Jump to content

New 2010 LaCrosse pictures


Recommended Posts

Very good show. Much better than the grainy pics that everyone whined over.

Regarding exterior details, it definitely appears there will be at least two powertrains. Some have dual exhaust and some don’t. I do like how the dual exhaust is integrated into the rear bumper.

Looks good in red. The interior looks very nice. Glad to see adjustable rear seat headrests.

If they're looking for the LaCrosse to compete with the MKS then the LaCrosse is bigger than we expect. I can see why the Regal would be appropriate to slot underneath the LaCrosse. The Regal will probably be the size of the MKZ.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Very good show. Much better than the grainy pics that everyone whined over.

Regarding exterior details, it definitely appears there will be at least two powertrains. Some have dual exhaust and some don’t. I do like how the dual exhaust is integrated into the rear bumper.

Looks good in red. The interior looks very nice. Glad to see adjustable rear seat headrests.

If they're looking for the LaCrosse to compete with the MKS then the LaCrosse is bigger than we expect. I can see why the Regal would be appropriate to slot underneath the LaCrosse. The Regal will probably be the size of the MKZ.

+1 :smilewide:

I think Buick might have another hit on their hands to followup the Enclave. This car looks great. I can't wait to see the full reveal. I still don't like the "LaCrosse" name, but I can overlook it if Buick nails everything else on this car. If Buick also receives the Insignia based Regal, they would have an excellent 3 vehicle lineup (Enclave, LWB Eps II LaCrosse, SWB Eps II Regal).

Link to post
Share on other sites

Very similar dash shape to the Malibu, the top end version could compete with a bottom end ES350, but people are willing to pay for the "L" on the front of the car so all things being equal most would pick a Lexus over this, so this better be better. The 2010 MKZ has a new interior that is nice, plus has the 340 hp ecoboost coming, the MKS is nicer than this car. Although the Hyundai Genesis kills them all, I sat in a Genesis a couple days ago, the interior is really good, blows away STS, DTS or anything form Lincoln or Buick.

I do like the exhaust pipes integrated into the bumper, but they just copied that from Lexus. Buick needs more originality, (as does the Genesis) and less trying to make a car look like a Lexus. Lexus doesn't even make 1 car that is well styled, why copy them?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Truly looks like an American Lexus. The LS wants its tailpipes back.

The interior looks very good, exterior is pretty good but nothing spectacular, pretty much like a Lexus. Looks like there's an MKS, E-Class, and Passat (?) in one of the pics testing with it.

If priced right, I could see my dad buying one of these.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Very similar dash shape to the Malibu, the top end version could compete with a bottom end ES350, but people are willing to pay for the "L" on the front of the car so all things being equal most would pick a Lexus over this, so this better be better. The 2010 MKZ has a new interior that is nice, plus has the 340 hp ecoboost coming, the MKS is nicer than this car. Although the Hyundai Genesis kills them all, I sat in a Genesis a couple days ago, the interior is really good, blows away STS, DTS or anything form Lincoln or Buick.

I do like the exhaust pipes integrated into the bumper, but they just copied that from Lexus. Buick needs more originality, (as does the Genesis) and less trying to make a car look like a Lexus. Lexus doesn't even make 1 car that is well styled, why copy them?

1. If you say the dash looks similar to teh Malibu again I will hurt you. You are blind. Please do not say it again.

2. Lexus was not the first company to do integrated exhausts.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Gauges look very Lincoln to me. Like the leather-stitched dash. Interior looks very nice. I would love to see it finished and in beige too.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Aimed squarely at the MKs, ES, and GS

Sorry.

I just don't see a Malibu-based LaCrosse even remotely competing with MKS or ES and GS......

This looks to me to be more of a Camry XLE, (maybe) Avalon, or the Fusion-based Lincoln (I can't keep the f@#king Lincoln names straight......stupid-ass Ford....) competitor.

Buick simply isn't in the same league to compete with Lexus or (gasp) even Lincoln. They had the potential.....but squandered it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry.

I just don't see a Malibu-based LaCrosse even remotely competing with MKS or ES and GS......

If your opinion is strictly based on platform sharing, then why can't a NG-Malibu-based Buick LaCrosse compete against a Ford Taurus-based Lincoln MKs and a Toyota Camry-based Lexus ES350?

And BTW... the current Malibu LTZ already competes well with the Camry XLE. It doesn't have all the available options, but interior quality and design are fine. The NG LaCrosse appears to exceed both of those by far. I’m sure available options will also.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say, I love it. I'd be very proud to be in this.

I found out it was the school nurse who bought the Enclave. She's extremely happy with it.

Now I'd have to get myself a new LaCrosse so I could turn some heads and bring the word "Buick" back in peoples' vocabularies.

Link to post
Share on other sites
If your opinion is strictly based on platform sharing, then why can't a NG-Malibu-based Buick LaCrosse compete against a Ford Taurus-based Lincoln MKs and a Toyota Camry-based Lexus ES350?

And BTW... the current Malibu LTZ already competes well with the Camry XLE. It doesn't have all the available options, but interior quality and design are fine. The NG LaCrosse appears to exceed both of those by far. I’m sure available options will also.

I just don't think it will be big enough (especially in width) to compete with the Lincoln......and I know it won't be expensive enough either.....hell a Lucerne Super isn't even close to a loaded MKS in price even.....but at least it's close in size....

At least hopefully it won't be a rental queen though....

Link to post
Share on other sites
I just don't think it will be big enough (especially in width) to compete with the Lincoln......and I know it won't be expensive enough either.....hell a Lucerne Super isn't even close to a loaded MKS in price even.....but at least it's close in size....

At least hopefully it won't be a rental queen though....

What? :confused0071:

Size can't be your reasoning to dismiss the new LaCrosse. Your choices of untouchable sedans stretched from the 191" ES350 to the 204" MKs.

It can't be power. Both the ES350 and MKs have under 300hp. Even the current LaCrosse has 303hp. Lucerne Super has 292hp.

Lucerne vs MKs MSRP price?

-- Lucerne Super starts at $38,980

-- Lucerne Super loaded is $45,100

-- Lincoln MKs FWD starts at $37,665

-- Lincoln MKs FWD Loaded is $45,670 (including Technology package, Navigation Package, with the Ultimate Package)

The AWD MKs just adds $1,900 in price. I don't see a disparity between Buick and Lincoln pricing.

I personally don't think the new LaCrosse will match the MKs in price or size. But it could come close. A couple of things are pretty sure:

- It will be more expensive than the current LaCrosse

- It'll be larger than the ES350 and MKz

- Everything indicates the new LaCrosse will eventually offer AWD and a two-mode hybrid version

- The new LaCrosse's interior is already a step above the Lucerne Super

As for your obligatory "rental queen" comment, I believe Buick has already taken care of that. Your chance of finding a rental LaCrosse is about as great as finding a rental Accord. Next to never.

I don't see any reason why the new LaCrosse cannot compete with Lincoln or Lexus. Warranty, features, reliability, style, and quality (based on the Enclave and SUPER editions) appear to be present and accounted for at Buick. An Insignia-based Regal slotting beneath the LaCrosse would be perfect to help position the LaCrosse against the ES & MKs.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry.

I just don't see a Malibu-based LaCrosse even remotely competing with MKS or ES and GS......

This looks to me to be more of a Camry XLE, (maybe) Avalon, or the Fusion-based Lincoln (I can't keep the f@#king Lincoln names straight......stupid-ass Ford....) competitor.

Buick simply isn't in the same league to compete with Lexus or (gasp) even Lincoln. They had the potential.....but squandered it.

In what way can't Buick not be in the same league as the ES or MKS? This is a LOT more car than a Camry XLE or Avalon.

ES and Avalon are Camry based, MKZ is Fusion based, MKS is Taurus based.

Link to post
Share on other sites

second thought, my initial reply was based upon seeing the cheap interior plastic and crappy looking gauges. and buick just cannot give up on the wraparound dash, can they. (95 riv).

but the concept of the interior looks ok. it just looks like it will have cheap plastic. which GM is famous for.

Link to post
Share on other sites
What? :confused0071:

Size can't be your reasoning to dismiss the new LaCrosse. Your choices of untouchable sedans stretched from the 191" ES350 to the 204" MKs.

It can't be power. Both the ES350 and MKs have under 300hp. Even the current LaCrosse has 303hp. Lucerne Super has 292hp.

Lucerne vs MKs MSRP price?

-- Lucerne Super starts at $38,980

-- Lucerne Super loaded is $45,100

-- Lincoln MKs FWD starts at $37,665

-- Lincoln MKs FWD Loaded is $45,670 (including Technology package, Navigation Package, with the Ultimate Package)

The AWD MKs just adds $1,900 in price. I don't see a disparity between Buick and Lincoln pricing.

I personally don't think the new LaCrosse will match the MKs in price or size. But it could come close. A couple of things are pretty sure:

- It will be more expensive than the current LaCrosse

- It'll be larger than the ES350 and MKz

- Everything indicates the new LaCrosse will eventually offer AWD and a two-mode hybrid version

- The new LaCrosse's interior is already a step above the Lucerne Super

As for your obligatory "rental queen" comment, I believe Buick has already taken care of that. Your chance of finding a rental LaCrosse is about as great as finding a rental Accord. Next to never.

I don't see any reason why the new LaCrosse cannot compete with Lincoln or Lexus. Warranty, features, reliability, style, and quality (based on the Enclave and SUPER editions) appear to be present and accounted for at Buick. An Insignia-based Regal slotting beneath the LaCrosse would be perfect to help position the LaCrosse against the ES & MKs.

I agree. I don't understand why people are dismissing this car's assets and abilities based on spy shots and grainy pictures. We haven't seen any clear, uncamouflaged pictures or specs/additional info yet. I'm holding out hope that GM has nailed this car and that it will be completely competitive in its market segment. What little I have seen so far looks promising.

Edited by cire
Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree. I don't understand why people are dismissing this car's assets and abilities based on spy shots and grainy pictures. We haven't seen any clear, uncamouflaged pictures or specs/additional info yet. I'm holding out hope that GM has nailed this car and that it will be completely competitive in its market segment. What little I have seen so far looks promising.

All GM has to do is take the Malibu and add what it learned from the CTS.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't see any reason why the new LaCrosse cannot compete with Lincoln or Lexus. Warranty, features, reliability, style, and quality (based on the Enclave and SUPER editions) appear to be present and accounted for at Buick. An Insignia-based Regal slotting beneath the LaCrosse would be perfect to help position the LaCrosse against the ES & MKs.

I agree with a slightly smaller than a Malibu high $20k car and a low to mid $30s malibu sized car to compete with the MKZ makes sense, but GM doesn't always do what makes sense.

Buick can't and won't compete with Lexus because Buick is Buick, and Lexus is Lexus. Buick has become a joke and damaged brand, and Lexus has become the gold standard. GM's R&D budget is smaller than Toyota's and Toyota has far fewer brands and models to spread that money to. The Enclave isn't even doing much since a dated and more expensive Lexus RX outsells it by over 2 to 1. The Lexus ES350 (which isn't even a good car) outsells the CTS most months. There is no way a LaCrosse priced at $34k can outsell a CTS.

The Genesis is possibly the best car under $50,000 yet it won't sell well because it is a Hyundai. Despite better handling and braking than a BMW 550i and better acceleration than the 750i, BMW buyers won't be considering a Hyundai, just like Lexus buyers won't look at a Buick.

And where is the Nav system on the LaCrosse?

Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree with a slightly smaller than a Malibu high $20k car and a low to mid $30s malibu sized car to compete with the MKZ makes sense, but GM doesn't always do what makes sense.

Buick can't and won't compete with Lexus because Buick is Buick, and Lexus is Lexus. Buick has become a joke and damaged brand, and Lexus has become the gold standard. GM's R&D budget is smaller than Toyota's and Toyota has far fewer brands and models to spread that money to. The Enclave isn't even doing much since a dated and more expensive Lexus RX outsells it by over 2 to 1. The Lexus ES350 (which isn't even a good car) outsells the CTS most months. There is no way a LaCrosse priced at $34k can outsell a CTS.

The Genesis is possibly the best car under $50,000 yet it won't sell well because it is a Hyundai. Despite better handling and braking than a BMW 550i and better acceleration than the 750i, BMW buyers won't be considering a Hyundai, just like Lexus buyers won't look at a Buick.

And where is the Nav system on the LaCrosse?

Wow, even more bull$h! comes out of your ass.

1st): Don't ever compare Buick to Hyundai.

2nd) Don't ever compare the CTS to ES,The CTS is worlds ahead of the ES.

3nd):The CTS has only sold 4,000 less than the ES, and the CTS Average Transaction Price is almost $44,000.

4nd):The new Lacrosse has a good chance of selling 72,000-78,000 with an Average Transaction Price in the $34,000-$37,000 range.

5nd): All Epsilon II'S HAVE NAV.

6nd): Once again stop it with your ''Enclave isn't a hit" crap.

7nd): Cut out your "Buick is trash" crap.

8nd): Get off the website!

Edited by Toyota.vs.GM
Link to post
Share on other sites
Forgive me Reg, but where are you seeing the cheap interior plastic?

um, the pictures of the interior. looks like the same old cheap $h! GM has put in the interior of their cars for a looooooong time now. the stuff that looks great for a bit after you spray apply high gloss armor all.

the pic ted posted, with the skylark, and the new one below it. looks like the plastic spec for buick hasn't changed.

Link to post
Share on other sites
um, the pictures of the interior. looks like the same old cheap $h! GM has put in the interior of their cars for a looooooong time now. the stuff that looks great for a bit after you spray apply high gloss armor all.

'high gloss armor all'? Does any one still use that stuff? I haven't used that 15 years or more...I like a low gloss, non-reflective finish, esp. on the top of the dash..

Link to post
Share on other sites

I wasn't comparing Buick cars to Hyundai cars, only saying that the Genesis will have a tough time because of who makes it. Just as Buick will have a hard time when for equal money people can get a Cadillac or Lexus. Further proven by the point that the CTS is no doubt a better car than the Lexus ES350, the ES350 is average at best, yet it still outsells the CTS because it is made by Lexus and people will pay for the L badge. If the CTS is selling about 70,000 a year, Buick is going to have a really hard time selling 70-75,000 at almost as high a price.

2-3 years ago everyone thought Pontiac would have an all rear drive lineup, and make performance cars and be restored to former glory. Now they have Aveo, Cobalt, and Matrix rebadges, a dated G6 that is 40% fleet, and 2 very low volume rear drive cars. GM couldn't (or was too broke to) do anything with Pontiac, what makes Buick any different. GM failed to deliver in the past, and they are just more broke now. GM can say Buick will be like Lexus, Cadillac will be as good as BMW, they'll stop doing rebates and fleet sales, their cars will be as reliable as the Japanese, etc but at this point, I won't believe anything until I see it.

Edited by smk4565
Link to post
Share on other sites
I wasn't comparing Buick cars to Hyundai cars, only saying that the Genesis will have a tough time because of who makes it. Just as Buick will have a hard time when for equal money people can get a Cadillac or Lexus. Further proven by the point that the CTS is no doubt a better car than the Lexus ES350, the ES350 is average at best, yet it still outsells the CTS because it is made by Lexus and people will pay for the L badge. If the CTS is selling about 70,000 a year, Buick is going to have a really hard time selling 70-75,000 at almost as high a price.

2-3 years ago everyone thought Pontiac would have an all rear drive lineup, and make performance cars and be restored to former glory. Now they have Aveo, Cobalt, and Matrix rebadges, a dated G6 that is 40% fleet, and 2 very low volume rear drive cars. GM couldn't (or was too broke to) do anything with Pontiac, what makes Buick any different. GM failed to deliver in the past, and they are just more broke now. GM can say Buick will be like Lexus, Cadillac will be as good as BMW, they'll stop doing rebates and fleet sales, their cars will be as reliable as the Japanese, etc but at this point, I won't believe anything until I see it.

The ES doesn't really compete with the CTS, IMO. Perhaps slightly, but really the ES's only competition is the TL, both of which sell pretty well. Passat also competes slightly perhaps. ES sells well because it satisfies a relatively big market (people who want a FWD luxury car because they're scared to drive RWD in snow, but don't want a barge, ie DTS) and has relatively few competitors. Not saying the LaCrosse will come in and take a large chunk of sales or outsell it at the same price, but part of the reason the ES sells so well is the competition, or lack thereof.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree with a slightly smaller than a Malibu high $20k car and a low to mid $30s malibu sized car to compete with the MKZ makes sense, but GM doesn't always do what makes sense.

Buick can't and won't compete with Lexus because Buick is Buick, and Lexus is Lexus. Buick has become a joke and damaged brand, and Lexus has become the gold standard. GM's R&D budget is smaller than Toyota's and Toyota has far fewer brands and models to spread that money to. The Enclave isn't even doing much since a dated and more expensive Lexus RX outsells it by over 2 to 1. The Lexus ES350 (which isn't even a good car) outsells the CTS most months. There is no way a LaCrosse priced at $34k can outsell a CTS.

The Genesis is possibly the best car under $50,000 yet it won't sell well because it is a Hyundai. Despite better handling and braking than a BMW 550i and better acceleration than the 750i, BMW buyers won't be considering a Hyundai, just like Lexus buyers won't look at a Buick.

And where is the Nav system on the LaCrosse?

I agree with this post. I also took the liberty of emphasizing the most important part, in my opinion anyway.

Link to post
Share on other sites
The ES doesn't really compete with the CTS, IMO. Perhaps slightly, but really the ES's only competition is the TL, both of which sell pretty well. Passat also competes slightly perhaps. ES sells well because it satisfies a relatively big market (people who want a FWD luxury car because they're scared to drive RWD in snow, but don't want a barge, ie DTS) and has relatively few competitors. Not saying the LaCrosse will come in and take a large chunk of sales or outsell it at the same price, but part of the reason the ES sells so well is the competition, or lack thereof.

I wouldn't really consider the ES and TL competitors...the TL is a more serious, driver oriented, sporty model-- more competitive with the Maxima and Saabs, maybe the A4..the ES is a softer, cushier entry lux model--just a fancier Avalon. I think the main competition for the LaCrosse is the Avalon,ES, Sable, perhaps the Azera..

Link to post
Share on other sites
I wasn't comparing Buick cars to Hyundai cars, only saying that the Genesis will have a tough time because of who makes it. Just as Buick will have a hard time when for equal money people can get a Cadillac or Lexus. Further proven by the point that the CTS is no doubt a better car than the Lexus ES350, the ES350 is average at best, yet it still outsells the CTS because it is made by Lexus and people will pay for the L badge. If the CTS is selling about 70,000 a year, Buick is going to have a really hard time selling 70-75,000 at almost as high a price.

2-3 years ago everyone thought Pontiac would have an all rear drive lineup, and make performance cars and be restored to former glory. Now they have Aveo, Cobalt, and Matrix rebadges, a dated G6 that is 40% fleet, and 2 very low volume rear drive cars. GM couldn't (or was too broke to) do anything with Pontiac, what makes Buick any different. GM failed to deliver in the past, and they are just more broke now. GM can say Buick will be like Lexus, Cadillac will be as good as BMW, they'll stop doing rebates and fleet sales, their cars will be as reliable as the Japanese, etc but at this point, I won't believe anything until I see it.

It look like someone doesn't get it.

It's the some old post, with the same crap .It's like putting lipstick on crap , lipstick on crap still makes it crap.

1st): The ES has only sold 4,000 more than the CTS

, and the CTS has an Average Transaction price of almost $44,000.

2nd):The CTS and ES are two different class of cars. so enough with that.

3nd):The Enclave's Average Transaction Price proves you're ''Buick having tough time'' '' Buick is just like Pontiac" is bull$h!.

4nd):The New Lacrosse has a good chance of selling 72,000-76,000 with an Average Transaction Price in the $34,000-$37,000 range.

5nd):Buick do very tiny fleet sales.

6nd): With the type of bull$h! coming out of you, I could care less what you think. End anybody who argee with you is a dumbass just like you.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree with this post. I also took the liberty of emphasizing the most important part, in my opinion anyway.

The part emphasized is true. You have to look at where (as in brand) GM is spending R&D dollars and where (what countries) GM is spending the money as well. Chevrolet, Opel, Buick and Cadillac are getting the R&D budget. The rest of the brands are benefiting from the results. It's also less expensive to perform R&D overseas, which is where almost the entire R&D appears to be happening these days.... at least for Buick, Opel, and most of Chevrolet's sub-midsize line-up.

Regardless of the dollars spent at Toyota, BMW and Mercedes-Benz still stay toe-to-toe with Lexus. Both with smaller budgets. The amount spent does not determine the product's result. See Toyota's R&D billions flushed down the toilet with the Tundra. GM made a superior product on a much smaller budget.

GM R&D dollars also benefits from mass. While Toyota has been busy developing more and more vehicles that are "market specific" like the Avalon, Verza, Tundra, Sequoia, FJ Cruiser, etc... GM is trying to move away from that by selling its portfolio of vehicles globally.

All I'm saying is don't write off the LaCrosse because Corporate GM doesn't have money. There's no sign of cost-cutting with the LaCrosse so far and the two-mode tech R&D was already paid for elsewhere. It appears Buick is finally showing us the results from the $3 Billion earmarked for the Brand 4 years ago.

Link to post
Share on other sites
The ES doesn't really compete with the CTS, IMO. Perhaps slightly, but really the ES's only competition is the TL, both of which sell pretty well. Passat also competes slightly perhaps. ES sells well because it satisfies a relatively big market (people who want a FWD luxury car because they're scared to drive RWD in snow, but don't want a barge, ie DTS) and has relatively few competitors. Not saying the LaCrosse will come in and take a large chunk of sales or outsell it at the same price, but part of the reason the ES sells so well is the competition, or lack thereof.

Ah ha....but here is where reality differs from what us car industry enthusiasts think......coming from someone working AT a Caddy lot, ES is MAJOR competition for CTS. REGARDLESS of drivetrain. It's priced very similarly....and in fact, just over the last month, we've taken in 3 ESs on trade for CTSs (this is good news)......an '02, an '04, and an '07.

Passat isn't even on the register of people looking at CTS.

Just my observations over 4 months here at a Caddy store.....

Regarding new LaCrosse.....I'll wager money......this car will fill the same slot as the outgoing car.....mid-to-high 20's to mid-30's (MAX).....and will not attract Lexus buyers.....plus, as already mentioned, FWD Lincolns start at around $37K and max out at almost $46K......hell, you have to be in a Super to be that pricey in a Lucerne.

I'm not saying it's going to be a bad car....I think the new LaCrosse will be a huge improvement over the current one. It's just that I find it funny all the grandiose ideas everyone has about where in the marketplace this vehicle is going to land......

Link to post
Share on other sites
Regarding new LaCrosse.....I'll wager money......this car will fill the same slot as the outgoing car...

Which LaCrosse? The US midsize sedan or the luxury sedan sold in China? Remember, this LaCrosse is replacing both.

mid-to-high 20's to mid-30's (MAX).....
Current LaCrosse: Base MSRP: $24,250 - $32,380

Current Lucerne: Base MSRP: $27,275 - $38,980

Which one will it be replacing? One or the other? Both? :scratchchin:

and will not attract Lexus buyers.....

Hmmm... Enclave has. Why shouldn't the LaCrosse if it's good enough?

plus, as already mentioned, FWD Lincolns start at around $37K and max out at almost $46K......hell, you have to be in a Super to be that pricey in a Lucerne.

FWD Lincolns start around $32k (Lincoln MKz Base MSRP: $32,155 - $34,045) and up to $40k without options (MKsBase MSRP: $37,665 - $39,555). Lincoln is also considering a smaller compact (4-cyl?) which will allow Lincoln to drop the entry price even further. (starting to look a lot like Buick's price model insn't it?)

I'm not saying it's going to be a bad car....I think the new LaCrosse will be a huge improvement over the current one. It's just that I find it funny all the grandiose ideas everyone has about where in the marketplace this vehicle is going to land......

Grandiose? For Buick to compete with a Lincoln? Come-on...The two brands have been cross-shopped for years. I know several people in Texas that have switched between the 2 brands (Riviera against Mark-series, LeSabres & Park Avenues against Continentals.) Both brands have appealed and catered to a less pretentious clientele for quite some time. We'll know more once stats and prices are announced, but the new LaCrosse appears more inline to replace the Lucerne with the Insignia-based Regal to fill the spot of the current LaCrosse. As I've said before, I don't expect Buick to be as expensive as the Lincoln competition, but I expect the pricing to be closer than it has been in the past.

I'll take your wager. We can discuss terms offline... :AH-HA_wink:

Link to post
Share on other sites
Which LaCrosse? The US midsize sedan or the luxury sedan sold in China? Remember, this LaCrosse is replacing both.

Current LaCrosse: Base MSRP: $24,250 - $32,380

Current Lucerne: Base MSRP: $27,275 - $38,980

Which one will it be replacing? One or the other? Both? :scratchchin:

Hmmm... Enclave has. Why shouldn't the LaCrosse if it's good enough?

FWD Lincolns start around $32k (Lincoln MKz Base MSRP: $32,155 - $34,045) and up to $40k without options (MKsBase MSRP: $37,665 - $39,555). Lincoln is also considering a smaller compact (4-cyl?) which will allow Lincoln to drop the entry price even further. (starting to look a lot like Buick's price model insn't it?)

Grandiose? For Buick to compete with a Lincoln? Come-on...The two brands have been cross-shopped for years. I know several people in Texas that have switched between the 2 brands (Riviera against Mark-series, LeSabres & Park Avenues against Continentals.) Both brands have appealed and catered to a less pretentious clientele for quite some time. We'll know more once stats and prices are announced, but the new LaCrosse appears more inline to replace the Lucerne with the Insignia-based Regal to fill the spot of the current LaCrosse. As I've said before, I don't expect Buick to be as expensive as the Lincoln competition, but I expect the pricing to be closer than it has been in the past.

:thumbsup: The new Lacrosse is replacing all three, the Lacrosse sold in China- the North America Lacrosse-and the Lucerne , and part replacement of the Park Avenue in China( the other part of the replacement is the very likely Buick Alpha which will replace the Insignia-based Regal).

Link to post
Share on other sites

If it is a ES350 competitor, hopefully it has similiar features that make the Lexus ES competitive in the entry lux category vs just being a wood filled quiet driving refined car.. including the top notch interior materials and switchgear, stereo (Mark Levinson), panoramic roof (not the $h!ty embarassing problematic GM one), rain sense wipers, laser adaptive cruise etc.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Like someone said, how many Lexus clones do we need?

I like the dash a lot, but I don't like the rest of it very much.

Well, Lexus is the market leader (top selling luxury brand in the US), so it's inevitable that they will be copied...

Link to post
Share on other sites

This will be a good car no doubt -- as much of an improvement over the current car as the new Malibu was over the old one. However, Buick will never challenge Lexus because of the lackluster quality of the dealers. There might have been a chance to counter this, but that was before Buick was combined with a truck brand and a has-been budget brand. Buick buyers just won't be able to get Lexus-levels of customer service on a consistent basis. That's not to say there aren't some excellent Buick dealers. There are. But the customer experience is inconsistent - it changes from one dealer to the next.

Link to post
Share on other sites
This will be a good car no doubt -- as much of an improvement over the current car as the new Malibu was over the old one. However, Buick will never challenge Lexus because of the lackluster quality of the dealers. There might have been a chance to counter this, but that was before Buick was combined with a truck brand and a has-been budget brand. Buick buyers just won't be able to get Lexus-levels of customer service on a consistent basis. That's not to say there aren't some excellent Buick dealers. There are. But the customer experience is inconsistent - it changes from one dealer to the next.

That's why I still don't quite understand the Saturn experiment. If GM saw that a large chunk of the buying public was abandoning the corporation's products due to subpar vehicles and unacceptable levels of customer service, why didn't it establish initiatives and strategies within the existing brand structure to address those issues? Why did it choose to launch Saturn or buy Saab (which was a troubled company when GM purchased it) and Hummer for that matter? It seems like GM would have realized that if the corporation couldn't fix the problems with its existing 6 brands, then it sure as heck was going to struggle even more by taking on 3 additional brands. GM would have been better off by thinking outside of the box to fix the existing brands instead of attempting to create a new box. For the Saturn experiment to be considered a success, its supposedly pioneering customer service concepts would have eventually spread to all of GM's divisions. It obviously hasn't happened if the customer service experience is still inconsistent throughout GM's dealer network. Now GM has 8 divisions that they have to try to manage while addressing some of the same issues it was facing before it launched "A Different Kind of Car Company". I don't hate Saturn, I just don't understand the thought process that brought about its existence. It seems like most of the concepts that Saturn was supposed to represent could have been implemented without GM launching another division.

I also don't quite understand the line of thought that dictates that a person who purchases an economical car or a truck should receive a lower level of customer service than a person who purchases a premium or luxury vehicle. Excellent service should be provided to all customers in an attempt to retain loyalty and expand the business. A person who purchases an economy car today might be a future premium/luxury vehicle customer tomorrow.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The GM of the early 1980s was still organized around the traditional divisions until Roger Smith forced the 1984 reorg into Large Car and Small Car-Canada groups. Before the reorg the Japanese were coming on strong. First, the 1979 energy crisis came along and people started trading in their American guzzler "boats" for Mazda GLCs and Toyota Corollas like crazy. Then, Reagan established the Voluntary Import Quotas to help the Big Four, and Honda responded with the Marysville, OH plant. So, Roger Smith figured that speed was of the essence and that the only way to circumvent the fiefdoms within the old divisional structure was to create Saturn, a separate car company. That, in a nutshell, is why the traditional GM divisions didn't compete directly with the Toyota, Honda, etc until very recently. The organization was too intrenched.

By the time the first Saturns came out they were much improved over the J-cars that GM had been offering (DOHC, innovative plastic construction, interesting design) but they were still behind the Corolla and Civic in several areas especially refinement. But buyers overlooked this because of the excellent customer service and touchy feely ad campaign. Saturn was never profitable and required much subsidization by GM. Along comes Lutz, his fascination with Opel, and the rest is history.

Regarding customer service and low-priced cars, I agree with you. But the car business is and has forever been plagued by overproduction and over-distribution. Car selling is an odious business whether you're selling Mercedes or Chevys. It's all about moving the metal because the factories have to keep cranking the junk out (remember, all cars break down, lose their value quickly, and are eventually junked). Low-priced cars, by definition, have a slimmer profit margin than expensive ones. There is only so much service manpower than can be reserved for these kinds of cars and their buyers if the dealer wants to earn a profit. It sucks, but it's important to keep the car business in perspective.

That's why I still don't quite understand the Saturn experiment. If GM saw that a large chunk of the buying public was abandoning the corporation's products due to subpar vehicles and unacceptable levels of customer service, why didn't it establish initiatives and strategies within the existing brand structure to address those issues? Why did it choose to launch Saturn or buy Saab (which was a troubled company when GM purchased it) and Hummer for that matter? It seems like GM would have realized that if the corporation couldn't fix the problems with its existing 6 brands, then it sure as heck was going to struggle even more by taking on 3 additional brands. GM would have been better off by thinking outside of the box to fix the existing brands instead of attempting to create a new box. For the Saturn experiment to be considered a success, its supposedly pioneering customer service concepts would have eventually spread to all of GM's divisions. It obviously hasn't happened if the customer service experience is still inconsistent throughout GM's dealer network. Now GM has 8 divisions that they have to try to manage while addressing some of the same issues it was facing before it launched "A Different Kind of Car Company". I don't hate Saturn, I just don't understand the thought process that brought about its existence. It seems like most of the concepts that Saturn was supposed to represent could have been implemented without GM launching another division.

I also don't quite understand the line of thought that dictates that a person who purchases an economical car or a truck should receive a lower level of customer service than a person who purchases a premium or luxury vehicle. Excellent service should be provided to all customers in an attempt to retain loyalty and expand the business. A person who purchases an economy car today might be a future premium/luxury vehicle customer tomorrow.

Edited by buyacargetacheck
Link to post
Share on other sites
There are more new pictures in today's autonews.com (9/29) if anyone is a member and can post them. Looks like a cool color.

What is the color?

Link to post
Share on other sites
This will be a good car no doubt -- as much of an improvement over the current car as the new Malibu was over the old one. However, Buick will never challenge Lexus because of the lackluster quality of the dealers. There might have been a chance to counter this, but that was before Buick was combined with a truck brand and a has-been budget brand. Buick buyers just won't be able to get Lexus-levels of customer service on a consistent basis. That's not to say there aren't some excellent Buick dealers. There are. But the customer experience is inconsistent - it changes from one dealer to the next.

Hell it could even be argued that there are few Caddy dealers that truly match Lexus' dealership standards.....

Link to post
Share on other sites

True, I have read some shocking comments about a Lexus dealer in my area. However, JD Power does rank Lexus slightly above Buick and Cadillac in sales satisfaction. On the other hand, Cadillac and Buick (and Lincoln and Mercury) consistently rank high too in sales and service satisfaction overall. One area where Lexus shines is dealership facilities. However, this could change when you consider that Lexus is nearing its 20th birthday. Most of the Lexus showrooms that I've seen look pretty much the same as the initial design 20 years ago.

On top of all that who's to say all LEXUS dealers are top notch?
Link to post
Share on other sites
it was a greenish blue. if you go to autonews.con and punch in buick it pops up

I wonder if it is that Mystic Sapphire Tricoat thing that is on the Lucerne for 2009.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
Best thing about it is the new Ep2 platform. Finally retiring the 21 year old 'W'.

And the 3800/4-speed auto combo.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm hoping they're not pulling an IS-F on those tailpipes. I think I see an actual pipe behind the bumper integrated exhaust.

Took at look at the pics up close Toni, and it looks to be the real thing. You can see the mufflers and the pipe leading from them to the exhaust tip.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't quite get the logic... Isn't it better to accelerate it to the market and start selling them earlier? How does delaying save money?

Well, it costs money to set up displays at the auto show, to ship prototypes there, etc....sounds like they are delaying those expenses in the short term..

Link to post
Share on other sites

It doesn't save money, they probably cut staff or cut back on the car in the development process trying to save money, and now it isn't ready.

Maybe they have very little for the Detroit auto show and want to release the CTS coupe and LaCrosse there, figuring they'll go on sale late winter or early spring. Although if I were GM, I would be working to get great product out fast, because on their current path, bankruptcy is in their future.

Link to post
Share on other sites