Cadillac News: Cadillac to be Center of GM's EV Push

[Drew Dowdell]

During GM's earnings call today, GM announced that a new, highly flexible, EV architecture is on the way and that Cadillac will be at the center of the release.  The architecture, called BEV3, is said to be highly flexible, being able to be configured from small sedans to large crossover formats, and front-wheel, rear-wheel, or all-wheel drive configurations.   GM is targeting a sweet spot of 300 mile in range according to GM CEO Mary Barra.  GM is going to continue its development of autonomous technology.  It currently offers SuperCruise automated driving on the flagship CT6 sedan and plans to expand that technology across the Cadillac lineup.

Late last year, GM announced that it would be canceling two of its plug-in hybrid vehicles in a slew of cutbacks in the sedan segment. 

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[David]

Excitement!

So cool that they have added some clarity to their EV strategy. Makes sense to start with Cadillac and push out from there.

[smk4565]

They better work fast, many luxury brands will have EV’s on sale this year.

[Drew Dowdell]

10 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

They better work fast, many luxury brands will have EV’s on sale this year.

We should start to see the first ones this year. 

[A Horse With No Name]

18 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

We should start to see the first ones this year. 

Given how good Cadillacs look and how bad the Bolt looks, this should be good news for GM's electric program. 

[Drew Dowdell]

9 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Given how good Cadillacs look and how bad the Bolt looks, this should be good news for GM's electric program. 

I"m mostly interested in how flexible the platform is supposed to be. They didn't show any trucks, but apparently, they showed 11 different possible configurations. 

[A Horse With No Name]

41 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I"m mostly interested in how flexible the platform is supposed to be. They didn't show any trucks, but apparently, they showed 11 different possible configurations. 

It should save hugely in terms of things like emissions certification for new vehicles.  Flexibility in manufacturing now becomes easy because your power plant configuration would seem to be more standardized. 

But yes...I think this is a real turning point. 

[regfootball]

And is this platform at the expense of other Cadillac ICE vehicle platforms that people will actually buy. It should be in addition.  

[surreal1272]

Any new tech, especially EV tech, should start with Cadillac. This is a wise move by GM. I just hope they don’t neglect the ICE side of things. 

[Drew Dowdell]

2 minutes ago, regfootball said:

And is this platform at the expense of other Cadillac ICE vehicle platforms that people will actually buy. It should be in addition.  

It sounds like it is a platform for all of GM, it's just that Cadillac is getting it first.

[smk4565]

2 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

We should start to see the first ones this year. 

They don’t even have a prototype yet, at least nothing that anyone has seen.  They won’t have it on sale this year.  Maybe by end of the year they have a concept car worked up.  

You wonder how scalable it will be, like could the Corvette and Silverado both be built off this platform?

[Drew Dowdell]

3 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

They don’t even have a prototype yet, at least nothing that anyone has seen.  They won’t have it on sale this year.  Maybe by end of the year they have a concept car worked up.  

You wonder how scalable it will be, like could the Corvette and Silverado both be built off this platform?

It's Jan 11th. They have plenty of time still. The XT6 that will be shown on Sunday will be on sale later this year. 

Definitely no on the Silverado, they showed it supporting 7-passenger SUVs but no trucks.  While I don't think it will go into Corvette, an EV sports car could be done.

[riviera74]

That new EV platform is needed on the Escalade and the XT5/XT4 as soon as it is all ready.  Then it can go everywhere else.

Q: Are they compatible with existing Tesla superchargers, or is GM going to build its own EV infrastructure?

[smk4565]

2 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

It's Jan 11th. They have plenty of time still. The XT6 that will be shown on Sunday will be on sale later this year. 

Definitely no on the Silverado, they showed it supporting 7-passenger SUVs but no trucks.  While I don't think it will go into Corvette, an EV sports car could be done.

They probably need another EV platform or two it sounds like then.  But obviously small to midsize crossover/sedan is where you start and 3 row crossover off that.

[David]

1 minute ago, smk4565 said:

They probably need another EV platform or two it sounds like then.  But obviously small to midsize crossover/sedan is where you start and 3 row crossover off that.

Tesla needs a compact and mid size CUV and a Mid Size Pickup. That would give them a decent portfolio. 

[smk4565]

11 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Tesla needs a compact and mid size CUV and a Mid Size Pickup. That would give them a decent portfolio. 

Agreed, it is all coming but they are too small to launch multiple vehicles at once like a Toyota or GM could.  This could hurt Tesla if everyone else gets up to speed with full EV lines.

[regfootball]

38 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

That new EV platform is needed on the Escalade and the XT5/XT4 as soon as it is all ready.  Then it can go everywhere else.

Q: Are they compatible with existing Tesla superchargers, or is GM going to build its own EV infrastructure?

or perhaps we can figure when exactly and what exactly the global charging and power supply infrastructure will be, roll it out and have it in place for that EV we are all going to buy.

Any chance we can carry a spare battery in case the one on the car dies?

 

 

[David]

2 hours ago, riviera74 said:

Q: Are they compatible with existing Tesla superchargers, or is GM going to build its own EV infrastructure?

Tesla Superchargers are not compatible with existing SAE charging systems that all other OEM Auto companies have agreed too.

GM has signed on along with Ford to support the SAE J1772 standard which will allow up to 800V charging which gives us our 400 mile battery pack recharge in 15 minutes once the chargers are in place. GM has announced that they will have these fast chargers installed at their dealerships for use by the dealer and customers.

As a stop gap measure till the faster chargers are installed, GM has made the following News which covers the current 31,000 charge points in the US for their customers:

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2019/jan/0109-charging.html

I also just learned that we missed the announcement in October that GM is offering true bumper to bumper full warranty offers to go from 3/36 to 5yrs / 60K miles or 6yrs / 70k miles from their 3/36k warranty depending on brand.

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2018/oct/1015-cca.html

[Drew Dowdell]

It doesn't get much press, but the EV charging infrastructure is expanding constantly. There is a bit of a race on among the main providers to expand and I think one or two of them may expand too fast and get into financial difficulties. 

[David]

3 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

It doesn't get much press, but the EV charging infrastructure is expanding constantly. There is a bit of a race on among the main providers to expand and I think one or two of them may expand too fast and get into financial difficulties. 

Both of the two core subscription services have signed agreements with VW for all that VW is installing. I wonder how much the VW installation of chargers across america is also affecting the charge points as we stood at just over 17,000 at the start of January  2018 and now at the start of January 2019 we have 31,000 public charge points across america and that does not include the Tesla ones which now have an adapter to allow use of the Tesla charge points.

https://shop.tesla.com/us/en/product/vehicle-accessories/model-s_x_3-sae-j1772-charging-adapter.html

So if we add the 12,011 Tesla Supercharger charge points to the list (https://www.tesla.com/supercharger ) we now have 43,011 charge points in the US alone from 17,000 in January 2018. Big change and proof that EV charging everywhere will happen as habits change on how you fuel your EV compared to an ICE auto.

[dwightlooi]

300 mile is NOT a sweet spot. 300 miles means that you are carrying more than 200 miles of battery costs and weight which 99% of commuters will NEVER use 99% of the time.

--

Now, breaking free of EV range constraints is a great idea. It is the only reason Tesla was successful whereas previous EVs -- regardless of price and performance -- weren't. But at an equivalent of $5000 for about 50 miles worth of batteries, one has to wonder whether those $20,000 can be better spent on other things. Things which can include a 30hp turbo-electric generator costing $2000 and the size of a muffler which can extend the range of the vehicle when needed and which guarantees that you will never be stranded by a depleted battery. A turbo-electric generator has no coolant circuit or radiator requirements. It'll run on gasoline, diesel, CNG, propane or whatever you throw at it. The fuel economy of this generator is largely irrelevant since you are not expected to use it 99% of the time.

Edited January 12, 2019 by dwightlooi

[Drew Dowdell]

2 minutes ago, dwightlooi said:

300 mile is NOT a sweet spot. 300 miles means that you are carrying more than 200 miles of battery costs and weight which 99% of commuters will NEVER use 99% of the time.

--

Now, breaking free of EV range constraints is a great idea. It is the only reason Tesla was successful whereas previous EVs -- regardless of price and performance -- weren't. But at an equivalent of $5000 for about 50 miles worth of batteries, one has to wonder whether those $20,000 can be better spent on other things. Things which can include a 30hp turbo-electric generator costing $2000 and the size of a muffler which can extend the range of the vehicle when needed and which guarantees that you will never be stranded by a depleted battery. The fuel economy of this generator is largely irrelevant since you are not expected to use it 99% of the time.

People like to travel in luxury cars.  That means they need more than 100 miles of range

[dwightlooi]

4 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

People like to travel in luxury cars.  That means they need more than 100 miles of range

Yes. Hence " Things which can include a 30hp turbo-electric generator costing $2000 and the size of a muffler which can extend the range of the vehicle when needed and which guarantees that you will never be stranded by a depleted battery. A turbo-electric generator has no coolant circuit or radiator requirements. It'll run on gasoline, diesel, CNG, propane or whatever you throw at it. The fuel economy of this generator is largely irrelevant since you are not expected to use it 99% of the time. "

[Drew Dowdell]

23 minutes ago, dwightlooi said:

Yes. Hence " Things which can include a 30hp turbo-electric generator costing $2000 and the size of a muffler which can extend the range of the vehicle when needed and which guarantees that you will never be stranded by a depleted battery. A turbo-electric generator has no coolant circuit or radiator requirements. It'll run on gasoline, diesel, CNG, propane or whatever you throw at it. The fuel economy of this generator is largely irrelevant since you are not expected to use it 99% of the time. "

That's basically what BMW did with the i3, at least in terms of power output, and it didn't work so well.  They made the range so small that even with the gas regenerator there is range anxiety.

[Cmicasa the Great]

I could've sworn I predicted this back in November. That perhaps the death of the CT6, or change over of the CT6 was to make way for some sort of EV replacement.. and that Cadillac was preparing for a move to take on Tesla... that another large sedan is replacing it (CT6).. a full size vehicle, that is a direct competitor, but obviously more luxurious than the Model S, which unless U spend serious coin, has a very basic interior. The plan also called for a large majority of the upcoming GM EVs to be Cadillacs. If that plan is still in play.. with the only surprise for Cadillac upon the announcements laid out was the North American death of the aforementioned CT6.. it stands to reason that it is not the Germans, nor Lincoln that Cadillac is looking to emulate.. but Tesla? Difference being.. with the full force of a profitable GM, comprised of Chevy, Buick, GMC, and a plethora of Trucks and SUVs to fund this venture.. Cadillac's "Tesla" will be actually profitable from git.