Chevrolet News:Chevy Malibu to die after 2024

[Drew Dowdell]

The Chevrolet Malibu will follow the likes to the Ford Fusion and Chrysler 200 by following them into that great nameplate junkyard in the sky after 2024 according to a report by Automotive News.  There is a possibility of an electric successor to the Malibu, but nothing is certain at this point.  An electric replacement would fit with GM's timeline to build 20 new EVs by 2023.   Before the ax falls in 2024, the Malibu could get one last face lift for the 2022 model year to help it through the final stages before retirement.  The Malibu is built in the Fairfax KS plant where the Cadillac XT4 is built.

This follows on reports that the Chevrolet Camaro will also die in 2023.  Other cars that are up for the chopping block are the Sonic after 2020 and the Spark after 2021.  The Bolt and Equinox will get a freshening next year.  With the Impala, Cruze, and Volt already dead, these changes will leave the Chevy brand without any sedans after 2024. With the Buick Regal also possibly canceled once the contract with PSA runs out, it may be that the only sedans available from General Motors will be from Cadillac. 

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[David]

With the advances in solid state battery technology and the design changes that have recently been discovered and are under heavy testing like from XNRGI 

I see a couple sedans still in the Chevrolet portfolio, but EV focused.

[riviera74]

Yes it is happening again.  Just like when affordable RWD sedans (mostly) disappeared after 1987.  Now it is virtually all affordable FWD sedans that are disappearing into the ether.  This is really sad, but it seems few people actually WANT to buy a FWD sedan when they want a FWD crossover instead.

[Robert Hall]

3 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

Yes it is happening again.  Just like when affordable RWD sedans (mostly) disappeared after 1987.  Now it is virtually all affordable FWD sedans that are disappearing into the ether.  This is really sad, but it seems few people actually WANT to buy a FWD sedan when they want a FWD crossover instead.

Seems very short-sighted thinking on the Detroit 3's part.  I don't see the Japanese and Korean companies getting out of the sedan market.  When the CUV/SUV fad fades, the Detroit 3 are going to be hurting due their usual short-sighted thinking...

[Drew Dowdell]

19 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Seems very short-sighted thinking on the Detroit 3's part.  I don't see the Japanese and Korean companies getting out of the sedan market.  When the CUV/SUV fad fades, the Detroit 3 are going to be hurting due their usual short-sighted thinking...

by the time the SUV/CUV fad fades, the market will have shifted more to EVs and autonomous vehicles... and who know what those will look like. 

Rolling toasters probably. 

[balthazar]

 

Quote

When the CUV/SUV fad fades…

That's what 'they' said about pickups… in 1970.

Hyundai was 100% cars when it arrived here, it's now only 56% cars (by volume YTD) and that number has been slipping for years (both at hyundai/kia and industry-wide). CUVs / SUVs are firmly-established; calling them a 'fad' ignores decades of consumer data.

Objectively speaking, the industry at large would be best served morphing a combination of the family sedan and the CUV (which is already the same underneath). All the brands have too many physically different models- with a morphed FutureKar, developmental costs would come way down and perhaps -just perhaps- some degree of control on runaway prices could be realized.  

Edited July 29, 2019 by balthazar

[smk4565]

So Ford and GM’s game plan is to put everything into pickups, SUVs and 1 sports car each, after giving up on minivans and sedans.  Meanwhile the Asian car companies are stealing crossover/SUV business off Ford and GM and Toyota has new trucks coming and Hyundai and Kia are doing pickups.  You can only retreat for so long until you run out of places to retreat to.

[balthazar]

Minivans are all but dead- there were over a dozen now there's 3-4. Sedans are slipping every single year; the pie anyone is stealing from is smaller every year.

IF a major industry downturn is looming (we'll see), thinning sedan offerings beforehand is probably a smart move. Eventually, you run out of places to fleet/fire sales sedans to.

[ccap41]

12 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

So Ford and GM’s game plan is to put everything into pickups, SUVs and 1 sports car each, after giving up on minivans and sedans.  Meanwhile the Asian car companies are stealing crossover/SUV business off Ford and GM and Toyota has new trucks coming and Hyundai and Kia are doing pickups.  You can only retreat for so long until you run out of places to retreat to.

I mean Ford has the Mustang and GT and Chevy has the Camaro and Corvette.. But who's counting? 

And Caddy has or will have CT variants that are sports cars. 

[David]

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

Seems very short-sighted thinking on the Detroit 3's part.  I don't see the Japanese and Korean companies getting out of the sedan market.  When the CUV/SUV fad fades, the Detroit 3 are going to be hurting due their usual short-sighted thinking...

I would disagree, unlike Asian countries, excluding China, small auto's and cars being the focus will always have a place as SUV/CUV are just too big and expensive. Yet for America, China and Europe, I think we will see a much longer life of the SUV/CUV sticking around. I see the Detroit 3 building some cars and might just be hybrid  / electric only for select markets, but the bulk of their global auto's will be SUV/CUV I think.

[balthazar]

An Encore is 168" long- there's no one for whom that CUV size is 'too big'.

[David]

30 minutes ago, balthazar said:

An Encore is 168" long- there's no one for whom that CUV size is 'too big'.

Yet, GM does NOT sell it in the rest of the Asian rim. It would sell and is a perfect size and I agree it is NOT too big, yet with that said, those small asian countries would need to open up to GM selling it there. There is great control over the story of what the local population is told and what works and does not work for them. They sell this that America SUV/CUV are too big and as such, people are lied to and led to believe that is why they cannot sell them there not the truth that the local gov is controlling what they can and cannot buy.

The compact CUV's that American auto companies build will fit and sell just fine if they are allowed into those places, Full size trucks and SUV's not so much.

[riviera74]

23 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Yet, GM does NOT sell it in the rest of the Asian rim. It would sell and is a perfect size and I agree it is NOT too big, yet with that said, those small asian countries would need to open up to GM selling it there. There is great control over the story of what the local population is told and what works and does not work for them. They sell this that America SUV/CUV are too big and as such, people are lied to and led to believe that is why they cannot sell them there not the truth that the local gov is controlling what they can and cannot buy.

The compact CUV's that American auto companies build will fit and sell just fine if they are allowed into those places, Full size trucks and SUV's not so much.

QFT times 1000.  The Encore (and the Chevy Trax) should be sold basically anywhere in the world since most countries cannot handle the large CUVs or pickup trucks GM offers these days.

[smk4565]

I bet in 5 year pa GM and Ford are cutting the Encore, Trax, Trailblazer, Ecosport, etc to “focus on more profitable models” and Equinox and Escape will be the base models, and post 2025 they might kill them off too if the RAV4 crushes the market the way the Camry did to the sedan market.

[ocnblu]

Any electric replacement for the Malibu will sell at a fraction of what the Malibu sells now.. .and the current car is not exactly setting the sales charts on fire.  Guaranteed.

[Frisky Dingo]

Shame. This gen was a very good car when it came out. They made it worse with powertrain options and design changes. They should keep either the Malibu or Impala nameplate, and make it a RWD/AWD sport sedan.

[smk4565]

43 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Shame. This gen was a very good car when it came out. They made it worse with powertrain options and design changes. They should keep either the Malibu or Impala nameplate, and make it a RWD/AWD sport sedan.

Because the Cadillac red/awd sport sedans sell?  The CT5 is $38k, so CT4 is probably going to be about $31k.   And that is before discounts which will be available after about a year on the market.

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

I bet in 5 year pa GM and Ford are cutting the Encore, Trax, Trailblazer, Ecosport, etc to “focus on more profitable models” and Equinox and Escape will be the base models, and post 2025 they might kill them off too if the RAV4 crushes the market the way the Camry did to the sedan market.

They're not cutting the Encore. They sell more Encores in China than they sell Buicks in the US. And it's on an inexpensive platform.

[daves87rs]

GM is simply looking to commit suicide another way than Ford is.  Ford is in for a major surprise when truck sales slide...better hope they have some EVs.....

I realize some cars have to go. But GM does things half assedd like they normally do. Realizing folks like bigger things, common sense says you get rid of the small stuff (Spark, Sonic) and things you have double of (impala) but keep your higher volume stuff (Malibu, Cruze) especially since the Cruze comes in two (sedan, hatch). And, we could have EV versions on both as well, so folks have lower cost EV choices.

Thing GM needs to see just how dumb that is going to be......

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

I bet in 5 year pa GM and Ford are cutting the Encore, Trax, Trailblazer, Ecosport, etc to “focus on more profitable models” and Equinox and Escape will be the base models, and post 2025 they might kill them off too if the RAV4 crushes the market the way the Camry did to the sedan market.

Ease up on the fine spirits there kind sir... If they are killing them off like that-the economy is going to be in much bigger shambles that I thought.

More than likely, any replacements like be full EVs.....

[daves87rs]

9 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

They're not cutting the Encore. They sell more Encores in China than they sell Buicks in the US. And it's on an inexpensive platform.

And they are everywhere here....

[smk4565]

21 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

They're not cutting the Encore. They sell more Encores in China than they sell Buicks in the US. And it's on an inexpensive platform.

The Chinese market could save it, but they could also remove Encore/Trax from the US market if there is a big sales drop.  Once the market is so crazy flooded with crossovers, the weak ones will die off.  Just like what is happening with sedans.   These are the people that want to kill Malibu, Impala and Camaro that are 50 year name plates, I don't think they would think twice about killing off the Encore.

YTD the Malibu is GM's #4 seller being Silverado, Equinox and Sierra.

Edited July 30, 2019 by smk4565

[riviera74]

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Shame. This gen was a very good car when it came out. They made it worse with powertrain options and design changes. They should keep either the Malibu or Impala nameplate, and make it a RWD/AWD sport sedan.

It is a shame.  A RWD Impala/Caprice would be fabulous.

[daves87rs]

4 hours ago, smk4565 said:

The Chinese market could save it, but they could also remove Encore/Trax from the US market if there is a big sales drop.  Once the market is so crazy flooded with crossovers, the weak ones will die off.  Just like what is happening with sedans.   These are the people that want to kill Malibu, Impala and Camaro that are 50 year name plates, I don't think they would think twice about killing off the Encore.

YTD the Malibu is GM's #4 seller being Silverado, Equinox and Sierra.

Keep in mind though- those very nameplates might come back on the new EVs as well....pretty sure all the EVs will not all be SUVs....

[balthazar]

14 hours ago, daves87rs said:

Ford is in for a major surprise when truck sales slide...better hope they have some EVs.....

I gotta ask: what data are you basing this prediction on?

Edited July 30, 2019 by balthazar

[Drew Dowdell]

7 minutes ago, balthazar said:

I gotta ask: what data are you basing this prediction on?

Cycles of boom and bust I would imagine.....

[balthazar]

OK, but is that 'data'?

Trucks (and SUVs) have been taking an increasing share of new vehicles sales for like 50 years running now. That's far too long to be in a cycle.
Sure; trucks sales dipped more than cars when gas spiked at $4/gal+ (for 6 months), but trucks now are reaching solidly into the mid 20s in FE (and beyond) - already a far cry from where they were 10 years ago. Add to that trucks in general have evolved much farther from where they were -say- in 1990, than cars have (IMO), and you have multiple 'insurance' factors that IF another huge upswing in fuel costs comes (I personally don't see the metrics for it), that trucks will retain their percentages better than a decade ago.
That scenario aside, they aren't fads and they are not part of a 'cycle'. The 'CUV-ing' of cars is measurable proof of that. 

At the very least, "when" is an reach.

[Drew Dowdell]

The data is that it isn't good to put all your eggs in one basket. 2024 is almost the end of the next presidential term, so who knows what can happen between now and then.  Chevy having 0 conventional sedans in 2025 doesn't sound like a good position to be in... especially since the Accord and Camry are likely to still be here.

[balthazar]

The accord & camry may be, but I note the Accord is fully 25% off it's peak volume, and the Sonata is about 55% off it's peak, which was only SIX years ago. 

We bemoaned GM getting out of minivans, and now the segment is almost dead. Sedans are dying faster than any segment in my memory; Ford & GM may be ahead of the wave here. While I hear the '1 egg' sentiment, I note a number of brands that have or are doing just that (Jeep, Land Rover, ferrari, porsche-before-SUVs, etc). Yes- they are singular brands within a portfolio of brands, but no corporate heads wish/plan to have any of their brands fail due to a '1 egg' approach. It can and does work in some instances (in other cases, you have Mini…).

The first OEM to bring out the 'hybrid sedan/CUV' is going to pave the segment into the future. 

[Drew Dowdell]

1 minute ago, balthazar said:

The first OEM to bring out the 'hybrid sedan/CUV' is going to pave the segment into the future. 

We've already had a few of those. The Subaru Legacy SUS, the Volvo S60 Cross Country, the Accord Crosstour, Acura ZDX, even the Chevy Bolt (Chevy insists it is a crossover)

[balthazar]

^ Hmmmm.
Going to vote 'no' on the SUS- that's a mildly lifted sedan (might as well include the Eagle here).
S60, Crosstour & ZDX seem to fit my bill, but still lean to the sedan side. Interesting…. but not there yet.

[Robert Hall]

Maybe we will see trans genre CUV-based sedans...with the body height  and proportions of a crossover but with a trunk.   Picture an Equinox or Edge w/ a trunk.    A crossover crossover. 

[balthazar]

I think it makes long term sense to merge the two, as they’re largely the same. Remember when AWD in a sedan was a pipe dream? Current smaller CUVs don't even try to incorporate any ‘tough trucky’ aspirations in them.

[ykX]

Today's crossovers are already slightly raised hatchbacks/wagon versions of the car platform.  Basically same cars, more utility than sedans.  I think sedans slowly will die completely.  

[balthazar]

^ I don't disagree… tho they all could use more cargo space. Some have nothing, and the trend of no rear overhang and a great big schnoz looks like crap. They lack the visual balance sedans have more readily. Plus dump the acres of plastic cladding. That mazda is a freak show.

[ykX]

33 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Plus dump the acres of plastic cladding

+1, some crossovers (and Buick TourX as another example) put a ton of ugly, unnecessary plastic.

CX-5 and CX9 look much cleaner without the huge plastic

Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk, has minimal cladding

Range Rover has none

[balthazar]

15 minutes ago, ykX said:

+1, some crossovers (and Buick TourX as another example) put a ton of ugly, unnecessary plastic.

Range Rover has none

Is this pic mislabeled? 'cause the entire 10 inches of the bottom of the vehicle is black plastic, PLUS the wheel wells.

If anything, the TourX comes off as far far less of it : 

Edited July 30, 2019 by balthazar

[Robert Hall]

Interesting..both the Evoque and Tour X have those silly tabs at the top of the wheel arch trims.     The Velar has cleaner side trim. 

[ykX]

45 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Is this pic mislabeled?

You put a picture of the old Evoque, all recent Range Rovers do not have that

On the other hand TourX is based on Opel Insignia wagon which looks SUBSTANTIALLY better without the cladding

Edited July 30, 2019 by ykX

[balthazar]

Unless you are calling a 2019 an ‘old model’ - thats whats on range rover usa’s website- tabbed wheelwell trim and all.

[Robert Hall]

11 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Unless you are calling a 2019 an ‘old model’ - thats whats on range rover usa’s website- tabbed wheelwell trim and all.

Looks like the RR website shows both the 1st and 2nd gen model (the new 2nd gen is in blue, the 1st gen in white).  The 2nd gen came out as a '19 in Europe, it looks like it's a '20 in the US.

https://www.landroverusa.com/vehicles/range-rover-family.html

Edited July 30, 2019 by Robert Hall

[ykX]

5 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Unless you are calling a 2019 an ‘old model’ - thats whats on range rover usa’s website- tabbed wheelwell trim and all.

Strangely enough I don't see it when I go to Range Rover website. I see pictures that I have posted 

[Robert Hall]

1 minute ago, ykX said:

Strangely enough I don't see it when I go to Range Rover website. I see pictures that I have posted 

https://www.landroverusa.com/vehicles/range-rover-family.html

[frogger]

I can't help but think of the Outback when black cladding is mentioned.. Was it the first to popularize this???

New one would luck much better without it too.

 

 

 

[Paolino]

That's a shame.  I really liked the Malibu and loved the styling.  I'm hating that choices for sedans are all disappearing, because I've always been a sedan man.  I do hope they refresh it before it goes out...

[riviera74]

51 minutes ago, Paolino said:

That's a shame.  I really liked the Malibu and loved the styling.  I'm hating that choices for sedans are all disappearing, because I've always been a sedan man.  I do hope they refresh it before it goes out...

What GM needs is a new RWD Impala to take on that KIA Stinger. . . . or at least the 300/Charger twins.  I would rather NOT see all the (non-Cadillac) sedans disappear, but GM is simply following demand.

[ocnblu]

Yeah... they went to the trouble of federalizing the SS sedan, giving lip service to their enthusiast base... then kept it a deep, dark secret.  When it did not sell on par with Charger (I guess "production constraints" or whatev prevented this... Aussies bought all of them as Commodores?) they killed it unceremoniously... and used it as an example of why RWD enthusiast sedans from an iconic American brand known for performance since the mid-50's don't sell.

I will always say the Commodore/G8/SS did not sell well enough in the USA for two reasons:  generic styling that could fit any GM brand with a grille change, and MARKETING.  It certainly was not because of a lack of performance ability.

[smk4565]

We seem headed to a market that among the mainstream brands there could be 100+ SUVs and 12 sedans.  And I wouldn't mind being the Camry/Corolla or Civic/Accord in that situation when they have almost no competition to deal with.

1 hour ago, riviera74 said:

What GM needs is a new RWD Impala to take on that KIA Stinger. . . . or at least the 300/Charger twins.  I would rather NOT see all the (non-Cadillac) sedans disappear, but GM is simply following demand.

The Cadillac CT4 will be priced like a Stinger if that helps.

[daves87rs]

10 hours ago, balthazar said:

I gotta ask: what data are you basing this prediction on?

It”s a mix of things- probably would have been better explained. 🙂  A lot of things....

-Drew is right- kinda due for a bust sooner or later....

-While the Silverado is kinda a joke- Ram is coming out with what I think is a better truck than the F-150.  Between the RAM and the Chevy’s heavier discounts- should steal some sales....

-Ecoboost- While it’s doing decent in the trucks-can’t say that about the rest of the line. Starting to see more Escapes and fusions in the local dealership for turbo repairs. While GM’s ain’t great either-they tend to be more durable.....

-Recalls- A good half their line will be up for recalls- with the biggest mess being saved for the Focus and Fiesta. Sprinkle in some Fusion and Escape as well....

 

Figured it would be a good start.....

[Frisky Dingo]

On 7/29/2019 at 6:42 PM, smk4565 said:

Because the Cadillac red/awd sport sedans sell?  The CT5 is $38k, so CT4 is probably going to be about $31k.   And that is before discounts which will be available after about a year on the market.

Those cars don't appeal to traditional GM performance car buyers. They are targeting the wrong audience with most Cadillacs, and have been for a long time.

21 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

We've already had a few of those. The Subaru Legacy SUS, the Volvo S60 Cross Country, the Accord Crosstour, Acura ZDX, even the Chevy Bolt (Chevy insists it is a crossover)

 

21 hours ago, balthazar said:

The accord & camry may be, but I note the Accord is fully 25% off it's peak volume, and the Sonata is about 55% off it's peak, which was only SIX years ago. 

We bemoaned GM getting out of minivans, and now the segment is almost dead. Sedans are dying faster than any segment in my memory; Ford & GM may be ahead of the wave here. While I hear the '1 egg' sentiment, I note a number of brands that have or are doing just that (Jeep, Land Rover, ferrari, porsche-before-SUVs, etc). Yes- they are singular brands within a portfolio of brands, but no corporate heads wish/plan to have any of their brands fail due to a '1 egg' approach. It can and does work in some instances (in other cases, you have Mini…).

The first OEM to bring out the 'hybrid sedan/CUV' is going to pave the segment into the future. 

 

The BMW 3GT and 5GT would beg to differ.

[Robert Hall]

13 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Those cars don't appeal to traditional GM performance car buyers. They are targeting the wrong audience with most Cadillacs, and have been for a long time.

 

As with the C8, they aren't targeting 'traditional GM performance car buyers'---they have realized they can't sell to Baby Boomers forever, they are aging out.