of terrible quality. Combine that with a silver color that washes out all the body character lines & brightwork and you have an almost worthless, but definitely damaging, spy pic of an unreleased vehicle.

I'm not disappointed by the overall understated look of the car. It's very similar to how the Enclave is understated. If I wanted "a lot of flash" like the CTS, I'd buy a CTS.

I recommend many should wait until official pics are released (and hopefully in a different color) before bashing GM, GME, God, etc. As much as some people want to "focus" on certain things possibly wrong with the car, there are many things intact from the concept that are exactly right.

I agree with you about a lot of items in your post. You are spot on in what you said above. I appreciate your realistic, down-to-earth viewpoints on this article.

First, the hate-fest on this car seems a little premature. It's a grainy picture without any accompanying info. Final judgements about the car need to be reserved until clearer photos and additional info becomes available. If anyone expects this car to be an exact reproduction of the Invicta Concept, then they are only fooling themselves.

Second, it's a Buick; it will not have an edgy design. That's not Buick's purpose. Buick represents casual luxury; their products are supposed to be understated and elegant (the Enclave was a perfect example). Cadillac is supposed to be the edgy luxury brand with "flashy" designs. This is what sets Buick and Cadillac apart (I would still like to see the 2 brands combined to form the luxury dealer network, but that is another issue).

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Those spy shots of the white NG LaCrosse (oh GM, why?) looked much better than this thing in silver. Those spy shots of the dark blue NG LaCrosse (I have to write that name twice in the same thread?) had a black grille, too, and it looked bad.

Listen to me, GM (GME)... and this is NOT nostalgia talking... Invicta is a hell-of-a-better name than LaCrosse.

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If anyone expects this car to be an exact reproduction of the Invicta Concept, then they are only fooling themselves.

Then don't show me a concept that GM can't or won't build.

Some use the term "understated," but Buick doesn't have to be boring. Stylish! Beautiful! Remember... "Drive Beautiful"?

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Bob Lutz needs to go. He was good for getting some great interiors back to GM and making panel gaps smaller with sheetmetal but this man is so out of touch with what's hot design-wise, it's pathetic. And this new Lacrosse is just the latest example of that.

You know what I'd do? I'd slap a Buick grill on the new Insignia and make it the new Lacrosse. Like everyone has said, this new Lacrosse is bloated and generic.

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First, the hate-fest on this car seems a little premature. It's a grainy picture without any accompanying info. Final judgements about the car need to be reserved until clearer photos and additional info becomes available. If anyone expects this car to be an exact reproduction of the Invicta Concept, then they are only fooling themselves.

To me it looks very close to the concept...very similar grille and headlight treatment, same taillight treatment, same side sculpting...the front fascia is a bit different and the greenhouse differs wrt to window framing. The small wheels on the 'production' version in the pics are underwhelming. Aspects I don't really care for that I did notice about both the concept and the 'production' version (if that is what it is) are the stubby front and rear, and the vertical tallness/thickness of the body relative to the greenhouse size...those seem to be current design trends that many automakers use.

Edited by moltar
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How could GM ever delay the Insignia coming here as a Saturn because it was "too close" to the Buick (Invicta - I refuse to say LaCrosse)? Or did they mean strictly the interior, 'cause they sure couldn't mean the exterior.

:glare: Oh wait, here's a new memo...

"NG LaCrosse delayed - GM says 'Too Close to '94 Buick Century'"

:fiery:

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How could GM ever delay the Insignia coming here as a Saturn because it was "too close" to the Buick (Invicta - I refuse to say LaCrosse)? Or did they mean strictly the interior, 'cause they sure couldn't mean the exterior.

:glare: Oh wait, here's a new memo...

"NG LaCrosse delayed - GM says 'Too Close to '94 Buick Century'"

:fiery:

Yeah, I didn't see any real resemblance between the Insignia and the Buick concept other than the dimensions and a bit of a similarity in the greenhouse. The Insignia is the nicest looking of the new GM FWDers, IMHO, esp. the hatchback (why can't we get a midsize hatchback in the US??)

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Wow, what a total letdown. After the transition the Enclave had from concept to production, I had high hopes GM was finally getting it right for Buick. The Enclave concept was a beautifully crafted crossover from front to back and it is just as beautiful in production form. So what the f@#k happened between the transition from Invicta to LaCrosse? GM pull your heads out of your asses, the truck market is dying, your cars NEED to be knockouts...this sorry sack of &#036;h&#33; is nowhere near being a knockout.

Granted the picture quality is low grade, and the interior seems to be fairly close to the concept's, but the exterior seems to have totally lost it's flair...and holy Lexus ass Batman....

Edited by Delta Force79
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Looks like the concept to me, given the bad lighting. As for the name, not even C&D said GM has confirmed it will stay "LaCrosse". They are just calling it LaCrosse themselves, fair enough as GM has not announced the name of the NG sedan.

I agree that it looks very similar to the concept. The photo is poor quality with the hood popped, so I would wait for more shots. This weird hating on gme is also quite strange.

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As for the name, not even C&D said GM has confirmed it will stay "LaCrosse". They are just calling it LaCrosse themselves, fair enough as GM has not announced the name of the NG sedan.

True, but the badging on the silver car in the spy shot does say "LaCrosse." Hopefully, GM is having second thoughts.

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It looks small to me, like the Buick version of the Chevy Cruze. Even the headlights and hood look the same. Are we sure this is the Epsilon II car?

I just keep hoping that this is not the "game-changing" Buick that BL promised.

I'll grab my 2011 Camaro SS convertible and say B-Bye to any hope of GM surviving.

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It looks small to me, like the Buick version of the Chevy Cruze. Even the headlights and hood look the same. Are we sure this is the Epsilon II car?

I think it's supposed to be larger than the current Malibu (Epsilon I).

I just keep hoping that this is not the "game-changing" Buick that BL promised.

I'm not sure what game they are trying to change, but it looks like it is competitive against the Avalon and Sable.

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Same damned, reguritated, tired, worn-out, boring, predictable, design. This is a longer design run than the '68-82 Corvette !! 4 round lights, horizontal plastic grille, pig nostrils, bland sheetmetal (actually, at least the '68 has some interest & flair to it). Even the hood emblem is in the exact same spot, twenty-five f@#king years later. It never changes (well, until it got Bangled). I hope to hell (like I care) bmw didn't pay any sort of design staff all those years, for what ??? Sure wasn't for interior design.

You still consider quad circular headlights 'modern' in 1994??

Same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over..........

:P

But it's okay man... Because it's a (cue angel choir) BMW!

Edited by FUTURE_OF_GM
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Second, it's a Buick; it will not have an edgy design. That's not Buick's purpose. Buick represents casual luxury; their products are supposed to be understated and elegant (the Enclave was a perfect example). Cadillac is supposed to be the edgy luxury brand with "flashy" designs. This is what sets Buick and Cadillac apart (I would still like to see the 2 brands combined to form the luxury dealer network, but that is another issue).

Sure, the picture is grainy. But if anyone here thinks this car is even remotely up to Enclave standards, then I'd like some of what they're smoking.

Even if the picture sucks, the disparity is already too big.

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To me it looks very close to the concept...very similar grille and headlight treatment, same taillight treatment, same side sculpting...the front fascia is a bit different and the greenhouse differs wrt to window framing. The small wheels on the 'production' version in the pics are underwhelming. Aspects I don't really care for that I did notice about both the concept and the 'production' version (if that is what it is) are the stubby front and rear, and the vertical tallness/thickness of the body relative to the greenhouse size...those seem to be current design trends that many automakers use.

Fair enough... But as with the G6 of yore, the details that were LOST from concept to production are what made the car appealing in the first place.

The devil is in the details... Especially on a design that is this generic to begin with (The Invicta was a nice concept, but even it was a bit generic).

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I can't see this car having better sales than the current car, although it will be more expensive and hopefully more profitable. I also thought of the G6 comparison when I saw this car.

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It also looks like a base model maybe a model that road a little lower with better wheels/trim would be better.

I think this might be a base trim model for the Chinese market (I think someone else suggested this in an earlier post). I just wonder if Buick has to cover a little more of the mainstream segment there with some of their lower trim levels than it does here in the States (after all, they do have a rebadged Suzuki Forenza in their lineup over there). Some of the front details just don't quite match the camouflaged cars I have previously seen. I think if they gave this car a grille and headlight treatment that was a little more similar to the Invicta Concept, a front bumper with foglights that was similar to one on the Lucerne Super, wheels that were a little larger and more similar in design to the Invicta Concept, and some chromed door handles, then we would be in business. If the cheapened details were addressed and cleaned up, it would actually be a nice looking car. I'm not going to give up on it until clearer official pictures of the U.S. version are released.

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It looks dated already, a car that would not lower the age of their buying demographic one bit. I hope this is not the real deal.

I disagree on both points... this car doesn't look dated at all considering the overhangs are very short and the interior is probably competitive with the newly remodeled Acura TL. BTW... Buick's buying age has already lowered into the 50's.

As for those who say it doesn't look like a Buick, let's just add a foot overhang to the front and back, oval/square formal upright grille, hood ornament, canvas roof, wire wheels, bench seat, and velour upholstery so all of you will recognize it even though you never intended to buy one in the first place. <_<

Sure, the picture is grainy. But if anyone here thinks this car is even remotely up to Enclave standards, then I'd like some of what they're smoking.

Even if the picture sucks, the disparity is already too big.

FOG... The picture doesn't show details... you can't tell if the door handles are chrome or body colored. You can't even see the chrome strip along the rocker panel. You can barely make out an incomplete sweepspear-inspired crease. You definitely can't make out the headlights and grille. They're just blurs.

The decent shot of the rear leads me to believe this car will appear more upscale than the current LaCrosse or Lucerne. The interior appears completely intact. That's where the Enclave comparisons are justified. GMNA needs better cars and more of them... many more. This is one of them.

WOW!!!

What an ugly, generic looking S.O.B.

But hey, what else would one expect from GME?

GME is in charge of Epsilon and now, according to PCS, MOST of GMNA.

(I know, I know :rolleyes: But whatever)

Give the GME hate a rest. At least keep it out of the Buick forum. You can say and do all you want in the Pontiac Forum which has turned into nothing but hate topic after hate topic about GME... Nothing but a pure bash-fest.

I won't allow that to poison the Buick Forum also.

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I disagree on both points... this car doesn't look dated at all considering the overhangs are very short and the interior is probably competitive with the newly remodeled Acura TL. BTW... Buick's buying age has already lowered into the 50's.

As for those who say it doesn't look like a Buick, let's just add a foot overhang to the front and back, oval/square formal upright grille, hood ornament, canvas roof, wire wheels, bench seat, and velour upholstery so all of you will recognize it even though you never intended to buy one in the first place. <_<

FOG... The picture doesn't show details... you can't tell if the door handles are chrome or body colored. You can't even see the chrome strip along the rocker panel. You can barely make out an incomplete sweepspear-inspired crease. You definitely can't make out the headlights and grille. They're just blurs.

The decent shot of the rear leads me to believe this car will appear more upscale than the current LaCrosse or Lucerne. The interior appears completely intact. That's where the Enclave comparisons are justified. GMNA needs better cars and more of them... many more. This is one of them.

Give the GME hate a rest. At least keep it out of the Buick forum. You can say and do all you want in the Pontiac Forum which has turned into nothing but hate topic after hate topic about GME... Nothing but a pure bash-fest.

I won't allow that to poison the Buick Forum also.

So you're going to tell me to omit my opinion because you don't like it and are the almighty admin of the Buick forum?

Okay...

I'll leave it at that.

Edited by FUTURE_OF_GM
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One thing that's cool.. electronic parking brake.

One thing I can't stand... the numbers in the speedo/tachometer... I hate when they go around the circle at different angles... I prefer all my numbers to be upright/vertical.

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So you're going to tell me to omit my opinion because you don't like it and are the almighty admin of the Buick forum?

Okay...

I'll leave it at that.

Whatever... This topic is about the LaCrosse replacement... twist it as you may for your own vendetta, but this car will not be sold in Europe and was designed by US and Chinese design centers... so how is GME responsible again?????!!!!! There's a difference between platform engineering and styling/design.

The story of GM's Chinese-based design team is certainly a rags to riches one that will culminate in the next few years with PATAC's designing the world's next Buick LaCrosse, due out in 2008 or 2009. As is the custom at GM these days, design chief Ed Welburn pitted his 11 design centers from around the world against each other for the privilege of penning the next LaCrosse. The favored North American team and the underdog Chinese team were clear favorites with the majority of good ideas, so Welburn chose to have both work on the design. The North American team will handle the exterior, while the smaller Chinese team will design the interior. The Chinese designers, though, will also have significant input on the car's exterior since it's expected that China will quickly be Buick's biggest market worldwide.

If I'm suppressing your hate soooo much, just start a topic (well... another topic) dedicated to bashing GME and everything about it... but the styling of the car in the spy pic (which is what this topic is about) has nothing to do with GME. That so-called ugly generic SOB is the fault of American designers.

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>>"One thing that's cool.. electronic parking brake."<<

Why, exactly, is this 'cool' ?

I hate the big brake pedal you have to lift your left leg up high (I have long legs) to engage, and the hand brake usually takes up a lot of space in the console area.

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I hate the big brake pedal you have to lift your left leg up high (I have long legs) to engage, and the hand brake usually takes up a lot of space in the console area.

Yes, electric parking brakes are indeed a big improvement. In manuals they keep you from rolling backwards on hills.

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Lord almighty... what a sad, anti-climactic product launch.

GM might as well put a pillow over Buicks' face in th middle of the night. <_<

Like Moltar said though, what did we epect styling wise when it's just

another FWD cookie cutter POS. The fact that Buick is not getting

any products off zeta, not even one... it's disgusting.

GM should be ashamed. :angry:

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Look, this car is light-years better than the LaCrosse we have now. Was I expecting something more dramatic? More daring? Yes.

I understand Buick has to appeal to two continents now, and I understand they had to take their time changing products over as to not lose their customers, but this is a bit slower than I had anticipated. The fact of the matter is, this is our last Buick sedan for a while. The Lucerne's replacement was cancelled, so no major changes there. The most I could imagine is a dramatic refresh of the existing Lucerne (which I'll hope for).

Do I like this Buick? Yes. Would I buy one? If it's in my budget, absolutely.

I'm going to wait until I see high-quality production pictures and read specs before I make my final judgment.

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>>"I hate the big brake pedal you have to lift your left leg up high (I have long legs) to engage, and the hand brake usually takes up a lot of space in the console area."<<

So there's no more console parking brake handle w/ EB? That's worth it right there, perhaps.

Foot parking brakes are perfectly fine with me. Instead of adding needlessly complicated electronics to a simple mechanical assembly, engineers should design a system where the pedal travel is 'geared up' and thusly doesn't have to move as far. Simple and never burns out.

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>>"I hate the big brake pedal you have to lift your left leg up high (I have long legs) to engage, and the hand brake usually takes up a lot of space in the console area."<<

So there's no more console parking brake handle w/ EB? That's worth it right there, perhaps.

Foot parking brakes are perfectly fine with me. Instead of adding needlessly complicated electronics to a simple mechanical assembly, engineers should design a system where the pedal travel is 'geared up' and thusly doesn't have to move as far. Simple and never burns out.

Foot parking brakes with a hand release are ok, but the ones that don't have one are a pain to use if you are parked on a hill w/ a manual..(though I normally never park on a hill).

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Look, this car is light-years better than the LaCrosse we have now. Was I expecting something more dramatic? More daring? Yes.

I understand Buick has to appeal to two continents now, and I understand they had to take their time changing products over as to not lose their customers, but this is a bit slower than I had anticipated. The fact of the matter is, this is our last Buick sedan for a while. The Lucerne's replacement was cancelled, so no major changes there. The most I could imagine is a dramatic refresh of the existing Lucerne (which I'll hope for).

I haven't heard if G-platform production has been extended. As far as my knowledge it hasn't. Hamtramck has product already pending to replace the G-Platform... one of them being the VOLT. The chances of the Lucerne living past 2010/2011 are slim to none at the moment.

In a way, this car replaces both the Lucerne & LaCrosse... and in a way it doesn't. This vehicle is in an entirely different class. It's a near-luxury midsize sedan. It'll replace the Lucerne in form of technology, features, and sophistication... it'll replace the LaCrosse in size. It will more than likely overlap both of them in price.

I still have reason to expect another sedan to debut shortly after the demise of Lucerne, but for it to be smaller than the Invicta/LaCrosse... not larger.

Don’t forget, they’re already working on the next gen Enclave too.

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So the Lucerne and DTS are dead? If GM is getting out of this segment all together that is stupid. But reading between the lines would make one assume so since the Zeta Buick and Caddy are dead. So what is left a very large Ep based sedan? I can only hope and it better have a V8.

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I was never in favor of a Zeta Impala no matter how cool it could be. But Pontiac needed the G8 a no brainer, Buick a Park Ave even if they import the one made for China so be it. (They get our Enclave can't we have there PA?) Caddillac didn't need one with the STS just a revamped verison of that in a few years would be nice. Then keep the large FWD DTS/Lucerne and give them the redesign then need on a new/well updated platform weather it be the EP II (a longer verison) or the a new G.

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So the Lucerne and DTS are dead? If GM is getting out of this segment all together that is stupid. But reading between the lines would make one assume so since the Zeta Buick and Caddy are dead. So what is left a very large Ep based sedan? I can only hope and it better have a V8.

Why put a V8 in a front drive car? 275 hp is about the limit to front drive cars without massive torque steer, they can get 300 hp from a V6, no need for a V8 in anything front drive. Plus the heavier engine messes up the already bad weight balance.